Hello,

I had a minor for me car smash an hour ago at a four way blinking light.

My Toyota PU has some right bumper damage which likely will need the plastic bumper cover replaced.    The Subaru has a smashed up front end and is likely totaled I would think.  (registration says 160k miles)/

I think that is was not my fault and have a witness that said that that's what she thought. (that I had the right of way).


I haven't been in an accident in 35 years so it's a little fuzzy on the law.  I believe that an accident report needs filed but if no insurance is claimed then I would think that it wouldn't be needed.

I recall something in Oregon about "no fault" insurance or such.

Other details:  Other party called cops but they didn't respond because no injuries.  Other party is 19 or so and is on Dad's insurance I think.  I am 54 years young.  Their car was recently purchased and only had the temporary documents.  The intersection was a four way blinking light.  I was turning left and she was going straight.  I have full coverage Farmers insurance.  I took photos of damage of their car and my Tacoma PU.  I am not exactly rich.

My preference is to maintain my accident free insurance discount and not have there be any claim and no accident report.  (Future insurance payments and employment concerns).



Please discuss.

Thank you

Oregon DMV will answer your questions, http://www.oregon.gov/ODOT/DMV/pages/driverid/accidentreport.aspx

If over $1500 in combined damage than DMV requires it be reported (other criteria too, but this is most applicable in your situation).  If not reported in 72 hours to DMV they can suspend your license. That said, if no claim is filed and police didn't write a crash report, then DMV will be none the wiser.

I'll also add that if the other party files a DMV report, and you don't, they may suspend your license.  So if it were me I would file the DMV report to be on the safe side.

Thanks for the replay's.

The other party already called all insurance companies and filed claims.  Pretty quick.  I had hoped to not go this route but that's what's happened.  The other parties father called me and explained this.  He started spouting off driving law about four way intersections.

I've just now talked to their and my insurance companies.



Anyone have a clear understanding of the four way red blinking light with turn lane rules?  I'm off to DMV website.

Don't give details and have your insurance company fix your truck. Your insurance company should handle the rest for you, that is what you have been paying them for.

If the father's kicking law around, you might want to read up on this - his insurance company will be happy to stick yours with the bill:

http://www.oregonlaws.org/ors/153.058

He was quoting a section of the drivers manual.  I didn't record the conversation or write down cites.  His reading was different than my understanding of a four way.  I looked up ors and found a couple of citations but I am still missing one.  I've sent a note to a couple of cop friends asking if the can give me exact ors.

I just sent a text to a witness and her response was that I had the right of way and she gave me her email addy. Which I forwarded to my insurance company.

I just don't understand the fathers insistence on moving forward with this on a car that has no value and not understanding the implications of a accident on his daughters record after having a driving liscence for 11 days.

Interesting discussion. Since I haven't read the driver's manual since I got my permit 50+ years ago I looked up the manual on the ODMV website. It doesn't really say much about 4 way stops other than look both ways and in front and proceed when it is safe to do so. I was always taught basically "first in - first out" but it doesn't say anything about that in the manual.

Other interesting comment I saw was that the right-of-way laws do not establish who has the right-of-way, but who must yield. Off to find the laws............

(11)
Flashing red signal. When a driver approaches a flashing red light used in a traffic control device or with a traffic sign, the driver shall stop at a clearly marked stop line, but if none, before entering the marked crosswalk on the near side of the intersection, or if there is no marked crosswalk, then at the point nearest the intersecting roadway where the driver has a view of approaching traffic on the intersecting roadway before entering it. The right to proceed shall be subject to the rules applicable after making a stop at a stop sign. This subsection does not apply at railroad grade crossings. Conduct of a driver approaching a railroad grade crossing is governed by ORS 811.455 (Failure to stop for railroad signal).

(15)
Stop signs. A driver approaching a stop sign shall stop at a clearly marked stop line, but if none, before entering the marked crosswalk on the near side of the intersection or, if there is no marked crosswalk, then at the point nearest the intersecting roadway where the driver has a view of approaching traffic on the intersecting roadway before entering it. After stopping, the driver shall yield the right of way to any vehicle in the intersection or approaching so closely as to constitute an immediate hazard during the time when the driver is moving across or within the intersection.

IOW while there are some common courtesy things like first-in-first-out, and if in doubt yielding to vehicle to your right, it would appear that whichever vehicle enters the intersection first has the ROW.

Yep, those were the citations that I found in ors.  I'm still looking for more.

http://www.oregonlaws.org/ors/811.350

I think the part that you are talking about is this:

Does not yield the right of way to a vehicle approaching from the opposite direction that is within the intersection or so close as to constitute an immediate hazard
--------------------

I was at the stop first.  I proceeded into the intersection first.  I was half way through my turn when I was hit.  My witness affirmed this.
-----------------------------------
What I'm looking for is the yield to the first person to the intersection or person on the right if all arrive at the same time ORS citation.

This is all you should need. There doesn't appear to be anything in statute regarding first person to arrive at the intersection, or to the right if in doubt about timing. Those are apparently suggestions to make traffic flow better. It looks like the statutes are only concerned about not yielding to someone already in the intersection.

Well, some good news.  My insurance company ruled in my favor (they will not pay the other parties claim).  Now I have to go after the other insurance company.  It will still go on my record with farmers but as not my fault.