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cedjunior
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Posted: 10/17/2012 3:40:11 AM
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Why is the Ford Raptor so expensive?


Marketing, baby.
Why would someone come in to this thread, after 2 pages of mostly informative posts, and post something like this?

blacksunshinez51
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Posted: 10/17/2012 4:29:15 AM
[Last Edit: 10/17/2012 4:31:03 AM by blacksunshinez51]
Originally Posted By cedjunior:
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Why is the Ford Raptor so expensive?


Marketing, baby.
Why would someone come in to this thread, after 2 pages of mostly informative posts, and post something like this?



Cause Tards can't do research on how much certain parts cost. How does a LaRue OBR cost so much more than a DPMS

effinNewGuy
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Posted: 10/17/2012 4:30:55 AM
Originally Posted By blacksunshinez51:
Originally Posted By cedjunior:
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Why is the Ford Raptor so expensive?


Marketing, baby.
Why would someone come in to this thread, after 2 pages of mostly informative posts, and post something like this?



Cause Tards can't do research how much certain parts cost. How does a LaRue OBR cost so much more than a DPMS



Marketing, baby.
blacksunshinez51
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Posted: 10/17/2012 4:32:36 AM
[Last Edit: 10/17/2012 4:34:33 AM by blacksunshinez51]
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Originally Posted By blacksunshinez51:
Originally Posted By cedjunior:
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Why is the Ford Raptor so expensive?


Marketing, baby.
Why would someone come in to this thread, after 2 pages of mostly informative posts, and post something like this?



Cause Tards can't do research how much certain parts cost. How does a LaRue OBR cost so much more than a DPMS



Marketing, baby.


OK so what does and FX4suspension have in common with a SVT Raptors
ETA: did you all look at the pics of suspension we posted. You will see where the extra cost went.
effinNewGuy
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Posted: 10/17/2012 4:33:43 AM
[Last Edit: 10/17/2012 4:34:13 AM by effinNewGuy]
Originally Posted By blacksunshinez51:
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Originally Posted By blacksunshinez51:
Originally Posted By cedjunior:
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Why is the Ford Raptor so expensive?


Marketing, baby.
Why would someone come in to this thread, after 2 pages of mostly informative posts, and post something like this?



Cause Tards can't do research how much certain parts cost. How does a LaRue OBR cost so much more than a DPMS




Marketing, baby.


OK so what does and FX4suspension have in common with a SVT Raptors



Don't ask me. I'm in marketing, baby.
blacksunshinez51
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Posted: 10/17/2012 4:35:19 AM
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Originally Posted By blacksunshinez51:
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Originally Posted By blacksunshinez51:
Originally Posted By cedjunior:
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Why is the Ford Raptor so expensive?


Marketing, baby.
Why would someone come in to this thread, after 2 pages of mostly informative posts, and post something like this?



Cause Tards can't do research how much certain parts cost. How does a LaRue OBR cost so much more than a DPMS




Marketing, baby.


OK so what does and FX4suspension have in common with a SVT Raptors



Don't ask me. I'm in marketing, baby.


With no usefull input to said thread.

effinNewGuy
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Posted: 10/17/2012 4:37:45 AM
Originally Posted By blacksunshinez51:
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Originally Posted By blacksunshinez51:
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Originally Posted By blacksunshinez51:
Originally Posted By cedjunior:
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Why is the Ford Raptor so expensive?


Marketing, baby.
Why would someone come in to this thread, after 2 pages of mostly informative posts, and post something like this?



Cause Tards can't do research how much certain parts cost. How does a LaRue OBR cost so much more than a DPMS




Marketing, baby.


OK so what does and FX4suspension have in common with a SVT Raptors



Don't ask me. I'm in marketing, baby.


With no usefull input to said thread.



To you maybe. You just don't want to accept the answer I gave, which pretty much answers the question. Think about it. Open your eyes.
ONISARU
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Posted: 10/17/2012 4:42:12 AM
Originally Posted By GNRNR:
I like that a manufacturer has shown interest in an off road truck.
With that said, you are better off rolling your own.

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2011/07/ford-svt-raptor-frame-bent-opt.jpg


not to mention cast alum front controls... Many,many have been towed back to the dealer on flat beds.. When I dropped off my superduty for some warranty work, they had two in the back lot with busted control arms..

