Game of Thrones Season 3 *OFFICIAL THREAD* Major spoilers pg 98 on - Page 80

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Game of Thrones Season 3 *OFFICIAL THREAD* Major spoilers pg 98 on (Page 80 of 109)

Posted: 6/4/2013 10:20:46 AM EDT

[#1]

Posted: 6/4/2013 10:23:51 AM EDT

[#2]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Jaime is in the King's Guard, for life, and can never be married off.

I will say that Jaimie already has a precedent of running off and doing whatever he wants despite being in the Kingsguard. Is it within the purview of the Kingsguard to run off to fight in a war with your house against another? That's why he was captured in the first place. If he had been doing is job and honoring his oath to guard the king, he wouldn't have been captured and lost his hand.

The King's Guard has been used like the 75th Rangers for a long time. Where do you think Barristan and Jaime get their notoriety from? It's not from standing beside the Iron Throne and it's certainly not from tourneys.

Jaime running off to fight because the Starks kidnapped his brother, threatened his sister and Joffery absolutely fits his character and his charge to protect the crown. But those actions don't translate to him getting married.

DO NOT hit the spoiler box if you don't want a Spoiler!

Click To View Spoiler

Exactly! I just wanted to stay purely with what the show has portrayed to this point. Which is way more than enough evidence.

Posted: 6/4/2013 10:26:55 AM EDT

[#3]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Jaime is in the King's Guard, for life, and can never be married off. Remember Tywin threatening to place Loras in the King's Guard if he did not marry Cersei (i.e. my daughter or no one, ever) only 2 episodes ago?

Jaime has also said ad nauseum he loves Cersei. There has been no change in his character since S01E01 to add credence that he loves another woman. Remember this? "I've only ever been with one woman, which is more than I can say for the honorable Ned Stark."

Additionally, Jaime swore to Cat to return the Stark girls on the condition of his release. I do believe he will try to uphold that vow, but I doubt he would go so far as to partake in any Stark revenge killing plot.

For most people, yes.

However if Tywin and Joffrey declare that Jaime is out of the Kingsguard and is free to marry who is going to publicly oppose their decision?

And you don't think Jaime, just like his mentor Barristan (whom he squired for until he joined the ranks) would not throw a conniption in the main hall and then go into self exile?

I wasn't talking about what Jaime would or wouldn't do. I'm talking about how the kindsguard rules can easily be broken if you're the king or the most powerful man in the country.

Do you really believe Joffery made that decision all by himself? That was Cersei all day long.

Do you really believe Cersei will attempt to have her brother/lover separated from her side again? Why do you think she is protesting marrying Loras so hard? She loves Jaime and having him on the King's Guard keeps them close. Yea yea she fucked Lancel, but she has needs I guess.

Do you really believe Tywin can convince Joffery to do it? Tywin needs Jaime as the heir to Casterly Rock. He could have had Jaime removed when he was the Mad King's Hand. He didn't. He could have had Jaime removed when Robert took the throne. He didn't, he had over a decade to do it and he still won't do it.

All I said was Joffrey and Tywin could remove a member of the kingsguard if they wanted to. Are you disagreeing with that?

But since you brought it up: it was Varys suggestion to dismiss Ser Barristan. Not Cersei.

Posted: 6/4/2013 10:34:23 AM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Jaime is in the King's Guard, for life, and can never be married off. Remember Tywin threatening to place Loras in the King's Guard if he did not marry Cersei (i.e. my daughter or no one, ever) only 2 episodes ago?

Jaime has also said ad nauseum he loves Cersei. There has been no change in his character since S01E01 to add credence that he loves another woman. Remember this? "I've only ever been with one woman, which is more than I can say for the honorable Ned Stark."

Additionally, Jaime swore to Cat to return the Stark girls on the condition of his release. I do believe he will try to uphold that vow, but I doubt he would go so far as to partake in any Stark revenge killing plot.

For most people, yes.

However if Tywin and Joffrey declare that Jaime is out of the Kingsguard and is free to marry who is going to publicly oppose their decision?

And you don't think Jaime, just like his mentor Barristan (whom he squired for until he joined the ranks) would not throw a conniption in the main hall and then go into self exile?

I wasn't talking about what Jaime would or wouldn't do. I'm talking about how the kindsguard rules can easily be broken if you're the king or the most powerful man in the country.

Do you really believe Joffery made that decision all by himself? That was Cersei all day long.

Do you really believe Cersei will attempt to have her brother/lover separated from her side again? Why do you think she is protesting marrying Loras so hard? She loves Jaime and having him on the King's Guard keeps them close. Yea yea she fucked Lancel, but she has needs I guess.

Do you really believe Tywin can convince Joffery to do it? Tywin needs Jaime as the heir to Casterly Rock. He could have had Jaime removed when he was the Mad King's Hand. He didn't. He could have had Jaime removed when Robert took the throne. He didn't, he had over a decade to do it and he still won't do it.

All I said was Joffrey and Tywin could remove a member of the kingsguard if they wanted to. Are you disagreeing with that?

But since you brought it up: it was Varys suggestion to dismiss Ser Barristan. Not Cersei.

