Anyone know for sure what Chopper was lost during raid? - Page 2

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Posted: 5/2/2011 3:03:17 PM EDT

[#1]

So any guesses what tech support is going to do with the remains?

Posted: 5/2/2011 3:03:59 PM EDT

[#2]

Quoted:
During the famous Son Tay Raid in North Vietnam, a helicopter was deliberately crashed inside the walls for surprise and to open the doors for the other raiders. The walls at the Bin Laden compound were tall with barbed wire on top, plus the helicopter is vunerable when fast roping out. Looks like history repeats itself.
Great job Seal Team Six.

interesting

Posted: 5/3/2011 6:30:10 AM EDT

[#3]

Wow! Unless these photos are doctored (which is always a possibility), gentleman, we are looking at a new, black program stealth helicopter (possibly a modification of an existing airframe - MH-60?) that went down in OBL's back yard.

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?197623-Mystery-of-downed-Chopper

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1382859/Osama-bin-Laden-dead-Photo-Obama-watching-Al-Qaeda-leader-die-live-TV.html

Posted: 5/3/2011 6:38:54 AM EDT

[#4]

On the radio this morning (I'm near Ft Campbell) it was the 160th Night Stalkers flying the mission.

Posted: 5/3/2011 6:42:42 AM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
Wow! Unless these photos are doctored (which is always a possibility), gentleman, we are looking at a new, black program stealth helicopter (possibly a modification of an existing airframe - MH-60?) that went down in OBL's back yard.

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?197623-Mystery-of-downed-Chopper

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12597.0;attach=131559;image

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12597.0;attach=131559;image

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12597.0;attach=131561;image

Damn, that is interesting.

Posted: 5/3/2011 6:52:16 AM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Wow! Unless these photos are doctored (which is always a possibility), gentleman, we are looking at a new, black program stealth helicopter (possibly a modification of an existing airframe - MH-60?) that went down in OBL's back yard.

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?197623-Mystery-of-downed-Chopper

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12597.0;attach=131559;image

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12597.0;attach=131559;image

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12597.0;attach=131561;image

Damn, that is interesting.

Well ain't that something.

Posted: 5/3/2011 6:54:13 AM EDT

[#7]

hmmmm

Posted: 5/3/2011 6:54:35 AM EDT

[#8]

Fox was showing some pakis hauling the copter away. Most likely to the Chinese no doubt.

Posted: 5/3/2011 6:54:47 AM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Wow! Unless these photos are doctored (which is always a possibility), gentleman, we are looking at a new, black program stealth helicopter (possibly a modification of an existing airframe - MH-60?) that went down in OBL's back yard.

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?197623-Mystery-of-downed-Chopper

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12597.0;attach=131559;image

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12597.0;attach=131559;image

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=12597.0;attach=131561;image

Damn, that is interesting.

Well ain't that something.

See, I knew that didn't look like a Blackhawk tail section.

Posted: 5/3/2011 6:59:10 AM EDT

[#10]

I am going to say not a 60.

The tail section from original pic looks a bit like an MI-17.

But the rotor looks like the panther a little bit.

Stabilator. Thats what they call that thing on a 60.

Posted: 5/3/2011 6:59:34 AM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:
http://img695.imageshack.us/img695/3991/7c634785915a.jpg

BHawk

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:03:46 AM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
I am going to say not a 60.
The tail section from original pic looks a bit like an MI-17.
But the rotor looks like the panther a little bit.

Stabilator. Thats what they call that thing on a 60.

Not an Mi-17. I spent all day, everyday on them.

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:05:27 AM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:

Quoted:

http://img695.imageshack.us/img695/3991/7c634785915a.jpg

BHawk

try again

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:05:51 AM EDT

[#14]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That doesn't look like a Blackhawk tail section.

Sure does, look: http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSczXK2Q4GhDE1FzMrO9VLxxxrRFPVhkzEc9ws1K2rNaRtBEWgP

The crash pic looks like the tail section has to separate vertical stabilizers coming off of it. The Blackhawk has one complete stabilizer.

http://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/imgs/sikorsky-uh60-blackhawk_2.jpg

Based on new photos I retract my previous assumptions

No comment on what the make and model is

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:07:15 AM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:
Here's some more photos of the Pakistanis hauling away wreckage

http://img846.imageshack.us/img846/8679/1000xw.jpg

http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/6082/1000xot.jpg

http://img838.imageshack.us/img838/9076/x900i.jpg

http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/9167/1000xu.jpg

And you know they will hand the wreckage over to the Chinese. Where it would have been reverse-engineered, if it had not been blown.

