An older '99 or '00 truck (pick your favorite brand) that has had most things replaced with new parts like transmission, motor, alternator, radiator, water pump, etc, all the things that break. the only difference is the truck will have squeaks and rattles and scratches and dings. Lets say you will reinvest $20,000 back into the old gal. Truck is paid for but needs to be refreshed. Not a beater, just 15 years old.

Or a brand new '15 truck (pick your brand) that everything is new, no squeaks, everything works well (it's new for God sakes) but it costs $35,000 ($40,000 after taxes,interest, Higher registration/insurance) You don't have the cash to buy outright so financing is the only way you can swing it.

This is not a brand war, this is a financial consideration/ economic collapse, pole.

Beyond the cost factor, you'll have time investment. The old truck will have to be torn down, new parts installed (whether you do it or a mechanic does it),

Hoeever, the new truck is right now, all ready to go, but will financially set you back double the money.

If there is a financial downturn, such as the 08 collapse, but this time there are no bail outs, no rescue or free government money, the clock has run out for money as we know it,

Everything you have is all you will likely have for the foreseeable future.

You feel you have 3 years to get your affairs in order to prepare. (you have the home,food, guns and medicine thing worked out already)

Voting here for something a little older, cheaper, with an established parts base (aftermarket and factory), but not 15 years. Maybe 10 y/o at the most.

I don't care for the new stuff, especially if it's a new model or generation. You get to be the test dummy to find the defects and quirks then.

That, and me being extra paranoid, I have no urge to have all the new-fangled electronic crap they cram into your vehicle these days. OnStar, long-term recording black boxes, transmitting black-boxes, back-up cameras, what have you. Some of it is optional, some mandated.

The less you have in your vehicle, the less that can go wrong.

I vote for the older w/refresh.  The older stuff is generally simpler and easier to work on, but that's a broad statement.  I'm basing my vote on the fact that older vehicles generally have parts available, and a good history of "this breaks a lot, and here's how to fix it." Parts are generally cheaper as well.  Of course, if you're projecting your new vehicle as a keeper, 20  years in the future your new vehicle will be the vintage I've described here.  IN that case, a popular brand will probably have good legacy support.

There's a thread by Yankee prepped I believe, that advocates saving your money and achieving greater economic prosperity by saving, etc

Depends on "reality".  Your job, other present cars, income, etc. do you  need truck or want a new truck?

I am cheap, so I advocate maintaining what you have and saving the money. Skip total overhaul, just maintain w a little bit of preventive action.  

Fantasy time: in a recession w ridiculous inflation, you don't want the vehicle repo'd. In total collapse, you will find resources that are abandoned etc.

Older truck.

While that makes total sense in times of plenty, or a close to home vehicle, I'm not very comfortable in relying on the ability to get service or parts when things start looking like Argentina or Greece in a few years.

Fantasy? Perhaps, but all of preparedness is part speculation part fantasy..........until it isn't.

And there is PLENTY of information out there by a wide, wide variety of smart people that all warn the music will be stopping very soon on the world economy and things that we take for granted will just evaporate or become prohibitively expensive or you'll have to deal with shady black market types.

I'm interested in avoiding as much of all of that as possible with a little forethought and planning.

70's land rover...biggest one they made with a military hitch and a mil-spec trailer..4x6' range..

Older truck, probably 5 years older than the given option.

The early to mid '90s GM trucks run forever and are cheap to maintain, I'm a ford guy but given the chance I'll choose the early '90s 1500 all day.

Recusance,
Relax, breath in through your nose and out through your mouth...count to ten...there ok.

Lots and Lots and Lots of businesses depend on a regular pay check.
Allow me to present the electric company as an example.  Would you pay them if you had not had electric power for the past month.  No: You would tell them something like "Y'all go on and cut my service an' when y'all get ready to deliver 'lectricity then we'll talk."

So the electric company keeps up deliveries because they want their pay day.

The parts maker has power to make parts.  Oh...He wants a payday too.

