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Page AR-15 » Troubleshooting
AR Sponsor: bravocompany
Posted: 5/21/2015 9:38:33 PM EDT
Evening everyone,

So I am building a 260 on a DPMS base. I have a new JP enhanced 308 bolt and a Red X Arms 308 bolt carrier. I oil everything slide the bolt into the carrier and then go to put in the cam pin. The cam pin hole is a little behind the cut out (1/16 to 1/8 inch) so i try to pull the bolt forward but it wont move. I try a little harder but the bolt will not move forward or back in the carrier, it dies rotate freely though. A beveled brass rod and some light taps though the firing pin channel don't move it either.

Any ideas out there as to how to get the bolt unstuck? I'm guessing that the gas rings are somehow catching on something but I could be wrong.
Link Posted: 5/21/2015 9:46:34 PM EDT
[#1]
Quoted:
Evening everyone,

So I am building a 260 on a DPMS base. I have a new JP enhanced 308 bolt and a Red X Arms 308 bolt carrier. I oil everything slide the bolt into the carrier and then go to put in the cam pin. The cam pin hole is a little behind the cut out (1/16 to 1/8 inch) so i try to pull the bolt forward but it wont move. I try a little harder but the bolt will not move forward or back in the carrier, it dies rotate freely though. A beveled brass rod and some light taps though the firing pin channel don't move it either.

Any ideas out there as to how to get the bolt unstuck? I'm guessing that the gas rings are somehow catching on something but I could be wrong.
View Quote




wooden dowel rod through back end?  (that's what she said)
Link Posted: 5/21/2015 10:10:20 PM EDT
[#2]
Already a brass rod rather than wooden, didn't budge. Debating the wisdom of trying to use the press in the work shop tomorrow to try and press it out, but really not sure that it is a good idea.

Did just manage to back the gas key screws out and can see the gas rings aren't moving as the bolt rotates.
Link Posted: 5/22/2015 9:29:38 AM EDT
[#3]
Found an old article that describes chisling out the gas rings then putting new ones and making sure to be careful to avoid letting the bolt slide back into the carrier while working on it. Guess that is the route I am heading to this evening.
Link Posted: 5/22/2015 5:09:47 PM EDT
[#4]
So after a failed attempt at drilling the gas rings out I ended up resorting to chiseling them out though the gas hole.

Now that I can look in the bolt carrier body you can see a line inside. The problem is that it isn't just a ridge but actually a hump and the diameter increases again after that constriction. Guessing that is where the rings got stuck.

http://s17.postimg.org/j0j8blmi3/20150522_153635.jpg

Got some damage to the bolt from getting it out but think a little polishing and I should be able to reuse the bolt once the new gas rings arrive.  

http://s21.postimg.org/cbzw1vfoz/20150522_154155.jpg
Link Posted: 5/23/2015 1:13:23 AM EDT
[#5]
Sounds like an Armalite bolt carrier. Tech note #5 in the library covers this and how to remove stuck bolt.

http://www.armalite.com/images/Tech%20Notes/2015/Tech%20Note%205,%20Errata%20Sheet%20for%20AR-10%20Rifle%20031230.pdf

CAM PIN FIT: Easy does it! Insert the cam-pin straight into the carrier with the flat edge of
the pin against the carrier key (you don’t rotate it 90 degrees like the M-15 cam pin). Until parts
are loosened by breaking them in, tight tolerances on the AR-10 sometimes require use of a flat
tipped screwdriver or other suitable object to slip the cam-pin past the bolt carrier key. The cam
pin must never be altered to provide clearance.
CAUTION: INSERTING THE BOLT: WHEN ASSEMBLING THE CARRIER GROUP,
INSERT THE BOLT INTO THE CARRIER ONLY DEEP ENOUGH TO ALLOW THE
CAM-PIN TO BE INSERTED. IMPORTANT: THERE IS A GROOVE INSIDE THE
CARRIER AT THE BOTTOM OF THE GAS CAVITY. INSERTING THE BOLT TOO
FAR INTO THE CARRIER WITHOUT THE CAM PIN IN PLACE CAN, IN SOME
CASES, ALLOW THE MCFARLAND GAS RING TO EXPAND SLIGHTLY INTO THE
GROOVE AND JAM THE BOLT IN THE CARRIER. REMOVAL CAN ORDINARILY
BE PERFORMED BY WIGGLING THE BOLT SLIGHTLY, BUT IT MIGHT REQUIRE
DRIVING THE BOLT FORWARD WITH A BRASS ROD. THIS CAN DAMAGE OR
DESTROY THE RING. THE ERROR CANNOT BE MADE WHEN THE CAM PIN IS
IN PLACE.
Link Posted: 5/25/2015 12:38:36 AM EDT
[#6]
That seems like an accurate description of the problem. If that is how Red X is building their bolt carrier they should make a note of it because their web site just says DPMS compatible and doesn't mention Armalite at all.

However the other thing is that even with the cam pin in place the bolt will still go back to the position where it got stuck so either the combo of JP bolt and Red X carrier are just incompatable or that carrier was mis machinened.
Link Posted: 5/25/2015 10:58:42 AM EDT
[#7]
Link Posted: 5/27/2015 1:23:39 PM EDT
[#8]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Sounds like an Armalite bolt carrier. Tech note #5 in the library covers this and how to remove stuck bolt.

http://www.armalite.com/images/Tech%20Notes/2015/Tech%20Note%205,%20Errata%20Sheet%20for%20AR-10%20Rifle%20031230.pdf

CAM PIN FIT: Easy does it! Insert the cam-pin straight into the carrier with the flat edge of
the pin against the carrier key (you don’t rotate it 90 degrees like the M-15 cam pin). Until parts
are loosened by breaking them in, tight tolerances on the AR-10 sometimes require use of a flat
tipped screwdriver or other suitable object to slip the cam-pin past the bolt carrier key. The cam
pin must never be altered to provide clearance.
CAUTION: INSERTING THE BOLT: WHEN ASSEMBLING THE CARRIER GROUP,
INSERT THE BOLT INTO THE CARRIER ONLY DEEP ENOUGH TO ALLOW THE
CAM-PIN TO BE INSERTED. IMPORTANT: THERE IS A GROOVE INSIDE THE
CARRIER AT THE BOTTOM OF THE GAS CAVITY. INSERTING THE BOLT TOO
FAR INTO THE CARRIER WITHOUT THE CAM PIN IN PLACE CAN, IN SOME
CASES, ALLOW THE MCFARLAND GAS RING TO EXPAND SLIGHTLY INTO THE
GROOVE AND JAM THE BOLT IN THE CARRIER.
REMOVAL CAN ORDINARILY
BE PERFORMED BY WIGGLING THE BOLT SLIGHTLY, BUT IT MIGHT REQUIRE
DRIVING THE BOLT FORWARD WITH A BRASS ROD. THIS CAN DAMAGE OR
DESTROY THE RING. THE ERROR CANNOT BE MADE WHEN THE CAM PIN IS
IN PLACE.
View Quote

Sully, I think you may have missed this part.

To the OP- you may be right about the incompatibility of the parts. You might want to get a complete DPMS bolt assy.
Page AR-15 » Troubleshooting
AR Sponsor: bravocompany
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