Could Joffery? Yes, because he is stupid.

Could Tywin? No, because he understands and even upholds, to the fullest extent allowed, the laws and customs of Westeros.

Was the Vary's piece portrayed in the show other than a few snide remarks from the small council? We can certainly talk the book piece as to why.

Posted: 6/4/2013 10:36:06 AM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
<a href="http://s1283.photobucket.com/user/RobertStevenson45/media/daf4270a-2abb-489c-86f6-1d34feb2bafb_zps3f470491.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i1283.photobucket.com/albums/a556/RobertStevenson45/daf4270a-2abb-489c-86f6-1d34feb2bafb_zps3f470491.jpg</a>

hahaha

Posted: 6/4/2013 10:39:38 AM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:

Get over yourself, nobody gives a crap. We like discussing the story (the whole story, the immersive universe, and everything that comes with it) and it's simply impossible to filter out every single detail that you might not know just because you've been too lazy/ignorant to pick up a book and read it any time in the last 17 years. Frankly having to walk on eggshells for you non-readers is more work than you're worth. If it weren't for the hilariously bad predictions I'd ignore every single one of you.

I bet you bitched about that Bible miniseries, too.

Click To View Spoiler

This thread is focused on the TV show.

The book thread is probably more along the lines of what you're looking for. It assumes everyone has read all the books, and everyone is free to discuss everything in the open.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_153/1491705_A_Song_of_ice_and_fire_MASSIVE_SPOILERS_THREAD_.html

Posted: 6/4/2013 10:43:22 AM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Do you really believe Joffery made that decision all by himself? That was Cersei all day long.

Do you really believe Cersei will attempt to have her brother/lover separated from her side again? Why do you think she is protesting marrying Loras so hard? She loves Jaime and having him on the King's Guard keeps them close. Yea yea she fucked Lancel, but she has needs I guess.

Do you really believe Tywin can convince Joffery to do it? Tywin needs Jaime as the heir to Casterly Rock. He could have had Jaime removed when he was the Mad King's Hand. He didn't. He could have had Jaime removed when Robert took the throne. He didn't, he had over a decade to do it and he still won't do it.

All I said was Joffrey and Tywin could remove a member of the kingsguard if they wanted to. Are you disagreeing with that?

But since you brought it up: it was Varys suggestion to dismiss Ser Barristan. Not Cersei.

Could Joffery? Yes, because he is stupid.

Could Tywin? No, because he understands and even upholds, to the fullest extent allowed, the laws and customs of Westeros.

Was the Vary's piece portrayed in the show other than a few snide remarks from the small council? We can certainly talk the book piece as to why.

So you believe the richest and most powerful man in the country couldn't remove a member of the kingsguard if he really wanted to?

I'm definitely going to have to disagree with you on that one.

It was Varys' suggestion to remove Ser Barristan from the kingsguard and Joffrey liked the idea because it opened up a spot for the Hound. It was not "Cersei all day long."

Posted: 6/4/2013 10:43:50 AM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:
http://24.media.tumblr.com/5e56b9d679cad402b792ffea9850b0ea/tumblr_mk9j66sgVg1rnbs1bo1_500.jpg

I would have started to sing the Rains of Castamere to him

Thatd be pretty awesome

Posted: 6/4/2013 10:45:59 AM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:

Quoted:

http://24.media.tumblr.com/5e56b9d679cad402b792ffea9850b0ea/tumblr_mk9j66sgVg1rnbs1bo1_500.jpg

I would have started to sing the Rains of Castamere to him

That'd be pretty awesome

He'd probably roll his eyes and say, "I've only heard that twenty times this week."

Posted: 6/4/2013 10:58:19 AM EDT

[#10]

Quoted:

Quoted:
http://24.media.tumblr.com/5e56b9d679cad402b792ffea9850b0ea/tumblr_mk9j66sgVg1rnbs1bo1_500.jpg

I would have started to sing the Rains of Castamere to him

That'd be pretty awesome

He'd probably roll his eyes and say, "I've only heard that twenty times this week."

Still worth it!

Posted: 6/4/2013 10:58:37 AM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:
I was sad of the puppy

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:04:49 AM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
Learning the history of the Lannister clan has really made me like them on the show a lot more than I did.

Cersei and Joffrey can FOAD. The rest of them are alright. I like how Jamie has sort of become Sawyer from LOST.

Most of the "bad" characters aren't as one dimensional as I believed they were in the beginning when I first started reading the books. You can imagine my horror when I started to like Jaime after everything he had done. Even Dog had grown on me.

Cersei and Joffrey? Absolutely no good qualities.

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:07:39 AM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Found this awesome interactive map. YOu can track the movements of individual characters throughout the books.

http://quartermaester.info/

If Robb was trying to get to Kings Landing to save Ned why did he even need to cross the river at the Twins?

If you zoom all the way out it kinda looks like Dany is attempting to draw Florida. Of course you have to move the bar all the way through ADWD-70.

Nobody even liked my joke.

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:08:56 AM EDT

[#14]

I told my wife that you book readers are saying that the next episode will be just as shocking. She looked genuinely scared.

