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Posted: 8/24/2015 11:39:20 AM EDT
OK, technically I don't have my first flight until tomorrow, so I was told, but ground school at the local community college starts today, so I'll meet my instructor, etc. I've been waiting nearly 30 years for this (I'm 29), and it still doesn't seem real. I'll be attending Quantum Helicopters at KCHD, going all the way through CFI. :) I'm so giddy, it's driving my wife crazy! Any suggestions for a new student pilot from the established members of the aviation community? I'm always open to learn from those who've gone before.

Update 11/11/15 - Been a bit since I posted, been pretty tied up with training and class. Anyway, I have my check ride scheduled for the 19th. Any tips, suggestions, or anything else you can share that will help? I'm hitting the books and doing the best I can. I don't feel entirely prepared, but I'm told nobody really is. Thankfully, I have a little over a week to nail things down. Flight-wise, but only real areas of concern are slopes (they're to standard, but I'm not super confident in them), hover autos (all safe, but some days I struggle a bit with yaw more than others, usually applying too much right pedal and yawning outside the 10* of standard), and 180* autos (just haven't done them much, so we're focusing on them tomorrow). Otherwise, everything else is pretty much in standard for the most part. But I'm 100% always ready to learn more! Thanks, everyone!
Link Posted: 8/24/2015 2:58:17 PM EDT
[#1]
You're going after a commercial with CFI heliflopter rating? Better find a way to get a dump truck fulla cash (robbing a bank or armored car might do it, but I doubt it ).

Seriously though...

DO:

-buy charts and an AFD for your area for ground study

-pay attention in ground school and ask questions- LOTS of questions

-fly at least 3 times a week weather permitting

- do the homework and academics so you know what's going on in the aircraft

DON'T:

-get sucked into paying 'up front'. At MOST, pay only 10-hour blocks if a discount is offered.

-train under Part 141- you're NOT going to get any advantage despite what the regs and flight schools tell you. In fact, you'll be under a distinct DISadvantage because 141 training is rote, lock-step in most cases- scheduled flying day but weather is bad, oh well...

-buy a headset until you've tried a few out and KNOW that aviation is for you. Most schools have rental sets.

-buy ANY extra books until you absolutely need them. Your instructor will have them and the Internet is your friend- most FAA Handbooks are online now.

-buy the biggest, most expensive flight bag out there. All you need is something that will carry a headset, plotter/calculator, a few charts, an airport facility directory (AFD) and your logbook. NOTHING ELSE is required. The aircraft manual is required to be in the aircraft, so you don't need to lug one around and all the other books and materials are for GROUND study.

Last: YOU are the one in charge of your training. If you can't get along with the assigned CFI, fire him and get another and that includes in the air. If you don't like the way a lesson in the air is proceeding, DEMAND to terminate and return to base.
This comes with a caveat- YOU have to be prepared for the day's lesson; don't take any ill-preparedness out on the CFI unjustly.

Others will be along soon with more advise. Good luck with it all and kiss your money good-bye.
Link Posted: 8/24/2015 4:15:24 PM EDT
[#2]
Congrats! Best thing I've done. I just landed from a training flight for my ASEL commercial ticket.

You will have good days and bad days. Don't let the bad days get to you, just keep trying.
Link Posted: 8/24/2015 6:53:38 PM EDT
[#3]
Quoted:
OK, technically I don't have my first flight until tomorrow, so I was told, but ground school at the local community college starts today, so I'll meet my instructor, etc. I've been waiting nearly 30 years for this (I'm 29), and it still doesn't seem real. I'll be attending Quantum Helicopters at KCHD, going all the way through CFI. :) I'm so giddy, it's driving my wife crazy! Any suggestions for a new student pilot from the established members of the aviation community? I'm always open to learn from those who've gone before.
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Congrats OP! I am about 4 hrs into my flight training.

To the others....What is the best way to learn with radio communications? Our instructor took us to a fly in on this past Saturday and I was just amazed that our instructor was able to get all the fast talk of the ATC. It had me like are you kidding me Am I over thinking this at a low hours in training? Any advice?
Link Posted: 8/24/2015 7:00:01 PM EDT
[#4]
Link Posted: 8/24/2015 7:00:55 PM EDT
[#5]
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Quoted:


Congrats OP! I am about 4 hrs into my flight training.

To the others....What is the best way to learn with radio communications? Our instructor took us to a fly in on this past Saturday and I was just amazed that our instructor was able to get all the fast talk of the ATC. It had me like are you kidding me Am I over thinking this at a low hours in training? Any advice?
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Quoted:
OK, technically I don't have my first flight until tomorrow, so I was told, but ground school at the local community college starts today, so I'll meet my instructor, etc. I've been waiting nearly 30 years for this (I'm 29), and it still doesn't seem real. I'll be attending Quantum Helicopters at KCHD, going all the way through CFI. :) I'm so giddy, it's driving my wife crazy! Any suggestions for a new student pilot from the established members of the aviation community? I'm always open to learn from those who've gone before.


Congrats OP! I am about 4 hrs into my flight training.

To the others....What is the best way to learn with radio communications? Our instructor took us to a fly in on this past Saturday and I was just amazed that our instructor was able to get all the fast talk of the ATC. It had me like are you kidding me Am I over thinking this at a low hours in training? Any advice?


You're over-thinking it.

Go to Live ATC.net and pick any of the KORD (Chicago) feeds and listen in. If you can understand those machine-gun talking yahoos, you'll get along anywhere.
Link Posted: 8/24/2015 7:32:36 PM EDT
[#6]
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Quoted:


You're over-thinking it.

Go to Live ATC.net and pick any of the KORD (Chicago) feeds and listen in. If you can understand those machine-gun talking yahoos, you'll get along anywhere.
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OK, technically I don't have my first flight until tomorrow, so I was told, but ground school at the local community college starts today, so I'll meet my instructor, etc. I've been waiting nearly 30 years for this (I'm 29), and it still doesn't seem real. I'll be attending Quantum Helicopters at KCHD, going all the way through CFI. :) I'm so giddy, it's driving my wife crazy! Any suggestions for a new student pilot from the established members of the aviation community? I'm always open to learn from those who've gone before.


Congrats OP! I am about 4 hrs into my flight training.

To the others....What is the best way to learn with radio communications? Our instructor took us to a fly in on this past Saturday and I was just amazed that our instructor was able to get all the fast talk of the ATC. It had me like are you kidding me Am I over thinking this at a low hours in training? Any advice?


