Just wanted to say thanks for the good instructions on installing new barrels.  Got my new BM barrel on with no problems.  Well, almost -- I tried at first to put the E-ring on the barrel nut without the use of the special tool for the purpose; about the third time it passed my head at 400 knots, I ran down to the hardware store and bought one.  [:\]  That was the only trick, though.  So, all in all:

BM Armorer's Action Block:       $38.95
BM Extra-HD Armorer's Wrench:    $29.95
E-Ring Putter-Oner Tool:         $11.95
No-BS instructions that work:    Priceless

Thanks for the help!  We'll see how it shoots tomorrow.

Algonquin

Another satisified customer. [:D]  Thanks, Algonquin, I appreciate it.

It's nice to see people succeed in building ARs without breaking parts or causing injury.  Unfortunately the same people on this board keep posting the same erroneous instructions that turn a 10 minute job into a week-long ordeal.  I cringe when I see those horrible posts from newbies saying stuff like "I've been trying to mount this barrel for the past three days, and even though I tightened and loosened the barrel nut 13 times I never got the right torque number, and the receiver threads are galled, the teeth on the barrel nut are all rounded, the gas tube notch won't line up, the front sight is cocked over 37 degrees to the left, and my knuckles are still bleeding.  But I think I'm getting close now.  Do you think I should try using different grease?"  Aaarrrggghhhh!!!! [>(]

BTW - I can't take credit for the Quick & Easy Barrel Mounting Method.  After doing just about everything wrong I mentioned above on my first barrel job, I asked a guy (who was not only an armorer in the US Army in the RVN, but also ruder and crankier that I am [shock]) for help.  After he finally stopped laughing at me [:D], he showed me how to do it with a breaker bar and eyeballs.  And I've been doing it that way ever since.

So, Algonquin, it's great to see you've got your first barrel mounted with few problems.  And I hope you're already shopping around for parts to build your second one.  [:D]

I have found big, ugly, greasy, beat-to-hell breaker bars work best.

I'd be interested in seeing those instructions, could some one post a link?

Thanks!

The Famous Homo Erectus Barrel Mounting Method -

You'll need an Action Block and a Barrel Wrench, and that's all the special tools you'll need.  I'm assuming you already have a vise, hammer and punches, files, and circlip pliers.

Forget the torque wrench and all those silly "tighten and loosen 17 times while waving a dead cat over the barrel nut and dancing naked in the moonlight chanting voodoo curses with your nutsack smeared with magic moly grease" procedures incessantly parroted my the Worshipers of Military Manuals who until recently confined their insanity to the Troubleshooting board but have now starting to infest and infect "Build it Yourself."  In order to install an AR barrel, all you have to to is tighten a single nut until the notch lines up.

But first, stick your new barrel in your upper receiver and make sure there's no play in the barrel pin notch and the front sight base is straight up and down.  If it's not, take a jeweler's file and open up the notch to bring the front sight base up straight.  You can tighten the notch to remove all slop (very important!!) merely but taking a small hammer and punch, and with the barrel in place very lightly peen down the threaded area on the "loose side" of the notch.  Be careful, use very light taps because it doesn't take much!!

Now that the front sight is straight, all you have to to is tighten one nut.  I use a short (2-3 inch) stub of a gas tube in the bolt carrier key pushed into the upper receiver to keep the circlip, weld spring, and delta ring indexed.  Spin the barrel nut on until it's hand tight, then lean on the barrel wrench until the next gas tube notch in the barrel nut lines up.  If you're using the gas tube stub in the bolt carrier, you'll see it pop through the notch.

That's it!!!  STOP!! You're done!!  Install the gas tube and handguards and go shooting!!!  The whole process should take less than 20 minutes. If it takes longer, you skin your knuckles, or you have to loosen and tighten the nut more than once, you're doing it wrong!!!

Good luck and good shooting!!!  Now, let the flaming begin...  

Thanks H.E.![:D]

"Forget the torque wrench and all those silly "tighten and loosen 17 times while waving a dead cat over the barrel nut and dancing naked in the moonlight chanting voodoo curses with your nutsack smeared with magic moly grease"

Ah Heck,thats the part I liked.[;)]

Now what the hell do I do with this tub of moly grease??????????

One stupid question... What is circlip pliers?

Thanks

Circlip pliers are what you use to install and remove the circlip.  It's that snap ring that keep the delta ring and weld spring on the barrel nut.  They look something like [url=http://www.ck-tools.com/pliers/circlip2.html]this[/url].  Also called [url=http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=45326]snap ring pliers[/url].

Ah, snap ring pliers I'm familiar with. Any particular size\shape (straight, bent, etc.) seem to work the best?

Thanks

I just use one of those inexpensive [url=http://www.mytoolstore.com/chnnlock/snapring.html]convertable internal/external snap ring pliers[/url] and they work fine.  I'm too much of a cheapskate to actually buy two pliers.  [:P]

This seems to be just the thread I was looking for!

