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Posted: 8/25/2023 10:29:59 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By thanosnap: This is a bit old but in case some of you haven's seen it, it explains a lot. It comes from Russian Prime minister Dmitry Medvedev who (due a constitutional issue on term limits) was actually President of Russia between 2008 and 2012 while Putin was prime minister, but we now know Putin mostly ran the show. Anyway, it comes from the Kremlin:
5. Russia doesn’t need Ukraine. A threadbare quilt, torn, shaggy, and greasy. The new Malorossiya of 1991 is made up of the artificially cut territories, many of which are indigenously Russian, separated by accident in the 20th century. Millions of our compatriots live there, harassed for years by the Nazi Kiev regime. It is them who we defend in our special military operation, relentlessly eradicating the enemy. We don’t need unterukraine. We need Big Great Russia. And it's pretty much in line with Putin's essay on Ukraine where he says Ukraine isn't a real country and them straying from Russia's orbit is an attack on Russia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Historical_Unity_of_Russians_and_Ukrainians http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/66181 Medvedev is a cunt who should hang. While there are people of "Russian" heritage living in Ukraine, don't forget that the vote for independence in 1991 carried over 90% in favor, except Crimea (only 54%). Even in 2014, 58% of Russian speakers in eastern Ukraine wanted to remain part of Ukraine, NOT secede from Ukraine or join Russia. Pew Research. Medvedev should hang. |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 10:35:19 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RockNwood: I don’t follow much of the R churn yet but saw this video exchange and was impressed that the crowd seemed to be cheering strongly for Haley’s points about Putin and Ukraine aid. Feel free to correct my impression if you follow this more than I.
Damn, she nailed him! Nikki for Pres! |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 10:40:45 PM EDT
[#3]
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NC, USA
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Posted: 8/25/2023 10:40:48 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By lorazepam: I was dumb enough to get out of the boat again.  Rational thought is missing from many here who used to be great posters. Sigh. My twitter account is almost useless, either everyone I have followed is ghosted, or I am. It's what I get for shitposting, I guess.  If it means anything, I will follow you on your twitter plus buy you a beer sometime! |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 10:41:14 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By notarandomname: China has no reason to get repaid. Shit their goal is to NOT get repaid. Then Take the ports. |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 10:42:47 PM EDT
[#6]
Originally Posted By Charging_Handle:
Fuck. Anyone know any details of what happened?[/qu ote]All I have is this discord post. I cannot say it's true at all.  |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 10:44:48 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By m35ben: Originally Posted By Charging_Handle: Fuck. Anyone know any details of what happened?[/qu ote]All I have is this discord post. I cannot say it's true at all. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/390973/Screenshot_20230825_214039_Discord-2932208.jpg Yeah. Russian TG  Yesterday, two Ukrainian MiG-29 fighters collided in the sky over the Zhytomyr region, local media reported about this, almost immediately deleting the news about the incident. At a minimum, there are dead among the crews of the Vinischuvach, this is confirmed on social networks. One of the pilots who arrived was a well-known Twitter pilot under the nickname Juice_Fighter, who was waiting for his turn on the F-16. Military Informant https://t.me/milinfolive/105585 |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 10:45:53 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By thehun06: Revolts would probably happen inside Russia and it would collapse as we know it … IMHO This is what some people might call a "goal". |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 10:46:26 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Prime:
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Posted: 8/25/2023 10:51:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: thanosnap]
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lieh-tzu: Medvedev is a cunt who should hang. While there are people of "Russian" heritage living in Ukraine, don't forget that the vote for independence in 1991 carried over 90% in favor, except Crimea (only 54%). Even in 2014, 58% of Russian speakers in eastern Ukraine wanted to remain part of Ukraine, NOT secede from Ukraine or join Russia. Pew Research. Medvedev should hang. There's a cool story about how the USSR was dissolved... the chairman of the parliament of Soviet Belarus (Shushkevich) hosted Russian President Boris Yeltsin and Ukrainian President Leonid Kravchuk for secret talks at a government hunting lodge in the Belarus Belovezha Forest in late 1991. They got together and said they need to get rid of this Gorbachev guy, the Soviet Premier. And they decided dissolving the union was the best way to go. https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2022/05/04/ex-belarus-leader-who-helped-dissolve-soviet-union-dies-aged-87-a77572 So 3 people got together (leaders of Belarus, Russia and Ukraine) in a forest, dissolved the union, and Gorbachev (the Soviet Premier) no longer had a job and Yeltsin was the President of Russia, as he had been all along. Ukraine, which parts of it (including Kiev) had been part off Russia for thousands of years, was now sovereign. Now, Putin's version is the USSR dissolved because the Americans wanted it to dissolve and made it so. But the US was actually trying to keep it together at that point. They liked Gorbachev and his liberal democratic reforms. |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 10:52:24 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AlmightyTallest:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F4Z0853XsAAAl2f?format=jpg&name=900x900 He was featured in multiple interviews over the past year and explained how the air war was being conducted. https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/inside-ukraines-desperate-fight-against-drones-with-mig-29-pilot-juice https://www.thedrive.com/uploads/2022/12/12/IMG_1644-scaled.jpg?auto=webp&optimize=high&quality=70&width=1920 Damn! That's a hard loss. How many sorties did he have? Must have been hundreds. FJB for not grasping the right course for this conflict and getting air power to Ukraine 16 months ago. I hope the Ukrainian air force had him doing training for pilots on the regular. SO much experience lost there. |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 10:55:52 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lieh-tzu: I don't want to dump on the isolationists that much. Putinbros, sure, and there are most definitely some in GD. There are isolationists who have a different cost/benefit calculus. They aren't blind, they just have different values and assessments. They have a point in talking about how fouled up things are in this country. But that's a separate problem. Saying "we won't address any other problems until we get America back on track" is short-sighted and risks taking bigger losses down the road. Especially when there isn't anything on the table to fix our own problems. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lieh-tzu: Originally Posted By RockNwood: It has devolved to that at this point. You have to be incredibly blind to Russian objectives and means, and incredibly obstinate to cling to the “not a penny for Ukraine” platform. And shamefully ignorant of how Reagan man handled the Soviets. I don't want to dump on the isolationists that much. Putinbros, sure, and there are most definitely some in GD. There are isolationists who have a different cost/benefit calculus. They aren't blind, they just have different values and assessments. They have a point in talking about how fouled up things are in this country. But that's a separate problem. Saying "we won't address any other problems until we get America back on track" is short-sighted and risks taking bigger losses down the road. Especially when there isn't anything on the table to fix our own problems. The beautiful part about the “we won't address any other problems until we get America back on track" group is that they can be harvested indefinitely. Each has their own version of ‘Merican Social/Political/Financial Nirvana and it will never be reached. It’s a multi billion dollar industry and the actual right wing “bread and circuses”. |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 11:01:26 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By thanosnap: The breakup of Yugoslavia into Serbia, Kosova, Bosnia etc is a lot like the breakup of the USSR, and Yugoslavia are slavs like the Ukrainians and Russians obviously. These were tensions that had been frozen over the Soviet period. Europeans didn't want war on their continent. The Russians did not like the breakup because it reminded them of their breakup, nor did they like the bombing campaign NATO did to end the war and the oppression of the Kosovars by the Milosevic led Serbs, so there could UN peacekeepers on the ground. So now the Russians say "hey, NATO is not defensive, they bombed slavs in Serbia." Pretty sure Gorbachev (no longer having a job after the dissolution of the USSR) did a drunken rant afterwards too about how they will be back. http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41664000/gif/_41664926_former_yugo_416fix.gif Later Libya would have a brutal civil war during the Arab Spring and NATO would bomb the Libyan army to end the civil war. Russia signed off on it in the UN but didn't think dictator Ghaddafi would be deposed; they thought it would just end the war. Once Ghadaffi was gone (killed by his own people) they were fuming. It was initially going to be 19 countries not acting as NATO but they couldn't agree on who would lead the attack so they resorted to NATO command. Of course, then Russia would say "See, NATO is not defensive. They take out dictators." Those are the only 2 offensive actions NATO has taken, other than the article 5 invoked after the 9-11 attacks. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By thanosnap: Originally Posted By RockNwood: Zekensky met with the Serbian leader and that guy released a statement that they support Ukraines territorial integrity because they want Serbia’s to also be respected. I have no idea what Serbia’s concerns are but for whatever reason they align with Ukraine. Strange world. We have Serbia who is aligned with Russia supporting Ukraine’s territory while Hungary being in NATO does not. The breakup of Yugoslavia into Serbia, Kosova, Bosnia etc is a lot like the breakup of the USSR, and Yugoslavia are slavs like the Ukrainians and Russians obviously. These were tensions that had been frozen over the Soviet period. Europeans didn't want war on their continent. The Russians did not like the breakup because it reminded them of their breakup, nor did they like the bombing campaign NATO did to end the war and the oppression of the Kosovars by the Milosevic led Serbs, so there could UN peacekeepers on the ground. So now the Russians say "hey, NATO is not defensive, they bombed slavs in Serbia." Pretty sure Gorbachev (no longer having a job after the dissolution of the USSR) did a drunken rant afterwards too about how they will be back. http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41664000/gif/_41664926_former_yugo_416fix.gif Later Libya would have a brutal civil war during the Arab Spring and NATO would bomb the Libyan army to end the civil war. Russia signed off on it in the UN but didn't think dictator Ghaddafi would be deposed; they thought it would just end the war. Once Ghadaffi was gone (killed by his own people) they were fuming. It was initially going to be 19 countries not acting as NATO but they couldn't agree on who would lead the attack so they resorted to NATO command. Of course, then Russia would say "See, NATO is not defensive. They take out dictators." Those are the only 2 offensive actions NATO has taken, other than the article 5 invoked after the 9-11 attacks. Fascinating, thank you. Way more complex than I thought I knew! 😅 |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 11:06:52 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Prime:
Looks like the Ukrainians filming, dead russian beside them in trench. Looks as if they assaulted and took it in the Stryker. They will recover and fix it i assume. |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 11:11:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Lieh-tzu]
[#15]
Some time ago when somebody was proposing negotiations, I made up my own 10-point list and put it in this thread. No idea where, 3000-something pages ago? Some genius posted a thread in GD saying "it's time to negotiate" so I made a new list. Some of you don't get out of the boat, so here's my proposal for a starting point for a negotiated peace settlement:
If full Russian denuclearization is not achieved, Ukraine immediately becomes a NATO country or becomes a nuclear-armed power on its own. Neutrality for Ukraine (as they choose to define it) is contingent on Russia giving up nuclear weapons forever. This sounds reasonable, does it not? |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 11:17:19 PM EDT
[#16]
 The Rusich group refused to fight in Ukraine after the arrest of its co-founder The Russian neo-Nazi group Rusich has announced that it is ceasing to carry out combat missions in Ukraine. According to the group’s telegram channel, the reason for this decision was the detention of one of the founders and leaders of Rusich, Yan Petrovsky, also known under the pseudonym Slavyan. “In the meantime, the situation with Slavyan is not resolved in the direction we need (extradition of the Russian Federation) - Rusich stops performing any combat missions. There will be time to relax and solve the accumulated cases. If a country cannot protect its citizens, then why should citizens protect the country?” - the group's telegram channel says. The detention of Jan Petrovsky took place in Finland, it became known only today. The Ukrainian authorities suspect him of participating in war crimes committed between June 2014 and August 2015 in the Luhansk and Donetsk regions. Petrovsky himself denies any involvement in these events. https://t.me/moscowtimes_ru/15288 The Kremlin prepared to disband Wagner The Kremlin will not be able to keep the Wagner PMC in its current form, two sources in the Russian government told The Moscow Times. Military units with combat experience in Ukraine, Africa and the Middle East, backed up by a media empire of telegram channels and political technologists — the Kremlin does not need all this on the eve of the elections, where Vladimir Putin is to be re-elected for a fifth term. Immediately after Prigozhin's June rebellion, the Russian military began to openly actively prepare to change the management of PMC structures in the Middle East and Africa, a person who has been on several business trips with Wagner told The Moscow Times. Now, after the plane crash in the Tver region, everyone is trying to stay as far away as possible from any stories and projects related to Prigozhin, says a Russian official. Without Prigozhin, Wagner is unlikely to exist, and Putin is not interested in this, Oleg Ignatov, an analyst at the International Crisis Group, believes: “Many members of Wagner believe that the authorities can be behind (Prigozhin’s death). And the authorities cannot ignore such risks.” Those whom the authorities consider to be closest to Prigozhin “will have to think about their safety,” says Ignatov. https://t.me/moscowtimes_ru/15289 |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 11:18:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: RockNwood]
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lieh-tzu: I don't want to dump on the isolationists that much. Putinbros, sure, and there are most definitely some in GD. There are isolationists who have a different cost/benefit calculus. They aren't blind, they just have different values and assessments. They have a point in talking about how fouled up things are in this country. But that's a separate problem. Saying "we won't address any other problems until we get America back on track" is short-sighted and risks taking bigger losses down the road. Especially when there isn't anything on the table to fix our own problems. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lieh-tzu: Originally Posted By RockNwood: It has devolved to that at this point. You have to be incredibly blind to Russian objectives and means, and incredibly obstinate to cling to the “not a penny for Ukraine” platform. And shamefully ignorant of how Reagan man handled the Soviets. I don't want to dump on the isolationists that much. Putinbros, sure, and there are most definitely some in GD. There are isolationists who have a different cost/benefit calculus. They aren't blind, they just have different values and assessments. They have a point in talking about how fouled up things are in this country. But that's a separate problem. Saying "we won't address any other problems until we get America back on track" is short-sighted and risks taking bigger losses down the road. Especially when there isn't anything on the table to fix our own problems. Which all the more demonstrates an ignorance on their part of Reagan’s situation and leadership. In 1980 the country was at its nadir economically. The great malaise. Price controls, inflation, shortages of oil and gas, galloping inflation, 30 years dominance of Democrats on both houses. Soon to follow was the Savings and Loan collapse, banks defaulting on CDs and eventually closing, 18% mortgages and credit cards near 30%. Unemployment around 12% and the collapse of the Rust Belt. 100-300 applicants for every job. All that to say Reagan had his hands full on domestic issues. Yet, he confronted Soviets head on and challenged them to an arms race in space. WW3 people screamed!!! But it worked, the expense to compete helped break the Soviets along with their war in Afghanistan! No world war. Soviet empire crumbled. No nukes. This is such a blatant parallel it is disgusting that people calling themselves conservatives run away from confronting the much smaller and weaker Russia. |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 11:19:46 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER: I will add that I suspect his immigrant parents influenced him also. Coming from "old" India, they are likely anti-colonialists and assumed Great nations like England and the USA get involved in foreign countries out of colonialist aspirations. The obvious remedy for colonialism is isolationism. Vivek was very likely influence by his parents in the same way my parents influenced me about communism. Except my parents were right... Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ITCHY-FINGER: Originally Posted By kncook: He is like many people sheltered in the west. He’s mostly ignorant….and that’s not trying to mock him. He’s just ill informed whether on purpose or accident. He’s ignorant. Lots of the people here in GD are similar thinking it’s a USA, Russia, Ukraine war with the US “using” the silly, corrupt Ukrainians to do their bidding. They never look a the rest of all eastern Europe and their attitudes toward Russia. These other countries (Poland, CZ, Romanian, Baltics, Nordic, etc truly know the evil of Russia and what they have done. Give proportionally MUCH more than the US (put their money where their mouth is) and have MUCH higher public support to stopping Russia. These aren’t lukewarm middle men that don’t care or blame the USA. We’ve had some generations of Americans that look at the foolish politics of today and the dumb, woke culture the left puts on us and think this country is worthless or deserving of fading for having that occur. The are foolish and don’t realize we are the best country in the world (and needs everyone’s help fighting to help keep it that way). I will add that I suspect his immigrant parents influenced him also. Coming from "old" India, they are likely anti-colonialists and assumed Great nations like England and the USA get involved in foreign countries out of colonialist aspirations. The obvious remedy for colonialism is isolationism. Vivek was very likely influence by his parents in the same way my parents influenced me about communism. Except my parents were right... Cheers to sound parents! 