This is the real reason the helo was destroyed....not, as they said, to prevent it from falling into the hands of al Queida.

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:10:50 AM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That doesn't look like a Blackhawk tail section.

Sure does, look: http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSczXK2Q4GhDE1FzMrO9VLxxxrRFPVhkzEc9ws1K2rNaRtBEWgP

The crash pic looks like the tail section has to separate vertical stabilizers coming off of it. The Blackhawk has one complete stabilizer.

http://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/imgs/sikorsky-uh60-blackhawk_2.jpg

It got blowed up and damaged you are looking at the tail section from a top down fwd facing up orientation.

it goes BOOM gets blown over the wall (assumption on my part) and the stabilator is likely cracked in half

oops, wrong quote

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:14:03 AM EDT

[#17]

This is where your Ambassador to Pakistan earns his pay. "President Musharrif, we're willing to not rock the boat on you guys hiding the most wanted terrorist in the world from us while bald-faced lying to our us about his whereabouts. Seeing as how he's dead now that's not much of an issue anymore, is it? What we will not tolerate, however, is any little bit of that helicopter making it into anyone's hands but ours. That would be completely unacceptable. Now either you can deliver it to us or we can send some more of the same people who left it there to recover it. It's up to you."

It seems like Pakistan got right in front on sealing off the area after the fact. Big bucks is on the line, more than what China would pay for the wreckage.

Quoted:

Quoted:

Here's some more photos of the Pakistanis hauling away wreckage

http://img846.imageshack.us/img846/8679/1000xw.jpg

http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/6082/1000xot.jpg

http://img838.imageshack.us/img838/9076/x900i.jpg

http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/9167/1000xu.jpg

And you know they will hand the wreckage over to the Chinese. Where it would have been reverse-engineered, if it had not been blown.

This is the real reason the helo was destroyed....not, as they said, to prevent it from falling into the hands of al Queida.

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:24:19 AM EDT

[#18]

I am questioning the validity of the second set of pics

The first picture you can clearly see the tail driveshaft and IGB as well as what appears to be the tail wheel right at the top of the wall. The shape and proportion of the second pictures do not appear to match those of the 1st.

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:33:19 AM EDT

[#19]

Quoted:
I am questioning the validity of the second set of pics

The first picture you can clearly see the tail driveshaft and IGB as well as what appears to be the tail wheel right at the top of the wall. The shape and proportion of the second pictures do not appear to match those of the 1st.

I think it's the same brother

I'm looking at the angles of the boom itself, as well as the remains of the broken blades. I believe they match up, but I'm not a photo expert by any means.

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:43:05 AM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:
Wow! Unless these photos are doctored (which is always a possibility), gentleman, we are looking at a new, black program stealth helicopter (possibly a modification of an existing airframe - MH-60?) that went down in OBL's back yard.

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?197623-Mystery-of-downed-Chopper

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1382859/Osama-bin-Laden-dead-Photo-Obama-watching-Al-Qaeda-leader-die-live-TV.html

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/05/03/article-1382859-0BE1F64C00000578-384_470x423.jpg

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/05/03/article-1382859-0BE1E40F00000578-506_470x423.jpg

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/05/03/article-1382859-0BE1E4AC00000578-295_470x423.jpg

Tha fuck?

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:43:38 AM EDT

[#21]

Quoted:

Quoted:
I am questioning the validity of the second set of pics

The first picture you can clearly see the tail driveshaft and IGB as well as what appears to be the tail wheel right at the top of the wall. The shape and proportion of the second pictures do not appear to match those of the 1st.

I think it's the same brother

I'm looking at the angles of the boom itself, as well as the remains of the broken blades. I believe they match up, but I'm not a photo expert by any means.

They may have chopped the area with the driveshafts to make it easier to crane.

