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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - FoldAR - Rolling Review (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 4/22/2019 2:44:49 AM EDT
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I know there are already TWO threads in this section on this product, but this is going to be a rolling review so I didn't want to dump it in the middle of another thread.
So before we get started, let's link to the original threads: And for any of you that want links to find out more: OVERVIEW This post will be part 1, an initial look at the FoldAR including description, images, and a video shot with the manufacturer. Due to length, range testing will be a separate post coming soon. First up, you might as well watch the video as there are many questions answered there, as well as a good overview of the product:  FoldAR - Folding AR-15 Upper and Double Fold AR The FoldAR is in my opinion one of the more innovative ideas to come to the AR platform in a long while. For this reason, we will spend a good amount of time talking about it here. Let's start with the concept: the ability to fit an AR in a small space. This is ideal for storage and transport. And the unique feature here is that the AR is not taken apart in any way. There are no parts that can fall out or get lost, and deploying it is simple and quick. So whether you are on a boat, motorcycle, or backpack when hiking, the ability to store an AR in a smaller space than is typically required can come in handy. The FoldAR comes in two configurations, though in reality the product itself is the folding AR upper. A 16" barreled AR-15 can fit in a package that is barely 18" long, which makes it ideal for many of the spaces described above. This is what they call the "single fold." There is a configuration that uses a 3rd party folding stock for a second fold, but this is only really applicable for an SBR or pistol using a short barrel. It allows the package to fold into 3 sections. Let's describe this one first as it is the "party trick," and then we'll dive back into the folding upper. (note: images below of a double fold are of a 9" 300BLK SBR/MG - remember all NFA rules apply) Here is a double fold AR showing how/where it folds: 
Here is that package fully folded: 
And here are a couple of images of the package fully open: 
This is the Dead Foot Arms DFA Modified Cycle System that allows for the second (lower receiver) fold: 
And below is an image of the folding upper itself, and how the parts are mated. Note the beveled barrel extension, as well as the split gas tube: 
Lastly, a quick shot of the double fold AR in a case to show how compact an entire kit and a couple of hundred rounds of ammo can be: 
DEAD FOOT ARMS MODIFIED CYCLE SYSTEM When we take a look at the Dead Foot Arms Modified Cycle System for rifle calibers, we see that it consists of 4 parts: the modified M-16 Style Bolt Carrier Group, plunger, and recoil and buffer springs. Together these work to shorten the cycle length of the AR, and unlike other folding systems, it does not depend on a folded out stock. So looking at the components: 
And when assembled, it would be in this configuration: 
The key here is the modified bolt carrier, and here we can see the extent of the modification: 
What you end up with is a short carrier, and then a buffer spring and buffer that are guided by the plunger/rear cap. Disassembly of this system requires that you remove the end cap, and then the springs and buffer can come out the back, allowing the user to then open the receivers in the normal manner. This Modified Cycle System is implemented in several products from Dead Foot Arms and is available in rifle caliber and pistol caliber versions. These include the right folding stock adaptor shown above, as well as a left hand folding version (which would not work with the foldAR product). This product allows the user to use any stock system they want, but DFA makes a T-Rex 5 position collapsible stock (shown above) as well as a G-Rex pistol brace. The beauty of this system is that it is truly a shorter cycle, so it can be fired with the stock folded. There is also a non-folding short cycle system which is all of the above without the ability to fold, so just a very short receiver extension. The Bolt carrier used is a modified standard full auto bolt carrier, which they will sell with the above products, or they offer a service to modify yours. WITH MAXIM DEFENSE PISTOL BRACE So based on demand from this thread, below are images of the 9" FoldAR upper on a lower with a Maxim Defense adjustable pistol brace. TLDR; IT WORKS. So let's start with the upper folded, here's what it looks like with the brace all the way in and the 9" barrel: 
View from the top: 
And from the bottom: 
Now the hand guard does touch the QD mount on the brace as visible above. It doesn't prevent the upper from folding all the way, but there is contact. Here's a close-up: 
Lastly here's what it looks like deployed: 
And here it is with a human for reference: 
Overall it's a good fit, and the lower is just about an inch and a half? longer than the 9" barrel. So a 12 or 12.5" barrel would be too long for this. If I were going to do a pistol build, I think this is the way to go: Maxim brace with 9" barrel. The difference between this and a Dead Foot Arms system (folding or the short pistol receiver extension) is that you are using a regular, unmodified bolt carrier group. Takedown doesn't require anything more than manipulating the takedown pin, and you don't have the thickness of a double fold version. For comparison, here it is with a 12.5" barrel for comparison. 
