Originally Posted By hk45shooter: Originally Posted By Tenifer19: Yeah, (head down, hands in pockets and kicking the dirt) I'll admit to buying a lamp and six lanterns after reading through the thread. Anybody else own up new purchases . . . ? Guilty, as charged. I just bought one of these, but with a clear globe. I liked the look of it better than the Bright Galvanized one. Something that confuses me is the shipping weight of the one I bought says it is 4#, & the Bright Galvanized one is 3#. They are the same lantern except for the color, as far as I can see, right?

I have a few of the straight galvi ones, and one with the black over galvi.  They're the same great lantern and should weight the same.  I see that only the set with the colored globe is 4lbs, I'd guess the fancier colored globe has more/heavier packaging.  WT Kirkman finds manufacturers to make things to their specs, so probably the clear globe and colored globes come from different manufacturers in different packages.  I've got extra globes that came in heavy cardboard tubes.  These things are pretty tall, so packaging is not easy.  
All-in-all they work really well for a 20 some dollar machines.  They were sub $20 when I bought several.  

WT Kirkman is great to deal with in my experience, so just call them if you have questions.  One I received got smashed by UPS, and WT Kirkman was real nice about getting me a new one.  I've had my since before Y2K and all still work great.  I use one camping every time I go, because they're so easy to get going, robust, portable, and provide adequate light to do things with.  I have several Dietz brand lanterns too, but the WT Kirkman's seem better, not only because of the corrosion resistant galvi finish.  

Originally Posted By TomJefferson: Yes, that model is the newer globe style wick similar to a Coleman lantern.  They are higher out put than flat or round conventional wick so will burn fuel pretty fast.  The wicks are slightly more durable than a Coleman wick but not much.  The good part is as a house lamp they won't be moved around as much as an outdoor lantern.  keeping spare wicks around is a good idea.   Tj

You mean mantles, dont ya?  And yes, a spare wick or two wont hurt....  but they last a very long time.

We need more links to some of these lamps and lanterns!!!!!

Originally Posted By TomJefferson: <snip> You gotta steal at that price btw.  Normally if you can find them in new condition they are $75 or more and funky used ones are going for around $40.   Congrats. <snip> Tj

Thanks, like I said, I would have never known anything about these lamps if it had not been for the info in this thread. I also would not have known it was a good price.
I don't think aladdin sells anything new for under $100.00.
I thought $34.50 had to be a mistake, thought maybe I misread and it was $134.50.
But I pulled them down from the top shelf and asked if that was the correct price.
I think the old guy at the store was glad to get rid of them (after 33yrs)

ETA: The burners are 'C' models.

Originally Posted By TomJefferson: Originally Posted By blackhawkhunter: You mean mantles, dont ya?  And yes, a spare wick or two wont hurt....  but they last a very long time. I'm sure they do, however compared to a flat wick its a delicate instrument.

Originally Posted By TomJefferson: Yes, that model is the newer globe style wick similar to a Coleman lantern.  They are higher out put than flat or round conventional wick so will burn fuel pretty fast.  The wicks are slightly more durable than a Coleman wick but not much.  The good part is as a house lamp they won't be moved around as much as an outdoor lantern.  keeping spare wicks around is a good idea.   Tj

Compared to the railroad lantern style flat wicks, yes. The Alladins are not really made to be moved around a lot.  They equal your desk lamps that sit on furniture and never move.  The flat wick lamps are more like your trouble lights and could be an old style flashlight.  When I was really little we had small, glass, flatwick lamps with a handle on them for night time runs to the bathroom.... and in the winter when the water line was frozen we used a railroad style for trips to the outhouse.  The Alladins would not have held up well for those uses.  

But if the Alladins are sitting on a table somewhere and not moved except for dusting and such the wicks and mantles last for a very long time!

TJ, didn't read all the posts to see if someone thanked you, but wanted to say thanks for the write-up on lamps. very comprehensive, helped me a lot....

