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Posted: 10/21/2014 4:35:38 PM EDT
Just got this in a Alert:
HANDGUN, FIREARM, SIDEARM, GLOCK VS WEAPON Avoid the use of the word “weapon” when referring to your firearm. Weapon has a negative connotation, referring more to something used in an aggressive or offensive manner. The military carries weapons. You and I carry for defensive reasons only. Instead use the words firearm, sidearm, handgun, or the firearm type, such as Glock, Sig, etc. [/b] PC Bullshit. 
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Posted: 10/21/2014 4:58:46 PM EDT
[#1]
While frankly it shouldn't matter what you call it, Gun, High-speed paper puncher, boomstick, Weapon etc... you must realize that political correctness exists and it can be extremely powerful. The other side has been using it against us for years and it has worked against us. Things like, Weapon, spray bullets, ghost gun, 30 caliber magazine clip, are all things designed to instill fear into those that don't know better. Take the 1994 Clinton Assault "Weapon" Ban. If the bill had stated 1994 Military Rifle look alike ban chances of it getting passed would have been slim. I agree that we should have the freedom to call it by a number of different things. However, if we want to be inclusive rather than exclusive to folks that may swing to our side sometimes we have to be careful. Sometimes its the little things that matter to the most ignorant. |
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Posted: 10/21/2014 5:40:15 PM EDT
[#2]
VCDL and one executive member in particular's obsession with eliminating the use of the word 'weapon' is incredibly annoying.
I'm working on a well-thought-out response to it. It's crap, and it's silly. |
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Posted: 10/21/2014 5:40:25 PM EDT
[#3]
Quoted:
.....However, if we want to be inclusive rather than exclusive to folks that may swing to our side sometimes we have to be careful. Sometimes its the little things that matter to the most ignorant. If memory serves that is about the same thing many were saying about OC. 
Sorry, I'm just not ready to knuckle-under to the antis on that sort of thing....Sounds like what the NRA is currently preaching and I don't care to be preached to. If you think rather than "feel" just who are you going to be talking to if you do refer to a weapon....Likely another "gun person" as in "that's a great functioning weapon". My weapon, my rules. 
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Posted: 10/21/2014 9:27:05 PM EDT
[#4]
yeah that's bullshit, it is incumbent upon any gun rights organization to avow our rights of self defense (certainly including the use of any and all weapons)
it is the concept "weapons are bad" which should be attacked directly, dancing around it is playing the liberals' game |
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Posted: 10/21/2014 9:29:03 PM EDT
[#5]
They are trying to play the game using the lefts rules.
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Posted: 10/21/2014 9:37:35 PM EDT
[#6]
a universal rule of combat is "don't play the other guy's game"
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Posted: 10/21/2014 10:16:33 PM EDT
[#7]
I understand the argument being made, I'm just not convinced it's a winning one.
We tried playing that game for a few decades, and we slowly had our rights eroded. I would rather the other side have to play defense for awhile. |
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Posted: 10/21/2014 10:46:45 PM EDT
[#8]
I have had folks say this to me since I used "weapon" to refer generically to a handgun, rifle, or shotgun for many years. This usage was drilled into me when I served in the Army...just as it was drilled into me that a "gun" is an artillery piece. It took a long time for me to get used to civilians saying "gun" after I got out...and I still generally avoid using the term.
The first time someone suggested that I stop saying "weapon" to refer to a firearm, I was incredulous...and a bit offended. As far as I was concerned, weapon was the correct term...and they were just being an overly sensitive pussy. Now that years have passed, I think there may be some validity in the point. To some extent, they are correct. While pretty much all military firearms are intended to be weapons, there are many civilian firearms that are optimized for target shooting rather than as a weapon. Could you refer to them as a weapon? Sure. You could refer to a baseball bat as a weapon too. It would probably freak out the other parents at little league though. "Son, grab that weapon...you're up next."