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Posted: 8/25/2023 11:23:54 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By coralreefer: If it means anything, I will follow you on your twitter plus buy you a beer sometime! I am currently on another suspension.
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Posted: 8/25/2023 11:26:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: RockNwood]
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lieh-tzu: Off-topic: he's an idiot on foreign policy, complete and total idiot. He also said China needs to wait until 2028 to invade Taiwan so we can catch up on semiconductor manufacturing, then they can have it. Not even exaggerating. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lieh-tzu: Originally Posted By RockNwood: So Vivek’s policy would be Give Russia everything it wants and hope for the best? He is either an idiot or compromised to Russia. Glad he got soundly ridiculed. Off-topic: he's an idiot on foreign policy, complete and total idiot. He also said China needs to wait until 2028 to invade Taiwan so we can catch up on semiconductor manufacturing, then they can have it. Not even exaggerating. Wow. No words can express my amazement a “popular” candidate can say such idiotic drivel and not be heckled off the stage as a surrender monkey. |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 11:34:33 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RockNwood: Wow. No words can express my amazement a “popular” candidate can say such idiotic drivel and not be heckkckled off the stage as a surrender monkey. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RockNwood: Originally Posted By Lieh-tzu: Originally Posted By RockNwood: So Vivek’s policy would be Give Russia everything it wants and hope for the best? He is either an idiot or compromised to Russia. Glad he got soundly ridiculed. Off-topic: he's an idiot on foreign policy, complete and total idiot. He also said China needs to wait until 2028 to invade Taiwan so we can catch up on semiconductor manufacturing, then they can have it. Not even exaggerating. Wow. No words can express my amazement a “popular” candidate can say such idiotic drivel and not be heckkckled off the stage as a surrender monkey. Not a serious contender and far from popular. Tell me who finished 3rd in each sides primary the last two election cycles off the top of your head. No one knows or cares. |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 11:36:04 PM EDT
[#22]
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Posted: 8/25/2023 11:40:15 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lieh-tzu: Some time ago when somebody was proposing negotiations, I made up my own 10-point list and put it in this thread. No idea where, 3000-something pages ago? Some genius posted a thread in GD saying "it's time to negotiate" so I made a new list. Some of you don't get out of the boat, so here's my proposal for a starting point for a negotiated peace settlement:
If full Russian denuclearization is not achieved, Ukraine immediately becomes a NATO country or becomes a nuclear-armed power on its own. Neutrality for Ukraine (as they choose to define it) is contingent on Russia giving up nuclear weapons forever. This sounds reasonable, does it not? Totally excellent! I would like to see added that the Belarusian SF dance team be disbanded and every participant gets whacked on his pee pee. But that could be a point of compromise. |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 11:42:32 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lieh-tzu: Damn, she nailed him! Nikki for Pres! Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lieh-tzu: Originally Posted By RockNwood: I don’t follow much of the R churn yet but saw this video exchange and was impressed that the crowd seemed to be cheering strongly for Haley’s points about Putin and Ukraine aid. Feel free to correct my impression if you follow this more than I.
Damn, she nailed him! Nikki for Pres! No. I do appreciate her position on Ukraine versus Vivek but I'm not interested in a female version of George Bush. She's proven she'll fold and pander to the left. It saddens me that Vivek has such a terrible position on Ukraine but I'd still take him over an typical establishment hack in spite of that. |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 11:44:34 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By thanosnap: I dunno, these were not exceptionally bright people. In Prigozhin's younger years he was in a gang, went to Prison for 12 years, when he got out of the penal colony he went to college but dropped out, started a catering company... and Russia is not a meritocracy, he got government contracts because Putin liked him. Sure, he's got street smarts and charisma but I think we can all point to a lot of things he did that was just plain dumb. Utkin was a special forces soldier, and then a mercenary. According to Wikipedia: "Utkin also reportedly called himself Wagner after German composer Richard Wagner, because his work was greatly admired by Adolf Hitler and was appropriated by the Nazis. Allegedly he greeted subordinates by saying "Heil!", wore a Wehrmacht field cap around Wagner training grounds, and sometimes signed his name with the lightning bolt insignia of the SS." Quite strange that a Russian merc group would use a German name. I'm a fan of Peter Zeihan's and he says that just before and after the USSR collapse there was a collapse of the education system and a lot of brain drain. Those that were educated before that are starting to retire. So things like the Yamal liquefied natural gas plant were built by foreigners, and they've pulled out. So it's questionable whether they can maintain these things on their own. There aren't a lot of people around that know how to run a government either. But I'm digressing. They could've been shot and thrown on the plane, or Prigozhin could still be alive, but I'm not surprised a bunch of thugs and gangsters didn't plan for continuity. Apparently Russia is not the iron curtain it used to be and it's very leaky. There's a story to be told here and it'll come out. If anybody had any doubts the country has no rule of law and is run like a mob this is proof though. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By thanosnap: Originally Posted By LesBaer45: I guess I'm used to former F500 companies I worked for that had specific rules about what level of employees could travel together depending on classification. Several times during big conferences or company meetings we wound up on different flights as we had to divide up the group. I dunno, these were not exceptionally bright people. In Prigozhin's younger years he was in a gang, went to Prison for 12 years, when he got out of the penal colony he went to college but dropped out, started a catering company... and Russia is not a meritocracy, he got government contracts because Putin liked him. Sure, he's got street smarts and charisma but I think we can all point to a lot of things he did that was just plain dumb. Utkin was a special forces soldier, and then a mercenary. According to Wikipedia: "Utkin also reportedly called himself Wagner after German composer Richard Wagner, because his work was greatly admired by Adolf Hitler and was appropriated by the Nazis. Allegedly he greeted subordinates by saying "Heil!", wore a Wehrmacht field cap around Wagner training grounds, and sometimes signed his name with the lightning bolt insignia of the SS." Quite strange that a Russian merc group would use a