Originally Posted By TomJefferson: One of the little boys in the movie had a habit of gong to the outhouse in the middle of the night.  In one hand he always had his trusty railroad lantern and in the other one a short stick.  When he gets to the outhouse, he rattles that stick around the hole. OMG! That just broke me up.  I had totally forgotten the old stick down the outhouse rattle to scare the snakes off trick. Now tell that's something we think of everyday? Tj

Ever wonder how much you would know if you could recall everything you knew once?  Thats one huge benifit of this place... I learn some, but I am reminded of more forgotten stuff than I realize I had forgotten....  if that makes any sense!

We didnt have to worry about snakes....  but our outhouse was wood on 2 sides and canvas on two sides.  In good weather you could pin the canvas back for air and view.  We kept a H&R 22 revolver and a box of shells down there so you could shoot red squirrels.  I got a couple rabbits to!

Here are pictures of my new aladdin:

Without shade:


With shade:

I have a Britelyte lantern. It's been a while since I used it but I can remember most of the good and bad points.  Executive summary: I recommend them, they're a nice piece of kit but lighting them takes some practice and they might need a little tinkering to get running right. They are supposed to burn any petro-fuel, but I'm a little wary of a pressurized container of gasoline. I use Kerosene, sometimes with a little coleman fuel mixed in.

Mine has the stainless nozzle (the part that the mantle ties onto, they refer to it as part #3) and the high-performance mixing tube, and the sombrero-like reflector.  It generates tremendous light and quite a bit of heat, I sometimes use it to knock the chill off my work shop.

I recommend their easy-pump adapter and a bicycle pump. Using the built-in pump takes a LONG time.

They are fully serviceable, I believe you could build one from scratch by ordering parts. I ordered spare seals and a spare globe.  Order at least a dozen mantles as they're easily broken once they've been lit, and only cost about a buck each.

The design is also a little bit finicky, and some of the parts get extremely hot. The thermal cycling can loosen screws, especially the mixing tube and nozzle. I found this out the hard way and the mixing tube height has to be just right, thermal cycling tends to make it creep downward. If the adjustment is wrong the tube will overheat, expand and the nozzle will drop out with an incandescent mantle leaving an open pipe with vaporized fuel coming out under pressure.

Lighting them can be a little tricky. Get a can of SLX denatured alcohol and use it for priming. Don't be shy with the little blowtorch. Practice with the shiny cap removed as it'll get sooted up pretty badly when the thing flares up. Do not light them inside any structure, they are prone to flare up if not sufficiently preheated. The instruction video is pretty helpful

Tip: light using Coleman fuel the first few times, then graduate to kerosene.

There were a couple of workmanship issues with the lantern - the threads around the pump are a little crooked, but work OK and there were a few leaks around the valve and preheater but they were easily fixed. I had to trim the heat shield a little bit to get it to lay flat. Nothing worth sending back to the factory for.

Interesting factoid: shortly after I got this lantern I was in Papua New Guinea for business. We were traveling back to our hotel around dusk and got stopped at some sort of checkpoint; they had a britelyte (or original petromax, I wasn't going to chat up the guards about the finer points of their light source) hanging in their shack.  

Originally Posted By TomJefferson: Originally Posted By ColtRifle: Whew.  There is a lot of info on kerosene/oil lamps!!   I have and use a propane mantle type lantern during power outages and it works really well.  Maybe I'll just get a couple more.  They put out a ton of light and are very inexpensive to run.  They are a little noisy though.   They put out some heat but virtually no odor.   I also have the propane refill adapter to refill a 1lb tank from a 20 lb tank so the cost per tank is around $0.50 or so. The problem with propane lights of any sort is they put out a massive amount of CO which is orderless and colorless.   This may not be a problem during an outage in summer with all the windows open but a major health concern in winter with the windows closed.  Major like being buried major.   Tj

A CO/fire alarm would be a good thing to have- of course I'm sure knowing everyone here, they already have them in the house.

height=8

I sometimes think many of us are gear spoiled.  I know I was.  We're so use to idiot proof gear.  The Colemans now you don't even need a match on the newer models.  I'd venture to guess most people would even ask what that little metal crank is for on the old Coleman 1510s.

