Have you ever heard that its dangerous to buy a firearm with a proprietary design, because you are stuck relying on just one company for replacement parts?  I'm here to tell you that is a very valid concern, particularly with Smith & Wesson products.

I bought an M&P 10 last year, intending to use it for hunting, as well as in the battle rifle/DMR role.  I liked its light weight and longer barrel.  When I first bought it, a member of another forum told me about a friend's rifle, and showed me a picture showing how the stamped text on the skinny part of the barrel apparently imprinted itself somewhat inside the bore as well -- he asked me if mine had any such issues.  Upon inspection, I didn't see anything like the stamp imprint, but I did notice an odd ring around the bore in one place.  It looked to be about the same diameter and height as one of the lands of rifling, but it was simply a ring all around the bore in one spot, about midway between the gas block and the muzzle.  I found it odd, but didn't think anything of it because I had already fired the rifle, and it exhibited very acceptable accuracy and seemed to function OK.  

Fast forward to last year's Pecos Run 'n Gun... a 6 mile run through the desert in West Texas, with shooting stations along the way.  I carried my M&P 10 for the event, along with my M&P .40 pistol.  I was using Lake City 147 grain M80 ball for the event. The rifle shot great -- I shot the best time on several of the rifle stages with it.  Now a little context -- this event occurred in the middle of the largest flood in living memory in that area, and there was some standing water to traverse.  At one point in the course, I crossed some thigh deep water, even falling into a waist-deep hole at one point.  After clearing the water, I retracted the charging handle and shook the rifle muzzle-down, just as a precaution against having any water retained in the bore (I was carrying the rifle slung across my chest in a "low ready" type position, and it did go partly under water during the crossing).  When I got to the next stage, which involved a not-particularly-difficult 200 yard rifle shot, I fired a shot that I called good when it broke, but which did not score a hit.  I also had a failure-to-feed malfunction.  I cleared the malf and fired again... again calling the shot good but getting no hit, and having the same malf.  The RO said that I was hitting way in front of the target, like 20 yards out.  I disregarded this because I thought if it was a miss, it was a very close one and he must be mistaken.  I fired another shot I called good... but this time I saw the mud fly in front of me from the bullet's impact, way lower than I was aiming, and again had the malf.  Now I knew something was wrong, and began inspecting the rifle.  Loose scope mount?  Nope, it's tight.  I then noticed the barrel.  To my horror, it was split down the middle, with the split centered about halfway between the gas block and muzzle, and showing daylight all the way through.  Incredibly, neither myself nor the RO noticed the split when it happened.  Well, needless to say, that event was ruined, and I was unable to complete the rest of the stages.  Other runners saw the rifle and thought that I must have plugged the barrel with mud.  however, I never dropped the rifle or pushed the muzzle into the ground (it would have had to go in pretty far to not only plug up the flash hider but also the muzzle itself)... the worst I did was crawl under some barbed wire with the rifle cradled in front of me, getting a little muddy, and going through the water with it.  Upon reflection, I thought about the strange ring in the rifle's bore, and realized that the barrel had split right at that point.

Now on to dealing with S&W's customer service.  I called and was eventually able to reach a CS rep, who e-mailed me a return shipping label, and I sent the rifle off.  About 2 months later, I received a letter stating that they determined that the split barrel was not due to a defect in workmanship or materials, and that they were declining to fix it under warranty.  They did, however, offer to sell me a replacement rifle for $1100 and change.  I called the rep whose name was on the letter, and asked how much a new barrel for the rifle would cost.  I was shocked when he told me that they do not currently sell barrels separately for the M&P 10.  I asked how much they would charge me to re-barrel the rifle if I paid for the work.  He said he would have to check with management to see if this was even a possibility.  After not hearing from anyone in a few weeks, I called, left messages, and finally heard back from one of their senior engineers who told me that his supervisor told him that they cannot replace just the barrel assembly on a rifle.  I confirmed that they did not sell M&P 10 barrels.   I said, somewhat incredulously, "so you won't warranty it, you won't fix it, and you won't sell me the parts to fix it myself?  I basically have an $1100 paperweight?"  He seemed somewhat embarrassed to have to give me this news.  He said that he had no control over what management's policies were, and that if it were up to him, he would replace the barrel for a small fee.  He said he was going to return the rifle to me.  

So that's my situation.  I have a broken rifle with well over $1000 tied up in it, with no way to either have it fixed, or to fix it myself.  I suppose I put myself in that situation, by buying a proprietary design from a company that doesn't stand behind their products.  Well, good job Smith & Wesson.  You fooled me once.  One thing is for sure though... I am not going to make that mistake again.  Oh, and I'm going to be carrying a Glock from now on.