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:12:18 AM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Do you really believe Joffery made that decision all by himself? That was Cersei all day long.

Do you really believe Cersei will attempt to have her brother/lover separated from her side again? Why do you think she is protesting marrying Loras so hard? She loves Jaime and having him on the King's Guard keeps them close. Yea yea she fucked Lancel, but she has needs I guess.

Do you really believe Tywin can convince Joffery to do it? Tywin needs Jaime as the heir to Casterly Rock. He could have had Jaime removed when he was the Mad King's Hand. He didn't. He could have had Jaime removed when Robert took the throne. He didn't, he had over a decade to do it and he still won't do it.

All I said was Joffrey and Tywin could remove a member of the kingsguard if they wanted to. Are you disagreeing with that?

But since you brought it up: it was Varys suggestion to dismiss Ser Barristan. Not Cersei.

Could Joffery? Yes, because he is stupid.

Could Tywin? No, because he understands and even upholds, to the fullest extent allowed, the laws and customs of Westeros.

Was the Vary's piece portrayed in the show other than a few snide remarks from the small council? We can certainly talk the book piece as to why.

So you believe the richest and most powerful man in the country couldn't remove a member of the kingsguard if he really wanted to?

I'm definitely going to have to disagree with you on that one.

It was Varys' suggestion to remove Ser Barristan from the kingsguard and Joffrey liked the idea because it opened up a spot for the Hound. It was not "Cersei all day long."

Using the book canon, yes I know it was Varys. I'm trying to stick with the show since we have the other thread now. Same with the Tywin bit.

Using that logic Tywin "could" do anything. Tywin 'could' kill Joffery and take the throne for himself. Tywon 'could' kill Loras. Tywin 'could' marry Margary and be the Hand, Warden of the West and Warden of the South. Tywin 'could' instruct Thoros to R'hollor Jon's ass and say "My bad! Just playing!"

But not as single one of those, or removing Jaime from his vows, fits in anyway to Tywin as we know him.

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:12:33 AM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Found this awesome interactive map. YOu can track the movements of individual characters throughout the books.

http://quartermaester.info/

If Robb was trying to get to Kings Landing to save Ned why did he even need to cross the river at the Twins?

If you zoom all the way out it kinda looks like Dany is attempting to draw Florida. Of course you have to move the bar all the way through ADWD-70.

Nobody even liked my joke.

She gets around for sure.

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:14:32 AM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:
I told my wife that you book readers are saying that the next episode will be just as shocking. She looked genuinely scared.

Tell her Dany gets eaten by her dragons because she can't warg.

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:20:23 AM EDT

[#18]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Ok one quick question, and remember I have not read the books.

I could see how things were shaping up for Robb to get betrayed or maybe killed in this last episode based on all the other stuff that had happened previously. Seems Bolton got bought off by the Lannisters, but did Lord Frey too? Didn't seem like he'd need the money. Why would Frey agree to go along with the Lannisters though? Hell when the King in the North asks for your help and essentially you have the majority power in that area, why would you necessarily rush at the chance to bend your knee to him? My point is, if Frey was going to have them killed why not do it for his own cause and claim lordship of all the north without the Lannisters involvement? Hell there's practically no real power force backing any sort of Stark claims in the north now.

Frey is a chicken shit bastard. His "honor" being wounded was used by Tywin and Bolton for there own ploy. Frey's goal was to hurt the Starks and better his position in the easiest way possible. Bolton convinced him the war was lost. No way that Frey would ever be so bold as to claim the North for himself unless everyone else is dead.

I get Frey's motivations. What I don't understand is why Frey thinks that the Lannisters will protect him and his family indefinitely. Like Tyrion says in the preview, the northerners will never forget, and eventually he and his family will be put to the knife (or worse) for what he did.

Boltons took his side. Karstarks are no friend of the Starks (currently) after that execution. Some will, some won't... just not enough to do anything. Besides, Winterfell is sacked and the Starks are all thought to be dead, save for Sansa. Mormont's are not too keen given the exile of Jorah over selling some slaves. Weatherlys are "meh" at best. They'll stick with the north but to march on the Twins? Do they even care? Besides, with the power vacuum in the North, everyone will be vying to control it with the Starks decimated.

Freys simply don't have much to worry about. They're going to marry off a bunch of ladies and be tied to all sorts of houses now, they control the river and path north, they'll get rich from the Lannisters... they don't need "protection" especially since they're in the south and they've just made a bunch of strategic moves to secure their house in the south.

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:24:01 AM EDT

[#19]

Quoted:
Using the book canon, yes I know it was Varys. I'm trying to stick with the show since we have the other thread now. Same with the Tywin bit.

Using that logic Tywin "could" do anything. Tywin 'could' kill Joffery and take the throne for himself. Tywon 'could' kill Loras. Tywin 'could' marry Margary and be the Hand, Warden of the West and Warden of the South. Tywin 'could' instruct Thoros to R'hollor Jon's ass and say "My bad! Just playing!"

But not as single one of those, or removing Jaime from his vows, fits in anyway to Tywin as we know him.