I have won over a number of family members and friends who were formerly very anti-2A and who now are supportive of the 2A to varying degrees. In some cases, some of those folks now even own firearms. That set includes my wife, who was very anti-2A when we started dating. She now shoots with me and has claimed one of my pistols as her own. I didn't get there by starting with an in-your-face approach or by using terms that scared these folks, which probably would have made many of them shutdown. Instead, I started with simple facts and built on them over time. Thus, I see some validity in VCDL's advice, even though I remember being offended the first time I heard it. Either way, they are a great organization and we are lucky to have them working so hard to help us maintain our rights. It gets tougher every year. |
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Posted: 10/21/2014 11:15:09 PM EDT
[#9]
While i personally agree with you, here are my thoughts...
Anti-gunners truly "feel" that guns are evil. In the world of "feelings", PERCEPTION IS EVERYTHING! As in every situation, when choosing your words, consider your audience. |
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Posted: 10/22/2014 7:09:46 AM EDT
[#10]
I'm sold. From now on I'll refer to my weapons as gamegetters, peacemakers and liberators as appropriate.
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Posted: 10/22/2014 7:21:21 AM EDT
[#11]
The handgun on my belt is not a weapon until I choose to use it as one.
Hammers, baseball bats, fists, cars, glass bottles filled with gasoline, knives, screw drivers, and even a ball point pen can be weapons IF the person wielding them choses to make them a weapon. My handgun is no different. |
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Posted: 10/22/2014 7:35:40 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: While i personally agree with you, here are my thoughts... Anti-gunners truly "feel" that guns are evil. In the world of "feelings", PERCEPTION IS EVERYTHING! As in every situation, when choosing your words, consider your audience. One thing I've learned over the years, is that we will never be able to placate a true anti. The want it all, and no matter the wording, nothing is going to change that. |
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Posted: 10/22/2014 8:16:43 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
One thing I've learned over the years, is that we will never be able to placate a true anti. The want it all, and no matter the wording, nothing is going to change that. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
While i personally agree with you, here are my thoughts... Anti-gunners truly "feel" that guns are evil. In the world of "feelings", PERCEPTION IS EVERYTHING! As in every situation, when choosing your words, consider your audience. One thing I've learned over the years, is that we will never be able to placate a true anti. The want it all, and no matter the wording, nothing is going to change that. Exactly. If the only argument against using it is some misguided connotation that the anti's get from hearing it, that's not good enough. Agreed, not all firearms are weapons, in that not all are intended for use against people. The one I carry daily, however, is. I don't carry it in order to suddenly burst out into competition or collecting. They are correct that words have meanings, and it's important to use the correct term. Weapon is not an incorrect term for a defensive handgun. |
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Posted: 10/22/2014 9:16:44 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Agreed, not all firearms are weapons, in that not all are intended for use against people. The one I carry daily, however, is. I don't carry it in order to suddenly burst out into competition or collecting. Exactly. If you're carrying a firearm every day for that purpose, then it is a weapon - and there's nothing wrong with that. THAT is the message that "we" need to get across to people. |
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Posted: 10/22/2014 1:14:53 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
VCDL and one executive member in particular's obsession with eliminating the use of the word 'weapon' is incredibly annoying. I see a postcard in your mailbox in the near future.....LOL! |
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Posted: 10/22/2014 2:19:54 PM EDT
[#16]
I agree with scuba steve. Battleships have guns. Aliens have rayguns. If I do enough chest workouts, I'll get bigger guns.
I carry a weapon- in the defensive capacity. If it ever craps out on me, I'll pick up a rock and go on the offensive. |
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Posted: 10/22/2014 2:53:18 PM EDT
[#17]
This just reinforces why I stopped sending them money.
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Posted: 10/22/2014 3:03:36 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This just reinforces why I stopped sending them money. You'll never like EVERYTHING that any organization does. The VCDL has done more for gun rights in Virginia than anyone else. They (and I proudly count myself as a member) deserve everyone's support. |
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Posted: 10/22/2014 3:26:44 PM EDT
[#19]
I saw that email blast, too. I don't give a shit what it said, I'll keep calling my ammo "bullets" as long as I'm paying for them.
