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Posted: 9/28/2004 8:11:40 PM EDT
I have been debating this idea...what do you guys think? Does anyone have any pictures? I have been envisioning a "go-to" gun and was thinking about an A1 upper with an A1 barrel (which I have headed my way as we speak!!
 ) but featuring a tele stock (Vltor specifically) based on the inevitability of changing attire...you know, being able to adjust the LOP because of thick clothing etc... TIA |
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Posted: 9/28/2004 8:12:51 PM EDT
[#1]
Get a light barrel or the balance will suck. I personally think it sucked when I tried mine, I think A1 is better.
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Posted: 9/28/2004 8:14:32 PM EDT
[#2]
Point pre-determined
 . That is one of the reasons I jumped on an A1 barrel (even a 1/12  )when I could.
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Posted: 9/28/2004 8:17:47 PM EDT
[#3]
An A1 barrel? 1:12? Ugh... Aside from that, telestock on a 20" is absurd... |
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Posted: 9/28/2004 8:19:21 PM EDT
[#4]
Why? Can you elaborate on your opinions so that I may have the chance to understand? I mean besides saying "YOU CAN'T USE HEAVY BULLETS!!!!"...yes I know that. |
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Posted: 9/28/2004 8:19:30 PM EDT
[#5]
Short carbine buffers have more muzzle jump, stick with a rifle length buffer if you can, its much more stable under rapid fire.
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Posted: 9/28/2004 8:20:00 PM EDT
[#6]
Its ugly as sin too.
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Posted: 9/28/2004 8:22:50 PM EDT
[#7]
So if the above statement is true, does it nullify the utility of a tele all together? I was under the impression they were all the craze because of their versatility, not to mention the sunset...
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Posted: 9/28/2004 8:30:15 PM EDT
[#8]
It is versatile, but I have always used collapsible stocks on my carbines, and I only ever use two positions: closed and A1 length. I like them cause the ladies put it in a notch and most of my buddies pul it out one notch from my favorite setting.
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Posted: 9/28/2004 8:36:12 PM EDT
[#9]
So is having that tele on your carbine disadvantageous, because you experience more muzzle jump?
But everybody loves tele stocks based on their versatility…evidently omitting the attempt to make a 20" more versatile... uh oh.... |
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Posted: 9/28/2004 8:38:31 PM EDT
[#10]
Its a trade off, and you need to find what works for you. FWIW, the carbines rarely make the sproinging noise of a full size buffer.
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Posted: 9/28/2004 10:04:19 PM EDT
[#11]
Someone has to have pics, I have seen it before.
I think a light weight ( A1) 20" KISS rifle with a tele would be the best SHTF gun...at least for the outdoors. BTW, the 1/12 doesn't bother me as I have a large stockpile of M193, not to mention it served us well in Nam. Oh yah, alot of the SUPER COOL SPRs have tele stocks...remember, they have an 18" barrel...
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Posted: 9/29/2004 6:58:11 AM EDT
[#12]
I have a 20" as well that I'm interested in making more versatile with some sort of varying length stock. I'd like to see some pics as well.
C |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 7:11:06 AM EDT
[#13]
I have a poster in my room of a Marine holding an M-16 with a tele-stock. Looks fine. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 7:27:16 AM EDT
[#14]
I'm with you somewhat, but it sure does look cool with a Dissy type setup. Of course the Beta mag helps in this particular pic: 
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Posted: 9/29/2004 7:35:45 AM EDT
[#15]
Plain and simple, it is God-awful. If you want any sort of use out of the stock than the telestock is far and away the worst thing you could opt for on ANY black rifle. I refer to comfort and cheek weld in particular. If anything, consider an adjustable stock, e.g. Magpul, Vltor, etc. The ONLY reasons for a telestock's existence (IMO) is for a purist's classic looing stock rifle, and for bottom of the barrel cheapskates.
I have a 20" and "all the rage" for me was the FS and bayonet lug. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 7:40:58 AM EDT
[#16]
That's one cool looking Dissy.
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Posted: 9/29/2004 7:42:17 AM EDT
[#17]
OK I see where the problem lies. You consider any adjustable stock for an AR to be a telestock. From an operational point of view you could be correct as all the high-dollar adjustable stocks telescope in and out like the original telestock. Many of us draw a line in the sand between the standard issue carbine stock the "telestock" and the better crafted and more expensive "adjustable stocks". If you want to put a monstrous "Frankenstock" like an adjustable clubfoot on your 20" rig you have the features you want, a better choice than a "telestock" and it doesn't look like a bat's ass. Just don't put a standard telestock on the damn thing!!! |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:16:05 AM EDT
[#18]
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:20:00 AM EDT
[#19]
<tag>
I'll slap one together when I get home and post pics. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:25:22 AM EDT
[#20]
Oh I beg to differ Jack. Greentip's rifle is a thing of beauty: |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:39:22 AM EDT
[#21]
Nah, take 2 of those rifles, but put clubfoot stock on one and then compare them. No contest. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 8:47:04 AM EDT
[#22]
Ive learned to hate fixed stocks.