In the books it was Varys suggestion to Joffrey that removed Ser Barristan from the kingsguard and there is absolutely nothing to suggest that wasn't the case on the show so I have no idea how you reached the conclusion that decision was "Cersei all day long."

I said Tywin could remove a member of the kingsguard if he really wanted to. I never said Tywin could do ANYTHING he wanted.

Click To View Spoiler

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:34:32 AM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Found this awesome interactive map. YOu can track the movements of individual characters throughout the books.

http://quartermaester.info/

If Robb was trying to get to Kings Landing to save Ned why did he even need to cross the river at the Twins?

If you zoom all the way out it kinda looks like Dany is attempting to draw Florida. Of course you have to move the bar all the way through ADWD-70.

Nobody even liked my joke.

It's a little hard to keep up with this thread now.

I go away for a few hours and I'm 3 pages behind.

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:35:58 AM EDT

[#21]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Using the book canon, yes I know it was Varys. I'm trying to stick with the show since we have the other thread now. Same with the Tywin bit.

Using that logic Tywin "could" do anything. Tywin 'could' kill Joffery and take the throne for himself. Tywon 'could' kill Loras. Tywin 'could' marry Margary and be the Hand, Warden of the West and Warden of the South. Tywin 'could' instruct Thoros to R'hollor Jon's ass and say "My bad! Just playing!"

But not as single one of those, or removing Jaime from his vows, fits in anyway to Tywin as we know him.

In the books it was Varys suggestion to Joffrey that removed Ser Barristan from the kingsguard and there is absolutely nothing to suggest that wasn't the case on the show so I have no idea how you reached the conclusion that decision was "Cersei all day long."

I said Tywin could remove a member of the kingsguard if he really wanted to. I never said Tywin could do ANYTHING he wanted.

Click To View Spoiler

Then I'll reiterate my previous point again. Tywin has had more than enough time (15 years at least) as a two time Hand, or even a petition to Robert, to have Jaime removed.

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:38:33 AM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Learning the history of the Lannister clan has really made me like them on the show a lot more than I did.

Cersei and Joffrey can FOAD. The rest of them are alright. I like how Jamie has sort of become Sawyer from LOST.

Most of the "bad" characters aren't as one dimensional as I believed they were in the beginning when I first started reading the books. You can imagine my horror when I started to like Jaime after everything he had done. Even Dog had grown on me.

Cersei and Joffrey? Absolutely no good qualities.

Exactly. Dog too.

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:39:25 AM EDT

[#23]

One thing to keep in mind is that the overall plot line is the literal GAME OF THRONES. And I think what GRRM is making clear is that the game is full of treachery and strategy - anyone that tries to play the game of thrones with honor is going to fail miserably.

He's driven that home with Robb Stark - who won every single battle (great tactician) but lost the war (failed to see the major mistakes he was making with Karstark and Jayne/Talisa and such). Those that set up the Red Wedding are much better at the game of thrones...

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:43:34 AM EDT

[#24]

So...What happens between Arya and the Hound? Does he take her under his wing and train her or does she want to go to the place where that one guy is who helped her escape from that busted ass castle?

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:47:56 AM EDT

[#25]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Using the book canon, yes I know it was Varys. I'm trying to stick with the show since we have the other thread now. Same with the Tywin bit.

Using that logic Tywin "could" do anything. Tywin 'could' kill Joffery and take the throne for himself. Tywon 'could' kill Loras. Tywin 'could' marry Margary and be the Hand, Warden of the West and Warden of the South. Tywin 'could' instruct Thoros to R'hollor Jon's ass and say "My bad! Just playing!"

But not as single one of those, or removing Jaime from his vows, fits in anyway to Tywin as we know him.

In the books it was Varys suggestion to Joffrey that removed Ser Barristan from the kingsguard and there is absolutely nothing to suggest that wasn't the case on the show so I have no idea how you reached the conclusion that decision was "Cersei all day long."

I said Tywin could remove a member of the kingsguard if he really wanted to. I never said Tywin could do ANYTHING he wanted.

Click To View Spoiler

Then I'll reiterate my previous point again. Tywin has had more than enough time (15 years at least) as a two time Hand, or even a petition to Robert, to have Jaime removed.

Click To View Spoiler

You also claimed that the decision to remove Ser Barristan from the kingsguard was "Cersei all day long." I'm curious how you reached that conclusion considering that's not what happened in the books and, if IIRC, there's nothing on the show that supports your claim.

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:49:13 AM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:
So...What happens between Arya and the Hound? Does he take her under his wing and train her or does she want to go to the place where that one guy is who helped her escape from that busted ass castle?

They end up getting married and open a mom and pop general store on the king's road.

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:49:59 AM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:

Quoted:

So...What happens between Arya and the Hound? Does he take her under his wing and train her or does she want to go to the place where that one guy is who helped her escape from that busted ass castle?

They end up getting married and open a mom and pop general store on the king's road.

Fuck Yeah!!!!! I hope they have a litter of little mutts too!

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:52:36 AM EDT

[#28]

Quoted:

Quoted:
So...What happens between Arya and the Hound? Does he take her under his wing and train her or does she want to go to the place where that one guy is who helped her escape from that busted ass castle?

