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Posted: 4/5/2008 10:14:55 AM EDT
Hello everyone. I just finished searching the archives but only found one thread where the photos have long expired.
Beyond the Aimpoint...what other magnified optics are available (and recommended) assuming one utilizes the factory SAI mount? It'd be great if Trijicon made a fixed scout optic with some fiber optics  I'm starting to think about selling my Aimpoint ML3 or trading it towards a more suitable optic....that....or keeping my Scout Squad an iron sighted lead thrower. |
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Posted: 4/5/2008 11:46:15 AM EDT
[#1]
I am in the same boat as you with an M1A Socom. I had asked about the Millet DMS-1. If I had more money, I might try for an Aimpoint or Eotech with the magnifier or even spring for an ACOG.
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Posted: 4/5/2008 12:03:14 PM EDT
[#2]
Burris Pistol scope (check eye relief specs!) with BallisticPlex reticle. You can shoot close-in, out to 500 yds, or set it at a BSZ setting.
Scout optics are in their infancy, and coming of age. The Burris is about the best currently available for a reasonable price, and the most versatile. |
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Posted: 4/5/2008 12:19:09 PM EDT
[#3]
Yep, I have the Burris 2-7x32 Handgun Scope with Ballistic Plex on my Mod 0 and I'm considering an Aimpoint CompML2 2x with a 2MOA dot for my Mod 1.  Link to Burris scope |
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Posted: 4/5/2008 12:25:02 PM EDT
[#4]
interesting....
I would think a fixed optic with the extended eye relief and illuminated BAC option would be most sweet. I sure hope we see something new down the pipeline. I'll look into that Burris option...never once heard of it. |
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Posted: 4/6/2008 3:46:02 AM EDT
[#5]
Thanks for the Burris information--I might have to go with that myself.
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Posted: 4/6/2008 7:07:28 AM EDT
[#6]
H20, How's the BDC fare shooting 308 ammo? I was on Burris' website yesterday and it seems they used a few choice 243/270/06 loads which they found most popular and ballistically comparable. Still, it does seem to be the best option out there for a scout optic. Second question, is it durable? I don't have much experience with Burris at all. |
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Posted: 4/6/2008 1:11:22 PM EDT
[#7]
Leupold fixed 2.5 IER
HERE |
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Posted: 4/6/2008 2:06:10 PM EDT
[#8]
I've yet to have a problem with any of my Burris scopes. If I do in the future, Burris has what they call a "Forever Warranty" That means the scope is warranteed forever, even if you were not the original purchaser. Check their current warranty info on their site to confirm. |
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Posted: 4/6/2008 4:57:05 PM EDT
[#9]
I'm sold on the warranty, that's refreshing to see.
The other part that I hadn't considered till now, is the repeatability of SAI's barrel-mounted platform. I wonder if I should invest in a top railed handguard....where would I go for that? |
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Posted: 4/6/2008 7:20:56 PM EDT
[#10]
don't you have the barrel mount on there? If so, turn a larue SPR mount backwards and put any kind of scope you want in there. Then there's no need to use the not so great Springy mount. And then you don't need a scope with scout specs. Unless you want it that way of course.
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Posted: 4/6/2008 10:21:20 PM EDT
[#11]
I tried pistol scopes, I used an Aim point then I went with Iron's a Unimak (sp?) mount and a red dot for help.
 Burris Fast Fire. |
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Posted: 4/6/2008 10:29:14 PM EDT
[#12]
My M1A Scout with a Leupold Scout 2.5x28 scope:
 I'm very happy with this set-up. |
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Posted: 4/7/2008 2:35:16 AM EDT
[#13]
The SAI mount is a picatinney/weaver hybrid....the Larue mount doesn't fit.  Rings are the only option for that particular mount. |
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Posted: 4/7/2008 2:35:34 AM EDT
[#14]
Josh you got a profile shot of that beauty? |
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Posted: 4/7/2008 2:36:28 AM EDT
[#15]
I like that alot, very low profile. I'd be looking for that as well. |
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Posted: 4/7/2008 6:41:02 AM EDT
[#16]
That sucks. I didn't know that. |
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Posted: 4/7/2008 7:43:27 AM EDT
[#17]
I am just this week removing my Aimpoint from my Scout. After the last range trip, practicing for the "postal match" I shot as well with the irons. I use Eotechs and ACOGs on my ARs and I actually prefer them over the Apoints.......