This is one of those personal preference things to which there is no right answer
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Posted: 9/29/2004 9:02:22 AM EDT
[#23]
For those times when a 20" wants to feel like a 16", use a tele-stock.
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Posted: 9/29/2004 9:14:53 AM EDT
[#24]
Fixed stocks are retarded.
Go for versatility, and put on a telestock. If you're concerned about the buffer issue, go for an HBuffer or even 9mm buffer. It's not going to matter so much anyway; you've got the 20" gas system. The "issues" are entirely overblown. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 9:33:01 AM EDT
[#25]
As usual, Lumpy to the rescue. Seems there are fewer and fewer people on here choosing function over cosmetics. Regarding more “muzzle flip” with a carbine, I say someone isn’t managing recoil correctly. I certainly don’t mean that in a flaming or mean spirited way. There are many factors at play here. If you are wearing thick clothing and are using a stock that won’t allow you to properly shoulder the rifle (because it’s too long), do you really think you’re going to effectively manage the recoil? I ran my 20” government profile with a carbine stock for a day. Just didn’t like the feel, so I went with an A1 stock. Just my opinion though. I say try it and if it works go with it. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 9:39:35 AM EDT
[#26]
The balance will be off but it will work fine. The aesthetics to me a awkward but your opinion is the only one that matters when it comes to how good something looks.
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Posted: 9/29/2004 10:07:23 AM EDT
[#27]
So what weight carbine buffer would be the most reliable with the 20" gas system? A normal carbine weight I am thinking.
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Posted: 9/29/2004 10:45:05 AM EDT
[#28]
If you like having a collapsible on a 20" then stand up to peer-pressure and install one!
 Who cares what somebody on the internet thinks it looks like? |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 11:16:48 AM EDT
[#29]
i always thought people put fixed stocks on their rifles because it wasn't a preban.....
i figure the 11 pounds of shit i ,and damn near everyone else, have hanging off the front of my 16" causes more of a balance problem than a 20" with a collapsable/adjustable (it's the same goddamn thing!) would. don't like the way it looks? are we starting queer eye for the black rifle? "bunch of slack jawed faggots around here" |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 11:56:07 AM EDT
[#30]
.... /\
... / . \ .. /- - \ ... | | ... | | ... | | ... | | ... | | HAHAHAHAHAHAHAhe also, that dissy with the beta looks like a big weiner now i understand why all my friends think ar's are "cock-extensions" and generally an overkill (until they shoot mine, of course) |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 12:04:27 PM EDT
[#31]
Most of the haters in this thread have shown their ass and lack of knowledge.
With the advent of the Magpul 93A there really is little use for a fixed stock of any sort. The wobble and cheek weld issues are non-existant with this stock. The only thing a fixed stock does that this one can't (for the momen) is allow you to store things in the butt, however I never did that with my A2s anyway. Other than a Cavarms, I won't be going back to a fixed stock, and intend to mount a SPR/SAM/Recce/Varmint upper on the exact same lower, with Magpul, as my M4. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 1:03:21 PM EDT
[#32]
fixed stocks are fine if yon never have to worry about length of pull due to gear.
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Posted: 9/29/2004 5:49:15 PM EDT
[#33]
Excactly my point... BTW nice rifle.
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Posted: 9/29/2004 6:23:12 PM EDT
[#34]
Add an ARMS 40 and you've got what I want (but cant afford) to build Nice rifle 
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Posted: 9/29/2004 7:11:13 PM EDT
[#35]
thanks guys. i tried running BUIS with the TA01 but it puts the scope to far forward for me. at 6-4 i need all the room i can get! i wish trijicon would make a TA11 with the TA01 reticle.
i know the old A1 skinny 1in12 barrel is not the lastest fade in barrel flavors but all i shoot is 55gr bullets and it makes for a lighter weapon but i've tried the colt Hbar route and the groups weren't any different. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 7:15:05 PM EDT
[#36]
you could try a Magpul stock. At full extension it's actually LONGER than A2. |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 10:38:58 PM EDT
[#37]
I am glad there are others who appreciate the 1/12 A1 profile barrels...