German name. I'm a fan of Peter Zeihan's and he says that just before and after the USSR collapse there was a collapse of the education system and a lot of brain drain. Those that were educated before that are starting to retire. So things like the Yamal liquefied natural gas plant were built by foreigners, and they've pulled out. So it's questionable whether they can maintain these things on their own. There aren't a lot of people around that know how to run a government either. But I'm digressing. They could've been shot and thrown on the plane, or Prigozhin could still be alive, but I'm not surprised a bunch of thugs and gangsters didn't plan for continuity. Apparently Russia is not the iron curtain it used to be and it's very leaky. There's a story to be told here and it'll come out. If anybody had any doubts the country has no rule of law and is run like a mob this is proof though. Lots of people made it to the top without much formal training. “Street smarts”, charisma, astute judgment, and the ability to read people and situations all matter. Maybe he believed his kompromat kept him safe. Maybe, if he works for actors in the security services other than Putin, he believed that kept him safe. And call me a conspiracy theorist but I wouldn’t be at all surprised to hear he isn’t dead. Actually, speaking for myself, I assume he is NOT dead. |
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Posted: 8/25/2023 11:46:49 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By kncook: Not a serious contender and far from popular. Tell me who finished 3rd in each sides primary the last two election cycles off the top of your head. No one knows or cares. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By kncook: Originally Posted By RockNwood: Originally Posted By Lieh-tzu: Originally Posted By RockNwood: So Vivek’s policy would be Give Russia everything it wants and hope for the best? He is either an idiot or compromised to Russia. Glad he got soundly ridiculed. Off-topic: he's an idiot on foreign policy, complete and total idiot. He also said China needs to wait until 2028 to invade Taiwan so we can catch up on semiconductor manufacturing, then they can have it. Not even exaggerating. Wow. No words can express my amazement a “popular” candidate can say such idiotic drivel and not be heckkckled off the stage as a surrender monkey. Not a serious contender and far from popular. Tell me who finished 3rd in each sides primary the last two election cycles off the top of your head. No one knows or cares. Whew! I was failing that question and sweating over it, then I saw your last line. You are right! |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 12:13:39 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RockNwood: That is a great thread. Non X link: https://t.co/LA380uj5GK I suspect it has turned for the worse now. Lukashenko offered asylum to Wagner and bragged about using post-mutiny Wagner to train Belarusian army. Since the special “gift basket” he has been backpedaling hard. He seems scared. I give him less than a month before Putin gets around to cleaning him up. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RockNwood: Originally Posted By Jaehaerys: Great Twitter thread on the relationship between Putin and Lukashenko. Highly recommend giving it a read. That is a great thread. Non X link: https://t.co/LA380uj5GK I suspect it has turned for the worse now. Lukashenko offered asylum to Wagner and bragged about using post-mutiny Wagner to train Belarusian army. Since the special “gift basket” he has been backpedaling hard. He seems scared. I give him less than a month before Putin gets around to cleaning him up. I’ve always felt the Lukashenko was playing this for his own benefit (beyond staying in power and out of the war) but that he may have gotten too ambitious and cozied up too long with the crocodile. Maybe he sees the endgame approaching and that Putin is set on a Gotterdammerung ending that Lukashenko didn’t sign up for. He still has value to the west and he can retire comfortably while retaining a lot of influence in Belarus. |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 12:16:45 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RockNwood: Sadly there have been plenty of Russian collaborators in the UA military, politics, and general population. Security services are scooping them up but a lot to sift through while also waging a war of survival and trying hard to demonstrate to EU that they obey the rule of law and don’t perform summary executions on the spot. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RockNwood: Originally Posted By sierra-def: Originally Posted By RockNwood: Another Russian agent near Bakhmut. Life in prison likely. I think former residents of Bakhmut and gold star families out to get first crack at her. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/494438/IMG_3200-2931639.jpg
The perpetrator turned out to be a teacher from one of the lyceums in Kramatorsk, who worked for the main directorate of the general staff of the armed forces of the russion federation. The court chose a preventive measure for her in the form of detention. The investigation is ongoing. The perpetrator faces life imprisonment. Even their teachers are or act traitorous? Sadly there have been plenty of Russian collaborators in the UA military, politics, and general population. Security services are scooping them up but a lot to sift through while also waging a war of survival and trying hard to demonstrate to EU that they obey the rule of law and don’t perform summary executions on the spot. MICE. It doesn’t all have to be ideology. Throw some money at someone who feels hard done by, and you have MCE right there. |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 12:18:48 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Auto5guy: Drone right to the back of the head. Twitter Link https://i.postimg.cc/SKLRnwnn/Screenshot-20230825-130826.png Edited to add pic I bet you can’t hear shit over a roaring tank engine. Keeping your head on a swivel is the only chance. |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 12:21:45 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By thanosnap: This is a bit old but in case some of you haven's seen it, it explains a lot. It comes from Russian Prime minister Dmitry Medvedev who (due a constitutional issue on term limits) was actually President of Russia between 2008 and 2012 while Putin was prime minister, but we now know Putin mostly ran the show. Anyway, it comes from the Kremlin:
"WHY WILL UKRAINE DISAPPEAR? BECAUSE NOBODY NEEDS IT 1. Europe doesn’t need Ukraine. The forced support of the Nazi regime, by the American mentor’s order, has put Europeans into a financial and political inferno. All for the sake of bandera’s unterukraine, that even the snobby, insolent Polacks don’t take for a valid country, and time and again toss in the issue of its western areas anschluss. There’s a nice perspective ahead: to permanently put the nouveau-Ukrainian blood-sucking parasites on the decrepit EU’s arthritis-crippled neck. That’ll be the final fall of Europe, once majestic, but robbed off by degeneration. 2. The US doesn’t need Ukraine. True, the military and sanction campaigns are attempted for PR by political blabbermouths, who long ago attested to their impotence and imbecility. Average Americans don’t understand what “Ukraine” is, and where “it” is. Most of them won’t show this “power” on the map on the first take. Why won’t the US establishment focus on inflation and job issues, or emergencies in their home States, instead of a country 404, unbeknownst to them? Why does so much dough go across the ocean? Sooner or later, they’ll ask for that. Then, storming of the Capitol in January 2021 would seem like scout games. 3. Africa and Latin America don’t need Ukraine. The hundreds of millions spent by US on pointless fights in Ukraine, could finance many development programmes for Latin American and African states. Latin America is gringos’ backyard – that’s what they’ve been rubbing in for decades. Africa’s had its share of suffering from the genocide, and colonial dependence, imposed by former western slave traders. That’s why the people of African huts and Latin American favelas ask a very reasonable question: for their former suffering and present-day loyalty, why is somebody else rewarded – very, very far away? 4. Asia doesn’t need Ukraine. By Russia’s example, they see “colour” technologies at work to eradicate the largest competing powers. They understand what scenario the America-led collective West has for them if they disobey. “Help us to overcome Russia, and we’ll soon come to you”, the utterly brazen Western leaders tell them. Such gigantic countries as India, China, and other Asia-Pacific states face the big enough challenge of post-pandemic economic recovery, let aside the drugged clowns, with their whining for aid. “We are not interested in you”, Asia tells their messengers, responding to the calls to support Ukraine and confine Russia. The country, geopolitically many times closer to Asian powers, the one that historically has proven itself a reliable strategic partner. Do Asian giants need such headache coming from former colonisers? 5. Russia doesn’t need Ukraine. A threadbare quilt, torn, shaggy, and greasy. The new Malorossiya of 1991 is made up of the artificially cut territories, many of which are indigenously Russian, separated by accident in the 20th century. Millions of our compatriots live there, harassed for years by the Nazi Kiev regime. It is them who we defend in our special military operation, relentlessly eradicating the enemy. We don’t need unterukraine. We need Big Great Russia. 6. Finally, its own citizens don’t need the Nazi-headed Ukraine. That’s why out of 45 million people there’re only some 20 million remaining. That’s why those who stayed want to leave for any place: the hated Poland, EU, NATO, to be America’s 51nd state. Joining the Antarctic with its pinguins will also be fine. As long as it’s quiet, and the food’s good. The ruling junta’s criminal ambitions forced Ukrainians to beg and roam around the countries and continents, searching for a better life. All that is for an obscure European perspective. Or rather, to let the harlequin in a khaki tricot and his band of thievish Nazi clowns to put the money stolen from the West into their offshore accounts. Would ordinary Ukrainians need that? Nobody on this planet needs such a Ukraine. That’s why it will disappear" And it's pretty much in line with Putin's essay on Ukraine where he says Ukraine isn't a real country and them straying from Russia's orbit is an attack on Russia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Historical_Unity_of_Russians_and_Ukrainians http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/66181 I believe we’re all well-acquainted with that piece of Russian propaganda for genocide. |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 12:41:49 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: I’ve always felt the Lukashenko was playing this for his own benefit (beyond staying in power and out of the war) but that he may have gotten too ambitious and cozied up too long with the crocodile. Maybe he sees the endgame approaching and that Putin is set on a Gotterdammerung ending that Lukashenko didn’t sign up for. He still has value to the west and he can retire comfortably while retaining a lot of influence in Belarus. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: Originally Posted By RockNwood: Originally Posted By Jaehaerys: Great Twitter thread on the relationship between Putin and Lukashenko. Highly recommend giving it a read. That is a great thread. Non X link: https://t.co/LA380uj5GK I suspect it has turned for the worse now. Lukashenko offered asylum to Wagner and bragged about using post-mutiny Wagner to train Belarusian army. Since the special “gift basket” he has been backpedaling hard. He seems scared. I give him less than a month before Putin gets around to cleaning him up. I’ve always felt the Lukashenko was playing this for his own benefit (beyond staying in power and out of the war) but that he may have gotten too ambitious and cozied up too long with the crocodile. Maybe he sees the endgame approaching and that Putin is set on a Gotterdammerung ending that Lukashenko didn’t sign up for. He still has value to the west and he can retire comfortably while retaining a lot of influence in Belarus. My main takeaway from that thread was that Lukashenko provides a number of valuable services to Putin, and that he likely isn't going anywhere soon, at least not due to Russian action. I'm sure there are some disagreements behind closed doors, but I feel that Putin is much better off having Lukashenko in charge of Belarus than not, and I think he knows that. In the past, I've wondered if Putin is upset that Lukashenko won't commit Belarusian troops to Ukraine, but I don't think that's the case anymore. Belarus has less than 20,000 combat capable soldiers it could commit to the fight, and those guys are needed to maintain order back home. The absolute last thing Putin wants at this point is to lose control of Belarus, which would be a fairly likely turn of events if the Belarusian Army got committed to Ukraine (something that is wildly unpopular in Belarus), got chewed up, and wasn't able to maintain order back home. Overall, I think Lukashenko's actions in terms of donating equipment, letting the Russians use Belarus as a staging/training ground, and being an annoyance to Poland and Lithuania provide more value to Putin and come with much less risk attached to them. From my perspective, the main question concerning Belarus is, what happens when Lukashenko finally kicks the bucket? Is there a succession plan put in place? Does one of his sons get put into power? Does Russia just outright annex Belarus at that point? We know that Russia's long term goal with regards to Belarus is annexation, according to leaked documents from 2021. Much like Ukrainians, Putin and Russian nationalists at large don't view Belarus as being a sovereign country and don't view Belarusians as being a distinct people that exist separate from Russians. It's only a matter of time until the Russians try to grab Belarus and reeducate their "confused little brothers." I wonder if that will happen immediately after Lukashenko's death, and I also wonder if Russia's quagmire in Ukraine has lengthened the timeline any. |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 12:48:02 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jozsi: NO! Vivek is a businessman just like Trump, it's all about wheeling and dealing and that is what he thinks on how Russia can be treated. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jozsi: Originally Posted By RockNwood: Originally Posted By kpacman: Originally Posted By RockNwood: I don’t follow much of the R churn yet but saw this video exchange and was impressed that the crowd seemed to be cheering strongly for Haley’s points about Putin and Ukraine aid. Feel free to correct my impression if you follow this more than I.
