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Link Posted: 1/2/2015 1:26:23 PM EDT
[#1]
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Quoted:
Since your list is only a partial list of guns, I vote for a Glock 22. Due to the fact that ammo has been plentiful during the last few panics. Figuring the same will happen again. So Glock 22 IS THE answer. So when you folks are sparingly shooting or scrounging for ammo at excessive prices, My fellow 40s and I will be shooting away. But yeah, 9mm is what you should get.
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So let me get this straight. Your plan is to purchase ammo after the fertilizer hits the ventilation? Because that is the only way your comparison of availability of ammo in stores during a perceived crisis (panic) relates to availability during an actual crisis. If you don't already have it you won't be able to get it. Yeah 9mm is what you should get. It is a capable round that pretty much every family member can use. Buy two thousand rounds a month. One to shoot one to save until you are comfy in your ammo fort.
Link Posted: 1/2/2015 3:34:26 PM EDT
[#2]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


So let me get this straight. Your plan is to purchase ammo after the fertilizer hits the ventilation? Because that is the only way your comparison of availability of ammo in stores during a perceived crisis (panic) relates to availability during an actual crisis. If you don't already have it you won't be able to get it. Yeah 9mm is what you should get. It is a capable round that pretty much every family member can use. Buy two thousand rounds a month. One to shoot one to save until you are comfy in your ammo fort.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Since your list is only a partial list of guns, I vote for a Glock 22. Due to the fact that ammo has been plentiful during the last few panics. Figuring the same will happen again. So Glock 22 IS THE answer. So when you folks are sparingly shooting or scrounging for ammo at excessive prices, My fellow 40s and I will be shooting away. But yeah, 9mm is what you should get.


So let me get this straight. Your plan is to purchase ammo after the fertilizer hits the ventilation? Because that is the only way your comparison of availability of ammo in stores during a perceived crisis (panic) relates to availability during an actual crisis. If you don't already have it you won't be able to get it. Yeah 9mm is what you should get. It is a capable round that pretty much every family member can use. Buy two thousand rounds a month. One to shoot one to save until you are comfy in your ammo fort.


So we both pretty much agree that you should have a supply on hand of ammo. My point was/is if you had a 40 in the mix you will still be able to find ammo available. Did you not see the shelves the last few panics? Plenty of ammo in the 40 cal, and no 9 or 45 available. Many people can not afford a couple thousand rounds a month to shoot or stockpile.  You are forgetting that many people do not plan ahead and wait for the last possible minute to purchase. Then whine and snivel that they are being raped/gouged on price. Look at the history of ammo sales on Gunbroker. 22 ammo is still being gouged. But really I'm not going to argue with you about this. Guess we will see the next panic.
Link Posted: 1/2/2015 4:25:20 PM EDT
[#3]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


So we both pretty much agree that you should have a supply on hand of ammo. My point was/is if you had a 40 in the mix you will still be able to find ammo available. Did you not see the shelves the last few panics? Plenty of ammo in the 40 cal, and no 9 or 45 available. Many people can not afford a couple thousand rounds a month to shoot or stockpile.  You are forgetting that many people do not plan ahead and wait for the last possible minute to purchase. Then whine and snivel that they are being raped/gouged on price. Look at the history of ammo sales on Gunbroker. 22 ammo is still being gouged. But really I'm not going to argue with you about this. Guess we will see the next panic.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Since your list is only a partial list of guns, I vote for a Glock 22. Due to the fact that ammo has been plentiful during the last few panics. Figuring the same will happen again. So Glock 22 IS THE answer. So when you folks are sparingly shooting or scrounging for ammo at excessive prices, My fellow 40s and I will be shooting away. But yeah, 9mm is what you should get.


So let me get this straight. Your plan is to purchase ammo after the fertilizer hits the ventilation? Because that is the only way your comparison of availability of ammo in stores during a perceived crisis (panic) relates to availability during an actual crisis. If you don't already have it you won't be able to get it. Yeah 9mm is what you should get. It is a capable round that pretty much every family member can use. Buy two thousand rounds a month. One to shoot one to save until you are comfy in your ammo fort.


So we both pretty much agree that you should have a supply on hand of ammo. My point was/is if you had a 40 in the mix you will still be able to find ammo available. Did you not see the shelves the last few panics? Plenty of ammo in the 40 cal, and no 9 or 45 available. Many people can not afford a couple thousand rounds a month to shoot or stockpile.  You are forgetting that many people do not plan ahead and wait for the last possible minute to purchase. Then whine and snivel that they are being raped/gouged on price. Look at the history of ammo sales on Gunbroker. 22 ammo is still being gouged. But really I'm not going to argue with you about this. Guess we will see the next panic.