You're over-thinking it.

Go to Live ATC.net and pick any of the KORD (Chicago) feeds and listen in. If you can understand those machine-gun talking yahoos, you'll get along anywhere.


I sure hope so!
Link Posted: 8/24/2015 8:25:59 PM EDT
[#7]
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Quoted:


Congrats OP! I am about 4 hrs into my flight training.

To the others....What is the best way to learn with radio communications? Our instructor took us to a fly in on this past Saturday and I was just amazed that our instructor was able to get all the fast talk of the ATC. It had me like are you kidding me Am I over thinking this at a low hours in training? Any advice?
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Quoted:
Quoted:
OK, technically I don't have my first flight until tomorrow, so I was told, but ground school at the local community college starts today, so I'll meet my instructor, etc. I've been waiting nearly 30 years for this (I'm 29), and it still doesn't seem real. I'll be attending Quantum Helicopters at KCHD, going all the way through CFI. :) I'm so giddy, it's driving my wife crazy! Any suggestions for a new student pilot from the established members of the aviation community? I'm always open to learn from those who've gone before.


Congrats OP! I am about 4 hrs into my flight training.

To the others....What is the best way to learn with radio communications? Our instructor took us to a fly in on this past Saturday and I was just amazed that our instructor was able to get all the fast talk of the ATC. It had me like are you kidding me Am I over thinking this at a low hours in training? Any advice?


Radio comes with time.  If you are at a non towered airport and in a remote area you will need to have your instructor help you practice and learn good radio communication skills. It's not really anything you can read and memorize.  Get VFR  flight following everywhere you go.  This will help you get used to the basic communication and you will hear more radio chatter that way.

I was lucky in that I did my PPL at a towered airport in Class B airspace.  I'm very comfortable with radios because of it and can hang with the best of pilots when it comes to radio coms.  Honestly, it isn't rocket science but does take some practice.   I hear GA guys on the radio who struggle or flat out can't communicate when they enter the class B airspace here.  One time I heard the controller refuse clearance into Class B because this bubba couldn't communicate his location or what he was trying to accomplish.  There were a lot of Uhhhhhh,  Ummmmm, Lemme see's.  I hear a lot of it here but luckily the controllers are used to the schools and cut people a bit of slack.  There are many GA pilots who avoid towered airports because they don't feel comfortable on the radio.  You really do not want to be one of these pilots.
Link Posted: 8/24/2015 11:50:18 PM EDT
[#8]
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GI Bill?
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Negative. Saving, a wife that makes decent money, working myself while going to school, and yes, a loan.

Because I'm going through the college, it's a Part 141 program. Nothing I could do about that, if what loans we did take out we're going to be reasonable on the interest (we don't have a home or any equity to secure a private loan with good rates) and have a reasonable payment period. I've heard and read everything about the pros and cons of various financing options and it is what it is, at this point. We've crunched numbers and have accepted the calculated risks involved. I'm sure we'll be fine there.

As for the downsides to Part 141, I'm familiar there as well (spent the past year and a half researching our options while navigating the medical's special issuance world). I would have highly preferred a Part 61 program, but it wasn't going to happen in the time frame we needed for things to work out on a career level. I'm a quick learner and feel I'll do OK.

And sadly, I don't fly until next week. :( But I suppose that'll give me time to study in the mornings this week to get a jump start!
Link Posted: 8/24/2015 11:55:11 PM EDT
[#9]
Link Posted: 8/25/2015 12:33:53 AM EDT
[#10]
If you are doing your training as part of a college degree program, the choice between part 61 and 141 has likely already been made for you.  This is especially true if you are doing it using VA benefits. So, with that said, make sure your instructor is willing to do syllabus deviations if you run into Wx issues during training.  Part 141 training can actually be accomplished in the same manner as part 61, if your instructor thinks ahead and is willing to do the paperwork. The chief pilot has to go along with it as well.  





Your future as a pilot depends on you getting hired as a CFI once you are done training.  Your best odds of getting hired are at the school you do your training at.  Your job interview starts day one.  I know a lot of pilots who didn't get that first job, and are now out of the aviation biz.  At least they still have the loans to remind them of their days as a pilot.







Start studying now.  Limitations and emergency procedures.  Read up on aerodynamic hazards, how to avoid them, and how to get out of them if you get into them.  Read each chapter multiple times.  Ask questions in the margins, and then get those questions answered by your instructor.  Spend every day memorizing something critical.  







Take notes.  Your notes will become a great study guide later for check rides.  I actually got to use some of my IFR/CFII notes for a job interview over the phone.  Was told we could have our notes for it.  I had very organized notes, which I arranged prior to the interview.  Found out later I was the only candidate to pass.  







Show up early to your lessons.  Ground and flight.  The school management will notice, and your instructor will put more effort into your training if you take it serious.







Even if the Wx is terrible, always go out and preflight.  If the Wx clears, even briefly, you will have the option to fly.  If you don't preflight, then you have already decided not to fly.  I did my training in the Pacific Northwest, and got to fly more than other students because I was ready to fly when the Wx broke.  Worst case, you spent a little extra time learning the aircraft.  







Spend time listening to the radio.  Get used to the phraseology and cadence.  Practice it as well.  Think ahead, what are you trying to communicate, and then do it clearly and efficiently.  







Learning to hover is frustrating.  Your mind will tell you it's impossible, and then you will see your instructor hover with no effort.  It will come.  







Remember that your instructor is there to teach and guide you. You are not there solely for his benefit so he can build hours.  If you don't click with your instructor, get a different one.







Don't spend extra money that you don't need to spend.  Money goes fast in aviation.  







Just a few things off the top of my head.  I started my training about 8 years ago, at 29 as well.  It can be done.  You can achieve a very good quality of life.  You just have to work for it.


 
Link Posted: 8/25/2015 6:47:18 AM EDT
[#11]
Congrats for setting out on the best decision you ever made! I did the same thing in 1992 and have been flying professionally ever since. First and foremost is to have an understanding spouse so one does not aquire AIDS (aviation induced divorce syndrome, yes this is real...). Read like your life depends on it, it does. With that being said here is a list of recommended reading.