My upper receiver is MAJORLY banged up and I would love to replace it, but I don't want to screw up my rifle.

HE, would you have that link that folks are talking about?  If I can understand the gist of it I may give it a try.

The original post is [url=http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=4&t=173151]here[/url], but the instructions above are basically a cut & paste from that, so you didn't miss anything.

Marked.

yeppers

Thank you very much HE, I used your method for my first barrel installation and worked like a champ!

Thanks for the reply!

I did have another question though.

Someone had mentioned that if your barrel had a muzzle brake on it, that it would have to be removed.  Is this true?

If so I may not be able to do the job, as my barrel has a welded muzzle brake on the end (that I like very much).

All I want to be able to do is replace my upper receiver re-using all other parts.

Thanks again,

Hoyt

No.  On a standard barrel with standard handguards, what's on the muzzle has nothing to do with mounting the barrel and the brake doesn't get in the way.  Go ahead and give it a try.

Thanks again HE, good info.

I also wondered since I would be using a bolt and barrel that had not been mounted in the new receiver, how would I go about verifying that everything is spaced properly?

I hear some vendors mention headspacing, and I see some posters say not to worry about it.  I know from my own experience working on other things that there is a reason some things should be checked.  When replacing an upper like this is there "never" a time when headspace will be out of tolerance or is it "usually" close enough?

I would really like to be able to verify this if I do this job.

Many thanks,

Hoyt

Headspace is set when the barrel extension is installed on the barrel, and has absolutely nothing to do with the upper receiver.  Using the same barrel and bolt with a different upper won't change it at all.  Don't worry about it.

Thanks HE, just what I wanted to hear!

Just to make sure I'm reading this right. I buy a Barrel from company A. Bolt and carrier from Company B. and a upper receiver from company C. and there is still no reason to check headspace?

Maybe I should ask it this way, is there ever a time when I would need to check the head space on a newly built upper?

Not exactly.  While it is prudent to check the headspace on the bolt/barrel combination that you're going to use, it's not nearly as critical as some people on the board will have you believe.  As long as your bolt closes on a live round just with pressure from the recoil spring, it's safe to shoot.

I happen to own a full set of SAMMI and Mil headspace gauges, and after checking dozens of bolts/barrels, I've found a few interesting things -

1. AR chambers are always long, usually able to swallow a No-Go gauge, and sometimes even a Field Gauge when new.  We're talking brand new factory Colts out of the box.

2. Even by mixing and matching bolts and barrels from different makers, this doesn't change, and I've never found a combination that was far enough out-of-spec to matter.



If you feel it's important enough to spend the money on a set of gauges, it's your money to spend.  But what's going to happen is you'll stick the gauge in the chamber once, find out everything is fine, then throw it in a drawer where it can gather dust.

If you want to read my long rant on headspace, go [url=http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=4&t=177948]here[/url].

Thanks again HE for the valuable info!

Finally a common sense approach to barreling AR's. Derrick Martin of "Accuracy Speaks" does the same thing when barreling his match rifles(see the Competitive AR by Glen Zediker) Why people get freaked on headspace and barrel nut torque for AR's is beyond me.  There is no way the barrel nut is going to come loose if the gas tube is in position(one notch past hand tight).

Now we need to tackle all of the over anal dogmatic cleaning regimens!

Good job HE!

T

I nominate HomoErectus to direct construction of Bush's moon base.

Do you have to have circlip pliers and a file or are these just recommended tools?  I will order the tools if I need to but don't want to waste my money.

Thanks,
Wes

You need the pliers to install the circlip (snap ring) on the barrel nut.  It holds the weld spring and delta ring in place.  Most of the time when you buy a barrel they don't come already installed.

I use those cheap, Chinese jeweler's files in the red vinyl case that you find at gun shows and swap meets, and they work just fine.  You need them if your front sight doesn't exactly sit straight in the upper receiver.

I'd say you probably want to buy both.  But you should be able to find them for less than $20 combined.



Are you saying you'd prefer that I was on a different planet?  [;)]

Where can you find the files?  At Lowes, Home Depot.....?

Thanks,
Wes

Gun shows, swap meets, and anywhere they sell tools.

For the snap ring pliars, Sears has a great one.  Sears Craftsman part number 947384.

Tagged

No, just that it would speed things up and save a bundle.

Here's a Real Life Barrel Nut Torque story that I know a few of you will appreciate:

Back around 1994 I was traveling for work when Knob Creek came around.  I didn't have the chance to go home to get my guns, but a good friend who had both dealer tables and shooting spots said he'd have some there I could shoot.  In fact, he had an M16 that needed rebarreling, and then mumbled something about would I mind working on it, etc.  When I got to Kentucky, he met me at the motel and handed me a completely disassembled M16 in a paper grocery bag.  We're talking a stripped upper and lower, along with a barrel, buttstock, pins, springs, and all the other parts rattling around in the bottom of the bag.  The bolt catch and a few other parts in the lower was assembled, but that's it.

