Was on another board and saw this , the results are outstanding using a drum tumbler and stainless steel media  that lasts years !!  long thread but worth the read , im going to try it next week or so.

leave this link cold
http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1513345#Post1513345

Here is a photo , credit to other folks on that board..

Before

After


another after with lemshine added

I need to work on a design for a large rotary tumbler apparently. The one most of those guys are using is way too small for the quantities of brass I need to clean.

200 pieces at a time over 5 hours is a long time.

dosen't using steel media work harden the brass???

Don't see how it would as it does not heat the brass.

check the threads  one guy converted a dryer without the heating element to handle more brass...also it does  not affect wieght or damage cases if you read more . yea its a long time but no media to buy ever again and only used soap water and maybe some lemshine.

Concrete mixer...  

I wouldn't mind trying the method, except I am pretty heavily invested in my cleaning setup.  I have three different tumblers right now, with around 30lbs or so of various media.  Although it does look like this would a better method for cleaning match cases, it does seem a little slow for the type of bulk shooting I do with 9mm and 5.56/.223 loads.  I may try it in the future, especially if I can find a relatively cheap rotary tumbler.  Guess I'll have to check Harbor Freight!

I just started using this method a couple weeks ago and it is phenominal.  250 pieces of brass in exactly 4 hours does a better job than what anyone else is doing with a vibratory tumbler.  Why?  Because it cleans the insides of the cases till they are just as shiny as the outside and it also cleans the primer pockets.  One argument is that the brass will last longer because the insides are getting cleaned which will reduce the internal case pressure building up due to the decreasing internal volume.

I still use my other tumblers (lyman 2500 and 1200) to tumble the cases for 15 minutes to get the lube off after sizing.  But it's the equivalent of using a giruad trimmer in the cleaning world....a million times better.

yeah, but you have to find one.

I almost spit my coffee out.



 

I'm talking used...I'm too broke and cheap to go buy a new one. About to go see if I can find a used tiller for my garden.

Dammit - beat me to it.

I'm thinking apartment sized (24") double stack electric setup, re-wired for 120v.  Tumble in the top, wash brass and parts on the bottom.

Edit: Now that I see it's a wet process, change it to a stacked front-loader setup.  Wet-tumble on one of the wash cycles (put the brass and media in cloth bags).  Dry in dryer.

I looked at the China Freight mixers and they were POSs.

For less money I ordered this one:

NORTHERN TOOLS

I can do 150 plus .50 cal, or 500 .308's.

That brass looks great but I do worry (probaly to much) about the life of my brass, I will stay with walnut

Sorry slick I got my alloys mixed up. But please answer the above question then.

Sorry slick I got my alloys mixed up. But please answer the above question then.

I was impressed with the results on that thread.  Think I'll be trying it out in the next few days.  I almost pulled the trigger on a commercial ultrasonic and saw that thread at the last minute.  If this works like its supposed to it'll be good enough for me.  I also like the lifetime(?) media and although I have to deal with water it's better than the dust.

Here is a 5lb bag of the SS media ready to go into the Thumlers.


Here is a closeup of the media with a case for size comparison.

The stainless media isn't going to work harden brass unless you fill a sack up with the stuff and repeatedly fold/deform individual cases with it. Or put the stuff in a dead blow hammer...same thing. Otherwise, there isn't enough solid weight impacting on any given point to cause dimensional changes..and there isn't enough friction to create heat(which would actually anneal brass).

Really?  Hrm, I have a pretty new dryer that quit heating, and it's just sitting out in the shed.  Might make an interesting project...

Please keep us updated on your results.

So the impacts aren't hard enough to mimic shot peening?

Harbor freight concrete mixer is the best bang for the buck in a large rotary tumbler.  

Here's a link:  http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=31979
3 1/2 cu ft for $219


They also have a 1 1/2 cu ft model for $179.  

I have always been very interested in this method, seems very elegent and effective.  