Honestly roll your own.. Cheaper in the long run.. As you won't have to replace all the garbage that is useless in the truck

Onisaru
blacksunshinez51
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Posted: 10/17/2012 4:44:08 AM
[Last Edit: 10/17/2012 4:47:54 AM by blacksunshinez51]
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Originally Posted By blacksunshinez51:
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Originally Posted By blacksunshinez51:
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Originally Posted By blacksunshinez51:
Originally Posted By cedjunior:
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Why is the Ford Raptor so expensive?


Marketing, baby.
Why would someone come in to this thread, after 2 pages of mostly informative posts, and post something like this?



Cause Tards can't do research how much certain parts cost. How does a LaRue OBR cost so much more than a DPMS




Marketing, baby.


OK so what does and FX4suspension have in common with a SVT Raptors



Don't ask me. I'm in marketing, baby.


With no usefull input to said thread.



To you maybe. You just don't want to accept the answer I gave, which pretty much answers the question. Think about it. Open your eyes.


Whatever... I have no skin in the game anymore, I broke even after my time of ownership. Had fun with it and will put said cash into something else. If you can afford to pay to play, do it. Not everyone on this site can, although some of us can.

ONISARU
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Posted: 10/17/2012 4:58:47 AM
As much as I like them & would love to own one.. They are a FACTORY truck with body mods and coilovers.. Really no different then buying a Saleen or Roush mustang. For the price you can buy a stock vehicle and build it yourself to be a better quality vehicle.
blacksunshinez51
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Posted: 10/17/2012 5:02:28 AM
[Last Edit: 10/17/2012 5:03:38 AM by blacksunshinez51]
blacksunshinez51
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Posted: 10/17/2012 5:04:59 AM
[Last Edit: 10/17/2012 5:05:50 AM by blacksunshinez51]
Originally Posted By ONISARU:
As much as I like them & would love to own one.. They are a FACTORY truck with body mods and coilovers.. Really no different then buying a Saleen or Roush mustang. For the price you can buy a stock vehicle and build it yourself to be a better quality vehicle.


Not really...for the price. Price out the FOX Shox

Meanj82
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Posted: 10/17/2012 5:29:42 AM
It's a hyped up f-150 with a nice motor.

Talk to anybody that knows about building offload vehicles and they will tell you it's an over priced POS that will not be able to go anywhere else a 2k jeep in any application other then perhaps applications where high horsepower is very beneficial. Not trying to make this sound like a brand war, I'm simply saying its no more an offload vehicle then a stock Toyota or Jeep. You aren't going to do much of anything offload with a stock vehicle. Half ton parts are still half ton parts. Might as well buy used and drop a crate motor with a stronger transmission and axles and still be 40k+ ahead of the game.
popsickles
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Posted: 10/17/2012 5:41:05 AM
Originally Posted By Meanj82:
It's a hyped up f-150 with a nice motor.

Talk to anybody that knows about building offload vehicles and they will tell you it's an over priced POS that will not be able to go anywhere else a 2k jeep in any application other then perhaps applications where high horsepower is very beneficial. Not trying to make this sound like a brand war, I'm simply saying its no more an offload vehicle then a stock Toyota or Jeep. You aren't going to do much of anything offload with a stock vehicle. Half ton parts are still half ton parts. Might as well buy used and drop a crate motor with a stronger transmission and axles and still be 40k+ ahead of the game.


Not everyone wants to fuck around with all that shit

Its a factory "baja" style truck, nothing more.

stickfigure
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Posted: 10/17/2012 5:46:42 AM
[Last Edit: 10/17/2012 9:34:42 AM by stickfigure]
Originally Posted By blacksunshinez51:
Originally Posted By ONISARU:
As much as I like them & would love to own one.. They are a FACTORY truck with body mods and coilovers.. Really no different then buying a Saleen or Roush mustang. For the price you can buy a stock vehicle and build it yourself to be a better quality vehicle.


Not really...for the price. Price out the FOX Shox



About $3500. It's a chunk but as good as those shocks are, you are putting them on an inherently limited stock pickup frame.

Your main connection linkage is still 3 leaf standard Ford springs.

The lower a-arms are nice but they stayed cheap on the upper a-arms, and they went even cheaper on the connecting linkages, Ford couldn't even bother to coat them apparently.

This is all readily replaceable and there kits specifically to replace these cheaper parts, but it seems like they just chinced on some pretty basic off-road parts.




