Do you believe God already knows what will happen in your life and your fate before you were born?

If so, then how can you influence him, for he knows what will happen, when it will happen, and how it will happen.  If he knows what you will do before you do it, then your actions, thoughts, or behavior shall have no new effect.

Obama's supporters also believe his policies will create a better country and better world.

You may disagree, but that is a matter of opinion regarding anticipated results, not an analysis of how your blind faith is logically different than their blind faith.

Thats the part I don't get. how dose the lack of belief by others rattle them so badly?

You're both absolutely right. Just earlier today I was in atheist church, and then afterwards, the entire atheist congregation went debunking door to door. It's tiring work and I'm about to go to bed, just after I say 10 hail sciences (I haven't been as self righteous as my atheist pastor likes us to be so I'm doing penance).

I don't need church to worship science!   I can do so perfectly well from my easy chair in my underwear!

That's fucking retarded.

I bet nothing would be said if she said she prayed to allah.

I'm an atheist and I'm not "Seething" about anything.



Merry "CHRISTMAS" everyone (Yeah, I'm good with celebrating the birth of the Christ child).

I love the bible thumpers. They are always good for laughs.

Why would atheists seethe?  She is obviously an idiot in spite of her education.

She deserves our pity for being stupid beyond belief.

I would agree.

What I would have a problem with is this kind of belief leading to her telling others not to listen to medical advice, and instead pray disease away.

and before anyone tells me that's bs, nobody here would do that - yes, they do, and i hear it at least once a year.

The fool says in his heart there is no God.

Pushing those kinds of quotes does the devil's work for him. Pounding on the wedge between people and Jesus.

Y'all do realize that that's what saying hurtful and insulting things to atheists is, right? Satan putting evil, self righteous words in your mouth to keep you from leading stray sheep back to the fold. He pays you for it by giving you that warm, superior, smug feeling. That's the devil's currency.

Will you ask Zeus to take mercy on you while on your death bed?

Right. But not everyone need die as infants, or of disease, or famine, or dehydration, or of brutal murder or of sexual abuse and torture. All of these are occurring while those two teams pray against each other and others ask for nice weather on their wedding day. If it weren't so offensive, it would be laughable.


But I know, "God works in mysterious ways..."

Next on their list will be to get the ACLU to file suit to ban prayer in hospitals.

And next on that of the theists' will be to lobby their Congressmen to require it.

I bet my prediction comes true before yours.

I'm sure you do.

Well it is an unfair bet because prayer is allowed in hospitals.

I'll give you 5 to 1 odds?

Let's just both hope that neither occurs

I BELIEVE



















I'll have another beer.

We all have doubts.

"Believers" as you put it witness the Gospel, as that is what we are instructed and compelled to do, by the Word of God, not out of a need to be "right".
If you have seen someone claiming to be a "believer" openly mock or ridicule a person without faith, then they aren't doing it the way they are supposed to.

My beliefs are gleaned from scripture, not simply my opinion.
When someone says XXXX is a sin, they are pointing out what Scripture tells them, and SHOULD be doing it in good will, to help, not in judgement.

Openly mocking someone because they cannot prove their beliefs, when you, yourself, cannot DISPROVE theirs, using your methods, is the problem, as I see it.

Yeah, my question too.

As a Christian, I have never understood that belief structure.

I would take advantage of any medical advances God provided us with the ability to discover.

Wow, that sounds kind of butthurtish.

Why is she an idiot? Because she also thanked her colleagues/medical professionals, AND prayer? Prayer, which is a form of positive thinking and very likely did help her keep a good outlook, which likely helped her beat this terrible diesase?

I'm willing to bet that she's a fairly decent nurse, and can even continue to function as one, even though she is religious and believes in the efficacy of prayer.

And this.

I doubt this woman became a nurse because she doesn't think medicine is good for anything.

Except for a few flavors of religion, most religious folk believe in modern medicine and will do both things—pray AND see a doctor.

Hey, if prayer "worked" for them and they got cured, what's the beef?

A lot of people do not believe in a higher order; no skin off my nose.

I am a man of faith; I pray.

If someone wants to believe in zero, no problem with me. Just don't go ballistic for those that do believe.

Question: When a man is in combat or a life threatening situation, the most often thing I hear is: "Oh, Jesus!" or "Lord, help me!"

...wonder why?....

How come she's not mad at God for letting her get it in the first place?  If someone walked up to me and stabbed me a few times, then called the ambulance, thanking the dude for saving my life is a little bit farther down on my list of priorities when the police come questioning.

The problem as I see it is, many are under the impression Christians think praying to God means He will do things for them or give them things.
Like asking Dad for more money for a date, or to use the car.
Maybe that's actually how some Christians see it, but I don't.

I've seen my share of death, disease, misery, and unfair circumstance.
Not once did I EXPECT God to make the bad stuff go away simply because I prayed for it.
Yes, I pray for Him to be merciful, and spare the suffering, but at the same time, I pray for myself and others to have the strength to accept, survive, overcome, or otherwise deal with, whatever happens.