Books
http://www.amazon.com/Cyclic-Collective-Shawn-Coyle/dp/0557090660/ref=pd_sim_14_2/176-0049100-3254153?ie=UTF8&refRID=0AADZ5RT709CJ8JHB62Y

http://www.amazon.com/Little-Autorotations-print-Shawn-Coyle/dp/0979263840/ref=pd_sim_14_3/176-0049100-3254153?ie=UTF8&refRID=0AADZ5RT709CJ8JHB62Y

http://www.amazon.com/Helicopter-Aerodynamics-Volume-Ray-Prouty/dp/0557089913

http://www.amazon.com/Helicopter-Aerodynamics-Vol-Volume-Prouty/dp/055709044X/ref=pd_sim_14_1/176-0049100-3254153?ie=UTF8&refRID=0AADZ5RT709CJ8JHB62Y

Continuous reinforcement
http://ntsb.gov/_layouts/ntsb.aviation/month.aspx

http://www.pprune.org

Enjoy every minute and avoid any story that starts off with "I have a friend"



Clint



Link Posted: 8/25/2015 2:39:47 PM EDT
[#12]
Congratulations. I remember the excitement I felt when I started flight school in Pensacola 45 years ago. I had a good time flying. I hope you do too.
Link Posted: 8/26/2015 8:33:00 PM EDT
[#13]
Quantum is good stuff. I fly helis and work for a flight school out of Prescott. Advise?...more money! You can never have enough in heli flight school. If you have any specific questions feel free to PM me.  
Link Posted: 8/27/2015 12:27:01 AM EDT
[#14]
I'm curious, how much money on average does it take to get a PPL in helos?   I hear it is much more expensive than fixed wing.
Link Posted: 8/27/2015 1:04:36 AM EDT
[#15]
Thanks, everybody! I got contacted by my instructor, and I'm officially scheduled for my first flight on Monday at 7AM! I've got plenty of book work to do in the meantime!

Also, they quote you about $20k-24k for a PPL, depending on how quickly you learn. That's the realistic quote. By the minimums, they'll tell you about $15k, but nobody meets the minimums, for the most part.
Link Posted: 8/27/2015 8:40:21 AM EDT
[#16]
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Also, they quote you about $20k-24k for a PPL, depending on how quickly you learn. That's the realistic quote. By the minimums, they'll tell you about $15k, but nobody meets the minimums, for the most part.
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It costs $20K just to get a private nowadays!?!?  
Link Posted: 8/27/2015 11:44:48 AM EDT
[#17]
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It costs $20K just to get a private nowadays!?!?  
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Quoted:
Also, they quote you about $20k-24k for a PPL, depending on how quickly you learn. That's the realistic quote. By the minimums, they'll tell you about $15k, but nobody meets the minimums, for the most part.

It costs $20K just to get a private nowadays!?!?  


It's costing my son about 10K do a helo ADD-ON!
Link Posted: 8/27/2015 12:18:12 PM EDT
[#18]
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It costs $20K just to get a private nowadays!?!?  
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Also, they quote you about $20k-24k for a PPL, depending on how quickly you learn. That's the realistic quote. By the minimums, they'll tell you about $15k, but nobody meets the minimums, for the most part.

It costs $20K just to get a private nowadays!?!?  


Most schools charge between $250-350/hr for an R22 wet. Quantum is $285/hr wet solo, $300 for dual time, I believe. Using the "national average" of about 75 hours at $300/hr to get a PPL for new students, and that's $22,500 in flight costs alone, nevermind ground school, books, sectionals, headset, other flight supplies and check rides/writtens. Some learn quicker than others. I'm hoping I'm one of them!
Link Posted: 8/27/2015 10:50:16 PM EDT
[#19]
Don't skimp on hearing protection.   And not just while flying.......the ramp is always loud and you lose hearing on the ramp just as easily as in the plane.

I have been flying on and off for almost 30 years, with the last 15 years as a job.   Had David Clark passives most of the time, but recently Lightspeed Zulu's.   The Zulu's are ok, but should have sprung for the Bose.

Anyway, best of luck and protect your hearing!!!!   After 10,000 plus hours of flying, and being on noisy ramps all the time, I now watch movies with subtitles.     Take protecting your hearing seriously!!

Link Posted: 8/28/2015 1:15:49 AM EDT
[#20]
Congratulations and good luck OP!  You're going into a field where you'll never 'work' a day in your life!  
("If you love what you do"...)

+1 for ear protection.  I wish I'd worn plugs under my headsets early on, maybe then I could still hear and my wife wouldn't be mad at me all the time.  Doesn't matter so much when you get to corporate jets, but if it has props or a canopy, wear ear plugs.

Here are my two pieces of advice:

First, Don't buy a kneeboard.  Never wear a kneeboard.  Ever.  Unless you're a fighter pilot writing his autobiography during cruise, you don't need one, and they promote bad habits.
Later on when you're getting into corporate flying, you just can't use one.  It comes across as unprofessional and frankly scares the hell out of everyone around you that you're so reliant on hand-written notes that you have to keep them strapped to your leg.
Furthermore, if you get into the habit of writing everything down, you'll never be able to break it, and you'll be dependent on that kneeboard your entire life.  The less things like that in the cockpit the better.

Second is kinda related, don't get into a habit of writing everything down.  I'm not saying don't write down stuff like complicated clearances and important portions of the ATIS, but don't write down stuff that ATC tells you enroute.  Just do it.  

Where this is coming from, is about half a dozen pilots I checked-out at an old job, were all taught to write everything down, all the time.  I don't know where this came from, but they all did it, and it was horrible.
About half of them even did it long-hand, which was just beyond ridiculous.  One had to have his clearance read back to him three times before he got it all down, covering half a page (just for a simple check-out flight from a small towered field, 3 landings and some airwork!).
Only then could he start getting the airplane ready to taxi.  

These were guys that had already been interviewed, passed the interview and were now being checked-out in a Cessna 182 as our sorta 'make sure they can fly okay' thing.  They were all commercial pilots, a little fresh but all were done with training and wanting to start their first aviation job.  They were nice guys, put together, and real professional in person.  But once they got into the cockpit, it was like they had no short-term memory.  They couldn't listen to a clearance, put in the initial altitude, appropriate frequencies and squawk code as they did and then read it all back, they had to write it down.  And it came across as tremendously unprofessional and incompetent.  Then once the ride got going, about half of them wrote it down every time they got a new assigned altitude or heading, BEFORE they did it!  

So now, if I see somebody with the kneeboard strapped on, I pretty much discount the idea of hiring.  It might be wrong, but it is what it is.  