Edit:  Pics on Page 6.

Send your upper to ADCO, cut and crown behind the damaged portion.

"half way between gas block and muzzle"

Cross post this in the Smith and Wesson industry section. http://www.ar15.com/forums/f_2/551_Smith_andamp__Wesson.html
I have been pondering a M&P10 and thought I could live with the proprietary parts. But not at this level of non support. Damn

Oh boy, and I just took possession of my M&P 10 three days ago.

SP

Something definitely was obstructing your bore.

You could always just buy a replacement barrel from another source, and have the M&P barrel extension head spaced on the new one.

Cut crown and thread is only $65  

Add $50 to diss and assm the complete upper.

Add $30 to pin and weld if needed.

+1 this tho it does suck that S&W went replace it all is not lost.

 

The split was centered halfway between muzzle and gas block, but the cracks extend nearly to the gas block on that end, and nearly to the flash hider on the other.  I really don't think the barrel is salvageable.  I will post a pic when I get it back from them.

ADCO can relocate the gas block. You would probably end up with a SBR upper, but it can be done.

This is your best bet.

The only tow I've ever had a bbl burst that was unobstructed was a bbl that was through hardened too much.

Do you have pictures of the issue?  I'm still being it was obstructed.

ETA:  Id get the bbl extension and get a custom blank made into sbbl

Cross-posted to S&W industry page.  

Here's the thing about cutting before the gas port and relocating the gas block journal: that would leave me with something like a 9" barreled .308.  I have absolutely no use for such a thing, and it would be a highly niche weapon that would be very hard to sell.  I highly doubt I would recoup enough from such a sale to justify the gunsmithing costs and NFA stamp.  

Buying another .308 AR barrel and having the S&W extension pressed on is an idea... though again I am loathe to sink any more money into this POS.  

I'm thinking my best bet is to put the parts up for sale and get whatever I can for them.

just get a smith to rebarrell it,  I wouldnt be surprised if you got something in the bore and didnt realize it.

He has a MP10 barrel extension

I would say its definately worth it.

buy a barrel blank (basically) and have it gas ported, its doable.
better than nothing, really the only option.

I'm sure there's some good advice here on possible options to salvage the rifle...and...it "could" have been something the OP did accidentally and unknowingly that caused the failure.  Still, I find it amazing that in this day and age with an AR platform design, a manufacturer actually offers no fix or the barrel to allow someone else to fix it.  The beauty of the AR platform is the modularity of parts and interchangeability, if not with some other manufacturer's parts line, at least with available parts within their own line.  Sure, big caliber AR's aren't the milspec, parts switching, capability of the AR15, but no barrel availability in an AR?...that's just stupid.  Is the M&P AR15 basically milspec, or are they full of proprietary parts with limited servicing by the owner or limited in parts availability?

How it happened is not relevant to me in light of the fact they won't replace the broken part.



That is utterly ridiculous that they won't sell you another $200 barrel.

Tag for pictures.

henchman, don't take this as challenging your scenario here, but after posting my response and thinking about this for a bit, it got me to thinking.  Since it's almost incredulous that an AR platform manufacturer wouldn't supply barrels for their guns to the public or for in-house repair, has anyone checked to verify this with S&W?  To not sell, supply, or have for in-house replacement a barrel for an AR rifle is unforgiveable and huge.  If not true, I'd hate to see the dogpile be for naught and undeserved.  If true, then no one should ever buy another M&P10 in the future until such nonsense is resolved.  People like the AR design because of its modularity and serviceability.

Seems henchman is not the first.
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_2_551/252652_MandP_10_Barrel.html

Wow I was going to purchase a m&p 9L pro Monday  thank you op for the warning I'll not support a company that won't support there products / customers.

I really like the idea of cutting the barrel down and crowning it............

Serious customization time.....

SP

I bought my M&P10 partially due to S&W's stellar customer service reputation.

They should at least replace your barrel (and any other damaged part). If they feel it was operator error, which I can see the likelihood of a bore obstruction in this case, then charge for the part but to scrap the entire gun over a damaged last few inches of barrel is a joke. And I paid less than $1100 for mine new. You might be able to use a DPMS pattern barrel and bolt with the rest of your parts (I know when I checked my friend's DPMS was really close to working in my M&P.

I'm tempted to trade my M&P for a Glock after reading your story.

Well I am still going to get my M&P10 set up with a rail, scope and flip down sights.

If I have any of these issues whatsoever, and S&W does not respond properly, I will tell every living soul I know from coast to coast, on broadcast radio, FB and such about the entire issue.

So, S&W, you had better think long and hard, how you will respond to these issues.