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Posted: 10/22/2014 3:42:21 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This just reinforces why I stopped sending them money. Your continually negative and misinformed posts suggests you will vote against or not support the very best selections we have for rights as VA citizens. At least some antis are so bad they help our cause 
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Posted: 10/22/2014 4:57:20 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This just reinforces why I stopped sending them money. I agree that this basis for this thread is about PC crap. That part sucks. That said, what other Virginia based organization has done or is doing more for our Second Amendment rights than VCDL? I don't agree with everything they do but I do realize that they are effective at protecting and preserving Second Amendment related issues. |
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Posted: 10/22/2014 5:09:10 PM EDT
[#22]
so the vcdl put out one email that had some obnoxious bullshit in it, they are still way more aggressive in their defense of rights than any other group (in the whole country afaik)
no one bats 1.000, I'd say I'm still comfortable with their ideological alignment on the whole |
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Posted: 10/22/2014 6:10:16 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
so the vcdl put out one email that had some obnoxious bullshit in it, they are still way more aggressive in their defense of rights than any other group (in the whole country afaik) no one bats 1.000, I'd say I'm still comfortable with their ideological alignment on the whole It's not a deal breaker membership wise but I suspect someone that's getting too big for their britches needs reigning in a bit.
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Posted: 10/22/2014 6:33:19 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's not a deal breaker membership wise but I suspect someone that's getting too big for their britches needs reigning in a bit.
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
so the vcdl put out one email that had some obnoxious bullshit in it, they are still way more aggressive in their defense of rights than any other group (in the whole country afaik) no one bats 1.000, I'd say I'm still comfortable with their ideological alignment on the whole It's not a deal breaker membership wise but I suspect someone that's getting too big for their britches needs reigning in a bit.
agreed, somebody needs a good reeducation 
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Posted: 10/22/2014 6:43:07 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
agreed, somebody needs a good reeducation Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
so the vcdl put out one email that had some obnoxious bullshit in it, they are still way more aggressive in their defense of rights than any other group (in the whole country afaik) no one bats 1.000, I'd say I'm still comfortable with their ideological alignment on the whole It's not a deal breaker membership wise but I suspect someone that's getting too big for their britches needs reigning in a bit.
agreed, somebody needs a good reeducation  Is there someone at VCDL that keeps going rogue?
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Posted: 10/22/2014 8:33:02 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
One thing I've learned over the years, is that we will never be able to placate a true anti. The want it all, and no matter the wording, nothing is going to change that. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
While i personally agree with you, here are my thoughts... Anti-gunners truly "feel" that guns are evil. In the world of "feelings", PERCEPTION IS EVERYTHING! As in every situation, when choosing your words, consider your audience. One thing I've learned over the years, is that we will never be able to placate a true anti. The want it all, and no matter the wording, nothing is going to change that. You will never placate a true anit. However there are a lot of fence sitters and folks who have just never been around guns that can be swayed either way. Using negative words with them gives them a negative image of the piece of hardware. I'm not going to try and change Sara Brady's mind, it is made up. But if using a different word helps change Suzie Homemaker. Carl the Cubicle Crawler, or Soccer Mom's mind I'm all for it. |
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Posted: 10/22/2014 8:37:04 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You will never placate a true anit. However there are a lot of fence sitters and folks who have just never been around guns that can be swayed either way. Using negative words with them gives them a negative image of the piece of hardware. I'm not going to try and change Sara Brady's mind, it is made up. But if using a different word helps change Suzie Homemaker. Carl the Cubicle Crawler, or Soccer Mom's mind I'm all for it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
While i personally agree with you, here are my thoughts... Anti-gunners truly "feel" that guns are evil. In the world of "feelings", PERCEPTION IS EVERYTHING! As in every situation, when choosing your words, consider your audience. One thing I've learned over the years, is that we will never be able to placate a true anti. The want it all, and no matter the wording, nothing is going to change that. You will never placate a true anit. However there are a lot of fence sitters and folks who have just never been around guns that can be swayed either way. Using negative words with them gives them a negative image of the piece of hardware. I'm not going to try and change Sara Brady's mind, it is made up. But if using a different word helps change Suzie Homemaker. Carl the Cubicle Crawler, or Soccer Mom's mind I'm all for it. You'd simply be adding to the incorrect thought that the connotation needs to be bad. There's nothing inherently wrong with the word 'weapon'. Contrary to the hit piece, a weapon can be used for defensive purposes. Police use weapons SOLELY for defensive purposes. Oddly enough, they are held to THE EXACT SAME STANDARDS with regard to lethal force that a citizen is. Words mean things, but connotations can be changed. ETA - that said, VCDL is top notch and I will continue to support them. I think this is a rather silly sticking point for them to be making a big deal about. I'd rather them say something along the lines of 'think about the connotations of the words you use, and try to paint with a brush that gives off a good light rather than bad.' |