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Posted: 9/29/2004 10:50:45 PM EDT
[#38]
Because heavy bullets are 'where it's at' as far as .223 & accuracy are concerned... And for 1:12, 62gr (weather M855 or Wolf) is 'too heavy'... Unless you want to be perminantly confined to 55gr and lighter, at least get a 1:9 barrel, prefferably 1:7. As for the CAR stock, with it comes the CAR buffer, which is designed for a CAR sized rifle... On a full-sized gun, the full-sized buffer provides a smoother action & more controllable fire... |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 10:52:35 PM EDT
[#39]
The muzzle jump issue is more of a problem with the 20" gas system, and a 14.5-16" bbl is short enough that you're not really looking for accuracy anyway... |
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Posted: 9/29/2004 10:59:13 PM EDT
[#40]
People put fixed-stocks on 20" guns because 20" military rifles have fixed (A2 length) stocks... Of course, I'm the kind of guy with the EXTRA weaight in his 20" stock for balance, so... |
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Posted: 9/30/2004 2:22:08 AM EDT
[#41]
Well how about an ACE Boom Tube? Maybe they'll start making them again since the ban is gone. Damn ATF said they were collapsible even though it takes an allen key and after you cut it to length you only get about one inch of travel. I cut mine o the length of pull I like when shooting in a T-Shirt and then cut the foam back the thickness of an Interceptor vest. Works like a charm. In fact I think it's gonna go on my M16 for my upcoming deployment.
 sorry for the crappy pick I'll try to get a better one when I go home on leave |
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Posted: 11/6/2004 5:14:19 AM EDT
[#42]
Does the 6 position stock have more spread than the 4? In other words, does the 6 go shorter and longer than the 4?
Thanks M4-AK |
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Posted: 11/6/2004 10:52:54 AM EDT
[#44]
chewbacca
I think this is the gun you were refering to in your original post. I also like the A1 barrel ( owned 8 ) Folks here seem to thing that use of the M193 55 gr bullets are a problem. I think otherwise. The Govt. doesn't issue me ammo and I find most of us shoot the 55 gr bullets to the exclusion of others. If you are a long range competive marksman, well that's another discussion. This rifle is very handy and points well. Good to go as shown. You would be pleased. I actually prefer this rifle with the ACE stock for looks and feel. |
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Posted: 11/6/2004 11:46:53 AM EDT
[#45]
I think greentips' rifle is MUY cool looking:
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Posted: 11/6/2004 3:08:32 PM EDT
[#46]
+1 |
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Posted: 11/6/2004 4:51:43 PM EDT
[#47]
Looks like S**T
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Posted: 11/6/2004 4:59:43 PM EDT
[#48]
YEAH! Who cares if there are FUNCTIONAL REASONS for doing it. |
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Posted: 11/6/2004 5:04:38 PM EDT
[#49]
You sound like one of those metro guys who paints their nails.... Anyways I was over at the shop today and threw a 20" upper on a lower that had a tele-stock on it. The upper was a govt profile flat-top. #1 No balance problems, and it swung very nicely. I suspected that it may over swing due to the weight when changing from point to point but it didnt seem to. #2 Having the long sight radious is great, I discovered that a 16" standard sight radius totally covers a man size target at 300 yards. With the 20" you will be able to see the target around the sight! #3 The recoil impulse on a 16" is totally different than a 20". Its not a matter of recoil control as some stated earlier its simple physics. A 16" gas system is operating at nearly double the gas pressure that a 20" is. Not to mention that a 20" has greatly improved terminal ballistics. #4 I found in a carbine class last month that when shooting with armor and an LBE having an adjustable stock will enable you to stay square with your target keeping your armor and plates facing foward "where they need to be" So quit crying that it doesnt "Look Cool" having a tele-stock on any rifle is a very practical solution.
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Posted: 11/6/2004 5:33:14 PM EDT
[#50]
This reminds me a bit of the pre-AWBsunset debate, where it was discussed that after the setting, use/development of adjustable stocks would drop like a rock because people only wanted them because they couldn't have them.
Now, after the setting, people like me can afford to have a full featured rifle for the first time(woo hoo!!!!) and I have to say I wouldn't be able to go without an adjustable stock on ANY rifle. I'm 5'11", my wife is 4'11", I like to shoot sometimes just for acuracy, sometimes for fast tapping fun.  The ability to adjust a stock to fit the current use and situation, prone, sitting, or standing, is something I cant beleive I went so long without!!!!!!An M4 stock will definitly be on the 20" I build! Tex78 |
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