They end up getting married and open a mom and pop general store on the king's road.

Fuck Yeah!!!!! I hope they have a litter of little mutts too!

It's smooth sailing for a while, but then Sansa shows up needing a place to stay. She starts having an affair with the Hound and when Arya finds out...... well, I don't want to ruin the surprise.

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:57:38 AM EDT

[#29]

Quoted:

Quoted:

So...What happens between Arya and the Hound? Does he take her under his wing and train her or does she want to go to the place where that one guy is who helped her escape from that busted ass castle?

They end up getting married and open a mom and pop general store on the king's road.

Fuck Yeah!!!!! I hope they have a litter of little mutts too!

It's smooth sailing for a while, but then Sansa shows up needing a place to stay. She starts having an affair with the Hound and when Arya finds out...... well, I don't want to ruin the surprise.

Fucking Home wreckers!!!

Posted: 6/4/2013 11:58:42 AM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Ok one quick question, and remember I have not read the books.

I could see how things were shaping up for Robb to get betrayed or maybe killed in this last episode based on all the other stuff that had happened previously. Seems Bolton got bought off by the Lannisters, but did Lord Frey too? Didn't seem like he'd need the money. Why would Frey agree to go along with the Lannisters though? Hell when the King in the North asks for your help and essentially you have the majority power in that area, why would you necessarily rush at the chance to bend your knee to him? My point is, if Frey was going to have them killed why not do it for his own cause and claim lordship of all the north without the Lannisters involvement? Hell there's practically no real power force backing any sort of Stark claims in the north now.

Frey is a chicken shit bastard. His "honor" being wounded was used by Tywin and Bolton for there own ploy. Frey's goal was to hurt the Starks and better his position in the easiest way possible. Bolton convinced him the war was lost. No way that Frey would ever be so bold as to claim the North for himself unless everyone else is dead.

I get Frey's motivations. What I don't understand is why Frey thinks that the Lannisters will protect him and his family indefinitely. Like Tyrion says in the preview, the northerners will never forget, and eventually he and his family will be put to the knife (or worse) for what he did.

Boltons took his side. Karstarks are no friend of the Starks (currently) after that execution. Some will, some won't... just not enough to do anything. Besides, Winterfell is sacked and the Starks are all thought to be dead, save for Sansa. Mormont's are not too keen given the exile of Jorah over selling some slaves. Weatherlys are "meh" at best. They'll stick with the north but to march on the Twins? Do they even care? Besides, with the power vacuum in the North, everyone will be vying to control it with the Starks decimated.

Freys simply don't have much to worry about. They're going to marry off a bunch of ladies and be tied to all sorts of houses now, they control the river and path north, they'll get rich from the Lannisters... they don't need "protection" especially since they're in the south and they've just made a bunch of strategic moves to secure their house in the south.

I don't see that happening.

They only way they've been able to marry them off has been through deals/payoffs; now, they're the enemies of anyone that is loyal to the Starks (and anyone that's an enemy of the Lannisters, when word gets out). Add to this the fact that they broke the sacred ritual of bread and salt, and you have a situation where no one will want to touch a Frey girl with a 10 meter pole.

I think that the "protection" offered to the Freys by the Lannisters will last just about as long as it takes for Tywin to decide he no longer needs them, or until he can comfortably take the Twins by force... which may be sooner rather than later, as he can now come into the Frey camp with an army and be welcomed as an ally.

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:06:01 PM EDT

[#31]

Quoted:

Quoted:

So...What happens between Arya and the Hound? Does he take her under his wing and train her or does she want to go to the place where that one guy is who helped her escape from that busted ass castle?

They end up getting married and open a mom and pop general store on the king's road.

Fuck Yeah!!!!! I hope they have a litter of little mutts too!

It's smooth sailing for a while, but then Sansa shows up needing a place to stay. She starts having an affair with the Hound and when Arya finds out...... well, I don't want to ruin the surprise.

Fucking Home wreckers!!!

Give em a break they come from a broken family

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:10:06 PM EDT

[#32]

Quoted:
So...What happens between Arya and the Hound? Does he take her under his wing and train her or does she want to go to the place where that one guy is who helped her escape from that busted ass castle?

My money is on... both. Maybe even an eventual alliance with Daenerys Targaryen. They share many of the same goals.

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:11:24 PM EDT

[#33]

Quoted:

Quoted:
So...What happens between Arya and the Hound? Does he take her under his wing and train her or does she want to go to the place where that one guy is who helped her escape from that busted ass castle?

They end up getting married and open a mom and pop general store on the king's road.

That will probably spawn a spinoff reality TV show.

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:13:13 PM EDT

[#34]

Quoted:

Quoted:
So...What happens between Arya and the Hound? Does he take her under his wing and train her or does she want to go to the place where that one guy is who helped her escape from that busted ass castle?

They end up getting married and open a mom and pop general store on the king's road.

Fuck Yeah!!!!! I hope they have a litter of little mutts too!

It's smooth sailing for a while, but then Sansa shows up needing a place to stay. She starts having an affair with the Hound and when Arya finds out...... well, I don't want to ruin the surprise.