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Posted: 10/22/2014 8:40:42 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I see a postcard in your mailbox in the near future.....LOL! Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
VCDL and one executive member in particular's obsession with eliminating the use of the word 'weapon' is incredibly annoying. I see a postcard in your mailbox in the near future.....LOL! He and I have had this exact discussion with each other last year. We came to the conclusion that we were not going to change each other's minds. I simply don't have the captive audience he does. |
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Posted: 10/22/2014 8:52:28 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Is there someone at VCDL that keeps going rogue?Now who would do such a thing! |
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Posted: 10/22/2014 9:50:06 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Now who would do such a thing! Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Is there someone at VCDL that keeps going rogue?Now who would do such a thing! I don't know! That was the question!? 
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Posted: 10/22/2014 10:13:38 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I carry a weapon- in the defensive capacity. Words, which caused me to think of "personal defense weapon" ... bringing to mind the Brügger & Thomet PDW, which would be not at all inappropriate to carry in some neighborhoods in the District ... 
Unlike scuba_steve , however, the Army taught me to never use two words that civilians believe have very plain meanings: gun and truck. DI Hartman revealed to the world what a gun in truth is: 
My drill-sergeants' phraseology was "This is my weapon, this is my gun," instead of Hartman's (and presumably most DIs') usage. No one in my recruit company ever needed a second correction. The correction involved activities similar to those portrayed in Full Metal Jacket, but the corrected-recruit acted-out the difference alone, in front of the company, and the correction also involved some pushups and rifle-kissing as well. By the end of Basic, no recruit ever used the word "gun" ... at all. And then there's that matter of the wheeled-conveyance that is used to transport soldiers over land. A vehicle. And not a truck. As everyone knows , the latter term means that "gold ball atop a military flagpole contain(ing) a razor, a match, and a bullet." Here's a link to that story.
I still have a hard time uttering the word, "gun," even after learning NRA's take on the word "weapon" years ago. (NRA at the time advocated the use of the word "gun" when speaking of one's concealed weapon ... errr ... gun.) So I usually refer to the sidearm I carry as "my pistol." And if you know the difference between small-arms and short-arms (think inspection), you're probably no youngster ...
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Posted: 10/22/2014 10:37:54 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And if you know the difference between small-arms and short-arms (think inspection), you're probably no youngster ... I was with you, up til Short-Arms. I had to look it up.
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Posted: 10/23/2014 9:03:01 AM EDT
[#33]
As a NRA Instructor, we are told NOT to use the "W" word. When I went through the NRA Instructor class 8-10 years ago, the NRA was very concerned about the use of the word "Weapon" - so much so, that every time you used it in class, it cost you money. Some folks with a military background paid $5-10 up front so they wouldn't have to stop in the middle of something.
I can see both sides of the argument, "What's in a name..." as they say - but you can't just wave your hand and say perception of non-shooters doesn't matter. I do a lot of work with the scouting folks around here, and getting the parents to allow their kids to shoot guns IS something we deal with.all of the time. Using the term "Weapon" in front of some of these parents would have some of them refuse to let their son/daughter attend the event. I also work for UVA (Yes, I am the minority around my offices, but not as bad as you might think), and I have taken many non-shooting UVA folks out to the range to get their first real gun experience. All I can say is, Words matter! To the OP - if you want to use the term weapon, go ahead - no one is stopping you. The e-mail from the VCDL is advice to those that want to present our side in a way more non-shooters can accept. The NRA has had the same guidelines for years. Take care, Bob S. |
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Posted: 10/23/2014 9:51:20 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
As a NRA Instructor, we are told NOT to use the "W" word. When I went through the NRA Instructor class 8-10 years ago, the NRA was very concerned about the use of the word "Weapon" - so much so, that every time you used it in class, it cost you money. Some folks with a military background paid $5-10 up front so they wouldn't have to stop in the middle of something.