We are definitely gear spoiled, good ol' fashioned tinkering is a dying art.

Ha - I'd almost forgotten the little crank on the old Colemans. That brings back some memories. My dad has a coleman 2-mantle lantern and 2-burner stove, they're probably 35 years old and still going strong.  Once I got old enough, my big job was to light that old stove in the morning on camping trips, always cranked the little handle without any real idea what it was doing. That stove ran without a hiccup, all we had to do was oil the little leather washer once in a while.

Then I grew up and bought my own Colemans, I had 3 of them (a little backpacker lantern and a big lantern and 2-burner stove). They all developed leaks around the needle valve. Now, I used my dad's Colemans for 12 years without a problem so I concluded (maybe wrongly) that Coleman had some QC problems and wrote them off. This was in the early 90's. Anybody had more recent experience with their new Exponent gear?

Years later I got the Britelyt, primarily because I'm pretty sure it can be serviced and eventually I'll hand it down to my kids. It also has a retro-cool factor. The price paid is some time spent learning to run it.  And they're pretty expensive up front, but if they last a decade the cost-per-year looks pretty good.

RE: wall mount lanterns.

I have a couple of nice wick lanterns from Lehmans, wall mounted with reflectors - one lights a hallway, basically a night light for those midnight bathroom trips.  I also got 2 of the Aladdin (genie III I think), but haven't tried to wall mount them. One is for the kitchen, and sits on the counter. The other is basically a spare.

The aladdins are pretty heavy, and generate a lot of heat. If you wall mount, be sure:

1. The bracket is sufficiently strong and anchored into a stud. The penalty for a lit lamp falling off the wall full of fuel would be severe.

2. The top of the chimney has sufficient clearance from the ceiling. The hot flue gas will, at the best, blacken the ceiling. At worst it'll burn the house down. I believe they make a little brass shield to hang above the chimney.

3. Mount them high enough to clear your shoulder so they don't get bumped when you (or the tallest household member) walks by. But not so high they are difficult to refuel. Also see (2.) above :)  

A wall mount reflector behind the lantern will almost double the effective light delivered to the room, almost for free.

Here's a pic of my daughter camping with our galvanized WT Kirkman Lantern.  I always take this one camping because it's so quick and easy to get light.   Not a lot of light mind you, but if it's close it's enough to read and brush teeth, and eat, do dishes, find things, etc.  I have a Petromax, and it's a great "whole area industrial type light" but is just too much work and time to want to use frequently, and the jet engine noise, often spoils the ambiance.  The WT Kirkman lights only cost about $20, so everyone should have at least a couple.  



WT Kirkman does not make that model anymore, however.  It was called the model 21 or something, and was similar to a No. 8 AIr Pilot, which was designed later in the era of these types of lights, so it was sort of the state of the art in cold blast lanterns.  This model is full size, yet is shorter than the Kirkman's flagship model, the No. 2 Champion, such that it fits in a 7 gal bucket, which is just like the 5 gal plastic food bucket, but taller with a Gamma Seal lid.  
This carrier set up, is great because it provides a sealed, rugged, breakpoof container for the lantern.  These lanterns do not completely seal the kero inside, so a little can leak out if tipped upsidedown, and kero contains sulfur so it stinks, and it's non-volatile, so if spilled, it won't evaporate away.  

So for one with no experience with the old school lanterns, what would be best between  Dietz and Kirkman?  I notice the Kirkmans are a bit more expensive.  Does that speak for any difference in quality?

Could someone refresh my memory about the cleanest burning fuel for kerosene heaters, burning indoors, like the convective or radiant KeroSuns with about 9000 BTU's output.

Also, the oil company here says they have kerosene for about $4.75/gallon and that it is the same stuff as jet fuel with one less filtering step.

Is there anything else to burn in kerosene space heaters besides kerosene that is clean?

So I picked up a few lanterns, extra wicks, and lamp oil.