I've flown with right-seaters who had to write everything down, tried to gently counsel them to stop writing Charles Dickens, and finally had to take over the radios and delegate them to seat-warmers because they were too slow to read stuff back or make inputs to the FMS.  These are guys with their ATPs in jets, who have the same bad habits that some poor instructor didn't break them of early on, and it's affecting their career prospects now.  If I take away their full-size notepad they can't seem to function.

When I fly, I keep a short block of sticky notes in one of my cupholders.  I'll scratch down an ATIS that I pick up enroute (just the pertinent items, basically wind, temp, alt setting, in short-hand) and maybe my departure clearance if there's more than a half-dozen fixes and it's given by a guy who thinks he's an auctioneer, but that's about it.  Normally a full day of flying will fill one sticky note.  If I'm in an older airplane that requires take-off and landing numbers to be pulled out of the book and filled into a TOLD card, then that's my sticky note for the day.

I know you're working on your private, and pretty much all of that about ATC clearances and fixes and stuff went over your head, but just trust me.  Start from day one exercising your short-term memory and thinking about the flight, and you'll be in a great position when you start working on your instrument rating.  And stay away from kneeboards.  It's possible they're the aviation equivalent of Birth Control Glasses.
Link Posted: 8/28/2015 3:14:22 AM EDT
[#21]
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It's costing my son about 10K do a helo ADD-ON!
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Also, they quote you about $20k-24k for a PPL, depending on how quickly you learn. That's the realistic quote. By the minimums, they'll tell you about $15k, but nobody meets the minimums, for the most part.

It costs $20K just to get a private nowadays!?!?  


It's costing my son about 10K do a helo ADD-ON!


Cost me $12k to do an add-on about 3 years ago.
Link Posted: 8/28/2015 4:23:54 AM EDT
[#22]
It's a "Push To Talk" button, not a "Push To Think" button.  Know what you are going to say before you key the mike.  Things will go smoother that way, and you will be able to make those sentence long calls in 3 seconds or less.

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First, Don't buy a kneeboard.  Never wear a kneeboard.  Ever.  Unless you're a fighter pilot writing his autobiography during cruise, you don't need one, and they promote bad habits.
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I disagree.  
A kneeboard is a tool.  Use it as one, but don't depend on it.  The description you gave of guys writing paragraphs is pretty ridiculous, I agree.  I probably wouldn't hire them either, as it shows a potentially dangerous task prioritization problem.  That said, scribbling down part of a clearance or unexpected frequency (that you'll have to tune back to later) is a reasonable thing!  I hate getting switched back to a frequency a half-hour later, and having to look it up.
Link Posted: 8/28/2015 5:49:58 AM EDT
[#23]
Hi OP,
Have you completed your first flight yet? If so how was your first hover practice

I say this because after 321 "introductory flight lessons" given and more than a few students from zero to hero status I learned a trick that helped students grasp hovering in a fraction of the time and seemed to work for everyone. after countless hours of repeating "don't look down, look out" it dawned on me that we all share a basic trait. When humans become task saturated they tend to focus closer and closer to themselves both visually and mentally and my droning on about look out further was falling on deaf ears. It also dawned on me that trying to get them to use the compass on the R-22 as a horizontal reference was similarly ignored.

I had an upcoming flight with another instructors student who was having his lunch eaten by trying to maintain a stable hover. I borrowed a grease pencil from my well equipped fellow instructor and went out to fly with Mr. Wobbles. Once we got out into our practice area I took the controls and placed the grease pencil on the bubble in front of the student. Once he verified it was on the horizon I drew a horizontal line across his side of the bubble. Then I put a short vertical line in the center. I gave him back the controls and told him to keep the line on the horizon. Once he got that part I had him do some precision pedal work by pointing his new "cross hairs" at various trees, cows, fence posts etcetera and the difference was dramatic. Within 5 minutes his mental hurdle was cleared and he was solid and stable to the point where he was able to pick up to a hover and set back down without any coaching.

My following flight was with a new student who had just completed her first introductory flight. Typicality it would take a student between 3 and 5 hours to become proficient at hovering but with the aid of the trusty grease pencil she was hovering acceptably by the end of her first lesson. This little trick managed to bring our hover proficiency average (the ability to maintain a stable hover, pick up and set down with no lateral movement) down to 2 to 3 hours. Note these times also included straight and level cruise work to keep the student comfortable and engaged in the learning process.

That trick only took me around 1,000 hours of dual given to figure out .

Enjoy your training, always listen to the little voice in your head and when you get stumped on something just remember "if helicopters were so hard to fly, the Army wouldn't have them"

Semper Fi
Clint
Link Posted: 8/28/2015 10:39:02 AM EDT
[#24]
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It's a "Push To Talk" button, not a "Push To Think" button.  Know what you are going to say before you key the mike.  Things will go smoother that way, and you will be able to make those sentence long calls in 3 seconds or less.


I disagree.  
A kneeboard is a tool.  Use it as one, but don't depend on it.  The description you gave of guys writing paragraphs is pretty ridiculous, I agree.  I probably wouldn't hire them either, as it shows a potentially dangerous task prioritization problem.  That said, scribbling down part of a clearance or unexpected frequency (that you'll have to tune back to later) is a reasonable thing!  I hate getting switched back to a frequency a half-hour later, and having to look it up.
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Quoted:
It's a "Push To Talk" button, not a "Push To Think" button.  Know what you are going to say before you key the mike.  Things will go smoother that way, and you will be able to make those sentence long calls in 3 seconds or less.

Quoted:
First, Don't buy a kneeboard.  Never wear a kneeboard.  Ever.  Unless you're a fighter pilot writing his autobiography during cruise, you don't need one, and they promote bad habits.

I disagree.  
A kneeboard is a tool.  Use it as one, but don't depend on it.  The description you gave of guys writing paragraphs is pretty ridiculous, I agree.  I probably wouldn't hire them either, as it shows a potentially dangerous task prioritization problem.  That said, scribbling down part of a clearance or unexpected frequency (that you'll have to tune back to later) is a reasonable thing!  I hate getting switched back to a frequency a half-hour later, and having to look it up.


It is a tool, sure, but the only people I've seen using that tool are the people that are budding authors.  Or the one guy at every airport who was minding his own business when a Sporty's catalog threw up on him.