We're invaders from another planet, we're invaders from another world... Martian Men look out for your planet... Earth Man's comin', to take control!!! EARTH MAN!!!
Hueto
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Posted: 10/17/2012 8:08:46 AM
Originally Posted By Dana1972:
Originally Posted By aBADidea:
buy a tundra rock warrior edition. Its cheaper, faster, and and an all around better truck.


But it's still a Toyota no thanks.


Just curious, what do you drive?
graysonp
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Posted: 10/17/2012 9:35:03 AM
[Last Edit: 10/17/2012 9:35:18 AM by graysonp]
Originally Posted By Meanj82:
It's a hyped up f-150 with a nice motor.

Talk to anybody that knows about building offload vehicles and they will tell you it's an over priced POS that will not be able to go anywhere else a 2k jeep in any application other then perhaps applications where high horsepower is very beneficial. Not trying to make this sound like a brand war, I'm simply saying its no more an offload vehicle then a stock Toyota or Jeep. You aren't going to do much of anything offload with a stock vehicle.
Half ton parts are still half ton parts. Might as well buy used and drop a crate motor with a stronger transmission and axles and still be 40k+ ahead of the game.


Really? How is it that the Ford Raptor has entered the Baja 1000 multiple times and placed top 3 in it's class multiple times, in stock form?

It's way more than a "hyped up F-150". It's as off-road capable as any comparable truck could possibly built for the same money.
LostX
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Posted: 10/17/2012 10:57:31 AM
So much in this thread.

The only other vehicle that comes close to being capable off the showroom floor is the Jeep Rubicon.



Hueto
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Posted: 10/17/2012 11:52:28 AM
Atomic_Ferret
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Posted: 10/17/2012 11:55:44 AM
Originally Posted By SoloMan:
Buy an older truck out-of-warranty and then mod it without worrying about voiding the warranty.

And come up tens of thousands of dollars ahead....

Win-Win.

There is really no reason to ever buy a new-car...they devalue thousands the minute you drive off the lot! I can't imagine anything else worse than that.


If built properly by a competent fab shop, it would smash the hell out of a Raptor off road as well.

"There is a time for peace and talk and reason; and then, at long last, and only with sadness of heart and mournful admission that all your wisdom and words have failed, you must go kill you some motherfuckers and set some of their shit on fire"
Atomic_Ferret
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Posted: 10/17/2012 11:58:08 AM
Originally Posted By Foxxz:
Originally Posted By sgtward911:
Originally Posted By aBADidea:
buy a tundra rock warrior edition. Its cheaper, faster, and and an all around better truck.


That truck does look good.
http://www.tundratalk.net/forums/signaturepics/sigpic26385_2.gif


Looks nice. I'll tell you though... Ever since I got the raptor I have taken more notice of other large trucks. Not so much because I feel like I'm in competition with them but because I have a better appreciation for them now.


I am a Toyota fanboy.

That said, the "Rock Warrior" package is pretty much window dressing whereas the Raptor does have some significant upgrades over the stock F150.

Neither of them are a trophy truck and should not be driven as such. I mean you can, but you will bend expensive things.
"There is a time for peace and talk and reason; and then, at long last, and only with sadness of heart and mournful admission that all your wisdom and words have failed, you must go kill you some motherfuckers and set some of their shit on fire"
WilliamGray
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Posted: 10/17/2012 12:04:09 PM
Originally Posted By RePp:
See the SEALs driving them around all the time here.


I do not doubt you. The border patrol around here love Rubicons and raptors.
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doubleshot00
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Posted: 10/17/2012 12:16:24 PM
Their really bad ass trucks but my question is: Why is every Raptor i see is always so clean??????? If i had a Raptor i would use it for what it is and not just drive aroumd town to show off my status symbol.
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Posted: 10/17/2012 12:19:23 PM
My Dad's 2012 Dmax Allison 2500 Z71 Crew Cab stickered at $52k, I think he paid somewhere just over $40k for it last month.

So yeah, that's ballpark now.

I bought his 06. Booked between $14k and $19k depending on condition. It's a good truck but damn, paying the bill for the UAW and the EPA is costing our ass.

Commando_Guy
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Posted: 10/17/2012 12:36:57 PM
Originally Posted By Meanj82:
It's a hyped up f-150 with a nice motor.

