http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-57552225-38/senate-bill-rewrite-lets-feds-read-your-e-mail-without-warrants/?part=rss&subj=news&tag=title

You'd be surprised what a federal subpoena could already do.

Are not a lot of people just opening offshore e-mail accounts where they have their e-mails sent and stored out of the purview of the Feds to easily thwart this already?

If so all then are doing is catching the dumb ones while the ones they really should be worried about are sailing under their radar.

they better not open anything or they will get some nasty virus's!
i get alot of spam

I find irony in the fact that "Leaky Leahy" is proposing this.....
 

You think the NSA isn't already intercepting international communication?

News flash!!!  EMAIL IS NOT PRIVATE!!!

As mentioned, a federal prosecutor basically gets whatever they want in terms of electronic communications as it is, at least going back a certain period (180 days?), and you won't necessarily even know about it (notification requirements are lax).

... I run my own e-mail infrastructure, so it would be somewhat challenging to avoid that whole notification issue, but if they really want my Nigerian spam and a few million geeky mailing list posts I suppose they could just ask

Well, you know, you can get some Pretty Good Privacy

I assumed they were doing this already.

That's why I octuply-Enigma encrypt all my sekrit plans!

Yes, i know Enigma is not secure, and 8X-enigma even less so.  ;-)

I'm long on:



PGP (GnuGP)

Thunderbird for Firefox

Tor Browser

Truecrypt

Startpage



It's better than nothing...


 

Until encryption is regulated and pegged at 64bit ciphers. We'll have an underground market for software!

FINALLY we're safe from terrorist, drug dealers and generic/unnamed ne'er do wells!

This is great news!

What about documents purely stored with ISPs and fully encrypted through the provider?

You guys should really read the book "1984"

It's remarkable how many of the elements in that book are taking shape before our eyes.

A government that has no need for a warrant to spy on its citizens is a soviet type government.

We are truly seeing the beginning of the end of our country.

Nah, the beginning was a long time ago.

Here's how the government works:


1. ruin something and create disaster

2. declare state of emergency

3. expand power to cope with emergency

4. go to no. 1



these teeth that the citizens are putting into the government's head are going to chew their ass off one day

how hard is it to understand?

It's just one simgle loop of logic, the whole system of government was originally formed around the idea, and yet nobody understands it.

this is the first country in history that died of stupidity

Email Privacy Concerns

Good info here @ FindLaw

I didn't see your thread when I posted mine about this.

+1

Guilty until proven innocent.
TSA style of security will rule the land.
Got to love the once size fits all society....

You younger folks are fucked...

It shocks me that you people still have the illusion of freedom...

Like this shit hasn't been going on all along?


About 5 years ago I got a call from a business associate telling me that I'd probably be getting a visit from .gov about some emails that were sent back and forth. The associate (client) is a friggin' defense contractor for God's sake and had been exchanging emails with the US Military (for God's sake, bunch of friggin' idiots...) and they had used too many "naughty words" in too many emails and got contacted on the .mil side by the NSA.

.Mil contacted my client and alerted them that they were going to need a sit-down chat with them and a couple of nice NSA agents, who incidentally were contacting EVERYONE on said client's email address list to review a few pieces of mail. Once they figured out that it was all in the interest of R&D in a friggin' .gov financed project it was all OK. (really?...really?) Like those idiots couldn't have called DCASR and confirmed that there was a CONTRACT for this work??? WTF?

Nonetheless, it sure as hell put everyone on notice that ALL emails are routinely monitored.

While I would cynically state that this bill only gives our current (and former) admin the legal justification for what they are already doing (see, e.g., Utah Datacenter), I nonetheless sent the following to my congresscritters. To the extent that you haven't abandoned the legislative process already, I'd suggest sending the same or similar to your own.  


I was deeply disturbed to learn that Patrick Leahy’s already unconstitutional “internet security legislation” has been quietly rewritten to give a large number of government agencies more surveillance power than they possess under current law. More specifically, it is my understanding that this bill now authorizes warrantless access to Americans' e-mail, and that a vote on his bill is scheduled for next week.

News reports on ths subject indicate that Leahy's rewritten bill would allow more than 22 agencies –– including the Securities and Exchange Commission and the Federal Communications Commission –– to access Americans' e-mail, Google Docs files, Facebook wall posts, and Twitter direct messages without a search warrant. It also would give the FBI and Homeland Security more authority, in some circumstances, to gain full access to Internet accounts without notifying either the owner or a judge.