I tried a pistol scope previously but it was an older and larger diameter housing, it just didnt look or feel right on the forward mount. The ones pictured look like a nice setup, but from H2Oman, thats not surprising.  Who knows, my Scout may get neutered and become a Bush rifle. 
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Posted: 4/7/2008 9:56:11 AM EDT
[#18]
Seems Burris has an illuminated ballistic plex 2-7 scope....interesting!
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Posted: 4/7/2008 10:06:45 AM EDT
[#19]
Interesting, but it looks like it's just an illuminated red dot - not the bdc reticle. 
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Posted: 4/7/2008 10:26:23 AM EDT
[#20]
ah....I'll have to look again, I thought that was a red dot inside the ballistic plex ret. |
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Posted: 4/7/2008 11:08:20 AM EDT
[#21]
H2O, check this out:
www.burrisoptics.com/handgun1.html#2x7x Seems they do offer a Ballistic Plex with an E-Dot...basically a red dot at the center of a blackened ballistic plex reticule. With an opaque flip cap it'd make for a nice occluded option. That might just be the scope for me. 
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Posted: 4/7/2008 11:21:47 AM EDT
[#22]
Very cool !! 
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Posted: 4/7/2008 12:45:17 PM EDT
[#23]
Burris has offered these for a while, at least in some models.
I'd prefer a totally illuminated reticle ofer the central dot. As said before, this whole Scout scope business is still in its infancy. I don't see why; all the technology is there to do it up correctly. I suppose the market is soft/ignorant of its advantages. |
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Posted: 4/7/2008 1:35:00 PM EDT
[#24]
I'd still venture to say that I wouldn't much care about an illuminated BDC, only the center dot. For one, identifying a target at dawn, dusk or some other dark backdrop is challenging enough at 100 yards...I would think a shot requiring bullet drop compensation would be a hail mary. If I actually needed an illuminated reticule to make a distance shot, I probably shouldn't be utilizing a BDC...but I'm not expert in that department, that's just me inferring. To that end an illuminated center dot over a ballistic plex reticule would be a sweet scope.
I have no idea how bright that dot is or anything regarding the battery life, but it seems like a neat option. SWFA doesn't carry that particular model though.... I'll find it somehow though....and I'll post pics! I just sold my Aimpoint & mount to fund it.
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Posted: 4/7/2008 5:42:43 PM EDT
[#25]
Hokie, I had this same dilemma not too long ago and I decided to keep mine a iron sight gun. I actually have it at the smith having a NM rear put on. Ultimak makes a nice rail that I liked. Its a bit expensive, but it seems nice. There are a few on here that have it. I pulled that scout rail off the day it came in because I do not like anything touching the barrel. Plus, I burned my hand on my buddies SOCOM rail and I knew I didn't want that on there
. |
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Posted: 4/7/2008 9:19:36 PM EDT
[#26]
Nice! You were able to get a co-witness with that? Pretty cool. This thread has turned out some great information. |
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Posted: 4/7/2008 11:24:45 PM EDT
[#27]
Sorry I didn't check in sonner this is the best I have atm I could do better if asked 
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Posted: 4/7/2008 11:26:23 PM EDT
[#28]
Ya I actualy bought it for a pistol and thought wtf lets try I was shocked it worked. |
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Posted: 4/8/2008 2:51:00 AM EDT
[#29]
I was/am also worried about that clamp mount shifting and screwing up my POI. I'm thinking a railed top hanguard would be a more sound platform for mounting a scope. But I'm not sure, anyone else wanna comment on that? |
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Posted: 4/8/2008 5:02:18 AM EDT
[#30]
I also took the factory barrel mount off of my M1A Scout after it fryed a brand new Aimpoint M3 due to the heat transfer. The Scout mount seemed like a good idea until I got it hot and tried shooting at distance. I've since istalled a Smith Enterprise ACOG mount with a Trijicon TA-11. It's a pretty good setup given the limitations of the M1A/optic combination. I still have been unable to post pictures here, but I do have a couple I recently took of the above combo in an attempt to post them. If anyone wants a few, send me an email please. Hokie, I just saw your interested in SAI mounts, so sorry for the off topic answer.