This part is my own take/opinion:
I see prayer mostly as a "strengthening of will" exercise (to borrow a phrase used earlier), to help Christians and others deal best with adversity.
Example, the guy who goes through hell on Earth and comes out stronger and more resilient, vs the guy that loses it, and commits suicide, or worse.
The family that grows stronger as a result of tragedy, vs being torn apart.

God has performed "miracles", of this I am certain.
I'm unsure whether it was in response to prayer, or His plan, it's not my place to question.

But simply understanding the physical processes of what has happened, it retrospect, in no way proves that the outcome was NOT influenced by outside intervention.
Nothing in science, medical or otherwise, is 100% free of "anomalies", correct?
No course of treatment has a 100% constant success rate, or outcome, correct?
If you've got a 50/50 chance, when treated, of reaching an outcome, who can say for certain the guy that made it did not make it because of Divine intervention?

Addressing an earlier comment, someone prays to God, and dies regardless.
Well, why is that you assume that is such a horrible, unfair situation?
If you postulate that God is unfair by letting someone "die", you are ignoring the fact that the existence of God validates the existence of Heaven.
Meaning, if that person was saved, they are in a lot better shape than they were, here.
Sure, their family will have a rougher time of it, here, but everyone dies, it's not a matter of if, just when, and a lifetime here isn't a drop in the bucket to eternity.

For the sake of argument, what happens if the atheists are "right"?
None of us will ever know.
Now, what, exactly, do you suppose the outcome will be assuming Scripture is correct?
I imagine there will be some surprised folks with lots of time on their hands to consider their decisions.

I see no upside in being "liberated" of my belief structure, other than bragging rights on the internet.

Really?  When watching live leak, all I hear are scatological and sexual comments concerning the area below the belt when they're being shot at.

Unless they're muslim, then it's all about how their god loves snackbars or some such.

I am sure many of the dead folks prayed too, so I can see their point
You can't see prayer under a microscope
She could have believed it and maybe it gave her some degree of comfort, but that's about all it can be worth from a scientific perspective

Why is it "some" folks blame God for everything bad that happens, but think that everything good that come their way they achieved on their own?

Feeding Dolphins on the Coast is illegal, right?
What's the logic against feeding the dolphins?
What's the logic against welfare, for those capable of providing for themselves?
What's the logic for not doing everything for your children, and making them struggle, at times?

Why do some folks think that a just and fair God would never allow anything bad to happen to anyone, ever, and allow them to do as they please, no matter what that consisted of?

In your experience, what happens to those who never have to struggle or fend for themselves, and have their every need attended to?

They become spiteful, disobedient, self centered, and disrespectful.

In the Old Testament, God played an active role in the lives of the chosen, and they rebelled anyhoo.

I'm just saying God could be a little proactive instead of just constantly putting out fires. It would be less than trivial to wave his hand, poof,  no more Ebola. Instead he's answering prayers after the fact, running back and forth like a triage nurse, you get cured because we have transfusions and antivirals here, you get to bleed out because you live in Liberia, curerd, cured, cu... no I don't like your face, no cure, Pauly Shore. Sounds inefficient to me.

All of that.





I'm one of those atheists that doesn't believe Religion (or more specifically Christianity) is a bad thing.  I've known a ton of people whose lives changed for the better as a result of it... hard to complain about that from where I stand.





The only problem with Christianity, is the same problem that plagues everything... which is, people can be assholes.



The atheists complaining, are being assholes.





Don't be assholes, folks.





 

quoting the Bible does the devils work for him?

I hope you don't mock the people that believe that the world is controlled by reptilian aliens. Bush, Obama, Putin, all of them are lizard men. You can't disprove it.

Yes these people really exist.

And just how often have you heard this from a man in combat or about to be killed? Considering the world's population is in the billions, what's your sample size?

Absolutely, there is some messed up stuff in those pages.

The surest way to set someone on the path of atheism is to ask them to read the bible.

You make a valid point. The difficulty I have is when the ignorant among us read these accounts and then try to use my tax dollars to legislate based on their superstitions.

And for the record, I don't seethe at anyone professing the power of their prayer, I may just chuckle a little inside.

Come on.  It's much more intelligent and logical to believe in supernatural spirits that we can't see or touch or find any practical evidence of.  Or even that there was a Jew who walked the earth 2000 years ago for about 33 years who actually was a god and saved the world, even though the world appears no more saved now then when Greeks and Persians conquered all.   At least Atheists don't believe in more than one god, that has got to be the worst, those 1 Billion Hindus.

Why does the heathen rage?

No atheists in the Ebola foxhole?

Can I stop seething yet?  My face is starting to go numb.

Weeping and gnashing of your teeth will also suffice.

I think this is the phase your were searching for...

 

Cherry picking divisive quotes when there are so many other quotes about Jesus' love? Pulling them out of context like that? You bet.

Most of the cherry picking comes from the side trying to find those few isolated instances of love amidst all the oppression and murder that makes up the bulk of the book.