You see even in the Great Depression and in the civil war in what was Yugoslavia there was an economy.

That said:
TJ has some good posts about keeping a truck for a couple decades or more.  IIRC he finally let a truck go after it was well old enough to buy booze because the 8700 rubber hoses and gaskets failed of age.

You keep a 15 year old truck and you got 6 or 7 years or less before some plastic gives way.

Before you sez "But my truck is old skool" check out the drama that jeep owners  went through when the plastic vacuum switches of the 4x4 shattered.  1970s Jeeps...no computer

You get a new truck and keep it well maintained.  Well then you may have 2 and a half decades before you have to concern yourself  that the truck wont run.

Option C:
Keep your old truck for a couple years and put money in a truck kitty.  If a deal comes your way, then you will be in a better position to jump on it.

Not sure where that came from. kinda set the wrong tone for an other wise good post.

In fact your post would have been much better received with out it.

But, fine, thanks.

Early to mid 90's Ford or Chev (Not Dodge IME due to terrible EFI component life).

Parts for years, easy to clean and rebuilt parts, easy to work on and diagnose EFI systems, FUCK TONS of parts commonality for the gas engines of each (I.E. Some Ford parts span from 1970-1998)

Not a Diesel guy, but a the older 1st Gen Cummins are pretty hot for their mechanical injection that can tolerate a pretty wide range of fuel from what I understand. (Not an expert, don't quote me )



From what I've been picking up, new vehicles are becoming less reliable due to emerging tech, pushing the limits on functionality and light construction, and more interdependent systems.

Basically, the earlier EFI trucks have robust, easy to repair systems with loner lasting components because they are heavily built, clunky, and preform one operation.



A early 90's truck with about 3-4K put into it, and a spare engine, tranny and diff sourced and restored over time ready to pop back in would IMHO outlast a late 90's early 2000's truck with 20k put into by a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG time.

Fine, but I am as chill as they come.

Telling me to calm down is like telling the Buddha to relax......

Whats so wrong with the late 90's trucks? Debating replacing 350 in mine.

If it is your favorite truck ever, then keep it and fix what breaks

Nothing wrong with that.

Expectations.

What are your expectations of truck "use"? Commuting to a job? Does it exist in the end? Scouting?

The reality is that the use it sees today, would likely not be the use it sees in a total collapse.

Nothing is happening, if your debt to income ration supports a new truck, go for it. We are indulging fantasy.

That being said, I have a few vehicles...eggs not in one basket.

If the world ended..lol, I would go to HD and take the rental PU w aluminum bed...I'd throw $20 in an envelope to cover the rental

One thing to consider is that starting about 2000 or so, a lot of parts started becoming "dealer only". In addition, the manufacturers started planning for parts availability of only 10 years. My current 2000 Dodge Dakota is starting to run into those issues where a replacement is a "dealer only" part, if one can be found at all. On the bright side, I've got 320k on my truck.

I'm thinking the older the vehicle, the more likely it will come apart due to rust moreso than some mechanical breakdown. In some areas, rust starts in earnest in about 4 years. I remember visiting down in Port Isabel and Padre Island how many of the locals drover newer cars. The only older cars seemed to be Poniac Fieros and Corvettes (plastic and fiberglass bodies).

While I'm not necessarily saying go buy new, especially since the minute you drive it off the lot, it loses resale value of 10-25%. It would seem to me to be a better idea to get a 1-3 year old vehicle where you still have a number of years of certain parts availaiblity, assuming S doesn't HTF. If it does, likely as not, all the foreign built parts will become unavailable first, then UAS sourced ones.

I have had topics kicked to GD that were (imo) a bit more appropriate than this one.



Happy Memorial Day!