Let's just say he ended up whacking her off. Or they whacked him off. Or something to do with whacking off each other.

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:15:57 PM EDT

[#35]

Quoted:
I don't see that happening.

They only way they've been able to marry them off has been through deals/payoffs; now, they're the enemies of anyone that is loyal to the Starks (and anyone that's an enemy of the Lannisters, when word gets out). Add to this the fact that they broke the sacred ritual of bread and salt, and you have a situation where no one will want to touch a Frey girl with a 10 meter pole.

I think that the "protection" offered to the Freys by the Lannisters will last just about as long as it takes for Tywin to decide he no longer needs them, or until he can comfortably take the Twins by force... which may be sooner rather than later, as he can now come into the Frey camp with an army and be welcomed as an ally.

Click To View Spoiler

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:17:00 PM EDT

[#36]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Using the book canon, yes I know it was Varys. I'm trying to stick with the show since we have the other thread now. Same with the Tywin bit.

Using that logic Tywin "could" do anything. Tywin 'could' kill Joffery and take the throne for himself. Tywon 'could' kill Loras. Tywin 'could' marry Margary and be the Hand, Warden of the West and Warden of the South. Tywin 'could' instruct Thoros to R'hollor Jon's ass and say "My bad! Just playing!"

But not as single one of those, or removing Jaime from his vows, fits in anyway to Tywin as we know him.

In the books it was Varys suggestion to Joffrey that removed Ser Barristan from the kingsguard and there is absolutely nothing to suggest that wasn't the case on the show so I have no idea how you reached the conclusion that decision was "Cersei all day long."

I said Tywin could remove a member of the kingsguard if he really wanted to. I never said Tywin could do ANYTHING he wanted.

Click To View Spoiler

Then I'll reiterate my previous point again. Tywin has had more than enough time (15 years at least) as a two time Hand, or even a petition to Robert, to have Jaime removed.

Click To View Spoiler

You also claimed that the decision to remove Ser Barristan from the kingsguard was "Cersei all day long." I'm curious how you reached that conclusion considering that's not what happened in the books and, if IIRC, there's nothing on the show that supports your claim.

S01E07 27min30sec Varys in the presence of Barristan, suggests to Ned that Lancel is at fault for providing the wine
S01E08 52min: Cersei calls out Barristan telling him to "put aside your armor and sword and rest" in front of the court.
52min50sec: Joffery then apes Cersei saying "you let my father die. You're too old to protect anybody."
53min: Cersei tells Barristan the "council has decided Ser Jaime will take your place as Commander of the Kings Guard."
53min10sec: Varys thanks Barristan for his service and tells him of his new keep near the sea with servants.

Click To View Spoiler

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:19:14 PM EDT

[#37]

Quoted:
Let's just say he ended up whacking her off. Or they whacked him off. Or something to do with whacking off each other.

Is this going to be our "Gene" ???

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:20:19 PM EDT

[#38]

Quoted:

Quoted:
So...What happens between Arya and the Hound? Does he take her under his wing and train her or does she want to go to the place where that one guy is who helped her escape from that busted ass castle?

My money is on... both. Maybe even an eventual alliance with Daenerys Targaryen. They share many of the same goals.

GRRM likes strong females and he favors Dany and Arya in a way that he doesn't favor the others.

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:25:14 PM EDT

[#39]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Using the book canon, yes I know it was Varys. I'm trying to stick with the show since we have the other thread now. Same with the Tywin bit.

Using that logic Tywin "could" do anything. Tywin 'could' kill Joffery and take the throne for himself. Tywon 'could' kill Loras. Tywin 'could' marry Margary and be the Hand, Warden of the West and Warden of the South. Tywin 'could' instruct Thoros to R'hollor Jon's ass and say "My bad! Just playing!"

But not as single one of those, or removing Jaime from his vows, fits in anyway to Tywin as we know him.

In the books it was Varys suggestion to Joffrey that removed Ser Barristan from the kingsguard and there is absolutely nothing to suggest that wasn't the case on the show so I have no idea how you reached the conclusion that decision was "Cersei all day long."

I said Tywin could remove a member of the kingsguard if he really wanted to. I never said Tywin could do ANYTHING he wanted.

Click To View Spoiler

Then I'll reiterate my previous point again. Tywin has had more than enough time (15 years at least) as a two time Hand, or even a petition to Robert, to have Jaime removed.

Click To View Spoiler

You also claimed that the decision to remove Ser Barristan from the kingsguard was "Cersei all day long." I'm curious how you reached that conclusion considering that's not what happened in the books and, if IIRC, there's nothing on the show that supports your claim.

S01E07 27min30sec Varys in the presence of Barristan, suggests to Ned that Lancel is at fault for providing the wine
S01E08 52min: Cersei calls out Barristan telling him to "put aside your armor and sword and rest" in front of the court.
52min50sec: Joffery tells apes Cersei saying "you let my father die. You're too old to protect anybody."
53min: Cersei tells Barristan the "council has decided Ser Jaime will take your place as Commander of the Kings Guard."
53min10sec: Varys thanks Barristan for his service and tells him of his new keep near the sea with servants.

