User Panel
Quoted:
Once a parts kit is built, are the barrel threads accessible? Is the handgaurd as easy to remove as a standard MP5? I guess I'm trying to figure out if I can have everything built except for the can, then form 1 a suppressor easily myself. View Quote Sure. As show in my pix above, I easily swap out KAC or HK can. |
|
Quoted:
Sure. As show in my pix above, I easily swap out KAC or HK can. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Once a parts kit is built, are the barrel threads accessible? Is the handgaurd as easy to remove as a standard MP5? I guess I'm trying to figure out if I can have everything built except for the can, then form 1 a suppressor easily myself. Sure. As show in my pix above, I easily swap out KAC or HK can. I figured you could drop in the can and thread it on and off, but I was wondering if I will have access to the threads for measurements, etc. I guess I could build the can before sending off the kit to get built. Did you grab one off of HKParts? Why not just buy two. I'll hold one for you. |
|
Quoted:
I figured you could drop in the can and thread it on and off, but I was wondering if I will have access to the threads for measurements, etc. I guess I could build the can before sending off the kit to get built. Did you grab one off of HKParts? Why not just buy two. I'll hold one for you. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Once a parts kit is built, are the barrel threads accessible? Is the handgaurd as easy to remove as a standard MP5? I guess I'm trying to figure out if I can have everything built except for the can, then form 1 a suppressor easily myself. Sure. As show in my pix above, I easily swap out KAC or HK can. I figured you could drop in the can and thread it on and off, but I was wondering if I will have access to the threads for measurements, etc. I guess I could build the can before sending off the kit to get built. Did you grab one off of HKParts? Why not just buy two. I'll hold one for you. Not very accessible. SeeHK94Dude unfinished pic. While the HG comes off, the metal shroud is welded in. BBLS - I did buy two. :-) |
|
Quoted:
The barrel threads would be a pain to get at <a href="http://s92.photobucket.com/user/HK94dude/media/6afb947a.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l30/HK94dude/6afb947a.jpg</a> View Quote That's what I was thinking. Thanks for the pic. |
|
|
Have a Coharie MP5SD, Dave Getz MP5 and BMP MP5K. They took a bit of tinkering and tuning to be 100% reliable in SA and FA but I love them dearly. Highly recommend.
The threads and barrel can be a pain to clean. Getting one of these helps: HK Parts MP5SD cleaning brush Coharie Arms MP5SD & Coharie SD can 9MM GSG5 SBR 22LR GSG5K (reverse stretch style) SBR 22LR Dave Getz MP5 with Swiss Impulse IIA 9mm & 3 lug adapter 9MM Coharie Arms MP5SD & Coharie SD can 9MM Black Market Parts MP5K & Gemtech MK9K 9MM Current production clones worth looking at: Ghillie Bear Turner Fab Dakota Have heard good things about the Atlantic Firearms offerings. |
|
I don't think there is a subgun/carbine more sexy than the MP5.
Thanks for all the pics and information. Looking forward to getting this project started. |
|
|
I think I'd wait to see what MKE offers for an SD (if they go through with it).
|
|
Quoted:
I think I'd wait to see what MKE offers for an SD (if they go through with it). View Quote I think I'd buy a SD suppressor now and get that ball rolling, and then have a gun built around it. I was in the other boat, of having the gun, but no Form 4 for suppressor.. Was fun to look at for a few months though.. |
|
|
Quoted:
I think I'd buy a SD suppressor now and get that ball rolling, and then have a gun built around it. I was in the other boat, of having the gun, but no Form 4 for suppressor.. Was fun to look at for a few months though.. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
I think I'd wait to see what MKE offers for an SD (if they go through with it). I think I'd buy a SD suppressor now and get that ball rolling, and then have a gun built around it. I was in the other boat, of having the gun, but no Form 4 for suppressor.. Was fun to look at for a few months though.. I'm leaning towards starting a Forn 1 can first. Then buying/have one built. |
|
Not helping. Getting all worked up.
Quoted:
<a href="http://s114.photobucket.com/user/gopherboy128/media/20151217_120246_zpsxpxvla31.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n266/gopherboy128/20151217_120246_zpsxpxvla31.jpg</a> How about triplets, with a UMP for added bonus?! View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
I don't think there is a subgun/carbine more sexy than the MP5. Thanks for all the pics and information. Looking forward to getting this project started. <a href="http://s114.photobucket.com/user/gopherboy128/media/20151217_120246_zpsxpxvla31.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n266/gopherboy128/20151217_120246_zpsxpxvla31.jpg</a> How about triplets, with a UMP for added bonus?! |
|
|
Bump. Only because I like talking about owning an SD one day...
|
|
|
|
MP5SD-K, lol! Definitely unique! |
|
So the "flats" are basically like an 80% lower. You have to build it (put the bends in and weld it) and then it becomes a receiver.