I thought Nikki did a great job exposing Vivek's lack of international knowledge. Nikki was UN ambassador, so she just ran circles around Vivek, especially regarding the Ukraine issue. Vivek's proposal is to freeze the lines as they are. Allow Russia to keep the territory they have seized in return for a pledge to cease all hostilities. This also comes with a promise to Russia that Ukraine WON'T be allowed to join NATO. WTF? So Vivek’s policy would be Give Russia everything it wants and hope for the best? He is either an idiot or compromised to Russia. Glad he got soundly ridiculed. NO! Vivek is a businessman just like Trump, it's all about wheeling and dealing and that is what he thinks on how Russia can be treated. I disagree. He’s either …completely clueless on the situation 18 months in. …pandering to the what he thinks is the TRUMP demographic of “if Biden supports it, it must be bad!” …a weak man who has allowed others to determine his moral compass. None of these make a case for him to be president. |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 1:02:58 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: I believe we’re all well-acquainted with that piece of Russian propaganda for genocide. Yeah. I think what's even more eye opening is Putin's essay on Ukraine written in 2021 titled ”On the Historical Unity of Russians and Ukrainians“. It's required reading for Russian officers. In his essay he says Ukraine, Belarus, and Russia have been one country for more than 5,000 years since Kievan-Rus times and they are only separate now because the founders of the USSR made the "mistake" of chopping them up into separate states under the union in 1922 which became sovereign after the union was disbanded in 1991. He says when that happened Russia was "robbed." And he also says that Ukrainians are really Russians that speak 2 languages, and that them starting to deny their roots and Russian language and Russian orthodox church and become "ethnically pure" Ukrainians who want to join the EU is "comparable to the use of weapons of mass destruction" on Russia because it will wipe out millions of Russians from the Earth. When he wrote it a lot of people said that's nothing new, he's been saying this for awhile: https://verfassungsblog.de/smothered-by-russias-brotherly-embrace/ https://jordanrussiacenter.org/news/in-putins-vision-of-ukraines-past-a-warning-about-russias-future/ But I don't think the average person knows that. |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 1:05:42 AM EDT
[#34]
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Posted: 8/26/2023 1:15:43 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By yekimak: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/66660/IMG_20230826_010517_394_jpg-2932318.JPG Whatever happened to Schmigs posting the daily graphic from Ukraine MoD? |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 1:17:06 AM EDT
[#36]
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Posted: 8/26/2023 1:19:52 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jaehaerys: My main takeaway from that thread was that Lukashenko provides a number of valuable services to Putin, and that he likely isn't going anywhere soon, at least not due to Russian action. I'm sure there are some disagreements behind closed doors, but I feel that Putin is much better off having Lukashenko in charge of Belarus than not, and I think he knows that. In the past, I've wondered if Putin is upset that Lukashenko won't commit Belarusian troops to Ukraine, but I don't think that's the case anymore. Belarus has less than 20,000 combat capable soldiers it could commit to the fight, and those guys are needed to maintain order back home. The absolute last thing Putin wants at this point is to lose control of Belarus, which would be a fairly likely turn of events if the Belarusian Army got committed to Ukraine (something that is wildly unpopular in Belarus), got chewed up, and wasn't able to maintain order back home. Overall, I think Lukashenko's actions in terms of donating equipment, letting the Russians use Belarus as a staging/training ground, and being an annoyance to Poland and Lithuania provide more value to Putin and come with much less risk attached to them. From my perspective, the main question concerning Belarus is, what happens when Lukashenko finally kicks the bucket? Is there a succession plan put in place? Does one of his sons get put into power? Does Russia just outright annex Belarus at that point? We know that Russia's long term goal with regards to Belarus is annexation, according to leaked documents from 2021. Much like Ukrainians, Putin and Russian nationalists at large don't view Belarus as being a sovereign country and don't view Belarusians as being a distinct people that exist separate from Russians. It's only a matter of time until the Russians try to grab Belarus and reeducate their "confused little brothers." I wonder if that will happen immediately after Lukashenko's death, and I also wonder if Russia's quagmire in Ukraine has lengthened the timeline any. Lukashenko and Putin have been working on a merger for years. Union State.. When complete, it will be a joined federation. Funny that Ukraine never went along with it. |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 1:29:24 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Prime: Friends. Once again, we want to remind you that the statements that have appeared allegedly from the commanders of the PMC Wagner are fake. None of our commanders, publicly or not publicly, has stated anything. Please trust only our official sources. @razgruzka_vagnera [i]The last "Ride of the Valkyries" - what is the future of Prigozhin's empire S He invented the phrase about “the best in hell” himself and hated it when someone looked for good in him - he wanted to look as infernal as possible and considered himself a manifestation of pure evil. Although Prigozhin admitted that in his cynicism and military ingenuity he is far from the commander of the Wagner PMC Dmitry Utkin.  Attached FileI’ve generally tried to resist the temptation to say “X is damned for his actions.” That isn’t for me to say. But there it is. I think he probably underestimated his own importance down there. That said, I haven’t yet seen any proof he’s dead. It’s always bugged me that there was a little too much admiration for this person even among people who are educated in what’s happening. Murderer, mass-murderer, thief, psychopath, genocide, probably rapist. But he’s a funny guy! No one who’s a Christian should have anything but disgust for him and his ilk. But he posed as a devout Orthodox and some/many people claiming to be Orthodox lionize him. Regardless of nationality it’s a lesson for all of us - your first loyalty is to God and you’re accountable to Him. |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 1:34:05 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: MICE. It doesn’t all have to be ideology. Throw some money at someone who feels hard done by, and you have MCE right there. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: Originally Posted By RockNwood: Originally Posted By sierra-def: Originally Posted By RockNwood: Another Russian agent near Bakhmut. Life in prison likely. I think former residents of Bakhmut and gold star families out to get first crack at her. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/494438/IMG_3200-2931639.jpg
The perpetrator turned out to be a teacher from one of the lyceums in Kramatorsk, who worked for the main directorate of the general staff of the armed forces of the russion federation. The court chose a preventive measure for her in the form of detention. The investigation is ongoing. The perpetrator faces life imprisonment. Even their teachers are or act traitorous? Sadly there have been plenty of Russian collaborators in the UA military, politics, and general population. Security services are scooping them up but a lot to sift through while also waging a war of survival and trying hard to demonstrate to EU that they obey the rule of law and don’t perform summary executions on the spot. MICE. It doesn’t all have to be ideology. Throw some money at someone who feels hard done by, and you have MCE right there. True! Russia has gotten real bargains over the decades with paltry payouts but stroking the ego. And honey traps are almost synonymous with friendly Russians. Although in this case I doubt honey trap was used but you never know! |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 8/26/2023 1:38:18 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: I disagree. He’s either …completely clueless on the situation 18 months in. …pandering to the what he thinks is the TRUMP demographic of “if Biden supports it, it must be bad!” …a weak man who has allowed others to determine his moral compass. None of these make a case for him to be president. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Capta: Originally Posted By Jozsi: Originally Posted By RockNwood: Originally Posted By kpacman: Originally Posted By RockNwood: I don’t follow much of the R churn yet but saw this video exchange and was impressed that the crowd seemed to be cheering strongly for Haley’s points about Putin and Ukraine aid. Feel free to correct my impression if you follow this more than I.