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Posted: 4/8/2008 5:27:14 AM EDT
[#31]
no no...this info is good, I'm actually steering away from SAI mounts given all this discussion, so no apologies please. This is a great thread with a lot of info being passed around.
I'm now looking into a full handguard replacement for my existing SAI mount. Seems the Ultimak is a good option. If I can put a two or three mags downrange and not get 3rd degree burns from the handguard or melt the scope rings I'll be happy. It also has to give me zero repeatability...otherwise what's the point!!! Also, I just got off the phone with Burris. Their website shows the 2-7 in a Ballistic Plex reticule with an E-dot...however Burris isn't sure if that reticule option is out there in the 2-7, only the 3-12 models....he thinks it's a website typo and couldn't give me anymore info. The illuminated 2-7 apparantly only comes in an E-Dot, not the ballistic plex. I checked Optics Planet, Cabelas, and SWFA...not one of them has a 2-7 in a Ballistic Plex E-Dot. So, I'm either going with the 2-7 Ballistic Plex (11 oz), or the 3-12 Ballistic Plex with an E-Dot (16 oz). I'm leaning towards the 2-7 because even though 2x vs 3x on the low magnification end seems trivial, 16 oz seems pretty heavy for a scout optic....especially after replacing the handguard with a railed forend. My goal is to have a 18" Scout Squad with a variable magnification to allow me the occasional 500 yard shot. Most if not all of my shooting is <200 yards. This would serve me as an "out and about" gun. I keep all my AR's <16" in length and reserve them for shooting <200 yards. |
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Posted: 4/8/2008 5:51:57 AM EDT
[#32]
I just finished installing an UltiMAK optic rail on my AK - the fit, finish and quality are very good.
 I will purchase two of the UltiMAK optic rails for the M14 very soon. One will be used in conjunction with the synthetic E2 from LAW483. Call SWFA and let them know what Burris you want - they have excellent customer service
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Posted: 4/8/2008 6:01:47 AM EDT
[#33]
Nice, nice, nice!
Looks like I'm going with the Ultimak mount & the Burris 2-7 Ballistic Plex. ...unless I convince myself to go with the 3-12 Ballistic Plex with the E-Dot. Just gotta convince myself that extra 5 ounces is worth the magnification & illumination! |
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Posted: 4/8/2008 7:30:03 AM EDT
[#34]
I wonder if the Knights RAS would do the same... Might be worth trying. |
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Posted: 4/8/2008 10:01:00 AM EDT
[#35]
I have my M1A Scout set-up with a Leupold Scout scope.
i30.photobucket.com/albums/c341/Brauer/M1AScout.jpg I have not noticed any shift in the POI due to the SAI mount. I'm not the best rilfeshooter, and was surprised how well this gun did both with iron sights and the Leupold scope. I was getting some decent groups using Argentinian surplus ammo. I've never had any problems with over heating the scope, but I don't dump mag after mag thru the gun. I enjoy seeing all the other builds here, and think the forward scout mounts are a good set-up. I've found I can make quick decent hits to 300 yards (the limit of my range), and have "plinked" out to 500 yards with success. |
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Posted: 4/8/2008 10:14:13 AM EDT
[#36]
I may very well be putting too much emphasis on overheating the gun, but I'd want the M1A to handle a few mags in succession and not have anything happen to the gun/mount/optic/whatever.
Thanks for chiming in with that, it adds to the pile. 
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Posted: 4/8/2008 6:50:49 PM EDT
[#37]
I had an Aimpoint on my M1A Scout and shot it a few times but decided I didnt like it. I'm going to go with iron sights for a while and see how it goes. The military post/peep sight is a great setup and i didnt like the balance of the rifle with it on. The scout rifle is supposed to be a quick handling setup and the M1A already has enough weight without adding more to the front of it. I would suggest getting really good with your iron sights (if you haven't already) and then seeing about optics. Just my $0.02
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Posted: 4/8/2008 8:44:39 PM EDT
[#38]
I'm running an Ultimak rail with a Burris 2-7 BDC on a Springfield Bush rifle. The rail doesn't really heat up all that badly; if you burn through 60 rounds it'll probably be pretty hot, but I've never done more than 30-40 without letting it cool back down. When I first mounted the Burris, I got about 25 rounds downrange before I realized that the reticle had detached and rotated itself approximately 5 degrees (which definitely explained why I wasn't hitting the target at 500 yards). Burris had it fixed and returned in under two weeks, and threw in a free scope cover. Since then I've got probably close to 600 rounds through it, and the scope has been perfect ever since. It's not pinpoint accurate, and I don't think it lets me shoot to the true potential of the rifle, but it WILL print 5 shots into right about an inch at a hundred, when using any decent 168gr ammo. I'll shoot at small objects at 500 yards plus (bowling pins, fire extinguishers, etc) and with the BDC my first round is pretty much guaranteed to either hit or come within an inch or two of the target. So solid hits on a silhouette out to nearly 600.