Talk to anybody that knows about building offload vehicles and they will tell you it's an over priced POS that will not be able to go anywhere else a 2k jeep in any application other then perhaps applications where high horsepower is very beneficial. Not trying to make this sound like a brand war, I'm simply saying its no more an offload vehicle then a stock Toyota or Jeep. You aren't going to do much of anything offload with a stock vehicle. Half ton parts are still half ton parts. Might as well buy used and drop a crate motor with a stronger transmission and axles and still be 40k+ ahead of the game.


Not really getting it, are you?
On the street, some cars can turn and burn, some can go relly freekin quick in a straight line.
They aren't generally the same car.
In rocks, a twisty Jeep will rule, but that solid axle/short wheelbase is a cast iron bitch at high speed over rough ground, and there is no way you can make it work at the same level as a Raptor in that terrain.
Different types of vehicles.

Nick


If the enemy is range, so are you.
unseenSNIPER
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Posted: 10/17/2012 12:40:15 PM
Originally Posted By Hueto:
Originally Posted By GNRNR:
I like that a manufacturer has shown interest in an off road truck.
With that said, you are better off rolling your own.

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.autoblog.com/media/2011/07/ford-svt-raptor-frame-bent-opt.jpg


Let the retardation begin.


Hit a nerve?

I guess no one failed to neglect that the first gen Tacoma frames that are prone to rust had frames that were treated by none other an a Ohio-based US company....Dana.
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Posted: 10/17/2012 12:41:08 PM

Originally Posted By Commando_Guy:
Originally Posted By Meanj82:
It's a hyped up f-150 with a nice motor.

Talk to anybody that knows about building offload vehicles and they will tell you it's an over priced POS that will not be able to go anywhere else a 2k jeep in any application other then perhaps applications where high horsepower is very beneficial. Not trying to make this sound like a brand war, I'm simply saying its no more an offload vehicle then a stock Toyota or Jeep. You aren't going to do much of anything offload with a stock vehicle. Half ton parts are still half ton parts. Might as well buy used and drop a crate motor with a stronger transmission and axles and still be 40k+ ahead of the game.


Not really getting it, are you?
On the street, some cars can turn and burn, some can go relly freekin quick in a straight line.
They aren't generally the same car.
In rocks, a twisty Jeep will rule, but that solid axle/short wheelbase is a cast iron bitch at high speed over rough ground, and there is no way you can make it work at the same level as a Raptor in that terrain.
Different types of vehicles.

Nick



No doubt. A jeep would be a bowling ball in a duning situation that the Raptor would excel at.

ONISARU
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Posted: 10/17/2012 12:43:35 PM
Originally Posted By blacksunshinez51:
Originally Posted By ONISARU:
As much as I like them & would love to own one.. They are a FACTORY truck with body mods and coilovers.. Really no different then buying a Saleen or Roush mustang. For the price you can buy a stock vehicle and build it yourself to be a better quality vehicle.


Not really...for the price. Price out the FOX Shox



no that is alright.. FOX would have to PAY me to run their garbage shocks..

As for the raptor, if I wanted a prerunner.. I'd fab my own.. The raptor is a nice mix of streetable and offroad.. But if you are going to build a prerunner, best to have it fabbed..
LostX
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Posted: 10/17/2012 12:49:36 PM
Originally Posted By unseenSNIPER:

Hit a nerve?

I guess no one failed to neglect that the first gen Tacoma frames that are prone to rust had frames that were treated by none other an a Ohio-based US company....Dana.




That will buff right out.
WilliamGray
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Posted: 10/17/2012 8:59:10 PM
Originally Posted By LostX:
Originally Posted By unseenSNIPER:

Hit a nerve?

I guess no one failed to neglect that the first gen Tacoma frames that are prone to rust had frames that were treated by none other an a Ohio-based US company....Dana.


http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e116/saleen49/cid__rust.jpg

That will buff right out.


Should be fine. Two piece drive shaft, carriage bearing, and you have a truck that is easy to unload.
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Meanj82
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Posted: 10/18/2012 12:00:57 AM
See some people are already getting butt hurt over this. The badge on the side of the vehicle has dick to do with its offload capability.

The ford raptor has a stamped short/standard travel IFS with 3500 dollar shocks. It's rear sports leaf springs (lol?) with 3500 dollar shocks. So in essence you take a hopped up motor and 3500 dollar shocks (not even the long travel version) and you are on the same level as the raptor. It's pure marketing at its best. It's the same story with the jeep rubicon. And with that motor and 35 inch tires those axles and r&p are screaming for mercy, not the most reliable combo by any means. Believe me when I say I know a thing or two about building offload vehicles, the only people that are enamored with the raptor are the people who simply don't know enough and have fallen subject to its hype.