The Parts kit is basically a full MP5 that just has had the receiver removed (HKparts talks about "demilling" it, so I assume was once a complete gun and they destroy the receiver)? If you build one of these, and then one day get a registered HK trigger group, that is how you get a full auto MP5? |
|
|
Innovative Arms recently posted a video of a MP5SD they did in their industry subforum page. Think it's a 40cal version. No clue costs or what all they are offering. But they have been doing integrals for a few platforms including the sig MPX and apparently the MP5 as well.
|
|
Quoted:
More inspiration. Not an SD, but still my absolute favorite gun. When I got it: http://i1223.photobucket.com/albums/dd519/generalpurpose87/MP5/DSCN3170_zps41ntogwr.jpg Now: http://i1223.photobucket.com/albums/dd519/generalpurpose87/MP5/DSCN3226u_zps3j0zpk5v.jpg It gets quiet, too: http://i1223.photobucket.com/albums/dd519/generalpurpose87/MP5/DSCN3225u_zpszkjhxwri.jpg View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
I don't think there is a subgun/carbine more sexy than the MP5. Thanks for all the pics and information. Looking forward to getting this project started. More inspiration. Not an SD, but still my absolute favorite gun. When I got it: http://i1223.photobucket.com/albums/dd519/generalpurpose87/MP5/DSCN3170_zps41ntogwr.jpg Now: http://i1223.photobucket.com/albums/dd519/generalpurpose87/MP5/DSCN3226u_zps3j0zpk5v.jpg It gets quiet, too: http://i1223.photobucket.com/albums/dd519/generalpurpose87/MP5/DSCN3225u_zpszkjhxwri.jpg Man...I'd love to send mine to change a barrel with either 3 lugs or threaded, so I can put a muffler on it. |
|
Quoted:
Man...I'd love to send mine to change a barrel with either 3 lugs or threaded, so I can put a muffler on it. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I don't think there is a subgun/carbine more sexy than the MP5. Thanks for all the pics and information. Looking forward to getting this project started. More inspiration. Not an SD, but still my absolute favorite gun. When I got it: http://i1223.photobucket.com/albums/dd519/generalpurpose87/MP5/DSCN3170_zps41ntogwr.jpg Now: http://i1223.photobucket.com/albums/dd519/generalpurpose87/MP5/DSCN3226u_zps3j0zpk5v.jpg It gets quiet, too: http://i1223.photobucket.com/albums/dd519/generalpurpose87/MP5/DSCN3225u_zpszkjhxwri.jpg Man...I'd love to send mine to change a barrel with either 3 lugs or threaded, so I can put a muffler on it. Do it. I've only shot my MP5 suppressed. No idea what it sounds like unsuppressed. |
|
With the ported barrel, is all 9mm ammo subsonic? Anyone have any ammo go supersonic?
If it's hit or miss, I'm going to go for the reverse stretch K option, since I have an Octane ready to 3-lug. If virtually all ammo stays subsonic, I'm going to press on. |
|
Quoted:
With the ported barrel, is all 9mm ammo subsonic? Anyone have any ammo go supersonic? If it's hit or miss, I'm going to go for the reverse stretch K option, since I have an Octane ready to 3-lug. If virtually all ammo stays subsonic, I'm going to press on. View Quote All go subsonic for me. I use either 115 or 124...124 preferably. |
|
Quoted:
Do it. I've only shot my MP5 suppressed. No idea what it sounds like unsuppressed. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I don't think there is a subgun/carbine more sexy than the MP5. Thanks for all the pics and information. Looking forward to getting this project started. More inspiration. Not an SD, but still my absolute favorite gun. When I got it: http://i1223.photobucket.com/albums/dd519/generalpurpose87/MP5/DSCN3170_zps41ntogwr.jpg Now: http://i1223.photobucket.com/albums/dd519/generalpurpose87/MP5/DSCN3226u_zps3j0zpk5v.jpg It gets quiet, too: http://i1223.photobucket.com/albums/dd519/generalpurpose87/MP5/DSCN3225u_zpszkjhxwri.jpg Man...I'd love to send mine to change a barrel with either 3 lugs or threaded, so I can put a muffler on it. Do it. I've only shot my MP5 suppressed. No idea what it sounds like unsuppressed. The idea of upper K sitting at HK gunsmith for several months is not really appealing to me. I might get over that fear and Dooo etttt... |
|
Quoted:
All go subsonic for me. I use either 115 or 124...124 preferably. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
With the ported barrel, is all 9mm ammo subsonic? Anyone have any ammo go supersonic? If it's hit or miss, I'm going to go for the reverse stretch K option, since I have an Octane ready to 3-lug. If virtually all ammo stays subsonic, I'm going to press on. All go subsonic for me. I use either 115 or 124...124 preferably. Thank you. |
|
Quoted:
The idea of upper K sitting at HK gunsmith for several months is not really appealing to me. I might get over that fear and Dooo etttt... View Quote Is there really that bad of a backlog? I feel like you could send it off to one of the bigger names that specialize in HK stuff and have it back in a couple weeks, but I've never sent mine out for anything. I bet the HKPro folks know who could set you up quickly. |
|
FYI. Zenith/MKE offers a 20% MIL discount.