I agree completely, that's basically what I said in my post as well.  That's why I have a sticky note nearby.  You don't need a kneeboard strapped on in order to jot down a frequency or scrawl out part of a clearance.  The kneeboard itself, there's nothing wrong with (okay, they're dorky as hell (no offense), and they have a stigma with a lot of guys like me who've seen knee-boarders in action), but most of the people that use them seem to be dependent on them, and seem to be verbose writers in the cockpit.  Which generally takes away from the flying.

In my defense, I didn't realize this was a helicopter pilot thread until after my initial reply.  Sorry OP, I don't think you'll have a free hand to worry about writing anything down, and if you're in one of those whirly-birds, you can wear a kneeboard all you want.  You might find one that has a small net around it to catch your fillings  when they occasionally fall out.  
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 11:00:24 PM EDT
[#25]
I think the pilot shortage may only include Fixed wing at this time.    Fwiw-  I have known a great many people who started in helos and crossed over to fixed wing flying (airline, corporate and 135)

In any case, my advice applies to either world.  Study as much as you can on your own.  Get a new instructor if you aren't compatible with the one you have.   Do not focus on the cost.  (I know it's almost impossible not to)    It's a rich man's world, but I'm damned glad I didn't know that when I started.
Link Posted: 9/1/2015 3:56:47 PM EDT
[#26]
Well, two (short) flights in, and things are going well so far. :) I've only got 1.6 hours between both flights since we've done pretty detailed preflights so I know the proper way to do them and what to look for.  Starting tomorrow, I do pre-flight on my own with the instructor watching, and then Thursday I do it on my own with the instructor watching from the break room inside (with their own pre-flight afterwards to make sure I've done it correctly.

First flight yesterday was a total blur. The flight (0.9 hours) went by way too quickly, and involved mostly trying each control out on it's own, then combining them for a brief time towards the end, plus training area familiarization, navigation aids, etc. Today, I was on all three controls for the majority of the flight, including takeoffs, climbs, turns in the pattern, approaches, and some basic, but brief, hovering (only about 30 seconds worth while some traffic cleared).

What areas do I need to work on? Well, all of them, haha. But of note is the fact that I over-control (common for new pilots, so I hear), and I tend to hold right pressure on the cyclic at times. I also over-grip the controls. I think as confidence builds, I'll relax more. The sooner that happens, the better, but I'm trying not to over-think things and let them come naturally.

In the 30 seconds of hover time I had, I did OK. I still over-controlled, but it wasn't awful. Lots of work to do there, though. But that first approach I did with all controls was a humbling experience, indeed, haha!

I also knocked out the SFAR 73 to part 61 Awareness Training yesterday. Good grief, that video is old! About 20 years old, if the dates on the "most recent data" they had were anything to go off of. Pretty sobering stuff, though. I always figured low rotor RPM stall was bad because it would take too long to recover from it. Wrong! It's bad because it's literally an unrecoverable condition if it gets out of hand. You simply can't overcome the drag that develops, and down you go. So I think I got the point on that for sure.

Hard as this all is, I still came down with a huge, stupid grin both times, and I don't see that changing soon. Maybe if I hit a significant plateau, but I still think this is going to be the best decision of my life, to chase this dream and make the cockpit my office. It'll be a long road to get there yet, but the hard work will ultimately pay off in the end!
Link Posted: 9/1/2015 6:59:29 PM EDT
[#27]
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I sure hope so!
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OK, technically I don't have my first flight until tomorrow, so I was told, but ground school at the local community college starts today, so I'll meet my instructor, etc. I've been waiting nearly 30 years for this (I'm 29), and it still doesn't seem real. I'll be attending Quantum Helicopters at KCHD, going all the way through CFI. :) I'm so giddy, it's driving my wife crazy! Any suggestions for a new student pilot from the established members of the aviation community? I'm always open to learn from those who've gone before.


Congrats OP! I am about 4 hrs into my flight training.

To the others....What is the best way to learn with radio communications? Our instructor took us to a fly in on this past Saturday and I was just amazed that our instructor was able to get all the fast talk of the ATC. It had me like are you kidding me Am I over thinking this at a low hours in training? Any advice?


You're over-thinking it.

Go to Live ATC.net and pick any of the KORD (Chicago) feeds and listen in. If you can understand those machine-gun talking yahoos, you'll get along anywhere.


I sure hope so!


90% of Aviating is anticipation.   The conversation, lingo, structure, is basically canned.   You learn by experience, but the good news about comm, is that you can practice it on the ground.   Find a pilot or atc that you can practice with, or simply write down both sides of the script and learn it.  Who you are, where you are, and what you want to do.
Link Posted: 9/2/2015 1:41:36 PM EDT
[#28]
Any suggestions on approaches from other heli pilots? As with anything, things will become more natural and I'll improve as I log more time, but my approaches are a bit rough. Granted, I'm only at 3.6 hours and I'm a harsh critic, so maybe I need to relax some, haha. But I can get things lined up well enough for a 10* approach angle, and hold that up until about 100' AGL or so. From there on, as I bleed off airspeed, things get shaky, probably around 30kts. I've only today been "officially" introduced to hovers, so I'm obviously at a very early stage of juggling all controls, which becomes more important and requires more "processing" as you slow down and pass through ETL, so again, perhaps I just need to be patient and enjoy the ride.

Otherwise, I do OK. My first day of hover practice found me all over the place initially, but that cleared up. I was eventually able to hold about a 15-20 second hover, and from there started our hover taxi back to our spot on the ramp, but lost things about 30' later. LOADS of fun, and I'm enjoying the challenge so far! At altitude, I do very well with managing everything else (75kts, 1800' MSL, trimmed/coordinated, and MAP at about 18" or so), so I did pretty much all of our flying to the practice area. I'm starting to relax (first two flights, I was gripping the controls pretty hard and was hunching over a bit due to general body tension), so things are going much better now.

We also got to watch a flight of 10 OH58D Kiowas departs from KCHD on their way to Davis-Monthan to be moth-balled. Sad to see them going there, but way cool to watch them spool up, hover taxi out, and depart as a flight! This helicopter flying stuff ain't half bad!

Thanks for the support and suggestions so far, everyone!
Link Posted: 9/2/2015 2:54:47 PM EDT
[#29]
Link Posted: 9/2/2015 3:09:41 PM EDT
[#30]
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One of my good buddies from the Kiowa course was in that KW flight.