Click To View Spoiler

It was Varys' suggestion to Joffrey that set the plan to remove Ser Barristan from the kingsguard in motion in the books and I don't see anything in those scenes that proves your claim that the decision to do that was "Cersei all day long."

Click To View Spoiler

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:29:58 PM EDT

[#40]

Quoted:

Quoted:
I don't see that happening.

They only way they've been able to marry them off has been through deals/payoffs; now, they're the enemies of anyone that is loyal to the Starks (and anyone that's an enemy of the Lannisters, when word gets out). Add to this the fact that they broke the sacred ritual of bread and salt, and you have a situation where no one will want to touch a Frey girl with a 10 meter pole.

I think that the "protection" offered to the Freys by the Lannisters will last just about as long as it takes for Tywin to decide he no longer needs them, or until he can comfortably take the Twins by force... which may be sooner rather than later, as he can now come into the Frey camp with an army and be welcomed as an ally.

Click To View Spoiler

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:30:20 PM EDT

[#41]

Quoted:
Learning the history of the Lannister clan has really made me like them on the show a lot more than I did.

Cersei and Joffrey can FOAD. The rest of them are alright. I like how Jamie has sort of become Sawyer from LOST.

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:30:40 PM EDT

[#42]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Learning the history of the Lannister clan has really made me like them on the show a lot more than I did.

Cersei and Joffrey can FOAD. The rest of them are alright. I like how Jamie has sort of become Sawyer from LOST.

Most of the "bad" characters aren't as one dimensional as I believed they were in the beginning when I first started reading the books. You can imagine my horror when I started to like Jaime after everything he had done. Even Dog had grown on me.

Cersei and Joffrey? Absolutely no good qualities.

Exactly. Dog too.

Yep. I wanted Jaime to be murdered with AIDS in book one. Now he's one of my favorite characters.

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:33:19 PM EDT

[#43]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Let's just say he ended up whacking her off. Or they whacked him off. Or something to do with whacking off each other.

Is this going to be our "Gene" ???

I was hoping Hondor would be this thread's Gene....

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:42:14 PM EDT

[#44]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Using the book canon, yes I know it was Varys. I'm trying to stick with the show since we have the other thread now. Same with the Tywin bit.

Using that logic Tywin "could" do anything. Tywin 'could' kill Joffery and take the throne for himself. Tywon 'could' kill Loras. Tywin 'could' marry Margary and be the Hand, Warden of the West and Warden of the South. Tywin 'could' instruct Thoros to R'hollor Jon's ass and say "My bad! Just playing!"

But not as single one of those, or removing Jaime from his vows, fits in anyway to Tywin as we know him.

In the books it was Varys suggestion to Joffrey that removed Ser Barristan from the kingsguard and there is absolutely nothing to suggest that wasn't the case on the show so I have no idea how you reached the conclusion that decision was "Cersei all day long."

I said Tywin could remove a member of the kingsguard if he really wanted to. I never said Tywin could do ANYTHING he wanted.

Click To View Spoiler

Then I'll reiterate my previous point again. Tywin has had more than enough time (15 years at least) as a two time Hand, or even a petition to Robert, to have Jaime removed.

Click To View Spoiler

You also claimed that the decision to remove Ser Barristan from the kingsguard was "Cersei all day long." I'm curious how you reached that conclusion considering that's not what happened in the books and, if IIRC, there's nothing on the show that supports your claim.

S01E07 27min30sec Varys in the presence of Barristan, suggests to Ned that Lancel is at fault for providing the wine
S01E08 52min: Cersei calls out Barristan telling him to "put aside your armor and sword and rest" in front of the court.
52min50sec: Joffery tells apes Cersei saying "you let my father die. You're too old to protect anybody."
53min: Cersei tells Barristan the "council has decided Ser Jaime will take your place as Commander of the Kings Guard."
53min10sec: Varys thanks Barristan for his service and tells him of his new keep near the sea with servants.

Click To View Spoiler

It was Varys' suggestion to Joffrey that set the plan to remove Ser Barristan from the kingsguard in motion in the books and I don't see anything in those scenes that proves your claim that the decision to do that was "Cersei all day long."

Click To View Spoiler

I'll concede the Tywin part. It probably does fit his character as he was slighted by King Aerys for taking Jaime into his King's Guard and thus losing the rightful heir to Casterly Rock, and wants his favorite son available to supplant him. But I'll still argue it doesn't take the wealthiest or most powerful man in the Seven Kingdoms 15 some odd years to do it.

I'm not sure what else you need about Barristan. I know, I know I know what the book says. I provided Game of Thrones proof to a Game of Thrones thread. I provided proof to the contrary, even so far as giving you the minutes and seconds, that Cersei, in the presence of Gods and Men, called out Barristan, shit canned him and replaced him. I even went so far as to provide the only video proof of Varys' interaction in this ordeal. There is no other evidence provided to suggest it was Varys in the show (yes, I still know what the book said). So my point is valid and factually. It was Cersei all day long.

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:48:18 PM EDT

[#45]

Quoted:

It's smooth sailing for a while, but then Sansa shows up needing a place to stay. She starts having an affair with the Hound and when Arya finds out...... well, I don't want to ruin the surprise.