One question I have is what is the method to remove the steel media after cleaning?  I seem to remember that it involved the use of a magnet, the question is how effective is it to get the steel media from inside the bass, seems like this has to be 100% or there could be big problems when it comes to full length resizing.

Delete.

Actually Harbor Freight has several small ones.

Concrete Mixers

ETA: Guess i should have went farther down the page. Anyway the link is there for a quick look.

I researched this method and I think it is too slow for bulk shooting and no matter what people say, there is more effort involved as well as the initial cost for the equipment compared to normal tumbling and media.

It takes longer as you are limited by weight, you need to drain the tumbler, you need to separate the media, you need to dry the brass, etc...

While it is impressive, I think it's too much work for what little benefit you get out of it unless you are benchrest shooting.

Keep in mind you get what you pay for.

I got the 4Cuft model from Northern tool. All of them are made in China.  In 6 months I burned up the motor. 8 months after that, the slots that the pinion grear ride in to turn the drum are tearing out. Keep in mind that I tumble brass and loaded ammo in it. The weight capaity is 290lbs. I don't even come close to that even with loaded ammo. I use 35lbs of cob and loaded ammo weight is usually no more than 100 lbs. Duration of mixing is the only thing that would be out of the norm for the mixer.

I also have the poly drum mixer with the gear box. A much better mixer.

This one and the others from Northern are made in China as well.

Instead of SS can a fella use ceramic like what is here?

http://www.buffaloarms.com/browse.cfm/4,5179.html

OK time out!  First, I am definately not trolling but asking a serious question since I am interested in the technique.  

I am relatively new to reloading, but I don't see why it should prevent me from asking a question on something I am interested in.  

I bring up a point of concern based only on my own thinking through the process which I think most people would do when they come across something new.  To me, obviousely, the process works, and works well and so I am interested in finding out how my concerns have been addressed by someone who actually use the technique.  I don't think that is unfair or unreasonable?  


Fixed the bracket.  AeroE

I think I got my Harbor Freight cement mixer for abotu $90 OTD. Now, I bought the floor model at a discount. If I wear the thing out or burn up the motor I feel relatively sure I will have gotten my money's worth.

I did 1124 pieces of .45ACP in it yesterday 752 pieces of .223 the day before.

jonblack

So just in case someone still thinks I am trolling, here is a detailed explanation of why I ask the question, it is a bit obvious but for the sake of clarity, I will explain:

From what I can see, we are using small steel rode to tumble clean the case.  If you look at the last photo post by traderpats, the steel rods are of considerable size relative to the case.  The concern I have is what would happen if one or more steel rods gets stuck in the primer hole, or sits across the primer pocket.  When I full length resize my 223 brass, my Lee die also deprimes.  If the depriming rod hits a hard foreign object on its way to push the primer out, it will likely bent or break.

The other problem with possibly leaving steel rods in the case is that it will affect case volume, now unless a lot of it gets stuck inside, which is unlikely, a small number would still potentially affect case volume and case pressure, which in turn will affect accuracy.  Something which I doubt anyone that interested in cleaning their brass that will would be happy with.

Realistically, I think the chance of the above happening is low, but not neil – at least according to Murphy’s Law.  Thus the concern and question – hope that is clear?

I asked a buddy about a tumbler and he said I did not need one.
Before I start reloading there is so much reading to do. But I do have a cement mixer to use.
What kind of medium do you use? Walnut shells? How long did you tumble the brass?

Legit concerns but you need to read the whole of the posted thread from the 1st post and all threads they mention on the other site as this has been covered. they say to deprime before you tumble . The pins do sometimes get stuck in primer holes  and in cases so you must inspect each case and they discuss other methods on the other threads like the magnet . inspecting every case multiple times during reloading should be done anyway at various stages , the pins would be found as would any other media type upon inspection. Read the entire thread and ask questions over there and they will be answered .  I ordered my media and will post the whole proccess from begining to end in a few weeks. It may not be the best way for everyone but wont know till you try it.