As for approaches? Well, Im a fan of constant angle. Brisk walk, transition forward and down with your eyes, and remember to keep flying, so you avoid stopping high and short.

Discussed "Circle of Action" yet?
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Nice! It was a trip watching ten of them spool up and then hover taxi out, one right after the other. One of the ships had a "For Sale" sign in the windows on one side, and what looked like a woman in a white (wedding?) dress from the bust up in the other, haha.

By brisk walk, you mean to say that during the entire approach, my speed over the ground appears to be at the same pace of about a brisk walk regardless of altitude, correct?

And no, I'm not familiar with the "circle of action" yet. I can ask about it tomorrow, unless you'd care to explain it to me. Either works.
Link Posted: 9/3/2015 5:51:46 AM EDT
[#31]
Congrats OP.  I have always wanted to fly choppers.  If I had the cash I would  do it.  Good luck sir on your training.
Link Posted: 9/3/2015 4:08:21 PM EDT
[#32]
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Congrats OP.  I have always wanted to fly choppers.  If I had the cash I would  do it.  Good luck sir on your training.
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Many thanks! Being able to fly helis has been a life-long dream, and it's certainly not an opportunity that fell into my lap. We've spent the past little while taking care of special issuance stuff, the cost of which was several thousand dollars on it's own. But it's already an effort and sacrifice that's well worth it!

Logged 1.2 today (for a total of 3.8 hours), and by the end of it, I was hovering!! Granted, it's not a super rock-steady hover, but I was on the sticks with little instructor involvement for a good majority of the flight. We also got into hover taxiing. I did great with regular taxiing, did OK with taxiing to the right, did OK to the left, and did terrible to the rear, haha. It's friggin' nerve racking hovering in a direction where you can't see anything!! But I didn't think I'd be hovering already, so. I was pretty stoked about that. Once I got my eyes outside at a reference point, my struggles from yesterday disappeared almost completely. This is amazing, and it felt great!
Link Posted: 9/3/2015 4:31:39 PM EDT
[#33]
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Quoted:


Many thanks! Being able to fly helis has been a life-long dream, and it's certainly not an opportunity that fell into my lap. We've spent the past little while taking care of special issuance stuff, the cost of which was several thousand dollars on it's own. But it's already an effort and sacrifice that's well worth it!

Logged 1.2 today (for a total of 3.8 hours), and by the end of it, I was hovering!! Granted, it's not a super rock-steady hover, but I was on the sticks with little instructor involvement for a good majority of the flight. We also got into hover taxiing. I did great with regular taxiing, did OK with taxiing to the right, did OK to the left, and did terrible to the rear, haha. It's friggin' nerve racking hovering in a direction where you can't see anything!! But I didn't think I'd be hovering already, so. I was pretty stoked about that. Once I got my eyes outside at a reference point, my struggles from yesterday disappeared almost completely. This is amazing, and it felt great!
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Congrats OP.  I have always wanted to fly choppers.  If I had the cash I would  do it.  Good luck sir on your training.


Many thanks! Being able to fly helis has been a life-long dream, and it's certainly not an opportunity that fell into my lap. We've spent the past little while taking care of special issuance stuff, the cost of which was several thousand dollars on it's own. But it's already an effort and sacrifice that's well worth it!

Logged 1.2 today (for a total of 3.8 hours), and by the end of it, I was hovering!! Granted, it's not a super rock-steady hover, but I was on the sticks with little instructor involvement for a good majority of the flight. We also got into hover taxiing. I did great with regular taxiing, did OK with taxiing to the right, did OK to the left, and did terrible to the rear, haha. It's friggin' nerve racking hovering in a direction where you can't see anything!! But I didn't think I'd be hovering already, so. I was pretty stoked about that. Once I got my eyes outside at a reference point, my struggles from yesterday disappeared almost completely. This is amazing, and it felt great!


Just wait till you start to practice inverted!


Link Posted: 9/6/2015 10:47:36 PM EDT
[#34]
Hovering: initially, keep your eyes way out at the horizon.  As you settle down, bring your eyes in closer to a point near the aircraft.  Relax.  Smile.  Think of Bob Ross, the painter.  "A little bit of cyclic, a little bit of pedal. That's it. No mistakes. Perfect."

Bob Ross

Approach: at the transition point, make a significant collective reduction.  Imagine casting a fishing line, with the line extending from your forehead to the intended point of landing.  Reel in the fishing line gradually with collective.  

Practice your radio calls.  It is important to sound cool on the radios.

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Many thanks! Being able to fly helis has been a life-long dream, and it's certainly not an opportunity that fell into my lap. We've spent the past little while taking care of special issuance stuff, the cost of which was several thousand dollars on it's own. But it's already an effort and sacrifice that's well worth it!

Logged 1.2 today (for a total of 3.8 hours), and by the end of it, I was hovering!! Granted, it's not a super rock-steady hover, but I was on the sticks with little instructor involvement for a good majority of the flight. We also got into hover taxiing. I did great with regular taxiing, did OK with taxiing to the right, did OK to the left, and did terrible to the rear, haha. It's friggin' nerve racking hovering in a direction where you can't see anything!! But I didn't think I'd be hovering already, so. I was pretty stoked about that. Once I got my eyes outside at a reference point, my struggles from yesterday disappeared almost completely. This is amazing, and it felt great!
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Congrats OP.  I have always wanted to fly choppers.  If I had the cash I would  do it.  Good luck sir on your training.


Many thanks! Being able to fly helis has been a life-long dream, and it's certainly not an opportunity that fell into my lap. We've spent the past little while taking care of special issuance stuff, the cost of which was several thousand dollars on it's own. But it's already an effort and sacrifice that's well worth it!

Logged 1.2 today (for a total of 3.8 hours), and by the end of it, I was hovering!! Granted, it's not a super rock-steady hover, but I was on the sticks with little instructor involvement for a good majority of the flight. We also got into hover taxiing. I did great with regular taxiing, did OK with taxiing to the right, did OK to the left, and did terrible to the rear, haha. It's friggin' nerve racking hovering in a direction where you can't see anything!! But I didn't think I'd be hovering already, so. I was pretty stoked about that. Once I got my eyes outside at a reference point, my struggles from yesterday disappeared almost completely. This is amazing, and it felt great!