Come and knock on our door....

We've been waiting for you....

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:49:51 PM EDT

[#46]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Let's just say he ended up whacking her off. Or they whacked him off. Or something to do with whacking off each other.

Is this going to be our "Gene" ???

I was hoping Hondor would be this thread's Gene....

That's actually a perfect recommendation.

I hereby dub thee Ser Hondor.

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:51:01 PM EDT

[#47]

Non book reader.

There is one character I like. Arya Stark or however you spell her name. Everyone else can die... preferable at her hands and I don't care. I want to see her get the assassin training and I want to see the trail of death she'll leave.

Toss in the epic battles in the north when the "others" come over/through the wall and the southerners finally realize what's happening... and I'll be happy. All of this is just distraction so that there will be no well organized forces to meet the invasion. They'll all be still fighting each other when they get blindsided from the north. Then we'll have people who were just fighting each other having to band together to fight off the others... and lots and lots of back stabbing during that as well...

If the series doesn't have the southerners who are too wrapped up in their own squabbles get completely taken by surprise and their sensibilities smashed by the north... I'll be disappointed.
Do not spoil anything. Go ahead and laugh.

Posted: 6/4/2013 12:55:31 PM EDT

[#48]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Ok one quick question, and remember I have not read the books.

I could see how things were shaping up for Robb to get betrayed or maybe killed in this last episode based on all the other stuff that had happened previously. Seems Bolton got bought off by the Lannisters, but did Lord Frey too? Didn't seem like he'd need the money. Why would Frey agree to go along with the Lannisters though? Hell when the King in the North asks for your help and essentially you have the majority power in that area, why would you necessarily rush at the chance to bend your knee to him? My point is, if Frey was going to have them killed why not do it for his own cause and claim lordship of all the north without the Lannisters involvement? Hell there's practically no real power force backing any sort of Stark claims in the north now.

Frey is a chicken shit bastard. His "honor" being wounded was used by Tywin and Bolton for there own ploy. Frey's goal was to hurt the Starks and better his position in the easiest way possible. Bolton convinced him the war was lost. No way that Frey would ever be so bold as to claim the North for himself unless everyone else is dead.

I get Frey's motivations. What I don't understand is why Frey thinks that the Lannisters will protect him and his family indefinitely. Like Tyrion says in the preview, the northerners will never forget, and eventually he and his family will be put to the knife (or worse) for what he did.

Perhaps it's his hubris relating to the fact that the Twins have never been taken?

Maybe, but any student of warfare knows that static defenses cannot hold out indefinitely.

"Fixed fortifications are a monument to the stupidity of man." - George S. Patton

Furthermore, if I were Frey, I'd be more worried about assassins sneaking in than a frontal assault on the Twins.

Honestly with the way they are depicted in the show the twins don't look that imposing, just a pair of towers and thats it.

but you can't lay siege to one unless you have forces on both sides of the river and there are no close fords. their strength is in their ability to support each other.

Posted: 6/4/2013 1:03:34 PM EDT

[#49]

Quoted:

Quoted:
It was Varys' suggestion to Joffrey that set the plan to remove Ser Barristan from the kingsguard in motion in the books and I don't see anything in those scenes that proves your claim that the decision to do that was "Cersei all day long."

Click To View Spoiler

I'll concede the Tywin part. It probably does fit his character as he was slighted by King Aerys for taking Jaime into his King's Guard and thus losing the rightful heir to Casterly Rock, and wants his favorite son available to supplant him. But I'll still argue it doesn't take the wealthiest or most powerful man in the Seven Kingdoms 15 some odd years to do it.

I'm not sure what else you need about Barristan. I know, I know I know what the book says. I provided Game of Thrones proof to a Game of Thrones thread. I provided proof to the contrary, even so far as giving you the minutes and seconds, that Cersei, in the presence of Gods and Men, called out Barristan, shit canned him and replaced him. I even went so far as to provide the only video proof of Varys' interaction in this ordeal. There is no other evidence provided to suggest it was Varys in the show (yes, I still know what the book said). So my point is valid and factually. It was Cersei all day long.

Glad to see you finally came around regarding your Tywin claim. As for your add on: just because Tywin didn’t try to perform a specific radical act over the past 15 years when his son in law was king doesn't prove he would never try to do it now that his grandson is king.

I see absolutely nothing in those scenes you posted that proves that not only was Varys not the one who planted the idea in Joffrey’s head, but that it was Cersei’s idea. We weren’t shown the small council meeting where this discussion happens so if it didn’t happen that way in the books and there’s nothing in the show to suggest anything different then I don’t think it’s reasonable to assume they changed it.

Unless maybe you think what is said publicly at court is the exact same thing that is said behind closed doors. Although I think that court scene in 2x10 showed that's not the case.

Posted: 6/4/2013 1:06:58 PM EDT

[#50]

Quoted:
What did they used to do in the old days? Build some makeshift ferries. Crossing a river isn't exactly rocket surgery.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Game of Thrones Season 3 *OFFICIAL THREAD* Major spoilers pg 98 on (Page 80 of 109)

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