It may be the same but if it is this is a highly modified version of the BHawk. Not surprised by it, I know some people who do that stuff down south

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:46:46 AM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
The Navy doesn't have Ch46's any more. MH60S Seahawk is most likely the Helo that crashed, not Blackhawk.... Army fly's those. lol

Uhhh, it wasn't Navy Helos

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:47:49 AM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That doesn't look like a Blackhawk tail section.

Sure does, look: http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSczXK2Q4GhDE1FzMrO9VLxxxrRFPVhkzEc9ws1K2rNaRtBEWgP

The crash pic looks like the tail section has to separate vertical stabilizers coming off of it. The Blackhawk has one complete stabilizer.

http://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/imgs/sikorsky-uh60-blackhawk_2.jpg

Kinda wierd. Swept-foward horizontal surfaces, strange cover over of the tailrotor hub, very smooth surfaces; no rivets or seams. It has a paint sheen similar to the pics of the F-22s

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:48:33 AM EDT

[#24]

Quoted:

Quoted:
The Navy doesn't have Ch46's any more. MH60S Seahawk is most likely the Helo that crashed, not Blackhawk.... Army fly's those. lol

No way anyone but 160th SOAR flew that mission.

Agree. I would be stunned if it was anyone else.

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:49:32 AM EDT

[#25]

Quoted:

Quoted:

That doesn't look like a Blackhawk tail section.

Sure does, look: http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSczXK2Q4GhDE1FzMrO9VLxxxrRFPVhkzEc9ws1K2rNaRtBEWgP

The crash pic looks like the tail section has to separate vertical stabilizers coming off of it. The Blackhawk has one complete stabilizer.

http://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/imgs/sikorsky-uh60-blackhawk_2.jpg

Kinda wierd. Swept-foward horizontal surfaces, strange cover over of the tailrotor hub, very smooth surfaces; no rivets or seams. It has a paint sheen similar to the pics of the F-22s

I thought it looked like forward swept elevators too, but now I think it may just be a bent shaft

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:55:15 AM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:

Quoted:

The Navy doesn't have Ch46's any more. MH60S Seahawk is most likely the Helo that crashed, not Blackhawk.... Army fly's those. lol

No way anyone but 160th SOAR flew that mission.

Agree. I would be stunned if it was anyone else.

NAVSPECWAR has their own aviation det.

As others have reminded me, they actually keep secrets, as opposed to the endless discovery channel specials.

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:56:59 AM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That doesn't look like a Blackhawk tail section.

Sure does, look: http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSczXK2Q4GhDE1FzMrO9VLxxxrRFPVhkzEc9ws1K2rNaRtBEWgP

The crash pic looks like the tail section has to separate vertical stabilizers coming off of it. The Blackhawk has one complete stabilizer.

http://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/imgs/sikorsky-uh60-blackhawk_2.jpg

Kinda wierd. Swept-foward horizontal surfaces, strange cover over of the tailrotor hub, very smooth surfaces; no rivets or seams. It has a paint sheen similar to the pics of the F-22s

It's got me baffled, and they way they have it all covered up on the trucks. I just don't see them doing that unless there was something to hide.

I mean, the whole world knows we lost a helicopter, so why hide it?

Posted: 5/3/2011 7:59:35 AM EDT

[#28]

Why the hell can't we make a helo that can get thru one commando mission intact?

I can't even begin to think of the times whirlybirds have cause problems all the way back to the Iran hostage rescue.

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:00:07 AM EDT

[#29]

Quoted:
Wow! Unless these photos are doctored (which is always a possibility), gentleman, we are looking at a new, black program stealth helicopter (possibly a modification of an existing airframe - MH-60?) that went down in OBL's back yard.

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?197623-Mystery-of-downed-Chopper

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1382859/Osama-bin-Laden-dead-Photo-Obama-watching-Al-Qaeda-leader-die-live-TV.html

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/05/03/article-1382859-0BE1F64C00000578-384_470x423.jpg

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/05/03/article-1382859-0BE1E40F00000578-506_470x423.jpg

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/05/03/article-1382859-0BE1E4AC00000578-295_470x423.jpg

My thoughts exactly. These were actually the first pics I saw, and they don't match up with a UH-60 airframe at all; my first thought when I saw that strange "cover" over the rotor was that it may have been a modified MH-53, but THAT airframe doesn't match, either. Also, in some of the other images the Pakis were hauling away what looked to be partially burnt carbon-fiber panels.