https://zenithfirearms.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/hero_program.pdf |
|
Quoted:
Is there really that bad of a backlog? I feel like you could send it off to one of the bigger names that specialize in HK stuff and have it back in a couple weeks, but I've never sent mine out for anything. I bet the HKPro folks know who could set you up quickly. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
The idea of upper K sitting at HK gunsmith for several months is not really appealing to me. I might get over that fear and Dooo etttt... Is there really that bad of a backlog? I feel like you could send it off to one of the bigger names that specialize in HK stuff and have it back in a couple weeks, but I've never sent mine out for anything. I bet the HKPro folks know who could set you up quickly. I have no clue how long it takes now. Probably there are more MP5 smiths now, and things can get done quicker. Maybe your K triggers the renewed desire to have it done. |
|
Light attachment options are weak for the SD... Such a great defensive gun, but it needs a light.
|
|
Brethren Arms:
http://brethrenarms.com/the-mp5-sd-integral-suppression-it-has-a-purpose-but-its-not-what-you-think/ The MP5 SD & integral suppression; it has a purpose, but its not what you think Industry news 1 Comment IMG_1348 The SD is without a doubt one of the coolest firearms in history. Whether it was in your favorite ‘Merica 80’s action film, a SEAL recruitment poster, or seeing it blast Iranians in Operation Nimrod,this gun has become a “bucket list” item for some people. And why not? Its horribly cool looking, Jedi quiet, and theintegral suppressor makes it the most compact platform with which to lay hate. Or does it?58Embassy_7 The MP5SD was developed by Heckler & Koch in 1976, at the request of military units who needed an incredibly quiet firearm but with all the performance capabilities not possible with suppressed pistols. The SD was a revolutionary concept because it allowed readily available standard NATO supersonic 9mm ammo, and still achieved subsonic performance. It did so by porting the barrel at the base, which allowed gas into the two stage silencer. The first portion is an expansion chamber that reduced the volume of propellant gas pushing the round. This gas then entered the silencer portion for the rest of the work. Patent_DE1553874_07-Oct-1971_Handfeuerwaffe_mit_Schalldaempfer_Heckler_und_Koch The porting reduced the velocity of the round by up to 25%. For you math people out there, you have probably realized that it also means the energy of the round was reduced, which due to the physics involved, means that a 25% reduction in velocity results in the kinetic energy being cut in half. Original patent drawing from Germany sd barrelThose that have used this gun in harm’s way will attest to the SD’s lack of stopping power; which in those situations is addressed by holding the trigger down until your target is sufficiently ventilated. So the entire purpose of the gun was to get noise reduction performance on par with standard silencers using subsonic ammo, but with ammunition that was readily available in a war zone. Now, fast forward 30 years, and replace a strategic military group with a regular civilian, or even a police agency. The price difference between 115 gr Blazer brass and 147 gr Speer Lawman (a subsonic round) is only about 5 cents a round, and readily available. Additionally, bullet manufacturing has drastically improved reliability and performance of 147 gr rounds, which was admitably quite a feat in the middle of the 20th century. So that initial need that drove production is all but gone for most buyers in the U.S. Modern Equivalents So how does the SD stack up to modern options? We will use the Griffin Revolution 9 silencer for this comparison, because it is a well built silencer, the tri-lug adapter adds no additional length, and we like those guys over there; they’re former co-workers in a fairly crappy part of the world. GAREV9-4 The average dB rating of the SD is about 127 dB. Out of our BAP9C with the Griffin silencer and using subsonic loads we have witnessed dB levels between 124-135 dB depending the ammo brand. Even in the worst case, it is less than a 10 dB difference. That is still significant, as the dB rating is not a linear but logarithmic scale; very loosely speaking a 10dB difference would be about twice as loud. From a comparison standpoint OSHA compares a 130 dB sound to a thunder clap, and a 140 dB sound to a jet 100 ft overhead (a fairly useless comparison as both result in hearing damage.) Skipping any further nerdery on the subject; it is suffice to say they are comparable, as long