I would rather buy S&W than others, but not if there are going to be stupid issues.

SP

Ringed a barrel on a Ruger 10/22 about 20 years ago.  Cheap ammo.  Had a misfire.  I chambered and fired another round without checking the barrel.  boom.  Ringed the barrel and blew the extractor off.

Took it to gunshop I bought it from.  They sent it back to Ruger.  Ruger replaced the barrel and sent it back for FREE.  

Guess times have changed.

Not at Ruger, they still do that sort of thing from what I hear.

I always like first hand accounts with CS experiences. It definitely helps the decision making process easier when it comes to purchases. Regardless if it was user error or not and the fact that parts are proprietary to the MP10, for a large company like S&W not being able to assist you aside from making you spend another $1000+ for a new rifle is VERY disappointing. Your situation is the shits, but thank you for turning a lot of interested parties off from going forward with their MP10 purchase. On a side note--I'm looking forward to Daniel Defense announcing their .308 (now that's a company I would stand behind)

Wow!    I've sorta been recommending the M&P 10 to some asking for an AR in 308.    Not any more.   This is horrible.    I wonder how many more split barrels have occurred?

Don't know how frequent, but this thread popped up today on another thread.  Even if the barrel fubars are owner caused, I guess it's the inability to get a new one that is unbelievable.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_2_551/252652_MandP_10_Barrel.html

What a crock of shit, and horrible service.

I almost bought an M&P 10, but decided to build a DPMS pattern instead for the better options, and non proprietary parts.

Call the quality manager.  You can find his info on Linkedin.

It was posted in this topic as well.

I will mark S&W off my future purchase list.
Incredibly terrible customer service.

I had a barrel break on my M&P 9 Pro about two years ago.  Sent it in and they replaced it with the new design.  Total turnaround time was 23 days.  No questions asked.  

Yes, I asked at least 3 different people at S&W about the barrel sales policy through this process, because I found it as unbelievable as y'all.

Ruger's CS definitely makes a sharp contrast to S&W's.  As misfortune would have it, I had a 10/22 design contest rifle with a misaligned barrel so bad it wouldn't zero, and sent it back to Ruger at the same time I sent the Smith back.  A Ruger rep called me, no shit, 2 days after I mailed the rifle back, offering to have a replacement in the mail as soon as I told them an FFL to ship it to.  I actually did Project Appleseed's review of this rifle for their newsletter:  http://appleseedinfo.org/smf/index.php?topic=43961.0

You know, I realize that there is a possibility the split barrel was caused by something I did... I wouldn't say it's more likely than not, but I don't think its worth suing them over or anything... and I realize that sometimes shit happens when you run a weapon hard under adverse conditions.  It's nothing I haven't put 5.56 rifles through with no problems, but I realize there is a chance I caused this malfunction.  And if S&W wants to make it their policy to do the bare minimum warranty against defects only, that is certainly their prerogative.  I But what I find to be unforgivable is that they do not support their products, and refuse to fix or even sell me the part I need.  That is just downright piss poor product support and customer service.

Off their website.... Call them and see if they can get you a barrel.


Where can I find S&W long gun parts & service?
For long guns manufactured in the early 1980's, please contact the following dealers for parts and service. Smith & Wesson discontinued these models and no longer has a parts inventory or offer repair service for these models.
Gun Parts
Williams Lane
W. Hurley, NY 12491
(845) 679-4867

LSG Manufacturing
10059 Hwy 1476
Comanche, TX 76442
(325) 885-2700
[email protected]
www.lsgmfg.com

one bad apple and all

I have been considering an  AR in 308 as well.  This incident has moved the S & W out of consideration.  Customer Service they don't get it.

The S&W M&P10 has a different barrel extension and bolt than the other SR25 imitation AR10's on the market.

It would be interesting to see if you could use a readily available bolt, and a drop-in barrel.

I personally would just have a smith use the existing extension, and get a barrel made for it to you specs.  Make sure he uses a reamer that will work well for a gas gun.

Another "split barrel"?? Or one of the same posters posting on another forum?
http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-wesson-m-p10-rifles/412311-m-p10-barrel-swap.html

Tag... class action in the making?

Tag.

Things like this are why I've always been wary of proprietary, single-source weapon systems/parts.

Also always amazes me when companies, in 2015, think it's a better financial decision to tell customers to go pound sand than to go above and beyond.

Also we need to figure out why the run-n-gun is always held in the rainy season of the desert. Perhaps May would be a better month.

Maybe for the challenge?...LOL!...but seriously...I have no idea.  Gotta admit that performing in challenging conditions like rain, cold, snow, etc., test man and machine(gun) to the ultimate.

Looks like they need to restrict usage of M&P 10s however.