And last time I checked it wasn't f150 type vehicles winning the Baja 1000. Ford cornered the stock class with big motor good tires and good shocks (notice I did not say suspension). All of which you can be done to any vehicle.

It's a nice truck don't get me wrong. But it's simply not what most people make it out to be.
LostX
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Posted: 10/18/2012 12:18:13 AM
[Last Edit: 10/18/2012 12:18:40 AM by LostX]
Originally Posted By Meanj82:
See some people are already getting butt hurt over this. The badge on the side of the vehicle has dick to do with its offload capability.

The ford raptor has a stamped short/standard travel IFS with 3500 dollar shocks. It's rear sports leaf springs (lol?) with 3500 dollar shocks. So in essence you take a hopped up motor and 3500 dollar shocks (not even the long travel version) and you are on the same level as the raptor. It's pure marketing at its best. It's the same story with the jeep rubicon. And with that motor and 35 inch tires those axles and r&p are screaming for mercy, not the most reliable combo by any means. Believe me when I say I know a thing or two about building offload vehicles, the only people that are enamored with the raptor are the people who simply don't know enough and have fallen subject to its hype.

And last time I checked it wasn't f150 type vehicles winning the Baja 1000. Ford cornered the stock class with big motor good tires and good shocks (notice I did not say suspension). All of which you can be done to any vehicle.

It's a nice truck don't get me wrong. But it's simply not what most people make it out to be.


But what about offroad vehicles?

The Raptor has 11.x and 12.x travel fore and aft –– stock is like 9 and 10. The rear "sport" springs have a softer spring rate. Not to mention you get all the electronic do-hickey's and what-not's with plus 35" tires, wider fenders, and "custom" seats. One can't compare a used F150 built to rock versus a Raptor. Take a fresh off the lot F150 and do all the things that need to be done to make it similar to a Raptor. There's the cost. And yes, marketing plays a HUGE role.

Besides, 80% of the people who buy it will never use the rear locker and 80% of that 80% probably don't even know what a locker even is.

Just like the Rubi, it's a capable vehicle off the showroom floor that has mods many will do anyway plus a warranty. Or sometimes it's just enough for the person driving it. A stock Rubi would do me wonders. But as along as someone will pay for it, someone will produce it.
Meanj82
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Posted: 10/18/2012 12:37:39 AM
Originally Posted By LostX:
Originally Posted By Meanj82:
See some people are already getting butt hurt over this. The badge on the side of the vehicle has dick to do with its offload capability.

The ford raptor has a stamped short/standard travel IFS with 3500 dollar shocks. It's rear sports leaf springs (lol?) with 3500 dollar shocks. So in essence you take a hopped up motor and 3500 dollar shocks (not even the long travel version) and you are on the same level as the raptor. It's pure marketing at its best. It's the same story with the jeep rubicon. And with that motor and 35 inch tires those axles and r&p are screaming for mercy, not the most reliable combo by any means. Believe me when I say I know a thing or two about building offload vehicles, the only people that are enamored with the raptor are the people who simply don't know enough and have fallen subject to its hype.

And last time I checked it wasn't f150 type vehicles winning the Baja 1000. Ford cornered the stock class with big motor good tires and good shocks (notice I did not say suspension). All of which you can be done to any vehicle.

It's a nice truck don't get me wrong. But it's simply not what most people make it out to be.


But what about offroad vehicles?

The Raptor has 11.x and 12.x travel fore and aft –– stock is like 9 and 10. The rear "sport" springs have a softer spring rate. Not to mention you get all the electronic do-hickey's and what-not's with plus 35" tires, wider fenders, and "custom" seats. One can't compare a used F150 built to rock versus a Raptor. Take a fresh off the lot F150 and do all the things that need to be done to make it similar to a Raptor. There's the cost. And yes, marketing plays a HUGE role.

Besides, 80% of the people who buy it will never use the rear locker and 80% of that 80% probably don't even know what a locker even is.

Just like the Rubi, it's a capable vehicle off the showroom floor that has mods many will do anyway plus a warranty. Or sometimes it's just enough for the person driving it. A stock Rubi would do me wonders. But as along as someone will pay for it, someone will produce it.