I thought Nikki did a great job exposing Vivek's lack of international knowledge. Nikki was UN ambassador, so she just ran circles around Vivek, especially regarding the Ukraine issue. Vivek's proposal is to freeze the lines as they are. Allow Russia to keep the territory they have seized in return for a pledge to cease all hostilities. This also comes with a promise to Russia that Ukraine WON'T be allowed to join NATO. WTF? So Vivek’s policy would be Give Russia everything it wants and hope for the best? He is either an idiot or compromised to Russia. Glad he got soundly ridiculed. NO! Vivek is a businessman just like Trump, it's all about wheeling and dealing and that is what he thinks on how Russia can be treated. I disagree. He’s either …completely clueless on the situation 18 months in. …pandering to the what he thinks is the TRUMP demographic of “if Biden supports it, it must be bad!” …a weak man who has allowed others to determine his moral compass. None of these make a case for him to be president. Anyone basing their opinion of someone's qualification for being POTUS on 'what is best for Zelensky' is fucked in the head. |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 1:41:43 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lieh-tzu: Lukashenko and Putin have been working on a merger for years. Union State.. When complete, it will be a joined federation. Funny that Ukraine never went along with it. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lieh-tzu: Originally Posted By Jaehaerys: My main takeaway from that thread was that Lukashenko provides a number of valuable services to Putin, and that he likely isn't going anywhere soon, at least not due to Russian action. I'm sure there are some disagreements behind closed doors, but I feel that Putin is much better off having Lukashenko in charge of Belarus than not, and I think he knows that. In the past, I've wondered if Putin is upset that Lukashenko won't commit Belarusian troops to Ukraine, but I don't think that's the case anymore. Belarus has less than 20,000 combat capable soldiers it could commit to the fight, and those guys are needed to maintain order back home. The absolute last thing Putin wants at this point is to lose control of Belarus, which would be a fairly likely turn of events if the Belarusian Army got committed to Ukraine (something that is wildly unpopular in Belarus), got chewed up, and wasn't able to maintain order back home. Overall, I think Lukashenko's actions in terms of donating equipment, letting the Russians use Belarus as a staging/training ground, and being an annoyance to Poland and Lithuania provide more value to Putin and come with much less risk attached to them. From my perspective, the main question concerning Belarus is, what happens when Lukashenko finally kicks the bucket? Is there a succession plan put in place? Does one of his sons get put into power? Does Russia just outright annex Belarus at that point? We know that Russia's long term goal with regards to Belarus is annexation, according to leaked documents from 2021. Much like Ukrainians, Putin and Russian nationalists at large don't view Belarus as being a sovereign country and don't view Belarusians as being a distinct people that exist separate from Russians. It's only a matter of time until the Russians try to grab Belarus and reeducate their "confused little brothers." I wonder if that will happen immediately after Lukashenko's death, and I also wonder if Russia's quagmire in Ukraine has lengthened the timeline any. Lukashenko and Putin have been working on a merger for years. Union State.. When complete, it will be a joined federation. Funny that Ukraine never went along with it. Had the Maidan never happened, Ukraine would resemble Belarus today. For Putin, Ukraine and Belarus are to be the core of the new Russian Empire. This is why I really hope to see this conflict result in the overthrow of Lukashenko and the creation of a free, independent Belarus. Nothing would be a bigger "fuck you" to Russia's imperial ambitions than losing control over Ukraine and Belarus. I do believe that the Belarusian volunteer units fighting in Ukraine are working on something, as I've read reports of them acquiring unregistered AKs from Azov in preparation for a future showdown with the Lukashenko regime. Whether that will actually amount to anything remains to be seen, but I'd be ecstatic at the sight of Lukashenko getting overthrown and the old white-red-white flag flying over Belarus. |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 1:44:43 AM EDT
[#42]
 Konstantin Samoilov - Inside RussianEconomy - Impact of Sanctions - Collapse of Rouble - Instability |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 1:46:43 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jaehaerys: Had the Maidan never happened, Ukraine would resemble Belarus today. For Putin, Ukraine and Belarus are to be the core of the new Russian Empire. This is why I really hope to see this conflict result in the overthrow of Lukashenko and the creation of a free, independent Belarus. Nothing would be a bigger "fuck you" to Russia's imperial ambitions than losing control over Ukraine and Belarus. I do believe that the Belarusian volunteer units fighting in Ukraine are working on something, as I've read reports of them acquiring unregistered AKs from Azov in preparation for a future showdown with the Lukashenko regime. Whether that will actually amount to anything remains to be seen, but I'd be ecstatic at the sight of Lukashenko getting overthrown and the old white-red-white flag flying over Belarus. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jaehaerys: Originally Posted By Lieh-tzu: Originally Posted By Jaehaerys: My main takeaway from that thread was that Lukashenko provides a number of valuable services to Putin, and that he likely isn't going anywhere soon, at least not due to Russian action. I'm sure there are some disagreements behind closed doors, but I feel that Putin is much better off having Lukashenko in charge of Belarus than not, and I think he knows that. In the past, I've wondered if Putin is upset that Lukashenko won't commit Belarusian troops to Ukraine, but I don't think that's the case anymore. Belarus has less than 20,000 combat capable soldiers it could commit to the fight, and those guys are needed to maintain order back home. The absolute last thing Putin wants at this point is to lose control of Belarus, which would be a fairly likely turn of events if the Belarusian Army got committed to Ukraine (something that is wildly unpopular in Belarus), got chewed up, and wasn't able to maintain order back home. Overall, I think Lukashenko's actions in terms of donating equipment, letting the Russians use Belarus as a staging/training ground, and being an annoyance to Poland and Lithuania provide more value to Putin and come with much less risk attached to them. From my perspective, the main question concerning Belarus is, what happens when Lukashenko finally kicks the bucket? Is there a succession plan put in place? Does one of his sons get put into power? Does Russia just outright annex Belarus at that point? We know that Russia's long term goal with regards to Belarus is annexation, according to leaked documents from 2021. Much like Ukrainians, Putin and Russian nationalists at large don't view Belarus as being a sovereign country and don't view Belarusians as being a distinct people that exist separate from Russians. It's only a matter of time until the Russians try to grab Belarus and reeducate their "confused little brothers." I wonder if that will happen immediately after Lukashenko's death, and I also wonder if Russia's quagmire in Ukraine has lengthened the timeline any. Lukashenko and Putin have been working on a merger for years. Union State.. When complete, it will be a joined federation. Funny that Ukraine never went along with it. Had the Maidan never happened, Ukraine would resemble Belarus today. For Putin, Ukraine and Belarus are to be the core of the new Russian Empire. This is why I really hope to see this conflict result in the overthrow of Lukashenko and the creation of a free, independent Belarus. Nothing would be a bigger "fuck you" to Russia's imperial ambitions than losing control over Ukraine and Belarus. I do believe that the Belarusian volunteer units fighting in Ukraine are working on something, as I've read reports of them acquiring unregistered AKs from Azov in preparation for a future showdown with the Lukashenko regime. Whether that will actually amount to anything remains to be seen, but I'd be ecstatic at the sight of Lukashenko getting overthrown and the old white-red-white flag flying over Belarus. |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 1:59:43 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Tomislav: Anyone basing their opinion of someone's qualification for being POTUS on 'what is best for Zelensky' is fucked in the head. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Tomislav: Originally Posted By Capta: Originally Posted By Jozsi: Originally Posted By RockNwood: Originally Posted By kpacman: Originally Posted By RockNwood: I don’t follow much of the R churn yet but saw this video exchange and was impressed that the crowd seemed to be cheering strongly for Haley’s points about Putin and Ukraine aid. Feel free to correct my impression if you follow this more than I.
I thought Nikki did a great job exposing Vivek's lack of international knowledge. Nikki was UN ambassador, so she just ran circles around Vivek, especially regarding the Ukraine issue. Vivek's proposal is to freeze the lines as they are. Allow Russia to keep the territory they have seized in return for a pledge to cease all hostilities. This also comes with a promise to Russia that Ukraine WON'T be allowed to join NATO. WTF? So Vivek’s policy would be Give Russia everything it wants and hope for the best? He is either an idiot or compromised to Russia. Glad he got soundly ridiculed. NO! Vivek is a businessman just like Trump, it's all about wheeling and dealing and that is what he thinks on how Russia can be treated. I disagree. He’s either …completely clueless on the situation 18 months in. …pandering to the what he thinks is the TRUMP demographic of “if Biden supports it, it must be bad!” …a weak man who has allowed others to determine his moral compass. None of these make a case for him to be president. Anyone basing their opinion of someone's qualification for being POTUS on 'what is best for Zelensky' is fucked in the head. Anyone boiling down the pro-Ukrainian position to supporting 'what is best for Zelensky' is being inherently dishonest and deceitful, which I suppose shouldn't be surprising at this point. Overall, the focus on Zelensky from the right is absurdly moronic, and it (perhaps intentionally) misses the big picture of what is going on here. This conflict boils down to a people resisting blatantly genocidal imperialism from a state that denies they have a right to exist, steals and indoctrinates hundreds of thousands of their children, uses their men from occupied territory as cannon fodder, rapes their women as a matter of policy, uses them as forced labor, runs numerous torture chambers in occupied territory, etc. Zelensky is a temporary executive of the will of the people (in before the inevitable "Zelensky is a dictator who banned all future elections!!!!1!!1!!!1"). Focusing in on him obfuscates the reality of the situation. |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 2:04:25 AM EDT
[Last Edit: RockNwood]
[#45]
I totally missed the significance of the unit number (205th) that was abandon on the islands in the Dniper near Kherson. Justice served, bitches! And perhaps being the focus of war crimes Putin is OK with them being eliminated. Everyone but the tsar is a patsy-in-waiting.