Link Posted: 9/7/2015 3:25:54 AM EDT
[#35]
For approaches:
Airspeed with pitch
Sink rate with collective
"tear the paper" (up collective = forward cyclic and vice versa)--keeps you relatively stable on angle
Link Posted: 9/7/2015 10:26:36 AM EDT
[#36]
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You're over-thinking it.

Go to Live ATC.net and pick any of the KORD (Chicago) feeds and listen in. If you can understand those machine-gun talking yahoos, you'll get along anywhere.
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OK, technically I don't have my first flight until tomorrow, so I was told, but ground school at the local community college starts today, so I'll meet my instructor, etc. I've been waiting nearly 30 years for this (I'm 29), and it still doesn't seem real. I'll be attending Quantum Helicopters at KCHD, going all the way through CFI. :) I'm so giddy, it's driving my wife crazy! Any suggestions for a new student pilot from the established members of the aviation community? I'm always open to learn from those who've gone before.


Congrats OP! I am about 4 hrs into my flight training.

To the others....What is the best way to learn with radio communications? Our instructor took us to a fly in on this past Saturday and I was just amazed that our instructor was able to get all the fast talk of the ATC. It had me like are you kidding me Am I over thinking this at a low hours in training? Any advice?


You're over-thinking it.

Go to Live ATC.net and pick any of the KORD (Chicago) feeds and listen in. If you can understand those machine-gun talking yahoos, you'll get along anywhere.


This.

Then go listen to KPHX, KSDL, KIWA and others to hear local fixes, reporting points and facility names. While the details and speed differ it's all basically the same. Actively listen
Link Posted: 9/7/2015 1:29:21 PM EDT
[#37]
You may have figured out basic radio already but this may help.   There are 4 basic things needed when communicating:

1. Who you are talking to
2. Who you are
3. Where you are
4. What you want

Ex:  Dallas Approach, this is King Air 556SP, located 10 miles to the east of Mid Way Regional at 1500 feet, would like VFR flight following to KMEM at 7500 feet.



One other item needed when taking off or entering a towered airport is the ATIS.  This would be item number 5 to be added to the list above when around these airports.  So if you are contacting ground at Addison and wish to fly to KMEM it would sound like this:

On ramp:  Addison ground, this is King Air 556SP, located at X FBO, would like VFR flight following to KMEM at 7500 feet with information Charlie (or whatever current ATIS is at the time).

In air coming in for landing:   Addison tower, this is King Air 556SP, located 12 miles to the east at 1500 feet, would like to come in for landing,  with information Charlie.



When I first began taking over radio communication during my FFL training I would count these items off on my fingers as I was speaking to ATC to make sure I didn't miss anything and always used the same order to prevent errors.  I trained in Class B airspace so communication had to be sharp and to the point.  The more you do it the more natural it becomes.   This summer I flew over NYC in extremely busy airspace with complex IFR radio communication and had no problem at all (other than their fast Yankee accents).  

Like one of the other posters suggested, I used LiveATC and listened in on them while I was sitting around studying ground.  After a while you will be able to predict what the pilot and ATC's responses are to each other.  What I've given you in the examples above is a framework.  I notice some people use slightly different technique or order but it's basically all the same.  If you get good with this then transition to IFR communication will be seamless.

Congrats on your training.  It sounds like you are doing well.  

Link Posted: 9/9/2015 1:33:23 AM EDT
[#38]
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Don't skimp on hearing protection.   And not just while flying.......the ramp is always loud and you lose hearing on the ramp just as easily as in the plane.

I have been flying on and off for almost 30 years, with the last 15 years as a job.   Had David Clark passives most of the time, but recently Lightspeed Zulu's.   The Zulu's are ok, but should have sprung for the Bose.

Anyway, best of luck and protect your hearing!!!!   After 10,000 plus hours of flying, and being on noisy ramps all the time, I now watch movies with subtitles.     Take protecting your hearing seriously!!

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Many years from now they will dig my body up and say, "this man was a pilot."  How do you know this says one of the other researchers?  He will resonded, "you can tell because his head is dented in from wearing what they called David Clark headsets."
Link Posted: 9/9/2015 3:07:37 PM EDT
[#39]
Thanks, everyone! Lots of good advice here.

Since my last post, I've been introduced to straight-in autos, 180 autos, low RPM recovery, VRS/Settling with power, air taxi, and quick stops. It all comes at you fast, but it's a blast! The first auto scared the bajeezus out of me at how abrupt the descent was and how quickly things happen, but I actually kind of enjoy them now. :) They're a challenge, and I like that. I'm making a good portion of the radio calls now, and doing most pickups and set downs, along with most hover taxiing and takeoffs. I have the basics down well enough to meet solo standards, just need to work on my comms and get the emergency procedures down (still more to learn there, naturally). I look forward to ALWAYS learning, which is really what my PPL ticket allows me to do, keep learning.

However, I now have an urge to shout "clear" when starting any vehicle, and go over my pre-takeoff, hover, and pre-landing checklists in my head when leaving or entering the garage, haha.
Link Posted: 9/10/2015 7:39:21 PM EDT
[#40]
If you do not already have one, get yourself a small notebook you can keep with you and use it after every flight.  If you have an instructor, take notes in the debrief.  Once you are on your own, make notes for yourself about things to sustain and things to improve.  

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Thanks, everyone! Lots of good advice here.

Since my last post, I've been introduced to straight-in autos, 180 autos, low RPM recovery, VRS/Settling with power, air taxi, and quick stops. It all comes at you fast, but it's a blast! The first auto scared the bajeezus out of me at how abrupt the descent was and how quickly things happen, but I actually kind of enjoy them now. :) They're a challenge, and I like that. I'm making a good portion of the radio calls now, and doing most pickups and set downs, along with most hover taxiing and takeoffs. I have the basics down well enough to meet solo standards, just need to work on my comms and get the emergency procedures down (still more to learn there, naturally). I look forward to ALWAYS learning, which is really what my PPL ticket allows me to do, keep learning.

However, I now have an urge to shout "clear" when starting any vehicle, and go over my pre-takeoff, hover, and pre-landing checklists in my head when leaving or entering the garage, haha.
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Link Posted: 9/12/2015 6:37:37 PM EDT
[#41]
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Most schools charge between $250-350/hr for an R22 wet. Quantum is $285/hr wet solo, $300 for dual time, I believe. Using the "national average" of about 75 hours at $300/hr to get a PPL for new students, and that's $22,500 in flight costs alone, nevermind ground school, books, sectionals, headset, other flight supplies and check rides/writtens. Some learn quicker than others. I'm hoping I'm one of them!
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Also, they quote you about $20k-24k for a PPL, depending on how quickly you learn. That's the realistic quote. By the minimums, they'll tell you about $15k, but nobody meets the minimums, for the most part.