If you're spending $40K on a truck, you are buying a lot of things your older truck wouldn't have.  It isn't an apples to apples comparison.  Nothing wrong with getting some toys thrown in on the deal, and I would much rather have a nicely optioned truck than a stripped down one, but you would be looking at a base model if you want to do a fair comparison to an old truck.  Even if you replace all the major stuff, you will still be finding minor issues that will cause problems.  I would probably buy a cheaper new truck over either of those options.  If that isn't in the cards, I guess new would still be preferable simply due to the fact that you are less likely to have issues as well as better fuel efficiency, safety, etc.

Don't forget the mission of the thread, it's not just buying A truck, it's buying the last truck you'll ever own.  





How well is a brand new truck going to hold up for 10, 20, 30 years +.  Early to mid 90's trucks have shown that they can do so with 300K+ miles and in some cases with no major repairs.



A lot of brand new vehicles are not hanging in there like that, especially given the move back to fuel economy or making lots of power over just simple robust construction.  



 

1 is none!
I went with 2 fairly identical f-350s 4x4 V10 low mileage and modified for durability and 2 jeep XJs same with 1 full set of tires on rims.
One of each stays in town and at the BOL.
I consider them disposable is SHTF it doesn't take much to disable a vehicle.
Now my wife has a new f-150 with an ecoboost that will probably do the job but that's her truck.

But how much fuel do we have stored? That is the real factor. I really want some rugged little 50mpg vehicle to add to my list as a
commuter car as shit gets bad but not over the top. VW jetta wagon?
F-350 - barricade running and last minuet hauling of gear to BOL
Jeep XJ - patrol / go anywhere.
Something super economical for not over the top but its pretty bad running errands with out using all the stored fuel.

I am hoping that a REAL electric vehicle comes on the market before all this as I can produce electricity alot easer than gas.

Just my musings on the subject.

Having owned both, I trust the newer ones.   The mid-90s trucks still kicking around are the exception, rather than the rule. You are pretty much left with the "lucky ones" by now.  They were much more rust prone and much less safe in a crash.  The trucks today are still using mature technology, so there is already a lot of experience with them.  You know what you're getting when you buy a hemi. They're already out there with hundreds of thousands of miles.  They've been around 12 years.

I have a 98 Cherokee. I'll drive it until I can't fix it anymore. Parts are easy to get and it goes anywhere. It has just enough electronics to be a pain in my ass, but nowhere near as complicated as something built now.

You have to really sit down and figure a few things out with stuff like this.



For instance, if you go and build yourself an awesome 4x4 ford f350 from 1995 and swap maybe a cummins in it because you think it is the best engine choice and you mod the heck out of the vehicle to be your perfect vehicle with no rust and coated undercarriage so rust is just something you check for and upkeep each spring, what do you do when someone hits it and totals it out?



New stuff is cool, I rented a newer f150 last year for a quicky road trip because my vehicles make for slow road trips.  Nice fancy trucky.  I am sure it will be fine for a bit but dang does it have a lot of complicated stuff on it.  And have you seen the cost difference in rebuilding something like a 3 speed automatic vs. some of these fancy 4 speed automatics?  Yeah I know we are now messing with 9 speed automatics and constant velocity transmissions or whatever they are called.  Constantly variable?  Beyond my brain.



And play with tires.  New stuff sure does come with some impressive load ratings and what not but dang do some of those tires cost a bit of cash.  And yeah tires are tires but I can usually find deals on my 15 inch tires for the half tons and as long as the one tons are something other than that nutty 16.5 or whatever rim size I ran into one time I can live with them as well.



How about insurance?  Gonna carry full insurance on your new toy?  Gonna try to insure your modified older vehicle for full replacement value?



To some extent I could sort of see getting a couple of the fiberglass bodies they had and may still have for some vehicles.  I know for fords the fenders and stuff are still around for the prerunning stuff.



Is this setup something you can work on?



Are you going to modify the new vehicle if it does not work the way you want?  Is the new vehicle something you want to keep forever and deal with upkeep on it?



I have a rusty 1995 ford and it is going to live for a long while but no way would I call it a last vehicle.  It needed a lot of work when I got it and it still needs some odds and ends here and there.  But I can drive it to work everyday if I wish to do so.