Speaking strictly from an offload point of view here (we are talking about a supposed offload truck.

That wheel travel is abysmal. That's 4" of up travel more or less and 6-7 of down travel, and that is most likely measured with all the stabilizer bars and sway bars disconnected.

The rear sport spring are still leaf springs, and leaf springs, especially lower spring rate ones are ginormously more prone to spring wrap, which means wheel hop, which means loss of power to ground, which means loss of traction. The rear end should have been linked with a long arm suspension and proper coil overs. Even Jeep doesn't use leaf springs any more, and they are usually always behind the curve.

All the electronic gizmos are for marketing you don't see any of that shit on offload vehicles because it doesn't work. They are meant as a handicap for people who don't know what they are doing, I don't want my CPU cutting power to my wheels because my tires are spinning a little too fast. Or slowing down around a corner because it feels the vehicle leaning a little too much.

Again with that being said. If you have to deal with emissions standards, simply want a raptor, or just flat out like its lines or whatever. Buy one. More power too you. If you just want the performance of the raptor or better? Buy a stock used one and you can have a better truck for way less money, and probably pay somebody else to do it as well. Just like the Jeep Rubicon, they are ok but you can build way better for much less.
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Posted: 10/18/2012 12:44:13 AM

Originally Posted By LostX:
Originally Posted By Meanj82:
See some people are already getting butt hurt over this. The badge on the side of the vehicle has dick to do with its offload capability.

The ford raptor has a stamped short/standard travel IFS with 3500 dollar shocks. It's rear sports leaf springs (lol?) with 3500 dollar shocks. So in essence you take a hopped up motor and 3500 dollar shocks (not even the long travel version) and you are on the same level as the raptor. It's pure marketing at its best. It's the same story with the jeep rubicon. And with that motor and 35 inch tires those axles and r&p are screaming for mercy, not the most reliable combo by any means. Believe me when I say I know a thing or two about building offload vehicles, the only people that are enamored with the raptor are the people who simply don't know enough and have fallen subject to its hype.

And last time I checked it wasn't f150 type vehicles winning the Baja 1000. Ford cornered the stock class with big motor good tires and good shocks (notice I did not say suspension). All of which you can be done to any vehicle.

It's a nice truck don't get me wrong. But it's simply not what most people make it out to be.


But what about offroad vehicles?



I read his whole post in a shitty-wok voice.

setlab
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Posted: 10/18/2012 1:04:39 AM
Originally Posted By micman777:
When I bought my Raptor in 2011, I ordered it through a buying service and paid $34,000 for it. When I went to the delivering Dealer, they had an Addendum sticker in the window for a $10,000 markup over Sticker. The price I paid for mine was $2000 more than the FX4, which put it in the range I was willing to pay. IF I had to pay $50,000 for one I would not have bought it.

http://i128.photobucket.com/albums/p168/micman777/Raptor.jpg"


Buying service? What is that?
LostX
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Posted: 10/18/2012 1:17:41 AM
Jesus. It's a weekend toy, not a buggy or a built Jeep. At the end of the day Ford had to produce a vehicle that could be a toy, pick up the groceries, and, most importantly, sell. It had to be built using a platform that could be tweaked and not rengineered. All that would end up adding to more cost to the vehicle. Look at all the other SVT projects, none of them rengineered the cube –– just improved it. Same thing with the Rubi. Jeep took all the mods most people do to their Wranglers and slapped them all together to offer a package that was attractive, able to be financed, and warrantied with the rest of the vehicle.

Look, you're not going to run the entire length of the Rubicon in a Raptor. You're not going to run JVOHV (although no one will if the .gov gets their way). Nor will you do all the trails in Moab in one. That was not their design. But if you're a weekend warrior who doesn't mind getting dirty, getting new dings/dents, and some offroad pinstriping –– the Raptor is for you. Assuming that's what you want and you can afford it.

And yes I aware if Ford's marketing of the Raptor. But they don't show the truck running Little Sluice or flying off a dune in Glamis.
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Posted: 10/18/2012 1:20:55 AM
Originally Posted By LostX:
Originally Posted By unseenSNIPER:

Hit a nerve?

I guess no one failed to neglect that the first gen Tacoma frames that are prone to rust had frames that were treated by none other an a Ohio-based US company....Dana.


http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e116/saleen49/cid__rust.jpg

That will buff right out.


hahahaha

lol

fail
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Posted: 10/18/2012 1:23:09 AM
Originally Posted By Covert8645:
Because she's a clever girl.


