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Posted: 2/23/2022 12:46:38 AM EDT
[#1]
Barrel is also cold hammer forged. So add another $100 or so of value if it's important to you.
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Posted: 2/23/2022 12:59:23 AM EDT
[#2]
Not for me.
If I was putting thousands of rounds a year through a rifle? Maybe. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 1:10:01 AM EDT
[#3]
Do they still use non-standard castle nuts where the notches for staking are rounded and shallow?
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Posted: 2/23/2022 1:17:13 AM EDT
[#4]
plot twist. DD IS mid tier.
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Posted: 2/23/2022 1:22:01 AM EDT
[#5]
Yes.
I used my mk18 for a main duty weapon and a training tool for three straight years. Beat the crap out of that gun and it still runs like a top, accurate, reliable. The only reason I went to a SBR super duty is the weight and Mlok. But for me DD has made great rifles. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 1:27:56 AM EDT
[#6]
Imo you're paying for the barrel, QC, warranty/support, and handguard (if it's RIS)
All are outstanding. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 1:32:24 AM EDT
[#7]
Get your hands on a DD barrel and a Microbest BCG. Build your Aero gun around them. Headspace check it. You can meet your torn mind in the middle.
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Posted: 2/23/2022 1:53:08 AM EDT
[#8]
I would pay the extra for one. Customer service/warranty work is by far the best. Their barrels are excellent. For hard use I would take that over a aero rifle for sure.
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Posted: 2/23/2022 2:01:05 AM EDT
[#9]
Build your own with a DD CHF barrel, that really is the best part of their rifles. I wasn't impressed with their MLOK handguards and the their brand-specific furniture. I use Forward Controls or MiwWest Industries handguards and MagPul furniture.
I put my rifles together and they run, I'm not too concerned about a rifle warranty as I can fix most anything wrong operationally with them. Faulty individual parts go back if they have to. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 2:06:31 AM EDT
[#10]
The gas port sizes, BCG materials, buffer weights, etc are all superior with the DD.
If you take training seriously, yes it is worth it. I've owned both. Aeros speciality is receivers, not the other parts for a whole rifle. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 2:14:14 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The gas port sizes, BCG materials, buffer weights, etc are all superior with the DD. If you take training seriously, yes it is worth it. I've owned both. Aeros speciality is receivers, not the other parts for a whole rifle. Agreed on all except buffer weights. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 2:18:25 AM EDT
[#12]
I like griffin and their RECCE.
My training rifle is a rifle built a centurion OEM handguard. My go to rifle with be 100% a factory gun and I'm leaning towards a DD every day. The only thing I don't like is their plastic port door I believe. DD is mid tier but it's a solid rifle. Honestly go with a colt or FN and choose your handguard of choice. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 3:05:35 AM EDT
[#13]
The only thing about DD that stands out is the barrel and handguard if it’s a RIS.
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Posted: 2/23/2022 4:08:04 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: plot twist. DD IS mid tier. CTPT. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 4:09:57 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The only thing about DD that stands out is the barrel and handguard if it’s a RIS. Concur. Get a DD barrel and a DD rail if one must, and build around it. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 4:12:24 AM EDT
[#16]
I use DD barrels in just about all my build ups. 1 rifle has an FN chrome lined, the other has a CMMG nitride barrel.
My 3 6.8's are DD barrels. 4 of the 5.56 rifles are DD also. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 8:21:42 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Honestly go with a colt or FN and choose your handguard of choice. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 8:29:38 AM EDT
[#18]
just the fact that you're asking this question leads me to believe you won't be happy if you do happen to spend the extra juice on the DD
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Posted: 2/23/2022 8:50:31 AM EDT
[#19]
Not to piggyback on OP’s question, but I’m currently trying to decide on my next AR. In terms of a hard use CQB-range carbine, how would a BCM stack up in terms of reliability and durability?