No need to argue on any of your points because we essentially agree. I misunderstood your first post. Carry on.

I have a .40 cal handgun to supplement my 9mm just because it kept me from shooting through my ammo fort last panic.

Familiar with human nature, rarely do people prepare for anything beyond today.
Link Posted: 1/2/2015 5:03:58 PM EDT
[#4]
I mean, really, said family members should be the one deciding. Not us or your.

That said, I voted for the M&P simply because its grip modularity. I've had two - female - family members turn to me in advice for a gun purchase. Neither one liked the grip of my G17; both loved the M&P with small backstrap. Took them shooting with both pistols (among many others) and the M&P won for both of them.

Next would be G17/19.
Link Posted: 1/2/2015 6:25:49 PM EDT
[#5]
Family?  Glock 17/19.

People that you know that may show?  38 special or 22

Close family? HK or 1911
Link Posted: 1/2/2015 6:51:28 PM EDT
[#6]
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Quoted:
Family?  Glock 17/19.

People that you know that may show?  38 special or 22

Close family? HK or 1911
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I like how family and close family get two totally different weapons.  
Link Posted: 1/4/2015 5:58:54 AM EDT
[#7]
G17/19 just for sheer availability of parts/mags, and numbers.

As others have said though, there's been a crop of used S&W model 10s out there for a pretty good deal which would make a nice used family gun too.
Link Posted: 1/4/2015 9:03:58 AM EDT
[#8]
Untrained shooters will probably be most successful with long guns.
Link Posted: 1/4/2015 9:46:06 AM EDT
[#9]
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Quoted:
For panicked people who are unfamiliar with firearms handling, I would definitely choose something with a safety... for safety reasons... or something with a trigger pull so awful it might as well have a safety. I don't want someone I care about putting a round through their leg when the SHTF.
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A safety won't help a panicked person. A panicked person shouldn't be handling guns anyway, not even when the zombies come. If you can't get them trained now, count them out of the fight. Giving guns to family members once the SHTF is wackadoodle fantasy crap.

Link Posted: 1/5/2015 12:53:55 AM EDT
[#10]
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Quoted:


A safety won't help a panicked person. A panicked person shouldn't be handling guns anyway, not even when the zombies come. If you can't get them trained now, count them out of the fight. Giving guns to family members once the SHTF is wackadoodle fantasy crap.

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Quoted:
Quoted:
For panicked people who are unfamiliar with firearms handling, I would definitely choose something with a safety... for safety reasons... or something with a trigger pull so awful it might as well have a safety. I don't want someone I care about putting a round through their leg when the SHTF.


A safety won't help a panicked person. A panicked person shouldn't be handling guns anyway, not even when the zombies come. If you can't get them trained now, count them out of the fight. Giving guns to family members once the SHTF is wackadoodle fantasy crap.


I agree. About the only thing you are going to accomplish by handing an untrained person a gun is getting someone hurt and it's usually not the intended target. So since you are looking to arm someone I truely hope that you are planning on having them trained.
Link Posted: 1/5/2015 4:47:52 PM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


So we both pretty much agree that you should have a supply on hand of ammo. My point was/is if you had a 40 in the mix you will still be able to find ammo available. Did you not see the shelves the last few panics? Plenty of ammo in the 40 cal, and no 9 or 45 available. Many people can not afford a couple thousand rounds a month to shoot or stockpile.  You are forgetting that many people do not plan ahead and wait for the last possible minute to purchase. Then whine and snivel that they are being raped/gouged on price. Look at the history of ammo sales on Gunbroker. 22 ammo is still being gouged. But really I'm not going to argue with you about this. Guess we will see the next panic.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Since your list is only a partial list of guns, I vote for a Glock 22. Due to the fact that ammo has been plentiful during the last few panics. Figuring the same will happen again. So Glock 22 IS THE answer. So when you folks are sparingly shooting or scrounging for ammo at excessive prices, My fellow 40s and I will be shooting away. But yeah, 9mm is what you should get.


So let me get this straight. Your plan is to purchase ammo after the fertilizer hits the ventilation? Because that is the only way your comparison of availability of ammo in stores during a perceived crisis (panic) relates to availability during an actual crisis. If you don't already have it you won't be able to get it. Yeah 9mm is what you should get. It is a capable round that pretty much every family member can use. Buy two thousand rounds a month. One to shoot one to save until you are comfy in your ammo fort.