I got that one!
brian4wd
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Posted: 10/18/2012 1:32:47 AM
Originally Posted By Meanj82:
See some people are already getting butt hurt over this. The badge on the side of the vehicle has dick to do with its offload capability.

The ford raptor has a stamped short/standard travel IFS with 3500 dollar shocks. It's rear sports leaf springs (lol?) with 3500 dollar shocks. So in essence you take a hopped up motor and 3500 dollar shocks (not even the long travel version) and you are on the same level as the raptor. It's pure marketing at its best. It's the same story with the jeep rubicon. And with that motor and 35 inch tires those axles and r&p are screaming for mercy, not the most reliable combo by any means. Believe me when I say I know a thing or two about building offload vehicles, the only people that are enamored with the raptor are the people who simply don't know enough and have fallen subject to its hype.

And last time I checked it wasn't f150 type vehicles winning the Baja 1000. Ford cornered the stock class with big motor good tires and good shocks (notice I did not say suspension). All of which you can be done to any vehicle.

It's a nice truck don't get me wrong. But it's simply not what most people make it out to be.


I'd like to learn a thing or two about building offload vehicles - please share your experience.

Brian

Originally Posted By SmilingBandit:
I don't concern myself with the income of fortune 500 CEOs because I'm not in any way qualified to do their job.

LostX
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Posted: 10/18/2012 1:43:57 AM
And for the man who has $100K+ to spend...



There's your 4-link coilover rear suspension with 18" of travel and 15" of front travel.
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Posted: 10/18/2012 1:44:18 AM
Originally Posted By Meanj82:

Speaking strictly from an offload point of view here (we are talking about a supposed offload truck.

That wheel travel is abysmal. That's 4" of up travel more or less and 6-7 of down travel, and that is most likely measured with all the stabilizer bars and sway bars disconnected. Do a search on Moss Brothers Racing Class 3 Bronco. How much travel do you think that truck has - it's won Class 3 ~8 times since it started racing in 2000.

The rear sport spring are still leaf springs, and leaf springs, especially lower spring rate ones are ginormously more prone to spring wrap, which means wheel hop, which means loss of power to ground, which means loss of traction. The rear end should have been linked with a long arm suspension and proper coil overs. Even Jeep doesn't use leaf springs any more, and they are usually always behind the curve. What's the "proper" amount of suspension travel for a truck that can be comfortably daily driven and then be used as a legitimate chase truck in Baja? A properly designed (for the intended application) leaf spring suspension can work damn well and be relatively simple and inexpensive.

All the electronic gizmos are for marketing you don't see any of that shit on offload vehicles because it doesn't work. They are meant as a handicap for people who don't know what they are doing, I don't want my CPU cutting power to my wheels because my tires are spinning a little too fast. Or slowing down around a corner because it feels the vehicle leaning a little too much. Hmm, all those electonic gizmos must be handicaps in the various road racing series that have outlawed their use........

Again with that being said. If you have to deal with emissions standards, simply want a raptor, or just flat out like its lines or whatever. Buy one. More power too you. If you just want the performance of the raptor or better? Buy a stock used one and you can have a better truck for way less money, and probably pay somebody else to do it as well. Just like the Jeep Rubicon, they are ok but you can build way better for much less.I have yet to see a prerunner with equivalent power, comfort and electronics that cost less than a Raptor. I'm sorry but a Ford Ranger with extended i-beams and fiberglass fenders isn't something I'd want to drive to La Paz when chasing for the race truck - every one I go to Baja with would take a Raptor in a heart beat but we all tow 5th wheel trailers in addition to chasing with our trucks so we all have 3/4 ton diesels.


Brian

Originally Posted By SmilingBandit:
I don't concern myself with the income of fortune 500 CEOs because I'm not in any way qualified to do their job.

LostX
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Posted: 10/18/2012 1:46:39 AM
Thank you Brian. Plus I remember some of the guys on Pirate said they love the Raptor to prerun or chase because they can do so with heated/cooled seats and other comforts.

I'm no fan boy, believe it or not –– but to just dismiss the truck as nothing is just silly.
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Posted: 10/18/2012 2:13:22 AM
Extreme 4x4 did a two or three part series on their version of a budget raptor called "half priced raptor".

http://www.powerblocktv.com/player/show_player.php?ep_num=XT2012-08&ep_show=XT
louisianarebel
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Posted: 10/18/2012 9:24:53 AM
Originally Posted By brian4wd:
Originally Posted By Meanj82:

Speaking strictly from an offload point of view here (we are talking about a supposed offload truck.