I can see both sides of the argument, "What's in a name..." as they say - but you can't just wave your hand and say perception of non-shooters doesn't matter. I do a lot of work with the scouting folks around here, and getting the parents to allow their kids to shoot guns IS something we deal with.all of the time. Using the term "Weapon" in front of some of these parents would have some of them refuse to let their son/daughter attend the event. I also work for UVA (Yes, I am the minority around my offices, but not as bad as you might think), and I have taken many non-shooting UVA folks out to the range to get their first real gun experience. All I can say is, Words matter! To the OP - if you want to use the term weapon, go ahead - no one is stopping you. The e-mail from the VCDL is advice to those that want to present our side in a way more non-shooters can accept. The NRA has had the same guidelines for years. Take care, Bob S. Unfortunately, it's not a matter of you do it your way, I'll do it mine. This particular EM from VCDL comes down hard on people, hammering them every single time. It's not handed out as advice, it's handed out as a mandate. It gets old. In fact, this email only came out because the day before, there was a discussion on the VCDL Facebook page about it, and it was 'my way or the highway'. Next day, this comes out. Coincidence? I don't believe in them. Flexing that muscle to a captive audience yet again. He seems to forget that there are other educated people in the gun world, who have significant amounts of experience with firearms of all sorts, including weapons. |
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Posted: 10/23/2014 10:15:35 AM EDT
[#35]
I do not FB - so I did not see any of those conversations, I can only comment on the e-mail sent out. From what I read, there was no "my way or the highway" tone.
"Words have specific meanings and it is important that we strive to use the correct terminology when referring to things firearm related. If you find yourself correcting a “newbie” or even an “oldbie,” do so politely and patiently - we are all on the same side and a little patience and respect can go a very long way. Better to let it go than to alienate someone." That attitude seems correct to me. As to what to call the Virginia Concealed Carry Permit - it is a CHP. I get asked this often - "Can I carry (knives, SBR's, SBS's, etc) with my carry permit?" The answer is No - we have a Concealed Handgun Permit. It seems to me that some of the anger in this thread is aimed at that VCDL EM - and maybe rightfully so (as I said, I didn't see that side of it), but that doesn't change the message. Take care, Bob S. |
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Posted: 10/23/2014 11:21:22 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
As a NRA Instructor, we are told NOT to use the "W" word. When I went through the NRA Instructor class 8-10 years ago, the NRA was very concerned about the use of the word "Weapon" - so much so, that every time you used it in class, it cost you money. Some folks with a military background paid $5-10 up front so they wouldn't have to stop in the middle of something.