L-R: WT Kirkman No. 2 Champion, Dietz #30 Little Wizard, Dietz #90 D-Lite

While all three will do the job, the No. 2 Champion has a superior feel to it.  Not only is it galvanized, it's got a much beefier globe.  The Kirkman branded lantern is also a bit more expensive, but you at least get some added durability for that price.

I have not yet begun putting aside kerosene, but Kirkman says Medallion Lamp Oil is okay for flat wicks whereas paraffin will clog it up.  The Medallion stuff seems to be readily available at my local Target & Wally World.

Incidentally, in the background are two cheapie grocery store lamps and an oil lamp that's been around a lot longer than me.

Re:  Kerosene

I won't run the red dyed kero anymore based on years of bad performance with it in kero heaters.  I have a radiant heater that has seems to be marginal in performance at best, and in time starts to smell and fail to acheive full flame.  This happens much sooner with the red dyed kero than with the clear.  

I only use un-dyed kero that I fill in a 15 gal blue poly mini drum, that I get from a fuel supply place, where the truckers and farmers getr their kero, so it's the most fresh.  It works well even if stored over the summer.  And has the least odor.  

I use too much to afford fancy, small quantity stuff.  But this wouldn't be an issue for just lamps.  Lamps use very little kero compared to heaters.  

Here's a pic of the type of drum I use for kero storage (the blue one).  

       

Metal would be better/safer for storage, but I couldn't find anything affordable enough, and this drum is better than the standard 5-gal plastic bucket/containers that are standard for kero sales.  I do have a bung wrench and manual siphon pump, that kero/heater dealers sell.

The warning on the top of my railroad lantern reads "Use kerosene only". Does that mean I can't use lamp oil? Serious question.

You guys are a bad influence.
I have a few old lamps, and two Alladin lamps.
I just bought a WT Kirkman #2 Champion with the warming plate.
For those of you with an Alladin lamp; use a tomato wire "cone" thingie, to slide over the lamp. You can then heat or cook on the wire.
Thanks for all of the input guys.

God bless America
M

That's probably mostly about trying to keep idiots from filling it with gasoline and lighting it.  Which people have done with kero heaters, with predictably disasterous results, since gasoline is volatile and must go like mad through that big wick, filling your house with just the right fuel air mixture to go off like a MOAB.  Kind of humorous to think about, if it weren't for the human tradgedy involved.  This "mix-up" is somewhat understandable since (as I understand it) in some states in the past, kero was sold at gas pumps, maybe even self serve, with the only distiguishing feature between the two liquids being that of the painted writing on the pump.  

Your railroad lantern is not very complicated.  If you take away the safety and convinience features, it's just a wick set on fire in bowl of liquid, with some chimney junk to try and get a draft of air.  And wicks are cheap.  I doubt you could screw it up by some liquid that's only slightly different than kerosene.  Try it and see.  
See if one gives better light.  

Just don't use anything volatile.

I use the cheap lamp oil from wal-mart in my deitz jupiters with no probs........liquid parifin will not work on the big wick.....I tried.....seems like the cheap lamp oil is just a better refined kerosene......I think

Thanks for the info. It has a 1/2 in. wick, so I guess it is gtg with lamp oil.

damn. Took 2 hours to read all that. Thanks for all the info TJ and everyone.
I bought 5 cheapie chinese lanterns last week at the flea market. IIRC the wicks were about 5/8. Painted red. $4 each.........Haven't tried them yet. Not even sure where to get Kerosene in the little town nearby. I'll try them and give some feedback.
Thank you gentlemen.