Thanks Tekpc007, I remember being involved in previous threads on this topic (may not be the same one) but did not remember this issue being addressed, but I admit it could be my memory.  This danger unfortunately comes with old age – LOL!

Regardless, thanks for taking time out to answer my question which is quite thorough and I thank you!

OK, here's the results of my first go with the SS media and the Thumler's.  Basically it was all that i hoped for.  From reading some other related posts I first pre-soaked 2.5# of brass ( 200 cases?) in about a gallon of water and a tablespoon of dish soap.  I let this soak overnight.  In the morning I put the 5# of SS media in the drum and added 2.5# of the brass that had soaked overnight.  (NOTE: The picture below is not the soaked brass but some other brass I was initially going to use)

I then added 3 Qts of HOT water, (only three qts because of the 15# weight limit of the Thumler's), one table spoon of dish soap, one table spoon of lemi-shine - which from reading the label seems to be a surfactant.  I read that with pre-soaking the tumbling time can be cut to about 1 1/2 to 2 hrs.  I set the tumbler and promptly forgot about it until the 3hr mark.  

I don't know if it comes through in the pictures but the cases were spotless.  That is, they looked like new brass inside and out, even the primer pockets shone brightly.  I did have a few pieces of media across the case mouth, (about 15) and maybe 10 of the flash holes had rod sections in them.  Both of these items take about a second to remove with a tiny set of needle nosed pliers.  It really wasn't much of a bother.  

Next batch I'll let pre-soak for a full day or so and I'll run the tumbler for 1 1/2 hours (maybe use the kitchen timer next time) and see how it turns out.  I'll also see if I can reduce the amount of water and increase the brass count without sacrificing results. I think I'll uniform the primer pickets and flash holes to see if there are any possible issues with sticking of the media.   I haven't gone through each and every case but the initial impression is good.  


5# of SS media in the tumbler


2.5# of brass added - About 200 cases - deprimed


Skip to the end.  Results after "toweling" them


Better picture - Hard to see but they're clean all over


Junky camera so can't see the primer pockets real good but notice
the SS media in the flash hole on the far left case.  Takes literally a
second or so to remove.  


That's about it for now.  I'll examine the cases later sometime  for any missed media and post my findings.

Well it doesn't take as much time as some of you guys think it does.  I've done easily a couple k of cases in the past couple days and it's so easy.  just pour 200 or so cases into my premeasured container, then pour them in with water, SS media, and lemishine.  come back in 4 hours.  pour out, rinse and repeat.

also getting the media out is really quickly because they have more weight to them, so spinning the dillon media separator for about 15-30 seconds and most of the water is gone, and all the SS media is out.  then I pour them out into my cardboard box and they dry within the hour.  

If you have a large amount of brass that you can cycle through then it's not a problem, because then you don't have to wait for them to dry or tumble.  You just take your preprocessed cases while you're processing others.

Would like to see if I can stretch it to 300 cases and get it down to about an hour with a day or so of pre-soaking.  So the Dillon separator works that good huh?  Will have to get one of them...

yea it works phenomenally.  I didn't think it would make that big of a difference, but it makes it extremely easy.  I got the small one and it can easily hold 400 cases.  Which is more than what I do in a single batch.  But just rotate it for about 15-30 seconds (switching directions halfway through) and they come out SS media free.

Well thanks for that bit o' info.  I was thinking of what would be best way to separate the two but seems you have that taken care of already...

Damm! That brass looks mint. This is a tag for when Uncle Obama gives me back my hard earned $$ so I can buy some SS media.
Thanks to the OP for posting. This sure beats all the nasty dust and walnut media. Even with nu-finish and crushed walnut I was never happy with the results (or the mess).

Yea the best part about the SS method is absolutely zero dust.  Even dryer sheets couldn't keep it down 100%.

I'm guessing the weight of the media is what keeps it from being effective in a vibratory tumbler?

100% correct...

Yeah, it's clean alright.  The interesting thing is it's just as clean and bright on the inside too...