FOLDAR UPPER (coming shortly) RANGE REPORT (coming soon) If anyone has specific questions or want to see something discussed which is not here, feel free to post or IM and we'll do our best to address. |
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I can personally attest to the outstanding Dead Foot Arms part of this firearm assembly. I sold several of the DFA MCSs through my shop and own/use a couple my self. Latest iteration is on my side charging 9mm AR9. It is now a braced AR9. The DFA unit is very well made with zero wiggle, a requirement for me when it comes to folding stocks. No experience with any of the front end stuff......yet. Is it sold separately.......guess I'll go read the ad copy and find out. ETA: Ouch. |
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Looking at it, yes. The rods will ride below the folded upper, just above the safety. I'm interested in a 12.5" folding upper to pair with a Maxim for a roughly flush fold in half package that uses a standard BCG. |
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I want to pre-order the 9” but it looks like the only option is for a stainless barrel behind the flash hider? That’s a deal breaker for me. Bummer. |
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@Kuraki - any plans to go forward with a FoldAR grendel build? If so, what parts will you use? I'm assuming you will want magnified optics, will you go ACOG style to keep the optic from protruding past the fold point? The way it looks to me right now is that to get what I want, I'd have to order a long barrel, cut it down, then deal with the lack of material for a new shoulder by either making a muzzle device that bottoms out on the muzzle, or by silver soldering a sleeve, or, figure out how to disassemble it and just replace the barrel with the one I want (I have no idea if this is using standard AR barrels and extensions?). $1k for an upper that I then have to modify to get what I want isn't real high on my list of things to do. What I really wish is that (and again I don't know if the design allows for it) that they'd sell the upper and folding mechanism/rail for people to assemble with the barrel of their choice for ~$600. But I would really like a 12" 6.5 Grendel with a Maxim CQB stock, and I have a TA11 I could throw on it for the time being, eventually upgrade that to an ATACR 1-8x which is receiver length or damn near. ETA: This is not a criticism of FoldAR in any way. I've been a fan since he posted his first prototype and think it's brilliant. |
| Yeah, it sucks it couldn't be made with a standard barrel extension. That would make it far easier put your choice of barrel in. But I understand why they're using the tapered extension that lets the fold work. I wonder if they would sell the extension seperately or let you custom order a barrel. |
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I wouldn't recommend a 12.5" Grendel, as that caliber is best suited for 16"-20" barrels. 300BLK or 6.8SPC would be much better in 12.5".
We have a basic drawing of the barrel critical dimensions in the manual: https://foldar.com/download.php?file_id=809 at page 38. This is for people who wish to have a custom barrel fitted. Unfortunately, you still have to buy the complete upper. Existing customers will have the option to have their qualified gunsmith use the extension from the factory barrel to turn a custom barrel, or order an extension from us, given stock availability. We wont sell extensions to prospective customers however. |
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I wouldn't recommend a 12.5" Grendel, as that caliber is best suited for 16"-20" barrels. 300BLK or 6.8SPC would be much better in 12.5". We have a basic drawing of the barrel critical dimensions in the manual: https://foldar.com/download.php?file_id=809 at page 38. This is for people who wish to have a custom barrel fitted. Unfortunately, you still have to buy the complete upper. Existing customers will have the option to have their qualified gunsmith use the extension from the factory barrel to turn a custom barrel, or order an extension from us, given stock availability. We wont sell extensions to prospective customers however. Ok I'm in. With that drawing I can do the machine work. What actually retains the barrel in the forearm? I'm not seeing on the drawing. Are 18" Grendels going to be available through Brownell's? Otherwise I'll order a .223 and just buy a BCG for 6.5 separately. Understand completely your sales decisions. |
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Oh, wait, 13/16-16...