I can see both sides of the argument, "What's in a name..." as they say - but you can't just wave your hand and say perception of non-shooters doesn't matter. I do a lot of work with the scouting folks around here, and getting the parents to allow their kids to shoot guns IS something we deal with.all of the time. Using the term "Weapon" in front of some of these parents would have some of them refuse to let their son/daughter attend the event. I also work for UVA (Yes, I am the minority around my offices, but not as bad as you might think), and I have taken many non-shooting UVA folks out to the range to get their first real gun experience. All I can say is, Words matter! To the OP - if you want to use the term weapon, go ahead - no one is stopping you. The e-mail from the VCDL is advice to those that want to present our side in a way more non-shooters can accept. The NRA has had the same guidelines for years. Take care, Bob S. it is infinitely more important to make these people understand that weapons are not bad than it is to get them to shoot a gun |
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Posted: 10/23/2014 12:00:24 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I do not FB - so I did not see any of those conversations, I can only comment on the e-mail sent out. From what I read, there was no "my way or the highway" tone. "Words have specific meanings and it is important that we strive to use the correct terminology when referring to things firearm related. If you find yourself correcting a “newbie” or even an “oldbie,” do so politely and patiently - we are all on the same side and a little patience and respect can go a very long way. Better to let it go than to alienate someone." That attitude seems correct to me. As to what to call the Virginia Concealed Carry Permit - it is a CHP. I get asked this often - "Can I carry (knives, SBR's, SBS's, etc) with my carry permit?" The answer is No - we have a Concealed Handgun Permit. It seems to me that some of the anger in this thread is aimed at that VCDL EM - and maybe rightfully so (as I said, I didn't see that side of it), but that doesn't change the message. Take care, Bob S. Agreed, the email was not bad at all. One point, the CHP allows the carrying of an otherwise Concealed Weapon - a handgun. Handguns are one of a class of specifically prohibited WEAPONS that are not allowed to be concealed. So a concealed handgun is by definition a concealed weapon, just one that is allowed. |
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Posted: 10/23/2014 12:15:29 PM EDT
[#38]
I don't go out of my way to correct a new shooter I've brought to a range. I don't get my knickers in a knot if they call it a clip and not a magazine. As long as they engage the safety, make sure the chamber is clear, keep it pointing downrange, and don't muzzle sweep anyone, I think I've done a lot of good. That, to me, is better than making sure they say "ammo" or "rounds" vs. bullets. But that doesn't really have much to do with the main point of argument here, I guess.
People ask to shoot my guns when they are speaking of my rifles or handguns, not my weapons, although they are one in the same. Of ALL the email blasts I get from them, that had to be the most bizarre I'd ever read. I assume there was a reason/agenda for sending it, I just can't figure it out. |
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Posted: 10/23/2014 12:37:13 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Of ALL the email blasts I get from them, that had to be the most bizarre I'd ever read. I assume there was a reason/agenda for sending it, I just can't figure it out. I don't mean to keep harping on the guy, but it seems to be the reason this whole discussion has come up. There has been a standing discussion about Weapon v. Firearm v. Gun in the VCDL circle for a few years now. Every time it comes up, and the other night specifically, there was a discussion that mirrored the points made in this one, with some making valid points in each direction. However, there are a few folks who simply cannot concede that the other side of the argument makes valid points. I personally think the email blast came out because 'the 'W' word is bad' crowd didn't feel they had the upper hand in the discussion, and felt the need to send their side of the argument out to the entire group, unannounced and unsolicited, and without the ability for anyone to argue. I love VCDL, I support them financially and with my time. I think this is a ridiculous issue that is causing a significant divide among their members, and they need to recognize that fact and drop it. Their underlining point is clear enough, and that is be cognizant of how others perceive your words, and be mindful to relate pro-gun causes in a good light, and to try to help sway those who are undecided. Beating your own members over the head about their word choice, when it isn't even a settled matter, is not the way to go about it. |
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Posted: 10/23/2014 12:45:43 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
it is infinitely more important to make these people understand that weapons are not bad than it is to get them to shoot a gun OK - How do we do that? I'm being serious. In today's world, how would you do that in a way that the fence sitters in this debate will accept? Do we start calling everything a weapon? My pocket knife is now a folding pocket weapon? Will that make people less sensitive about the word "weapon"? Please understand, I'm not against the term weapon - just interested in how folks think it can be used without pushing the middle of the road folks in the wrong direction. We will never convert the extreme left (just as they will never covert me to their side), it's the folks in the middle now, that will decide gun ownership in the future. To me - getting more people - especially young people, shooting in a safe & fun way, will do that job the best. If calling my firearms "weapons" pushes some parents away from letting their child enjoy our sport, I'd rather NOT call it that. Again - I'm in the "call it what you want" boat, but I have my reasons for not using the "W" word. Take care, Bob S. |
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Posted: 10/23/2014 12:50:56 PM EDT
[#41]
The idea is that weapon has a bad connotation, because weapons are used against PEOPLE.