I do seem to recall seeing the new Burris in their 2008 catalog, but unfortunately I think I gave that away. I'm pretty sure they're offering the BDC reticle with the red dot feature, but I could be wrong. As for the 3-12, that's probably another good choice...I picked the 2-7 because it was the only decent scout scope I could find and inspect locally. Just picking up both models in stores, or at SHOT, I have a hard time really telling which would be better (not that there's a tremendous difference anyhow). I think the only really conclusive method would be to buy both, test both out thoroughly, and then decide. The problem with handgun/scout scopes is that virtually no one keeps a decent stock of them on hand, so an awful lot winds up being guesswork. Leupolds are nice, but they don't offer any factory handgun models in a matte finish, IIRC, nor do they offer the same number of options. The rest of the market is even worse. Burris is realistically the only choice. 
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Posted: 4/8/2008 9:01:08 PM EDT
[#39]
Wes thats a nice set up.
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Posted: 4/8/2008 9:07:00 PM EDT
[#40]
This the scope you have? The BDC pritty close eh?
www.opticsplanet.net/burris-2x-7x-handgun-scopes.html I may have to get one. |
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Posted: 4/8/2008 11:08:40 PM EDT
[#41]
Nice rifle and great review on the scope. What rings did you use to mount it? BP |
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Posted: 4/9/2008 3:14:52 AM EDT
[#42]
Wow...that's an exact duplication of what my Scout will look like. That's slick! I'm going to have to call Burris again today....all I need is a model number. |
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Posted: 4/9/2008 8:52:00 AM EDT
[#43]
The rings are Leupold PRW mediums, and the scope is actually the Burris 2-7 BDC with Posi-Lock. Dunno if the Posi-Lock really makes all that much difference or not, to be worth the extra few dollars, but it does seem to hold zero reasonably well. Scope model number 200299. You might prefer the 3-12 or one of the newer illuminated ones however...were I building up a second one I might do it just for the heck of it. I also might use some quick-detach rings, in case the scope goes down while in use. The stock was a surplus GI synthetic, purchased from Numrich, and the sling is a Ching Sling II from www.shottist.com. Still haven't quite figured out if the Ching Sling works for me or not; probably need some real instruction in its employment before making up my mind. It's worth noting that because of the weight of the rifle (12-13 pounds fully loaded), it's awkward carrying the rifle slung muzzle-up over the shoulder (the rifle wants to rotate down and forward).
On the other hand, it's almost boring shooting targets at 500 yards. |
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Posted: 4/9/2008 8:53:07 AM EDT
[#44]
Oh, and the finish on the stock is nothing more than a $5 can of black textured Rustoleum for plastics. Scratch it up, screw it up...spray it up again.
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Posted: 4/9/2008 11:34:59 AM EDT
[#45]
Wes how's your rifle balance out? I've got a Vickers Sling on mine with the M14 buttstock adaptor. I added a paracord loop on the stock adaptor so I can carry it waistlevel without it leaning one way or the other - works great. |
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Posted: 4/9/2008 12:06:10 PM EDT
[#46]
Anyone have any info on one of the .308 sights from EOTech?
http://www.eotech-inc.com/product.php?id=5&cat=2 |
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Posted: 4/9/2008 12:31:38 PM EDT
[#47]
I have one and the reticle is sweet! My needs have changed, therefore it is listed as a WTT/WTS item. |
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Posted: 4/9/2008 2:52:59 PM EDT
[#48]
lol...looks like you were served 
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Posted: 4/9/2008 4:52:49 PM EDT
[#49]
That is just freaking outstanding!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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Posted: 4/9/2008 6:53:32 PM EDT
[#50]
Balance is good when shooting, but not so great from the traditional sling points (when slung). I suppose it might be possible to rig up some alternative method of carry, but so far I haven't spent too much time on it.
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