That's standard extension thread pitch right? Brownells is selling Saturn 6.5 Grendel barrels with a bolt. 18" mid length gas. So I could buy a 16" .223 FoldAR, and that Grendel barrel, and all I have to do is swap extensions and time/headspace after cutting to length. |
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@jaqufrost here's my parts list. Going on my SBR lower. Orders placed. Hoping I can reuse the .223 barrel. We'll see. From Brownells Attached File From OpticsPlanet Attached File |
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Very nice! Figured out the muzzle device/suppressor side of it yet? I'm thinking a Nomad with a Plan A/short comp might work well. Can't find a photo atm but here's a screenshot of the model. It's a ratchet like AAC. Attached File However down the road here I will likely be making a shorter, lighter TI can that is QD on A2 flash hiders. |
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Interesting. 1.5" OD? Any clips on your baffles? But I did actually have the opportunity to have this can professionally metered on a 16" .308 and 8" .300 blackout (subs) and it was pretty comparable to cans you can buy. Cones aren't the best for subs IMO but I shoot subs the least anyway. This mostly gets .308 and 6.5x55 shot out of it. |
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Added photo of 12.5" barrel for comparison with the Maxim/FoldAR above. The 12.5" was almost exactly to the back of the brace, so take away the extra .5" and add 1" for a short muzzle device, and you'll be just over the lower's length. I can't wait to get this thing built. Then find a case that'll hold the gun, optic, can and a mag or two. |
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Oh, wait, 13/16-16... That's standard extension thread pitch right? Brownells is selling Saturn 6.5 Grendel barrels with a bolt. 18" mid length gas. So I could buy a 16" .223 FoldAR, and that Grendel barrel, and all I have to do is swap extensions and time/headspace after cutting to length. Have to make sure the gas block location on the barrel you buy is set up for mid-length. |
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Received mine today. I dunno what these humps are on the bottom face of the upper. Look like tool path error.
Attached File But they won't allow the receiver to close and have to go away. See how they're making contact with the lower above the mag well? Attached File |
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No problem it's only aluminum. Attached File Ok that's better. Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached File |
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Received mine today. I dunno what these humps are on the bottom face of the upper. Look like tool path error. But they won't allow the receiver to close and have to go away. See how they're making contact with the lower above the mag well? 
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Quoted: I guess you should have watched the video... those bumps are tensioners to prevent any wiggle between upper and lower. Just have to press upper and lower together... |
Picked up 2 of these a couple weeks ago. a 9" .300 double fold and a 14.5" .223 wylde single fold. It's crazy how fast these deploy from a case or bag. I used a shot timer with the double fold and was always right under 10 seconds from zipped up bag to shot on target.