Rather than shy away from this fact, why not embrace it? Yes, my defensive pistol absolutely will be used against the PEOPLE who threaten me or my family with lethal force. Rather than focus on the inanimate object (the gun/weapon/pistol), why not put the impetus back on the PERSON who is the cause of it in the first place? After all, isn't that what the anti's try to do to us? Make us focus on the object, and not the person? |
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Posted: 10/23/2014 1:14:30 PM EDT
[#42]
I understand & agree.
For years when someone asks what's that (pointing to my carry handgun), I tell them it's my personal safety tool. Then I usually go on to explain that just like a hammer, it's just a tool. It's not good or evil - it's what you do with it that decides that. (Years ago - California passed a law that you couldn't bring a stabbing type "weapon" onto school property that couldn't be detected by a metal detector - my comment then was, do they still plan on using #2 pencils? )
And while I don't read these two lines differently - some would, and there is where need to find a way to deal with it. "Yes, my defensive pistol absolutely will be used against the PEOPLE who threaten me or my family with lethal force." "Yes, my defensive weapon absolutely will be used against the PEOPLE who threaten me or my family with lethal force." I do not have a cut & dried answer on how to do this - wish I did. Getting more people shooting in a safe & fun environment is the best I can do. Take care, Bob S. |
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Posted: 10/23/2014 2:07:15 PM EDT
[#43]
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This just reinforces why I stopped sending them money. Oh for fucks sake.
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Posted: 10/23/2014 2:18:16 PM EDT
[#44]
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Oh for fucks sake.
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This just reinforces why I stopped sending them money. Oh for fucks sake.
You know he doesn't like sending them money.
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Posted: 10/23/2014 2:45:41 PM EDT
[#45]
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OK - How do we do that? I'm being serious. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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it is infinitely more important to make these people understand that weapons are not bad than it is to get them to shoot a gun OK - How do we do that? I'm being serious. if I knew I'd be out there changing the world, all I know is I'm done playing the liberals' game and letting them redefine language |
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Posted: 10/23/2014 3:00:55 PM EDT
[#46]
For me it's about context. When I'm teaching target shooting to college students it's "handgun," "firearm," "pistol," and so on as I don't want to inspire weapon apoplexy in administrators as we poke holes in paper. When I'm teaching CHP classes we are talking about using a firearm in defense of our life and in that context it's a weapon and that's my term of choice. I think it's incumbent upon instructors to make it clear that this stuff is Serious Business and using the "W word" connotes that better than some placating synonym.
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Posted: 10/23/2014 3:35:20 PM EDT
[#47]
I remember an instructor years ago that wanted us to use proper terminology depending on what we activity we were engaged in with a firearm. If we are carrying a firearm for self-defense then it is most certainly a "weapon". If we are target shooting, plinking or collecting then it is some thing else (rifle, handgun, shotgun, etc.). I suppose what you carry while hunting would be a "weapon" as well.
If I am violently attacked, I want a "weapon" with which to defend myself. This is probably from the same crowd that wants us to refer to hunting and killing deer as "harvesting" (which actually sounds MUCH creepier)
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Posted: 10/23/2014 4:02:45 PM EDT
[#48]
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This is probably from the same crowd that wants us to refer to hunting and killing deer as "harvesting" (which actually sounds MUCH creepier)That sounds super creepy. Makes me think of getting roofied and waking up in a bathtub with an organ missing. |
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Posted: 10/23/2014 4:09:50 PM EDT
[#49]
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That sounds super creepy. Makes me think of getting roofied and waking up in a bathtub with an organ missing. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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This is probably from the same crowd that wants us to refer to hunting and killing deer as "harvesting" (which actually sounds MUCH creepier)That sounds super creepy. Makes me think of getting roofied and waking up in a bathtub with an organ missing. OK that actually made me laugh out loud. In the library. Thanks. |
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Posted: 10/23/2014 6:08:31 PM EDT
[#50]
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That sounds super creepy. Makes me think of getting roofied and waking up in a bathtub with an organ missing. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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This is probably from the same crowd that wants us to refer to hunting and killing deer as "harvesting" (which actually sounds MUCH creepier)That sounds super creepy. Makes me think of getting roofied and waking up in a bathtub with an organ missing. I want to party with you.
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