The only tool I had was the Swiss Army Knife I always carry with me.  And while I was walking across the rain-soaked parking lot of the Shepherdsville, KY, Best Western, I happened to spot a rusty pair of slip-joint pliers laying on the pavement.  Well, that's - I'm all set!!  [:D]

Back in my room, I jammed the upper receiver into the top drawer of the little low-boy dresser, and with my back braced against the foot of the bed, pressed my feet against the drawer in an impromptu action block/vise.  I wrapped a motel towel around the barrel nut and twisted it as hard as I could and luckily a gas tube notch pretty much lined up.

The rusty pliers made a pretty good hammer, among other things, and I managed to get the rest of the M16 built up that evening, including the butter knife I "borrowed" from the coffee shop to use on the pistol grip screw.  The next day we went to the range.

The only 5.56mm ammo we had on hand was some green, dented Paragon crap that looked like it was shoveled up from a trash heap.  Man, this is just getting better and better.  What the hell.  So I loaded up a full mag and pulled the charging handle.  The bolt wouldn't close on the dented round, so I did the smart thing and beat on the forward assist as hard as I could, and after several stout whacks got the round to chamber.  Time to pull the trigger.

BANG!  Hey, it worked!!  BANG!!  It worked again!!  Ok, that's enough of this semi-auto crap, so I pushed the selector forward and pulled the trigger.  The magazine emptied and the bolt locked back.  Perfect.

I hosed a dozen or more magsfull without a single hitch.  Then my buddy walks up with a beat-up Colt carry handle scope and asks me to try it.  I drop it on and start shooting semi off-hand at a railroad tie at the far end of the range.  After a few rounds, he asks "How is it?"

I say "It's shooting a couple feet low."

"What do you have the scope set to?"

"A hundred, I guess.  Why?"

He says "Because the end of the range is 400 yards."

Oops!  I crank the dial on the BDC over to 400 and I start hitting the railroad tie 10 out of 10 times.

About that time Jeff walks up - he's a potential customer and my buddy wants him to get a little trigger time at the Creek.  No problem, I load up all 7 magazines and hand him the M16 and he hoses them as fast as he can, then walks back to my buddy's table with a smile on his face.

The rest of the weekend was uneventful.  The guy who bought the 1,000 rounds of crappy Paragon ammo said he did not want to haul any of it home, so I spent most of my time furiously burning it up in that M16.  And it worked great.

A few months later I was chit-chatting with my buddy when I asked him whatever happened to that M16?  He said Jeff bought it.  I reminded him about my motel barrel job and told him if he gave it back to me I'd be happy to do a proper rebarreling job before the paperwork went through.  Sorry, he said, but the Form 4 was already approved and the gun was delivered.

I still talk to Jeff occasionally, and to this day ten years later, he's still shooting that same M16 with my motel barrel job, and he's never had any problems with it.

Torque wrench?  We don' need no steeknin' torque wrench!  [devil]

ok... so lets describe "hand tight".   ok I'm 215 lbs...  if i drop my upper into an action block and vise it closed how much pressure do i need to apply on the barrel wrench for it to be "hand tight"?? are we talking drop my weight onto the wrench??? or maybe press down till my tri's can't push anymore???  or lugnut tight???


LittleJacek

This demonstrates the problem with the Torque Spec - that is, people think it's important.  Like torquing head bolts or lug nuts.  But on a AR, that's not what's important.

What [b]is[/b] important is the exact position of the barrel nut.  ARs will function just fine with their barrel nut tightened over a wide range of torque values, but won't work at all unless the gas tub notch lines up exactly with the bolt carrier key.

So back to your question "how much pressure do i need to apply on the barrel wrench...?"  The correct answer is "until the gas tube notch lines up."


[Edited to ficks speling misteaks.]

sweet!!



LittleJacek

Me too; but I get evil eyed by the neighbors though ,and I might end up in the oddly enough news section on the excite page.

I used a flathead screw driver to wedge each side of the snap ring onto the barrel nut, then slid it back into the slot.

Worked fine for me.

I followed these directions and it worked fine for me.

I also just used "Homo_Erectus' Barrel Install Instructions" and everything went fine.  Thanks for the info!  

Tagged.  I will be building an upper soon.

Could someone point me to a good thread, or copy/paste the text to here regarding how to remove the existing barrel?

I'm changing my Bushy Hbar bbl to an A2 bbl, and I have all the tools but still not sure what to do to take the existing bbl off.

I'm not sure of any on-line directions for that.  I'm sure they are on here somewhere though.

It's an easy enough task.  Remove the bolt carrier and charging handle.  Place the upper is your upper receiver vice block.  Remove the handguards.  Remove the gas tube roll pin using the appropriate roll pin punch.  Remove the gas tube.  You might need to twist the tube a bit if it's in really tight, but it should come right out.  Use the barrel wrench to loosen the barrel nut.  Once the barrel nut is off the barrel should just pull right out of the upper.

It really is a simple task.  You looking for more info or something more specific?