This isn’t the fierce, seasoned leadership they had hoped to nurture; it’s an unstable structure waiting to crumble. These new wave commanders, blinded by greed, are diverting humanitarian aid for personal gain. They’re sending ill-prepared soldiers into the field, deprived of ammunition and cover. It’s not the strategic error of novices; it’s sheer recklessness. The enemy’s morale is plummeting. After the incident with Prigozhin and the actions of Wagner’s group, there’s a sense of dread permeating their ranks. The March for Justice may have provided them temporary respite, but our intelligence indicates that fear runs deep now. They’re on a precipice, and any further push could lead to their implosion. Stay sharp. Their desperation might make them unpredictable, but their fear gives us the upper hand. The game is in our favor. Let’s play it to win
They have recorded a desperate message to their commanders, threatening them with literal reprisals. 🪖Shouting won't help you. Due to your extremely inspiring despair, I will outline your thoughts and capture them for generations to come. As your blood sinks and dissolves in the water that will become your grave. |
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MI, USA
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Posted: 8/26/2023 2:04:57 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jaehaerys: Anyone boiling down the pro-Ukrainian position to supporting 'what is best for Zelensky' is being inherently dishonest and deceitful, which I suppose shouldn't be surprising at this point. Overall, the focus on Zelensky from the right is absurdly moronic, and it (perhaps intentionally) misses the big picture of what is going on here. This conflict boils down to a people resisting blatantly genocidal imperialism from a state that denies they have a right to exist, steals and indoctrinates hundreds of thousands of their children, uses their men from occupied territory as cannon fodder, rapes their women as a matter of policy, uses them as forced labor, runs numerous torture chambers in occupied territory, etc. Zelensky is a temporary executive of the will of the people (in before the inevitable "Zelensky is a dictator who banned all future elections!!!!1!!1!!!1"). Focusing in on him obfuscates the reality of the situation. The reality of the situation is that the US is funneling billions of dollars of unaudited dollars into a country that paid Hunter millions of unaudited dollars. America has much more pressing concerns. The war in Ukraine could be over this afternoon if they agreed to give up some bits that no Ukranian gives a fuck about. But I guess Nuland's opinion should drive the fate of the region? |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 2:06:38 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Tomislav: Anyone basing their opinion of someone's qualification for being POTUS on 'what is best for Zelensky' is fucked in the head. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Tomislav: Originally Posted By Capta: Originally Posted By Jozsi: Originally Posted By RockNwood: Originally Posted By kpacman: Originally Posted By RockNwood: I don’t follow much of the R churn yet but saw this video exchange and was impressed that the crowd seemed to be cheering strongly for Haley’s points about Putin and Ukraine aid. Feel free to correct my impression if you follow this more than I.
I thought Nikki did a great job exposing Vivek's lack of international knowledge. Nikki was UN ambassador, so she just ran circles around Vivek, especially regarding the Ukraine issue. Vivek's proposal is to freeze the lines as they are. Allow Russia to keep the territory they have seized in return for a pledge to cease all hostilities. This also comes with a promise to Russia that Ukraine WON'T be allowed to join NATO. WTF? So Vivek’s policy would be Give Russia everything it wants and hope for the best? He is either an idiot or compromised to Russia. Glad he got soundly ridiculed. NO! Vivek is a businessman just like Trump, it's all about wheeling and dealing and that is what he thinks on how Russia can be treated. I disagree. He’s either …completely clueless on the situation 18 months in. …pandering to the what he thinks is the TRUMP demographic of “if Biden supports it, it must be bad!” …a weak man who has allowed others to determine his moral compass. None of these make a case for him to be president. Anyone basing their opinion of someone's qualification for being POTUS on 'what is best for Zelensky' is fucked in the head. where was that even stated???  .. Zelensky wasnt even mentioned, Stopping russian aggresion was the topic, Not your made up imaginary statement "whats best for zelensky" bs
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Posted: 8/26/2023 2:06:56 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Jaehaerys: Anyone boiling down the pro-Ukrainian position to supporting 'what is best for Zelensky' is being inherently dishonest and deceitful, which I suppose shouldn't be surprising at this point. Overall, the focus on Zelensky from the right is absurdly moronic, and it (perhaps intentionally) misses the big picture of what is going on here. This conflict boils down to a people resisting blatantly genocidal imperialism from a state that denies they have a right to exist, steals and indoctrinates hundreds of thousands of their children, uses their men from occupied territory as cannon fodder, rapes their women as a matter of policy, uses them as forced labor, runs numerous torture chambers in occupied territory, etc. Zelensky is a temporary executive of the will of the people (in before the inevitable "Zelensky is a dictator who banned all future elections!!!!1!!1!!!1"). Focusing in on him obfuscates the reality of the situation. Some people are fine with genocide and tyrants. |
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Posted: 8/26/2023 2:08:07 AM EDT
[Last Edit: AROKIE]
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Tomislav: The reality of the situation is that the US is funneling billions of dollars of unaudited dollars into a country that paid Hunter millions of unaudited dollars. America has much more pressing concerns. The war in Ukraine could be over this afternoon if they agreed to give up some bits that no Ukranian gives a fuck about. But I guess Nuland's opinion should drive the fate of the region? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Tomislav: Originally Posted By Jaehaerys: Anyone boiling down the pro-Ukrainian position to supporting 'what is best for Zelensky' is being inherently dishonest and deceitful, which I suppose shouldn't be surprising at this point. Overall, the focus on Zelensky from the right is absurdly moronic, and it (perhaps intentionally) misses the big picture of what is going on here. This conflict boils down to a people resisting blatantly genocidal imperialism from a state that denies they have a right to exist, steals and indoctrinates hundreds of thousands of their children, uses their men from occupied territory as cannon fodder, rapes their women as a matter of policy, uses them as forced labor, runs numerous torture chambers in occupied territory, etc. Zelensky is a temporary executive of the will of the people (in before the inevitable "Zelensky is a dictator who banned all future elections!!!!1!!1!!!1"). Focusing in on him obfuscates the reality of the situation. The reality of the situation is that the US is funneling billions of dollars of unaudited dollars into a country that paid Hunter millions of unaudited dollars. America has much more pressing concerns. The war in Ukraine could be over this afternoon if they agreed to give up some bits that no Ukranian gives a fuck about. But I guess Nuland's opinion should drive the fate of the region? thats another false statement... ffs man learn some facts.. Ukraine aid is the most Audited aid ever given to any country in the history of the USA foriegn aid this country has the ability to deal with those "more pressing" concerns, but FJB doesnt do it. Its not because of foreign aid going to Ukraine, ffs
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Posted: 8/26/2023 2:09:33 AM EDT
[#50]
Please don't feed the trolls.
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