Hey all, just finished two interpretations from JT. i know the actual versions that should go with these builds, but i like chrome BCGs, i like triangle hand guards, i like forward assists, and i like partial fence lowers, so if you don't like it, go pound sand!

John Thomas is really a master. His work was flawless and quick. Thanks for everything JT!

605:
Colt NOS upper
A2 gadsen lower

177:
NDS upper and lower (partial fence)
JT brown mottle handguard and grip
Essential arms CAR stock
Brick moderator

Nice.  Different, but nice.



I like the 605 despite the FA. lol

M R Nice!   I'd expect no less from JT.

Thanks ya'll. Actually the XM177-inspired looks way better without the light, but it's my new bedside so I figured I should throw a torch on there. Went with the classic surefire barrel clamp, so it's like a XM177 that absorbed 607 handguards and lower receiver, made it to the late 1980s/early 1990s and took on flashlight...? Heck if I know!

I was surprised at how much I liked the 605 maybe even more than the 177. That thing handles like a dream, and I love the long forearm.



JT's work really is second to none; not just as a retro-builder, but as a builder in general. His pins and welds was by far nicer than MANY builders whose work I have seen, some even on this forum. Plus he's just an all around good dude.

Cheers

Very nice, I really like the XM177 !

Two nice looking rifles you have there.  The 605 is my next build,  I've always liked the looks of that rifle/carbine.

I am going to use a 16" Mid--Length Gas System Barrel, have the barrel shortened and threaded so it comes out to like 16.1" at the end of the 3 Prong Flash Hider.  Is that what you did?

Yes, very much so. He's a great asset to the retro community.

I really dig the 177. And i approve the building it how you want it. To me theres nothing wrong with doing a variation on a theme. Great job!

Hey Chief, I originally suggested that and JT suggested buying a rifle length gas system barrel and cutting it down to 15+ and pin and welding to 16". i'm VERY glad i listened to him. two things, 1) if you go with a separate FSB and gas block (e.g. middy or carbine) when you look down the top of the hand guard you'll see either half a gas tube or less. I like looking down the top of the holes in that flimsy triangle handguard and seeing that bright shinning silver tube of glory running all the way back; just seems right, natural...you know ;)
2) from what i've seen if you go middy you have to remove a chunk of the heat shield, which i was NOT happy to do for the obvious reasons of integrity and heat insulation. i'm not sure if you go carbine length gas system if you have to remove part of the heat shield (since the handguard is tapered), but it will look funny with respect to the gas tube.

I originally bought a McKay 1/7 20" pencil to be cut down but i was unhappy with it, so i bought a 20" bcm heavy and used that. accuracy is outstanding.since it is so short, the only way you know it's a heavy is by looking at the FSB; i was happy to know i got quality head spacing, barrel construction. my 605 runs like a top.

both look great, I love the 177 as well and need to post pics of mine

You have to remove an area of heat shield on a carbine gas barrel as well, I ran a pseudo 605 with a BM Dissy barrel and Morg hooked me up with handgaurds that had heat shields already cut. I got a 20" Colt C MP C barrel that was from a ban state and poorly modded to use for a real 605 barrel.

one more of the 177 hanging out with me in my library while doing some work. got my sayeret sling on there, so now it's part Sabra?
http://i813.photobucket.com/albums/zz54/makabi24/IMG_0787.jpg

What barrell did you use for the 177 ? Also  how good are the triangle  handguards / where did you get them I've seen about  three places selling them  don't know if there any differences .

daniel defense 12.5" lightweight (pencil). i got the PKfirearms triangle carbine length. the finish on them is dull plastic, which doesn't look as good as the cut down A1 triangles, but they are very sturdy. They look beautiful and shinny and textured with JT's brown mottle on there. I wasn't too keen on their aesthetics out of the box. They are much more rigid than my triangle handguards on the 605 and lockup nice with none of that rattle or play.

Dude those look awesome!

I love the look!  I'm in the middle of the same build .sorry for the 20 questions  im trying to pick a barrel did you have to shorten the barrel or does it work as is ?What did your barrel measurement come out to from bolt  face to end ? Thanks Ricky

No need to apologize, bud. There is a 2-D engineering drawing floating around here from Brick, but if i remember correctly, with the grenade ring and moderator threaded down, it should come out to 16", maybe 16.1"?, with a 12.5" barrel. If you don't find it, later tonight I'll look around for the image for you. Cheers

So you used a 20" heavy barrel and just cut it down.  Do you know if the gas port needed to be opened up?  I've read somewhere over the years that you may need to open the port for reliability.  But if not then this changes my whole plan.  I have a nice hbar that's just begging to be used.



eta For the 605.

Yes I have that . it says 12.77 barrel length that's what has me confused  about a  12.5 barrel working . Also Did you use the hand guard cap that came with the pk kit it says its .750 ? I thought the dd barrel was .625 at gas block?  Thanks

Good question. So the 12.776" barrel gives you a 16.59" barrel length, but what we're interested in is the BATF form of measurement, which becomes 16.25". Add 0.1" for grenade ring and about 0.05" for washer and that's about 16.4" with a 12.776" barrel. Subtract 0.276" for a 12.5" barrel and you get 16.124". I measured mine with a rod down the pipe on a closed bolt and got close to 16 1/4" (just under) with a 1/8" increment 18" ruler (remeasured, since I didn't like the accuracy of a tailor's tape). My ring measured thicker than his spec with a caliper. Although my moderator measured slightly under. If you're concerned about cutting it so close you can always cut down a barrel or add a couple washers hidden under the grenade ring to lengthen it? I ordered a separate 0.625 triangle handguard cap like you said.

You're right on. The port is a whopping 0.110" diameter. There is zero indication of over gassing though. The ejection is perfect at 3oclock (if that really is an indication of anything anyway), no brass shavings, no malfunctions.

A couple folks asked me for pics of the brown mottling. I can't really take any that would capture the pattern of the finish. The best I can describe it is it looks like a beautiful brown marble.