hey Tj, what would be the value of an old CM&S PRy lantern? It looks to be maybe 75 years old, in good shape. Same name embossed into the glass. What can you tell me about that? Saw it at the flea market today for $75.
Did buy 2 old Dietz. Green Giant is close to perfect, other is older, Little Wizard, not perfect, wick ass'y is shot., bottom is rusted through in a couple spots, put 3 coats of JB quick on it, that should hold up to the fuels. $6 and $7!!
Also picked up several glass lanterns. One in particular has a heavy, discolored, thick glass base. $10. It has "Giant" lightly embossed into the base. The brass says "Queen Anne No. 2.
Got 2 made by Lamplight Farms, both decorative glass, one is 7" dia. and the small one is 4" dia.
Got one small white with no globe. 2 "coach" lanterns, small brass glassed housings with small brass lanterns. I think like the Omish use on their carriages.
Others were small and $2-$3 each. Pretty good score I think.
I've got a feeling I should've bought the old CM&S but I've got his phone #.
Also picked up one gallon Kerosene 1-K and a small bottle of parafin oil. I want to try them all out soon.

Tried them all, at least tested. All but the Wizard. Still strugling with it.
Like I needed another adiction.........Besides black rifles!
I'm hooked.
Thanks.

Mainly intended as a bump, to try to catch Tj's attention for answers to previous questions.
I think I have repaired the old Wizard Dietz. I JB quicked a new wick ass'y onto it.
3 coats on rusty bottom. Next need to rob a glass support ass'y from one of the chinese copies. Should be GTG. Lever to raise glass is still there but glass bottom plate was rusted and in pieces.

Just the thread I was looking for. Thank you! Just bought a couple to try out.

Good source for lantern information
Lehmans

Video of how to light an Aladin

Cool info, now I have to go get out my Grandads lanterns, to see if they still work.

I'm with you on this,  I have an old orginal Dietz Comet.
(First Introduced in 1934 for the export market, Smallest Cold Blast Lantern produced by Dietz, once adopted by the Boy Scouts for official use.)

...and two Adlake Kero RR lanterns,  all 3 were my grandfather's.   I think one of the Adlakes needs a new burner/oil pot.   Also need another Adlake clear globe, as one of them has a thick Red globe,  great for a caboose (or house of ill repute),  but not much good for usable light.

Same question as others,  can I burn lamp oil, liquid parafin in these, or do I need to stick with kerosene?

The Comet is a 3/8" wide flat wick,  but I might see if I can get a 1/2" in there, if it will fit.

Great thread guys.  We just has a nice ice storm here in AR.  After reading through the thread I decided to order a couple of the WT Kirkman #2 Champion cold blast lanterns, with extra wicks, and a few containers of their lamp oil.

I've had a Petromax (PM) for a few years and have used it some in parallel with other kero lanterns.  My experiences are this:
The PM gives a lot of multi directional light and it's a great tool to have.  However...  It's very noisy when running.  It's significantly more difficult to start than a wick lantern.  Since it uses delicate mantles which break after a number of uses, I would estimate that if you use it once a night, you may have to replace the mantle once a week, or maybe once a month, depending on how much it's moved, and how roughly.  The problem with this is that it may be dark, you want light, and you find the mantle requires replacement.  Wick (e.g. Deitz) types lanterns are much more reliable, faster and easier.  PMs have to be pumped up to start (I found a tire pump much quicker and easier for this, and I used that every time I could (get the schrader valve adapter).  After pumping up, the PM has to be preheated (when using kero) before turning to run.  All of which can be a big pain.  

Another significant issue with the PMs is "flair ups".  The PM requires auto exhaust pipe putty to seal the nozzle because of the severe expansion and contraction of the fittings.  This "glue job" only lasts about a month, at which time the lantern develops a fireball inside the globe.  This happened so severly once (or perhaps repeatedly) that my kero delivery tube is warped and my lantern is out of service needed a new part.  The PM would be great when you need a lot of multi-directional light and you don't care about the noise, such as if you have a group of people that have to do some maintenance on a vehicle, or are setting up a large camp, or have a large group and need to cook or do some "industrial" type task.  For indoors with my small family, I'd pass due to the noise, the smell and off-gas, potential for flair-up, and work to get started.  I like the WT Kirkman "Deitz" type lanterns for their ease, reliability, silence, ruggedness, portablity and relative safety.  They can be used in groups for more light and I've read by them, although marginally.  I really like LED headlights as well.  If it looked like we were headed for an extended time without power or ability to obtain batteries, I look at the Kosmos lamps fore more reading light, or Alladins.  