That wheel travel is abysmal. That's 4" of up travel more or less and 6-7 of down travel, and that is most likely measured with all the stabilizer bars and sway bars disconnected. Do a search on Moss Brothers Racing Class 3 Bronco. How much travel do you think that truck has - it's won Class 3 ~8 times since it started racing in 2000.

The rear sport spring are still leaf springs, and leaf springs, especially lower spring rate ones are ginormously more prone to spring wrap, which means wheel hop, which means loss of power to ground, which means loss of traction. The rear end should have been linked with a long arm suspension and proper coil overs. Even Jeep doesn't use leaf springs any more, and they are usually always behind the curve. What's the "proper" amount of suspension travel for a truck that can be comfortably daily driven and then be used as a legitimate chase truck in Baja? A properly designed (for the intended application) leaf spring suspension can work damn well and be relatively simple and inexpensive.

All the electronic gizmos are for marketing you don't see any of that shit on offload vehicles because it doesn't work. They are meant as a handicap for people who don't know what they are doing, I don't want my CPU cutting power to my wheels because my tires are spinning a little too fast. Or slowing down around a corner because it feels the vehicle leaning a little too much. Hmm, all those electonic gizmos must be handicaps in the various road racing series that have outlawed their use........

Again with that being said. If you have to deal with emissions standards, simply want a raptor, or just flat out like its lines or whatever. Buy one. More power too you. If you just want the performance of the raptor or better? Buy a stock used one and you can have a better truck for way less money, and probably pay somebody else to do it as well. Just like the Jeep Rubicon, they are ok but you can build way better for much less.I have yet to see a prerunner with equivalent power, comfort and electronics that cost less than a Raptor. I'm sorry but a Ford Ranger with extended i-beams and fiberglass fenders isn't something I'd want to drive to La Paz when chasing for the race truck - every one I go to Baja with would take a Raptor in a heart beat but we all tow 5th wheel trailers in addition to chasing with our trucks so we all have 3/4 ton diesels.


Brian


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Posted: 10/18/2012 9:44:21 AM
Originally Posted By RAINBOW6:
Extreme 4x4 did a two or three part series on their version of a budget raptor called "half priced raptor".

http://www.powerblocktv.com/player/show_player.php?ep_num=XT2012-08&ep_show=XT


I saw that too, and while I'm sure it's a cool truck, it's not the same.

I'd rather finance a limited production bone stock factory-warranted truck with all the modern creature comforts than build up a ten year old truck that's going to be a huge money pit.

At the end of the day, you've got 25k dumped into an old F150 that may resell for a fraction of that.
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Posted: 10/18/2012 9:53:36 AM
Originally Posted By cedjunior:
Originally Posted By effinNewGuy:
Why is the Ford Raptor so expensive?


Marketing, baby.
Why would someone come in to this thread, after 2 pages of mostly informative posts, and post something like this?



Why are diamonds so expensive.

Same damn answer.

Sure you do pay for quality, but it's the marketing that gets the money.

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Posted: 10/18/2012 10:06:24 AM
Sure are alot of haters in here! :)

Buddy of mine got one, and immediately became the designated driver for when we go shooting. It's great on highway and can tear out over the grasslands while I'm drinkin coffee. I damn near ordered one the day after they delivered his, but I had my heart set on a GT500.... which because of that bastard I did order that day
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Posted: 10/18/2012 10:15:17 AM
I love raptor threads, they just peg all the meters for arfcom



And I'd love one in blue, just can't stomach the sticker
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Posted: 10/18/2012 10:17:19 AM
love the motor and trans

i would wreck that trucks suspension

i owned a lifted and done up truck with a similar front suspension setup.

those a arms and that setup would not last, not beefy enough for my liking.

no skid plates on the bottom a arms

those knuckles are too skimpy.

the shocks are nice

but not enough travel to be efficient enough they need about 50% more travel to make it work.
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Posted: 10/18/2012 10:21:30 AM
[Last Edit: 10/18/2012 10:22:19 AM by dropbass]
my Brother N Law has one, it is the shit!

He made sure to get it without the graphics. Looks better in my opinion.
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