???

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:00:32 AM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:

Quoted:
That doesn't look like a Blackhawk tail section.

Sure does, look: http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSczXK2Q4GhDE1FzMrO9VLxxxrRFPVhkzEc9ws1K2rNaRtBEWgP

The crash pic looks like the tail section has to separate vertical stabilizers coming off of it. The Blackhawk has one complete stabilizer.

http://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/imgs/sikorsky-uh60-blackhawk_2.jpg

Kinda wierd. Swept-foward horizontal surfaces, strange cover over of the tailrotor hub, very smooth surfaces; no rivets or seams. It has a paint sheen similar to the pics of the F-22s

It's got me baffled

The shot of the 'lower' upper end: very smooth, carbon black color. The 'half cheese wheel' cover at top (note: gone durning recovery). Strange tail cone.

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:02:24 AM EDT

[#31]

Quoted:

So any guesses what tech support is going to do with the remains?

Next stop: China.

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:08:26 AM EDT

[#32]

Do I see five blades on the small head near that gear box ?

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:11:54 AM EDT

[#33]

More importantly, were any of our guys injured or killed?

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:15:30 AM EDT

[#34]

Quoted:

More importantly, were any of our guys injured or killed?

Pretty sure nobody died.

Injuries probably wouldn't be talked about.

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:16:59 AM EDT

[#35]

It makes me all giddy inside knowing there are still advanced aircraft that nobody knows about doing covert ops.

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:18:04 AM EDT

[#36]

Quoted:
Do I see five blades on the small head near that gear box ?

Yep, and what's even more evident, is the blade that is closest to the stabilizer appears to be intact. I can't image them being any longer without contacting the stab itself.

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:18:20 AM EDT

[#37]

Which US helos have a five bladed tail rotor?

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:23:58 AM EDT

[#38]

Quoted:
Which US helos have a five bladed tail rotor?

None that I know of, but I could be wrong obviously.

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:29:56 AM EDT

[#39]

Quoted:
Which US helos have a five bladed tail rotor?

None I know of, but doesn't the AH-6D Little Bird have a 5 bladed main rotor? But the tail section looks too big for that craft.

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:32:25 AM EDT

[#40]

its a four bladed rotor––-the bottom blade is simply bent back from striking the ground.

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:34:45 AM EDT

[#41]

Interdasting! Think that could be some spinoff from the RAH-66 program?

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:36:45 AM EDT

[#42]

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:37:11 AM EDT

[#43]

Quoted:
its a four bladed rotor––-the bottom blade is simply bent back from striking the ground.

I can agree with this, but the overall blade length is still the shortest I've ever seen.

Retracted, it's five blades after looking at the pics again.

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:38:01 AM EDT

[#44]

Quoted:
It makes me all giddy inside knowing there are still advanced aircraft that nobody knows about doing covert ops.

Yeah. This one has everyone stumped across the internet.

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:41:30 AM EDT

[#45]

Interesting. When I first saw the picture of the tail hanging over the wall I was wondering what it was.

Wonder if that is armor or some type of stealth material over the tail. It looks like it's a tight fit right up to the tail.

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:42:27 AM EDT

[#46]

Quoted:

Quoted:

That doesn't look like a Blackhawk tail section.

Sure does, look: http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSczXK2Q4GhDE1FzMrO9VLxxxrRFPVhkzEc9ws1K2rNaRtBEWgP

The crash pic looks like the tail section has to separate vertical stabilizers coming off of it. The Blackhawk has one complete stabilizer.

http://www.militaryfactory.com/aircraft/imgs/sikorsky-uh60-blackhawk_2.jpg

The MH-60s (and USAF HH-60s) have a different more squared off stab design (part of the manual folding tail), they also have handholds to make them easier to fold. All of that makes them easier to fold up for air transport or shipboard stowage.

I know for an absolute fact that the 160th flew the mission.

Posted: 5/3/2011 8:46:12 AM EDT

[#47]

If it was a super secret chopper, I wouldn't get near that thing without a respirator and hazmat gear. But it is Pakistan and maybe they don't care about their people. I bet that we are going to have to cough up a lot more aid to get that son of bitch back.