This is an abrupt departure from Leahy's earlier approach, which required police to obtain a search warrant backed by probable cause before they could read the contents of e-mail or other communications. Further, it is a direct contradiction to prior press reports about this supposedly “necessary” bill, which boasted that it “provides enhanced privacy protections for American consumers by... requiring that the government obtain a search warrant.”

I would remind you of the text of the Fourth Amendment to the United States Constitution, which reads:

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

I would further remind you of the oath that you took when you were elected to your current office on behalf of the citizens of the State of Alabama:

I do solemnly swear that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter: So help me God.

Finally, I would remind you of the sage words of one our most memorable Founding Fathers, Ben Franklin, who wisely wrote more than two centuries ago:

They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

Simply put, there is no legitimate government purpose for this unconstitutional legislation. To the extent that legitimate suspicion or law enforcement need arises, electronically stored information can already be accessed through a valid search warrant. Simply allowing a large number of already power-hungry, executive-lead agencies to simply snoop, search and invade the privacy of the citizens that you serve without notice, however, would be a direct violation of the oath which you took to protect our liberties and freedoms against all enemies foreign and domestic. I must accordingly demand that you take all steps, including filibuster, to defeat this unnecessary and unconscionable bill.

This is really just the steady progression.


ETA:  How could a law such as this possibly pass judicial review?

big gov., fuck yeah

I have had the FBI contact a client who traveled abroad several months prior to inform them that a foreign state had installed a trojan on his laptop which had been forwarding copies of all his email to said foreign intel. They claimed to have been monitoring the whole situation since 0 hour, and then graciously "offered" to come by and secure said laptop and some associated paraphernalia that same afternoon.

Maybe they can setup my spam filters better, the spammage still gets through sometimes

I thought anyone who opposes this kind of thing was to labeled a "moby" ?

Some of this shit is getting out of control.

I guess the Patriot Act made Local Law-enforcement jealous?



The Government, local, state, federal, has found it easier to assume Guilt, than to prove it.



Here's to some Power-tripping 'Good-Intentioned' Bureaucrats, I hope I never piss one of them off



Can someone explain the New definition of Liberty?




 

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And that's all I have to say about that.

Correct, this is like being upset at the mail man for reading post cards.





 

More like your nosey neighbor (who is a felon) going into your mailbox and searching for postcards, then reading them.

nope.. they put in a back door for the feds.

hitting reset is seeming more an more like a good idea as time goes on. and 5 years ago i was scared shitless hoping we wouldn't have to.

who the fuck do these people think they are?


is there any decent south american countries i can go to, be realitivly safe, be left the fuck alone, and live comfortably with a couple hundred thousand in my pocket?

Even using 2.6.2 or the cyber knights templar version?   I doubt it.

Did you send it via email?

Their basis for the lower expectation of privacy was because of the plain text nature of email communication. That's why I brought up the example of them looking at secured ISP storage (such as Google Docs and other encrypted cloud storage).



I don't see how there would be a low expectation of privacy for encrypted cloud documents using the email philosophy for raping the fourth amendment.

Yep.  Sickening where we now find ourselves.  Oh well, the masses have their bread and circuses...



 

Your expectation of privacy is only what you can reasonably EXPECT.

Go read the TOS of those cloud services  They provide that they will provide cleartext access to your data on request / subpoena / etc. by the .gov.  Ergo, you do not have a legitimate expectation of privacy on those services unless you encrypt things before sending them there.

Look forward to Gestapo style security unless you are an illegal.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

To be more clear, they already do this. This just brings it out into the light, which they might as well do since nobody is going to really care.

A better analogy would be the mailman opening your envelope and taking a look at your letter. While "plain text" sounds like it's just open for viewing, most emails are encoded to ease transportation just the same. It does involve some amount of work to read the message, although very little... sort of like opening a piece of paper sealed with a light adhesive.

The legislation the OP mentioned does not cite terms of use policies. It appears this law would apply regardless of an ISP having a pro-privacy policy.

You need to update your newspeak citizen!  It's "pro-criminal"!

???

I realize that a certain percentage of arfcom HAS TO present a contrary opinion

but you need to show a little self restraint once in a while, it gets silly

Lets take a looksie at what the Justice Department had to say:



Notice the keyword there, stored e-mail. We're far past plain-text communication here. The postcard analogy is incorrect.

Thanks, I just emailed my two Senators with a version of this well written note.












 

I tell you what, George Orwell got it right....