So we both pretty much agree that you should have a supply on hand of ammo. My point was/is if you had a 40 in the mix you will still be able to find ammo available. Did you not see the shelves the last few panics? Plenty of ammo in the 40 cal, and no 9 or 45 available. Many people can not afford a couple thousand rounds a month to shoot or stockpile.  You are forgetting that many people do not plan ahead and wait for the last possible minute to purchase. Then whine and snivel that they are being raped/gouged on price. Look at the history of ammo sales on Gunbroker. 22 ammo is still being gouged. But really I'm not going to argue with you about this. Guess we will see the next panic.


While I agree that was the case, that does not mean that is a static situation.  You might be right, but I wouldn't assume that .40's will always be available.  Last panic I always saw 7.62 x 54R on the shelves too, but I'm thinking that might not always be the case.  Hey, maybe we can hope there never again will be a panic.......  Anyways....  I think the only way to fully ensure you have ammo is either have it previous or have components to load.  Expecting a certain round to be there on shelves just seems....  well, hey, if you have a crystal ball that works, that's cool.  
Link Posted: 1/6/2015 6:30:06 PM EDT
[#12]
I'd throw in another choice. Ruger P95 is clunky but pretty much indestructible, and can be found fairly cheap as security trade-ins.
Link Posted: 1/8/2015 11:12:42 AM EDT
[#13]
Handing out weapons to untrained people in a high stress situation sounds like poor critical thinking skills. The last thing I want to deal with is gunshot trauma because "aunt Bell, or cousin Billy" was freaked out by noises and walking around with their finger on the trigger.

If you think ammo would be scarce, think about the availability of a fully staffed trauma center, let alone the logistics of getting to one.

The untrained would be better off in other support roles until they were at a level of conscious competence..

With  a low level of training, a long double action pull of a modern DA revolver, would be an additional safety factor that I would consider.

As much as I would prefer everyone to be highly trained and sporting a Glock 9mm, I am willing to bet that that is not going to happen.

I lived in Iraq as a contractor for 4 years. I've seen all sorts of dumb and tragic stuff involving weapons in the hands of the poorly trained.
Link Posted: 1/17/2015 3:51:22 AM EDT
[#14]
I voted for the M&P 9.
1. Reliable
2. Easily changed grip sizes.
3. 9mm is cheap and easy to find right now.

Like others I would suggest any number of revolvers. Go with 357 so you can also shoot 38's.

Personaly, if I was going to stockpile weapons for friends/family that may show up empty handed it would be Mosin Nagant 91/30's.
1. They are cheap.
2. They are rugged.
3. The ammo is fairly cheap and plentiful.
4. Many come with "goodies" ie.. pouches/sling/bayonet.

If you run out of ammo a 91/30, with bayonet, can still be an effective defensive weapon.
Link Posted: 1/17/2015 4:50:30 AM EDT
[#15]
Link Posted: 1/24/2015 2:18:46 PM EDT
[#16]
I understand what the OP is talking about.  One of the misconceptions that people seem to envision is the group showing up to the armorers locker and requesting a plasma rifle in the 40 watt range.  I envision a gun safe with 5 or more hand guns and a stack of loaded mags laying in there.  I would envision a situation where the group somehow felt they need to be armed quickly (apply tinfoil here).  Of course Murphy's Law dictates that you (the armorer) are not there.

Now everyone runs to the safe, reaches in, grabs a pistol and a few mags and runs off to their pre-determined defensive position.  In my family that would entail the middle of the liviing room, running in circles.  

In envisioning that rack of handguns my choice would be the G19 with a pile of G19 or 17 mags (mix and match ok).  The reason being there would be no "looking for the pink one"  or "I like that one, but I don't like that one", no numbers or use of braincells at all.  Reach in and grab one, they are all the same.  In my family the mix and match mags might lead to confusion so I am revising it to G17 mags only.

My experience is that the G19 is the easiest pistol to shoot, new or experienced with a minimal amount of training.  My wife can take mine off of my dead body and use it effectively, or vice versa.  (Really it would be off of my body, if she remembered to look). My kids can handle it and within a few minutes I am sure we could get Uncle Cletus up to speed if he were to show up.  The lasting safety lessons would be easy, don't put your finger on the trigger, the kids already know that one.

As far as cheapest, I am not sure the G19 is available at any discount prices, even used.  Mags are plentyful and reliable, size is right.  The manual of arms is reliable and consistent.  I am done.




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