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Posted: 2/23/2022 9:35:45 AM EDT
[#20]
Quoted: I'm looking at getting another rifle and I've noticed that Daniel Defense makes more or less what I'm looking for, but it would cost an additional $500 over a mostly Aero Precision rifle. The only differences that I can discern are the Daniel Defense specific components (charging handle, handguard, furniture, etc.), a chrome lined bolt carrier, and a chrome lined barrel. I get the advantages of the chrome lined components, but in my experience chrome lined components aren't an additional $500.00 (I feel like that both should be at most $100-$150 more). Is Daniel Defense really worth the extra money? Daniel Defense makes US military issued products. Aero Precision does not. Aero Precision doesn't make a single product ordered by the US military. You are paying for the pedigree with Daniel Defense. And yes, they are worth it. I do have a DD M4A1 rifle and highly recommend DD rifles. The quality of Aero Precision is also just so-so. The anodizing on my Aero Precision lower easily chipped off at the trigger guard area as I was installing a trigger guard. That can be covered up but I was surprised. They are known for occasional out of spec receivers and parts so be prepared for that. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 9:36:58 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not to piggyback on OP’s question, but I’m currently trying to decide on my next AR. In terms of a hard use CQB-range carbine, how would a BCM stack up in terms of reliability and durability? I have a BCM rifle and a DD rifle. While the DD is superior due to the barrel, the BCM is as reliable and durable in my book. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 9:49:46 AM EDT
[#22]
Add another $100-150 to the DD for replacing the stock and grip, then add another $100-270 for replacing the trigger.
$1900 + $420 = $2320 Now you’re in the LMT/KAC zone. Or you could just build something with a premium barrel/BCG/hanguard for way less and call it a day. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 10:10:25 AM EDT
[#23]
At MSRP, they are quite the jump in price. Most DD's are $1500-2200. Most Aero's can be pieced together for $800-900.
While I'm not saying DD's are worth MSRP, I've bought 2 for $1300-1400ish in the last 2 years (yeah, Covid prices) and the DD's are the only AR's I've bought with zero regrets. Reliable, more accurate than I feel like defending on here this morning, and resale is on point. I believe you are also buying more QC with the dud/good ratio, not that Aero is bad,but that DD is better. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 10:41:26 AM EDT
[#24]
Not to me, or more that I’d rather build my own or buy other brands at their price point.
Very small sample size, just my only personal experience with DD. In my family we probably own 25 different ARs from multiple manufacturers + a bunch of home builts. Only 1 of those is DD but it’s the only one that had to be sent back to be fixed cause it wouldn’t feed at all. I think all you’re paying for is marketing. *edit - DD did fix the problem quickly, for free, and sent it back quickly so they will take care of you if you do have issues. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 10:49:38 AM EDT
[#25]
I have a couple factory DD guns from when I was just starting with ARs and they’ve been excellent but have moved to building my rifles around a DD barrel and sometimes their BCG.
The new RISIII has my attention but am using G MK 8 rails for now. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 10:50:59 AM EDT
[#26]
Quoted: Is Daniel Defense really worth the extra money? Are you going to put a suppressor on it? If so, the Daniel Defense rifle with barrel threads cut the proper size and concentric bore is what you want, and WELL worth the expense over the other. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 11:19:37 AM EDT
[#27]
I have only ever owned one factory built AR15, and that is my DD that I got last year.
To me, yes, it was worth it. I lack the ability to build a rifle as nice, and the small parts seem superior to all the Spikes and DPMS and PSA crap I have used in the past. It comes with an excellent warranty, and it actually has a good resale value (for an AR15) if I ever feel the need to sell or trade. I doubt I will ever build an AR again, and I don't see myself ever buying an Aero or a PSA or an S&W (though I think they are all satisfactory). |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 11:22:08 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not to piggyback on OP’s question, but I’m currently trying to decide on my next AR. In terms of a hard use CQB-range carbine, how would a BCM stack up in terms of reliability and durability? BCM's cold hammer forged barrels are better than their standard barrels, in my experience. I have 14.5" and two 11.5" BCM CHF uppers, and they are comparable in accuracy and reliability to my 10.3 and 11.5 Daniel Defense barrels. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 11:24:39 AM EDT
[#29]
Everyone always says “just build it”…
Some people like to just buy a quality factory rifle with factory assembled components and be done with it. That’s basically where I’m at…I just wanted to buy a great rifle and run it. I have two DD rifles and couldn’t be happier. A lot of little things like their barrels and BCGs, as well as top notch handguards and the fact their rifles are made 100% in house is what you’re paying for. I’m sure I could have saved a few hundred bucks “building” one of similar quality but that’s not worth the effort to me. If it is for you then power to you. I think the new DD RIS 3 rail will also be a game changer and will be getting at least a 10.3 once they’re available. RIS quality/strength in an MLOK rail? Sign me up! |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 11:31:33 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Everyone always says “just build it”… Some people like to just buy a quality factory rifle with factory assembled components and be done with it. That’s basically where I’m at…I just wanted to buy a great rifle and run it. I have two DD rifles and couldn’t be happier. A lot of little things like their barrels and BCGs, as well as top notch handguards and the fact their rifles are made 100% in house is what you’re paying for. I’m sure I could have saved a few hundred bucks “building” one of similar quality but that’s not worth the effort to me. If it is for you then power to you. I think the new DD RIS 3 rail will also be a game changer and will be getting at least a 10.3 once they’re available. RIS quality/strength in an MLOK rail? Sign me up! Building a rifle sounds like a great idea until it's time to sell it. And I am skeptical that it actually saves much money. I have never built am AR and thought "Gee, I saved so much money!" versus a factory rifle of sinilar quality. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 11:37:48 AM EDT
[#31]
DD is releasing the new DDM4 RIII with a ambi lower in 10.3, 11.5, 14.5, 16 this spring.
 Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 11:49:38 AM EDT
[#32]
Or you could just buy a DD upper, an Aeroprecision stripped lower receiver, Aeroprecision or CMMG parts kit and add stock and trigger of your choice. You get the best parts of DD, get to spec your own trigger, stock, etc., and save some money. I picked up a DD upper from Brownels, (minus the charging handle and bolt carrier) on sale for under $700. With a little patience you can find an Aeroprecision stripped receiver for $70. Add a LaRue trigger for $100, or splurge on a Geissele. Finding a stock on sale generally isn't a problem. And, if you want to go with a barrel under 16" you can get a pistol brace. Maybe throw in an H2 buffer and you're going to end up with a fantastic rifle.
Honestly, to me it's the best of both worlds, particularly since I have distinct preferences when it comes to what trigger, stock, charging handle and even pistol grip I use. And putting together a lower is pretty simple. As to worrying about potential resale ... it depends on how important that is to you. Personally I'm keeping my DD rifles until I die. If my kids lose a couple of bucks if/when they sell my rifles, that's there problem. 
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Posted: 2/23/2022 12:41:35 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Add another $100-150 to the DD for replacing the stock and grip, then add another $100-270 for replacing the trigger. $1900 + $420 = $2320 Now you’re in the LMT/KAC zone. Or you could just build something with a premium barrel/BCG/hanguard for way less and call it a day. I put an ALG ACT on my DD for $50. Where are you getting $270? Replacing the furniture is a personal preference. Many like and prefer DD furniture. I myself prefer the Vltor IMOD stock on everything so that's going to bump up the price for me regardless of the rifle I buy. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 1:02:21 PM EDT
[#34]
Quoted: I'm looking at getting another rifle and I've noticed that Daniel Defense makes more or less what I'm looking for, but it would cost an additional $500 over a mostly Aero Precision rifle. The only differences that I can discern are the Daniel Defense specific components (charging handle, handguard, furniture, etc.), a chrome lined bolt carrier, and a chrome lined barrel. I get the advantages of the chrome lined components, but in my experience chrome lined components aren't an additional $500.00 (I feel like that both should be at most $100-$150 more). Is Daniel Defense really worth the extra money? If I wanted a go-to rifle, I'd have no qualms about buying a DD complete rifle. The company has history, staying power, and a pedigree. They have supplied parts to the US military. The barrels and BCGs are top quality by all accounts. They are one of the few that are making the majority of components in house. Aero Precision produces budget parts for a budget-conscious consumer. They make cost saving measures in raw materials, QC, and sourced parts. Nobody can tell you if a DD rifle is worth the additional money to you. Decide what you're going to use it for (shooting dirt, classes, home defense). Determine what the odds are of you ever selling the rifle (a factory DD rifle will retain its value). Make your decision. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 1:03:59 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: DD is releasing the new DDM4 RIII with a ambi lower in 10.3, 11.5, 14.5, 16 this spring. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/236598/90DA8DD1-C78E-48EA-B497-3AD0149D628F_jpe-2290048.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/236598/A774CDF7-C1BD-4BA1-AD9A-64AED8074B84_jpe-2290055.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/236598/BD81F0A7-8596-4615-8E2F-1F2C482B9EEB_jpe-2290057.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/236598/E9EE0D36-5F9A-4424-9516-9BEE382DE071_jpe-2290058.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/236598/5C4464EA-D17A-4A45-9922-015A112717A4_jpe-2290059.JPG I haven't bought a factory rifle in a dozen years. I'll buy one of these when they're available. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 1:08:39 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Daniel Defense makes US military issued products. Aero Precision does not. Aero Precision doesn't make a single product ordered by the US military. You are paying for the pedigree with Daniel Defense. And yes, they are worth it. I do have a DD M4A1 rifle and highly recommend DD rifles. At one point, DD made rails for the military…that’s it. Not much of a pedigree. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 1:48:41 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Daniel Defense makes US military issued products. Aero Precision does not. To be fair..their military contracts are relatively recent and only for specific components..not complete rifles. Their parts are in the infancy stage of military use compared to other manufacturers. In contrast, FN has been cold hammer forging barrels for legit military use in real combat since likely before little dannys grandfather was born..that however did not stop them from charging extreme prices since launching their product and with zero track record. I remember seeing their guns and pricing when they first released..and was like who the fetch is daniel? Lol Also lets not forget that discount pricing and politics play a large part in securing military contracts. SIG with their problem ridden P320/M17 and their unknown optics winning contracts over the long proven Glock system and well established and combat proven Trijicon RMR etc. being a prime example. To answer OP's question..No, I would not say dd is worth the extra $500 unless significant and objective upgrades are included. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 1:49:07 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Add another $100-150 to the DD for replacing the stock and grip, then add another $100-270 for replacing the trigger. $1900 + $420 = $2320 Now you're in the LMT/KAC zone. Or you could just build something with a premium barrel/BCG/hanguard for way less and call it a day. Not arguing against the quality of Knights...but I don't think this is an apples-to-apples comparison. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 1:51:12 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: At one point, DD made rails for the military…that’s it. Not much of a pedigree. I only buy their rails. DD does rails well and make really good ones, whether for the military or for civilian use. While I don't care for their needlessly stylized furniture, and am indifferent about hammer forged barrels (just cheaper to make in volume once the higher tooling cost is recouped), the attraction to me was and still is their rails. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 2:14:38 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have only ever owned one factory built AR15, and that is my DD that I got last year. To me, yes, it was worth it. I lack the ability to build a rifle as nice, and the small parts seem superior to all the Spikes and DPMS and PSA crap I have used in the past. It comes with an excellent warranty, and it actually has a good resale value (for an AR15) if I ever feel the need to sell or trade. I doubt I will ever build an AR again, and I don't see myself ever buying an Aero or a PSA or an S&W (though I think they are all satisfactory). Just out of curiosity, what specifically made the Spike, DPMS and PSA stuff crap? In what ways were the DD parts superior? |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 2:18:03 PM EDT
[#41]
Some goofy input on some of the comments here but.....
Yeah, building is awesome if you know what you're doing and have the tools, but Daniel is definitely good to go. I've had a few Aeros, and they're just not even in the same class. Good for cheap xmas presents for a first AR though. Putting 10's of thousands of rounds through KAC, DD, BCM, and many more, I wouldn't even say KAC is "Better" Too much to discuss on here though. Based on what you're saying, you'd probably be just as happy saving a few $ and roll with a BCM. Buy the complete upper directly from them for around $1000. Lowers can be found around $350-$400. An equal choice would be Geissele super duty for around $1500. Good luck! |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 2:31:45 PM EDT
[#42]
I'd take my DD over my KAC. The whole "tier" thing is made up BS for gun nerds to flex on.
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Posted: 2/23/2022 2:39:18 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Building a rifle sounds like a great idea until it's time to sell it. And I am skeptical that it actually saves much money. I have never built am AR and thought "Gee, I saved so much money!" versus a factory rifle of similar quality. It is more about choosing the parts that you want. In that aspect, it saves money vs. buying a rifle full of parts that you are going to change. As much as you don't understand this, there are many of us that don't understand your "Gee, I have a kick-ass warranty, and I can sell my rifle for more than you!" While this view is solid in practicality, there are very, very few warrantable issue with a quality rifle. As for selling, you would be surprised what happens with quality parts here in the EE. For me, I don't sell, the receivers would likely get used for a different build. I don't sell firearms, but this seems to be a theme for many, it's like a commodity or something. To each their own, this I do understand. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 2:41:05 PM EDT
[#44]
DD makes a nice rifle. But you’re paying a premium.