With the junkyards selling out to scrappers and going the way of the dinosaur I am careful about thinking about what would happen if someone hit it and wrecked a corner of it.



I know its value is low to the insurance so they would want to junk it.  I would want my parts back I have put on it and would just about have to go buy another one to make all those parts worth that sort of hassle.  With receipts I might come out sort of ok and call it a day, but overall I doubt it.



Newer vehicles can be more efficient and should be safer in a wreck but that sort of stuff brings complications and complexity with it.



I wanted a simple older vehicle that is easy to work on and therefore either I can do it or a shop laughs at it and says that is an easy fix.



Today's new stuff makes me shake my head.  Just the new canbus systems and I gave up counting computers in em a long time ago.



It won't tow much and it is a specific job sort of vehicle but a jeep wrangler, cj or whatever you prefer, can be built from a parts catalog.  And fiberglass body perhaps for no rust on the body.



I have been told the older mustangs are similar.



I don't know if the older broncos would be the same or not.



I have been messing with the ford lately, so fords are what I know.



I used to know general motors.  Their boxy body style ran into the 91 model year for the big blazer, crewcab, and burbans.  The regular cab pickup changed out in 88 for halftons I think.



General discussion had a nice thread on a fella who bought a 6.0 diesel ford not running and he rebuilt it.  Fixed all known major engine issues and has a nice running truck for not much money, but time is worth a lot.



Basically if you really want to play last vehicle you will be rebuilding whatever you mess with unless you are older and expect to be dead before a rebuild is needed.



The rubber would be the parts that go first but like I said earlier some kid going to fast or some drunk on the road might wipe out your toy.



Now what?

IMHO, this is another fantasy thread.

If the economy goes to crap...

And if you have a store of value stashed away...

You can get trucks, cars, airplanes, skate boards ---all day long.


The issue MIGHT be where you get the Go Juice -to put in them.

As well as how to keep folks at bay, when you drive down the road -with envious Sheeple staring at you.

Ready to give you an envelope with $20 and 'rent' your ride from you   Or worse...


So, live your life, drive what you want NOW, SAVE your $$$$, and if things go South, buy what you need, if ANYTHING...

At FIRESALE prices!




When the SHTF economically is when you'll be able to make the best decision for your ride solution, -in the context of this discussion.

IF you've been prudent and used Common Sense.


There'll be so much neat stuff for sale at fantastic prices, like there was in the 2007+ economic 'troubles', our heads will be spinning -again.


It probably won't be too long again, either.  

We covered it all. Just bought a new Silverado. Still have the '99 1 ton Dodge Cummins. A 71 Land cruiser with the only electronics being a HEI dist. in a small block.

Are you replacing the used truck with crappy after market or quality components?

As for my self new or used It doesn't really matter as long as its serviceable or able to swap out. IIRC the new Malibu doesn't have a serviceable power steering pump

I agree with EXPY.  My wife drives a 2000 SUV and I drive a 2001 4wd truck.  We bought them new and they get used daily and at times hard just to get home on any given day.

I would like something old to drop one of my Brothers new engines in, like a Scrambler or old full sized Jeep.  If I bought new, the Ford aluminum truck would be high on my list.  Next daily drivers will come during economic opportunity.

I won't touch anything made after 94, as they're nothing but a jumble of electronics that fail, emissions crap and custom easy break parts.



1970 Kaiser-Jeep M35A2 please, or I'll stick with my 90 Dodge Ram (well before the era of the plasticy bubble "ram" they make now).

Depends on your mechanical skills. I have none so I'd buy newer

My 1997 Dodge Ram with 250,000 miles on it that is going in for new paint next week and will also be receiving new carpet and a new center console will have to serve as my answer.

Coincidentally enough, I have one of those, too.

Funny, what you describe is exactly what my 90 dodge ram was.
 

Well now we know that you didn't pony up for the Cummins engine option.