as subsonic 9mm is used. But not on the SD. Because it probably wont be able to cycle the next round. Yeah, forgot to mention that; using subsonic ammo in the SD will not help much in the sound suppression department, but it will almost certaintly lead to a malfunction. There is more to consider than just sound; lets look at what happens in front of the muzzle. a 147 grain delivers on average about 10% less kinetic energy than a 115 gr bullet, assuming everything else is identical. But don’t forget, the aforementioned velocity reduction leads to a 50% reduction in energy on target. Again, for comparison, a .380 ACP averages about 20% more energy than what is coming out of the SD. hqdefault Still stronger than your SD Ballistic improvements have made the 9mm round useful again, but all those advancements become useless when the round is slowed down that much. All those super cool, exploding, DNA erasing rounds need that velocity to expand, liquefy, vaporize etc. on target. The velocity is a crucial component in any terminal ballistic design; it is not something that can be changed without a massive performance impact. Other Important Dimensions we have already poked some holes into the lure of the SD, but we at Brethren Arms are not ones to stop beating the horse until it is undeniably dead. As stated above, another great aspect of the SD was its comparable size to unsuppressed submachine guns. So lets do it by the numbers: MP5SD BAP9C w/ Griffin Revolution9 weight 6.2 lbs 5.5 lbs Overall length 21.7? 21.3? ( end cap only, no stock) Keep in mind that those values are with the silencer, so if the world is ending, and you have already blown out your ear drums, with a twist of the wrist your gun now weighs 4.8 lbs and is only 13.7? long. Its not a clear victory from a dimensional standpoint; the SD does have both a longer sight radius and more front end real estate for accuracy. However, the addition of optics and a variety of foregrips does diminish those advantages. Which brings us to the final fact to consider; modularity. With AR-15s being so modular that “light weight polymer dust cover” is a legitimate product, we have realized that some of those accessories are pretty useful and even lifeIMG_2010 saving. Even with our Mlok handguard winning the title of shortest handguard in existence, There is still enough space to put a vertical foregrip, a flashlight, and even a laser, quick detach sling mount, pencil sharpener, etc. The SD handguard currently has to be welded to the receiver, and the only ergonomic upgrade is a rubber sleeve which loosely resembles a bicycle tire. We can add light and foregrip mounts, but it is a custom and frankly pricey modification. Without a welder and an engineering degree, this is what your SD looks like when you want to be able to use a light. fixsdxy5 Yes, those are hose clamps on a gun that retails close to $4000. If this was your issued gun, you could care less. But as a regular consumer, it ventures into buying-a-mercedes-and-putting-walmart-hubcaps-on territory. To be fair, there are some other options for mounting lights, but better is relative in this instance - See more at: http://brethrenarms.com/the-mp5-sd-integral-suppression-it-has-a-purpose-but-its-not-what-you-think/#sthash.kqSnszEz.dpuf |
|
Regular ArfComer here in CT has a dealer sample 1972 with the 4 position lower.
115g plinking ammo....... Sounds like a paintball gun. https://instagram.com/p/00ISZ_BQlU/ |
|
TPM will sell the SD without the suppressor for $3K.
I'm thinking that Form 1ing a shorter/larger diameter suppressor (diameter increase after the HG) would be fun. |
|
|
Quoted:
this works well http://store.commandarms.com/products/HX3SD.html View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Light attachment options are weak for the SD... Such a great defensive gun, but it needs a light. this works well http://store.commandarms.com/products/HX3SD.html Oh, very nice. Thanks. |
|
B&T handguard works good too- but you have to drill and tap the cage for the scews.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ha. Thanks Gents. I'll have to thrive on the anticipation since this will be my one NFA purchase for the year.
|
|
|
Quoted:
Haha, wishful thinking on your part! I know who your dealer is and the stuff he pushes is more addictive than crack lol.. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
Ha. Thanks Gents. I'll have to thrive on the anticipation since this will be my one NFA purchase for the year. Haha, wishful thinking on your part! I know who your dealer is and the stuff he pushes is more addictive than crack lol.. I was there today. |
|
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.