My opinion, BCM upper on a stripped and built Aero lower. Save a ton of money, and just as reliable . |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 3:04:40 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: $2000 and change will land you a used KAC upper or maybe a new one of you're willing to wait for the right "deal". A factory Knights rifle in the EE is going for what, like $3k+ right now? Not arguing against the quality of Knights...but I don't think this is an apples-to-apples comparison. @135Patriots  Attached File Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 3:32:06 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Don't go FN other than the SRP. They use mostly 4140 barrels and some cheaper alloys in their receiver extensions and charging handles. Factory FN is not equal to their contract parts. What exactly is wrong with 4140 steel it is nearly identical to 4150 steel with minor difference each having about the same benefits/cons. What is wrong with 4140 in the use as barrels the advantages of one or the other kind of is pointless. Are you going to be stretchng or bending your barrel? 4140 is also used on many high stress parts in an engine or cars like the crankshaft and gears. DD makes amazing stuff but they are a bit high in price. If you buy one you will not regret it. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 3:40:46 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What exactly is wrong with 4140 steel it is nearly identical to 4150 steel with minor difference each having about the same benefits/cons. What is wrong with 4140 in the use as barrels the advantages of one or the other kind of is pointless. Are you going to be stretchng or bending your barrel? 4140 is also used on many high stress parts in an engine or cars like the crankshaft and gears. DD makes amazing stuff but they are a bit high in price. If you buy one you will not regret it. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Don't go FN other than the SRP. They use mostly 4140 barrels and some cheaper alloys in their receiver extensions and charging handles. Factory FN is not equal to their contract parts. What exactly is wrong with 4140 steel it is nearly identical to 4150 steel with minor difference each having about the same benefits/cons. What is wrong with 4140 in the use as barrels the advantages of one or the other kind of is pointless. Are you going to be stretchng or bending your barrel? 4140 is also used on many high stress parts in an engine or cars like the crankshaft and gears. DD makes amazing stuff but they are a bit high in price. If you buy one you will not regret it. It'll work for most people and never create an issue, especially with a chrome lined barrel, but they're doing it to be cheap, not because they're doing you a favor. And then they're still charging a premium for their ever so slightly above standard rifles that are full of compromises. My FN Tactical 2 was $1499. Accurate enough, but I should have bought a V7 instead. I still would have had the V7. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 3:51:53 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Because it isn't 1998 anymore. 4140 is fine, but there are better options. Always have been, that's why the TDP spec'd 4150 CMV or equivalents. It'll work for most people and never create an issue, especially with a chrome lined barrel, but they're doing it to be cheap, not because they're doing you a favor. And then they're still charging a premium for their ever so slightly above standard rifles that are full of compromises. My FN Tactical 2 was $1499. Accurate enough, but I should have bought a V7 instead. I still would have had the V7. 4140 vs 4150 is not really a significant price difference. It could be availability or some process is easier to use 4140 with a heat treating process. My only FN barrel is a Spikes optimum profile 16 mid CHF barrel I am not exactly sure the barrel material it states DIN 21CrM0V511 not particularly familiar with it. Maybe we should have a side discussion so not to derail OP's thread. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 4:10:44 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: At one point, DD made rails for the military…that’s it. Not much of a pedigree. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Daniel Defense makes US military issued products. Aero Precision does not. Aero Precision doesn't make a single product ordered by the US military. You are paying for the pedigree with Daniel Defense. And yes, they are worth it. I do have a DD M4A1 rifle and highly recommend DD rifles. At one point, DD made rails for the military…that’s it. Not much of a pedigree. Relative to Aero Precision, I'd say that's a pedigree. |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 4:20:48 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: plot twist. DD IS mid tier. I've never considered my DD stuff anything more. The most complete DD rifle I own is a complete M4V11 upper. I do own BCG, sights & rails I've put on other guns though. It's great, but so is all my BCM, Larue & Aero stuff.  Attached File |
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