LOL Clearly!     Thoguh, for $700 on Craigslist, it was a nice little truck after putting about $200 in electronics back into the engine.







As well as after blacking out all the F'd up chrome, mismatched wheels, and such.  





Ended up driving it for 6-7 months them sold for $1000 on CL to a kid that wanted a 90's gasser to turn into a street truck.  He freaking LOVED the thing. It was pretty zippy with a 360 too.



 

Nice! That looks like a pretty decent truck and a heck of a deal for $900 and a little elbow grease!

I just went through the exact same debate. The newer old stuff wins. Had a 94 F150 4x4 with the 351 in it. Put a ton of money into making it more reliable - putting better suspension, 4wd, transmission and cooling system upgrades,  and badass tires. Always had stupid little issues with it. Airbags, idle speed, cruise control, and the interiors are generally just shit and rattle bad.
Father in law bought a brand new pickup, and I got a 2000 F150 5.4 4x4 as a hand down. As soon as I drove that one for the first time, the 94 was gone. No comparison what so ever in power, ride comfort, reliability. The 2000 basically already had all the upgrades installed from the factory that I did to the 94. No upgrades needed other than tires.
I also have a newer diesel pickup. The 2000 is just as good minus some power and electronic doo-dads. I actually enjoy driving the 2000 more as I don't worry about it as much and it draws less attention.
So I'd find a good running, low mileage 2000's pickup, maintain the hell out of it (they don't need much), put the best tires you can afford on it, and call it good. When you start to rebuild stuff, I believe you lose some reliability. Electrical connections break and bolts don't always get torqued right when removing and replacing shit under the hood. Wires don't end up in the correct wire looms, wires wear through on engine components, electrical shorts happen. No reason at all to rebuild that stuff when there are plenty of low mileage older pickups out there.
Take all the money you saved from not rebuilding stuff, and save for a low mileage 2015 pickup to buy after your 2000 pickup dies in 2030. Lifetime pickup plan solved.

I vote old truck if you have money to fix her up and keep her running. I have a 1997 GMC Sierra with the Vortec 350 and it runs like new but only has 85,000 miles on her. I take really good care of her and she lives in the garage until I need a truck for something. This vintage(1988-1998) of GM truck was the best they ever made. The shit they make today is garbage. Here is mine. She is pushing 20 years old and never have any problems....ever:

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I say new if those are the only two options... I maybe do not get the refresh thing, are these things you have to do to get it running, or just to refresh it? It would seem odd to me to replace everything if it really did not need it. I would either go for buy older and repair as needed, or buy something a few years older for much less than new. My thinking is 15 years from now a new vehicle will be 15 years old, something already 15 years old will be 30 years old. I just see problems, suspension, exhaust, electrical, throw in how many parts have been replaced and I see a mess. With a new car you never really know how it will stand the test of time, it's not my area, but I see it with other products, I never go by brand, I see quality issues within each brand  line. If you see end times... maybe go with old and reliable, especially is you can do it yourself. In any event why spend 40k on something you have to finance? If you do not have the cash is it really a wise purchase? I would say some sort of financial preps might be more important than a 40k truck, even if you have food, water, housing, etc squard away,

I like the idea of keeping an older truck going, especially if you can do 95% of the work yourself.  If your paying a garage to do it then there is no point.

The problem with my AO is rust.  Any vehicle that is daily driven in our area will start to be rusty after about 10 years.  Most 20 year old used vehicles that were daily driven in my AO are completely rusted out and very difficult to work on.

I do about 20~25K miles per year.  If I can get 8-10 years out of my current vehicle with only normal up-keep and maintenance I will be happy.  I drive to many miles to try and keep an old vehicle going reliably.  I can't have a vehicle down for several days with no way to get to work, and reg + insurance on two gets expensive.  One good vehicle for me makes the most since financially.

If you can work on your vehicle, and don't drive crazy miles, and like your current vehicle then keep at it.  If not then get yourself a new one.  