As I said, I have several kero heaters that I use every winter in my garage, so I store 15 gals of undyed kero in a 15 gal poly drum, and use this for lanterns as well.  

OBTW, I think you'd be a fool to ever put gasoline in a PM and the sellers that advertise that are doing a dis-service to the public (and they know it).  Search the web for this issue and you'll find write-ups by real, unbiased lantern experts on this subject.  I've had frequent flair ups with my PM, which would be disasterous and very dangerous with gasoline.  They are really made for kerosene only.  

http://www.milesstair.com  all things kerosine powered.  

Parts, parts diagrams, wicks for heaters and lanterns

Reading this thread has inspired me.  I have an old Rayo lamp that has been in the family for a while.

I need a new chimney and wick for it but I can't figure out how to take the burner out of the lamp.  There are several sites that tell you how to rewick the lamp, but they all start with "remove the burner" which is easier said than done.  Is there an Arfcom of oil lamps anywhere?

Hooptie

"Rayo"       cool


Maybe info here:   Rayo's and Such


or here:  The International Guild of Lamp Researchers

I've read about Rayos.  

Looks like they used a tubular wick, like the Kosmos you can buy new today, and were advertised as being good for reading by.  


I gotta get me a Kosmos some day.  I like the idea of a wick vs a mantle (for robustness and trouble free ops).  

Hmmm, well maybe not.  Look what I found here:


Maybe I should get an Alladin then for it's light and fuel efficiency.  

I think so

I finally got the thing apart.  The Rayos and Such page said to soak it in hot water with Oxy Clean added.  Well, I'm fresh out of OxyClean so hot water alone had to do.  I turned the lamp upside down and immersed the top in really hot water and let it sit for 15 minutes or so.  Then it opened right up.  Now its off to Lehman's to get  wicks and a mantle.

At some point in its history, someone soldered the tripod onto the bottom of the gallery.  I'm not sure when or why, and I'm not even sure it's a Rayo tripod.  It is slightly different than the ones I've seen in photos.

Ordered 2 Kirkman #2 lanterns tonight. Thanks to everyone who posted the great info in this thread.

After reading this thread I ordered several lamps from W.T. Kirkman and now I have a question.

I just purchased several bottles of the Medallion lamp oil (suggested for the lamps by the Kirkman employee) from Wal-Mart. I read in this thread that the bottles become brittle and break. My question is, how are you storing your lamp oil? Are you buying metal fuel cans and putting it away? I intend to store about 10 gallons so I'd like something capable of holding it long term. I know that Kerosene comes in metal cans, is that what everyone is putting away for SHTF?

Thanks

Tom

I have use the same 15 gal blue poly mini drum for the last 8 years, successfully, and it looks like it'll last 10 more.  

Here's a pic of the type of drum I use for kero storage (the blue one).  

       

Metal would be better/safer for storage, but I couldn't find anything affordable enough, and this drum is better than the standard 5-gal plastic bucket/containers that are standard for kero sales.  I do have a bung wrench and manual siphon pump, that kero/heater dealers sell.

I've used (Israeli surplus) Jerry cans, and they work well, but I don't like the fact that they are easily tipped over.  
The 15 gal drum is stable and is light enough when full to be lifted by one person.  

My long term stuff in the shed is in the new paint cans you can get at Home Depot.  The usage plan would be to decant it back into the one remaining plastic bottle with a funnel.  

I looked for new square 1 gallon metal cans (like paint thinner) or larger, but found nothing localy.  There are online places that have those.  For what I needed, this was a cheap alternative to more plastic blitz cans or something bigger and metal I could get locally.

I have a surplus store near my house that offers these barrels in 5 gallon up to 55 gallon. I currently have water stored in some 55's and 30 gallon tanks, maybe I'll grab a 15 for my kerosene, thanks for the tip.


Tom