It costs $20K just to get a private nowadays!?!?  


Most schools charge between $250-350/hr for an R22 wet. Quantum is $285/hr wet solo, $300 for dual time, I believe. Using the "national average" of about 75 hours at $300/hr to get a PPL for new students, and that's $22,500 in flight costs alone, nevermind ground school, books, sectionals, headset, other flight supplies and check rides/writtens. Some learn quicker than others. I'm hoping I'm one of them!


I did it in 42 hours, you can too. Just put your head down and learn it.
Link Posted: 11/11/2015 3:22:06 PM EDT
[#42]
Updated the OP. I'm scheduled for my check ride on the 19th, open to any and all suggestions. Thanks, everyone!
Link Posted: 11/14/2015 5:50:24 PM EDT
[#43]
Link Posted: 11/15/2015 9:59:22 AM EDT
[#44]
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Updated the OP. I'm scheduled for my check ride on the 19th, open to any and all suggestions. Thanks, everyone!
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Awesome! I got my private heli add-on about 2 years ago (in fact I'm due for my first heli biennial ) and I've just got the written and maybe 5 or 6 hours of instruction to go for my heli commercial.

Here is what I'd suggest (and what I did):

1. Fly a LOT just before the checkride.
2. Make sure the auto's are really sharp. I probably did 20 auto's in the week before the checkride. I would have done more the day before but the school made me take that day off
3. If it's not going to be your home field, fly over to where you will be doing the checkride and do a few auto's there to get your landmarks set. It's cheating a little, I suppose
4. During the checkride fly confident but not cocky. Even if you are nervous, and you will be, don't appear so. Exude a warm professionalism.
5. Visualize success at every stage of the game. You will perform as you see yourself in your mind's eye (a little bit of sports psychology there )
6. Talk yourself through every maneuver. Unlike your instructor the examiner won't be Chatty Cathy. This lets the examiner know what you are thinking and keeps you focused. This last one is not for everyone, but it works for me.

Oh, and plan to write a BIG check My checkride day was 2.5 hours in the ship (had to go over to another field), plus the examiner--ouch!
Link Posted: 11/15/2015 12:31:57 PM EDT
[#45]
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Yikes! Personally I think those helicopter schools are a bit of a scam with how they try to convince everyone that there are helicopter jobs everywhere. Fixed wing there's a pipeline, helicopter, well, the mil guys will get the jobs while you're trying to get turbine time.
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I disagree. The helicopter industry is much smaller than the fixed wing industry and the pipeline is murky, but there are jobs out there. A dedicated, competent pilot who can do some networking will have an excellent career in the industry. I'm a PIC of medium and heavy twin helicopters, and I would estimate that 33% if not more of my peers are civilian trained pilots with zero military time.
Link Posted: 11/15/2015 7:45:30 PM EDT
[#46]
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Quoted:

Awesome! I got my private heli add-on about 2 years ago (in fact I'm due for my first heli biennial ) and I've just got the written and maybe 5 or 6 hours of instruction to go for my heli commercial.

Here is what I'd suggest (and what I did):

1. Fly a LOT just before the checkride.
2. Make sure the auto's are really sharp. I probably did 20 auto's in the week before the checkride. I would have done more the day before but the school made me take that day off
3. If it's not going to be your home field, fly over to where you will be doing the checkride and do a few auto's there to get your landmarks set. It's cheating a little, I suppose
4. During the checkride fly confident but not cocky. Even if you are nervous, and you will be, don't appear so. Exude a warm professionalism.
5. Visualize success at every stage of the game. You will perform as you see yourself in your mind's eye (a little bit of sports psychology there )
6. Talk yourself through every maneuver. Unlike your instructor the examiner won't be Chatty Cathy. This lets the examiner know what you are thinking and keeps you focused. This last one is not for everyone, but it works for me.

Oh, and plan to write a BIG check My checkride day was 2.5 hours in the ship (had to go over to another field), plus the examiner--ouch!
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Updated the OP. I'm scheduled for my check ride on the 19th, open to any and all suggestions. Thanks, everyone!

Awesome! I got my private heli add-on about 2 years ago (in fact I'm due for my first heli biennial ) and I've just got the written and maybe 5 or 6 hours of instruction to go for my heli commercial.

Here is what I'd suggest (and what I did):

1. Fly a LOT just before the checkride.
2. Make sure the auto's are really sharp. I probably did 20 auto's in the week before the checkride. I would have done more the day before but the school made me take that day off
3. If it's not going to be your home field, fly over to where you will be doing the checkride and do a few auto's there to get your landmarks set. It's cheating a little, I suppose
4. During the checkride fly confident but not cocky. Even if you are nervous, and you will be, don't appear so. Exude a warm professionalism.
5. Visualize success at every stage of the game. You will perform as you see yourself in your mind's eye (a little bit of sports psychology there )
6. Talk yourself through every maneuver. Unlike your instructor the examiner won't be Chatty Cathy. This lets the examiner know what you are thinking and keeps you focused. This last one is not for everyone, but it works for me.

Oh, and plan to write a BIG check My checkride day was 2.5 hours in the ship (had to go over to another field), plus the examiner--ouch!


Thanks for the advice! I'm fairly certain the majority of the flight will be at my home field, so I've got that going for me. We can't do run-on/shallow approaches anywhere but my home field anyway, so that more or less seals the deal.

And yeah, I have 5.5 hours blocked off on our schedule. Three and a half for the ground and two for the flight.

While I feel absolutely "unready" for the check ride (I'm told most feel that way), I did manage a 97% on my written on Friday. :)
Link Posted: 11/21/2015 11:56:25 PM EDT
[#47]
How'd it go?
Link Posted: 11/22/2015 1:25:17 AM EDT
[#48]
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How'd it go?
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Doh! Forgot to update the thread. It got postponed as I've got a nasty cold I'm getting over. It's supposed to happen Tuesday as of this moment.
Link Posted: 11/22/2015 8:12:07 AM EDT
[#49]
Good luck again then!
Link Posted: 11/24/2015 6:10:58 PM EDT
[#50]
And? And? Are we having celebratory beers, or the kind you use to put out flames?
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