I wouldn't base primary commuting vehicle choice on a possible SHTF.  If you want to do it with a secondary "toy" well then I understand that.

Heck I have been seriously considering getting a Mitsubishi mirage 3cyl car for commuting.  I think this would also make a good "SHTF" or degrading society car.
3rd world based design.  
Robust simple engine design.
Soft suspension for rough roads.
Slow but gets crazy MPG (50ish)
Basic interior design with a flat level rear seat.  Not comfortable but great for stuffing gear or multiple people back there.
14" tires which are very cheap to replace.

All of the above things I think are good, but for modern America, many see as downfalls.  Slow, poor handling, not luxurious or super comfortable etc...
You can get one brand new for less then 12K with a warranty.  I would keep my older truck and get a small car for every day activities.  
If the economy goes to shit you've got a vehicle that can make the most out of the precious JUCE!  Of course it wont be as cool as a huge lifted Jeep or maybe a Ford Falcon interceptor for TEOTWAWKI so there is that...  

Depends on the tonnage. I dislike the ride in my '14 150 compared to my 03 250. I like the stiff ride in a truck, the '15 is a bit better, but not like a heavy duty. So if I could have had the older truck and higher load rating I would jump at it. Not because I hate technology because the ecoboost in the 150 is great, but I just like a bit of old tech (like rocking a manual to get it unstuck)

Edit I forgot the electronic locking rear end is the bees knees.

I would say older and more established is the better choice. By older I mean a lot more than 15 years old though. Keep in mind that if an economic shtf occurred, something that is rugged and good on fuel is your best bet.

I lie your musings.

I too have considered exactly the same things. I have a 1999 Suburban, a 2003 4 Runner and a 2001 Camry. all cover the basics........but they are getting long in the tooth. Both have around 150,000 miles. Not junk mind you, I plan to hang on to them till the wheels fall off, (somewhere around the 300,000 mark)

The fuel thing is the Achilles heal of any vehicle, you could have the best, bad ass truck alive, but without fuel (or a way to make fuel) it's just scrap iron.

I am no mechanic, and I have never been into diesel (great fuel, just no experience dealing with them) so I will stick to my gasers.

biere and you make heap big wisdom....

A car is something you get and throw away in ten years. I prefer to buy them when they're already about two years old to stave off major depreciation costs.

If you can't afford to pay cash for the new truck, and you have concerns, or awareness of the financial dangers we face, you are insane to even consider buying a brand new, $40,000 truck.  

Let me reiterate:    You say you have a self imposed timeline of three years to get your financial house in order.

You don't have several hundred thousand in cash lying around.  

Given your concerns, it sounds like you know you need to just fix the truck you have.

I thought we had found our last truck.
We had a 2001 Dodge Ram 1500, regular cab, V-6, 5spd standard, vinyl seats, vinyl flooring, Manual everything.
We intentionally got it this way because we had just bought land out in the country and wanted something easy to clean when it got muddy. - just hose it out.

167,000 trouble free miles - just tires and oil changes.

July 2013 - cement truck rolls onto it at an intersection.
Now what?

We bought a slightly used 2012 Ram 1500 QuadCab - 1yr old, 11K miles, still under factory warranty, $39K truck for $27K cash (after TTL).
Still had new truck smell in it, and so far, no problems.
plus the HEMI in this thing gets better mileage than the old 2001 V-6.

TLDR version:
You don't know what is going to happen in the future,
and I think your choice of either brand new (pay 40K) or old (and invest 20K) is a little false.
I mean, you could actually keep your old truck and use the $20K to buy a fairly new truck and have 2 trucks.

First year depreciation is huge on vehicles.
So, you can get your $40k truck  for a lot less by buying just a couple of years old.

Just went through this mental exercise myself and the bottom line for me was I wanted something that would last longer than my body.

Don't see myself doing engine changes etc at age 70 or 75.

Went new 4x4 that my heirs can worry about.