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Posted: 10/23/2005 11:16:28 PM EDT
I took a tactical AR-15 class at FAS this weekend. It was a non stop workout. I'm pooped! Here is the itierary of the class that I cut and pasted from their website.
 
 
FAS-7: TACTICAL RIFLE
FAS-7, our second-level rifle class, is geared for the patrol officer or armed citizen wanting to increase his/her proficiency with the use of the semi-auto rifle/carbine.

Students will be trained in use of cover, search techniques, multiple targets, rapid fire, long range shooting (out to 200 yards), transition to pistol, malfunction clearing and speed reloading. Also covered will be moving and shooting and shooting on moving targets, along with use of the rifle in low light environments. Students will also have a chance to complete the FAS Rifle Master test, a very demanding course of fire which will either validate your skills with a rifle, or brutally point out to you where you need work.

Pistol caliber carbines are NOT suitable for this class. We highly recommend a .223 caliber rifle of the AR-15 configuration, but semi-auto rifles of other manufacturers have done well in our rifle training. Combat type of scope such as the ACOG is acceptable, along with iron sights, of course. Iron sights do not have a disadvantage in this course.


My fingertips are sore from continuously reloading mags. I'm going to get one of those Lula Mag reloaders, it will save a lot of time. There were 15 people in the class. It was a wide assortment of civilians who want to become proficiant with their AR-15, there some cops going through the class, a couple of Alphabet types, and one US Army Major who will shortly be heading to Afghanistan. The AR's had various configurations. About half of the group had Eotechs including myself. There were some Acogs and AimPoints as well. There were several people who had iron sights and they did quite well in the class. Overall I would say the class is a good supplement/follow up to Masaad Ayoob's Lethal Force III Tactical Rifle course. The FAS #7 class did a lot of the stuff that Ayoob presented in his class except this class took it a little deeper and focused on the individual shooter to make that person a better marksman within the confines of long range shooting and tactical CQB. The long range shooting was at 200 yards and at 265 yards.
I was making Center of Mass shots with my Eotech at 265 yards. I didn't think that was possible. It was a pleasant surprise. At the end of the class there is a test of course. It is a masters test. I took the test and lets just say that I'm not a master but I know what I need to work on for the next time. The test is hard but it's not impossible. There were about 8 people in the class who passed the mastes certification. They were all young guys, I'm al old fart so that's my excuse! I would highly recomend this class for anyone who wants to become more proficient with the AR-15 platform.
Link Posted: 10/23/2005 11:47:31 PM EDT
[#1]
COOL!
What's a "FAS"?


Linky?
Link Posted: 10/23/2005 11:58:26 PM EDT
[#2]
Thanks RD6,

Nice debrief. Sounds like a great class.
Link Posted: 10/24/2005 12:15:26 AM EDT
[#3]

Quoted:
COOL!
What's a "FAS"?


Linky?



Firearms Academy of Seattle

It's actually in Onalaska, but that would not sound as catchy.


I've taken FAS 2 and 3.  Very valuable.
Link Posted: 10/24/2005 1:22:52 AM EDT
[#4]
Link Posted: 10/24/2005 8:13:36 AM EDT
[#5]
Link Posted: 10/24/2005 1:46:46 PM EDT
[#6]
Link Posted: 10/24/2005 7:53:42 PM EDT
[#7]
Ooooh!  Finally some info on a training outfit that will help me make a decision for a change.  Better than reading some dang website drivel.
Link Posted: 10/25/2005 6:22:37 AM EDT
[#8]

Quoted:
Glad you had a good experience with the class. I’ve taken 3 classes at FAS and earlier this year I took FAS 7, got the certificates and that whole thing. While I found the class to be somewhat worthwhile, I didn’t think it was nearly as complete as it should be. Things that were advertised in the class outline weren’t covered or were only lightly touched on and there wasn’t even a trace of a lecture at the beginning of the course. Not that a lecture is everything just that it’s nice to have some type of introductory from the teacher as to his or her opinions on the weapons system, it’s use/application, and what the goals of the class are. I think Marty’s words to my class were... ”my idea of the AR-15 differs from most... I think the gun is an offensive weapon and teach the class as such.” That about covered it.

The class was also a bit void in the shooting instruction department. Even though some of these things were advertised in the class outline the instructors failed to cover such fundamentals as: administratively loading and unloading the gun, checking the status of the weapon, tactical reloads, and malfunction clearance drills just to name a few. Other things that, while covered were hardly touched on such as search techniques, transition drills, and one-handed operations. Plus when shooting around a hard right hand corner or around the left side of a barricade a right-handed shooter was instructed to transition the rifle to their left side and there was no instruction on how to properly shoot right handed around the aforementioned obstacles. But I think one of the worst parts was during the low light section where the students received absolutely no instruction on how to use both a rifle and a flashlight. In fact, only the shooters with dedicated gun mounted lights were permitted to use them during the low light section.

Now don’t get me wrong I don’t think the class was a complete waste of time and I’m certainly not trying to bash the school, not one bit. But for a course described as “Tactical Rifle” I would think the course would focus on a bit more practical aspect of rifle shooting as opposed to how to hit targets at 100yds and beyond. Personally I can imagine many “tactical” situations wherein I would be required and legally justified to engage a “threat” at 100yds much less 265yds. YMMV.        



At the end of the class we had a debriefing session. One of the critiques was the time spent on the 200 yard and 265 yard range that could have been better used by going over remedial action drilss, clearing jams etc. Some of the students thought that the long range shooting aspect should be for another class. My spin on it is that no class you take is going to be perfect. After all humans are teaching the class and if you can't walk on water you won't teach the perfect class! Now with that being said, ya it would have been nice to have spent more time on clearing jams and stuff like that. At the same time it's good to know that it is possible for me to make a 200 yard and 265 yard shot to COM with my Eotech. The other thing that Marty does that is good is to have every one set up on a 100 yard zero and you just have to practice and know how much your holdover is for long shots and close in shots. That takes practice and time on the trigger. Overall I thought it was a good class and we did some drills that I thought were pretty darn good. I think if you combined Masaad Ayoob's LFI-III class and the FAS-7 class together you would really have something to brag about. But then there is no way anyone could teach that class in just one weekend. It's simply too much information to cram into 16 hours. So to become really good you have to take both classes and then practice everything you've learned and then you will be on you way to becoming adequately trained IMO.
Link Posted: 10/25/2005 10:37:46 PM EDT
[#9]
A good thing about FAS is that you can retake a class for half price. I have retaken 2 and 4 many times, always fun!
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