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The ACOG fit perfectly in the case it came in, could probably even fit a 1-6x24. I wanted to stay light because I thought the rifle would be heavy, but it's surprisingly light.  " />
Shoots pretty well too. I didn't have much time to set up targets or have a full range day, was just doing work at the ranch this weekend and only had an hour to get some trigger time. here's some groups while I was zeroing with bulk AE XM193 resting on the steering wheel of a polaris with 4x ACOG.  " />
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Not on my lower. It wasn't possible. I left them proud, so it's under tension, just in case that was intentional. But I couldn't get them closed if I laid on it. We use only Aero's lowers and all our stuff fits on all their stuff. But in these few cases of not fitting particular lowers (even when squeezing tight) here is what FoldAR suggests considering when contacting us: -We will sell an Aero lower to our existing customers who are having a fit problem for $40 (they are normally $90). This offsets the shipping cost on an RMA that might not even be helpful. -For customers who dont want the lower but still need a fix, we can swap the upper component with parts that are currently in production )which lowers the humps a little and lowers the rear takedown slot a little), in order to fit the other-branded tight lowers better. These wont be ready for another month or so. |
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Quoted: We have started to see some of the uppers being too tight of a fit on some lowers. We use only Aero's lowers and all our stuff fits on all their stuff. But in these few cases of not fitting particular lowers (even when squeezing tight) here is what FoldAR suggests considering when contacting us: -We will sell an Aero lower to our existing customers who are having a fit problem for $40 (they are normally $90). This offsets the shipping cost on an RMA that might not even be helpful. -For customers who dont want the lower but still need a fix, we can swap the upper component with parts that are currently in production )which lowers the humps a little and lowers the rear takedown slot a little), in order to fit the other-branded tight lowers better. These wont be ready for another month or so. This lower is my oldest SBR lower and is tight with most uppers. Now that Eforms is back I should just get a couple more Aero lowers registered as SBRs. |
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I have been looking at these for a little while.
I either am going to get a 16” double folder which I think equals a setup with a total length of right at 18” Os that true? I have a 300 std. upper already and installed a laws tactical folder on it. But a 9inch 300 with a pistol receiver and brace may be doable. Currently I do not have a lower receiver designated as a pistol to use the short barrel setup My secret wish is for a 10mm double folder with a brace- I do worry the brace decision could be revoked anytime and am a bit nervous about being left with a SBR and having to run it thru the F4 WAITING PERIOD. Ugh So for everyone buying barrels for these that are under 16” ya’ll are all going to form 1 them to SBR-Is that correct? I want to buy one of these that double fold, the latest iteration, that fires when folded. Has the cracking of a few gas blocks been studied and changes made yet? That worries me most. Can the FoldAR gas block be replaced with an adjustable gas block? IF so which would ya’ll recommend Mark |
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I have been looking at these for a little while. I either am going to get a 16” double folder which I think equals a setup with a total length of right at 18” Os that true? Quoted:
I have been looking at these for a little while. I either am going to get a 16” double folder which I think equals a setup with a total length of right at 18” Os that true? Quoted:
So for everyone buying barrels for these that are under 16” ya’ll are all going to form 1 them to SBR-Is that correct? Quoted:
I want to buy one of these that double fold, the latest iteration, that fires when folded. Quoted:
Has the cracking of a few gas blocks been studied and changes made yet? Going forward, we are going to start making our own low profile gasblocks with materials and features we can control. I am looking at integrating a gas adjustment screw in it, but no determination on that just yet. Quoted:
Can the FoldAR gas block be replaced with an adjustable gas block? IF so which would ya’ll recommend I think some chinese source is making some similar low profile gasblocks, but I wouldnt recommend using those at all. |
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Well here's mine all buttoned up. I stuck with the 223 barrel and just cut and threaded it so muzzle attachments bottom out on the crown. At this length I had to open the gas port a bit. But I like it, a lot.
Attached File Attached File |
Hey I bought the 9inch 300 blk upper back in April. I really like it and run it on a custom registered SBR with a Surefire 300 SPS, a Geissele sd-3g trigger, and JP silent capture spring H2 with bi tone red and black parts.
The big problem I ran into is that the upper wouldn't install on my 3 lowers. The back takedown pin wouldn't go in no matter what. I tried it on a Rainer Arms. smith M&P and a Serbu all registered SBRs lowers. 
I got it to work on my Serbu lower by filing the upper rear take down. I still have to push down some on the upper for it to seat. Im worried this might be bad in the long term. I guess after waiting 2 years to finish the build I was just in the zone to get it up and running before I moved and fire season shuts down shooting in the desert. I've shot 100 rounds suppressed through the upper. Its never had a failure to function. It can cycle Hornady subsonic without the can. 
What do yall think about the rear takedown slot on the upper? |
[ARCHIVED THREAD] - FoldAR - Rolling Review (Page 1 of 2)
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