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Posted: 4/23/2017 6:23:15 PM EDT
[#1]
I believe the theory is that you will be of a different mind if you get there so you will be understanding and ok with the situation.
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Posted: 4/23/2017 6:29:38 PM EDT
[#2]
Being transformed the things of this world will no longer matter to us.
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Posted: 4/23/2017 6:35:40 PM EDT
[#3]
I don't think you're supposed to notice the plot holes.
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Posted: 4/23/2017 7:03:05 PM EDT
[#4]
Who needs loved ones or even fun when you can spend an eternity singing in grovelling praise of some celestial dictator? No one has yet to offer an enticing picture of heaven, let alone manage to justify the behavior of the so-called all loving sociopath. The best they can manage is to say that it is not hell.
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Posted: 4/23/2017 7:16:47 PM EDT
[#5]
You stop believing in Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny at some point in your life - the story of "Jesus" and "God" is literally no different. That includes the make believe "heaven and hell."
It's a fairy tale that helped primitive mankind explain life. There's actually a semetary near where I grew up that is separate from the main cemetery - it was purpose designed for babies that died before they were baptised (they ended up in "limbo"). The sad and absolutely pathetic thing is that so many people still believe this bullshit. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 11:02:44 AM EDT
[#6]
Are you kidding? If I entered the afterlife and found out I'd be spending eternity surrounded by my family, then I'd know for sure that I was in Hell.
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Posted: 4/24/2017 11:11:12 AM EDT
[#7]
Quoted:
I know this will likely turn into a mess, but to those that believe I have an honest question. As a precursor, I am a non-believer, haven't been to church since I was a kid. If heaven is supposed to be paradise, free of pain and sorrow, how can that be reconciled with the possibility of loved ones that have fallen off the path, or with non-believers not being allowed in? It seems like if your family was excluded you would spend eternity full of sorrow, amplified more if they were suffering in hell. I'm reading a slight, but very common, misconception on Heaven. A lot of people focus on people in heaven. Loved ones, dogs, which people, what the people will look like, what the people will do, people, people, people. Heaven is all about the Glory of God. You are literally in the presence of God. God is Love, so there will be a kind of love, excitement, contentment, and celebration that we can't imagine, yet we long for. Without getting too deep, people decide for themselves to be separated from God here on earth. God doesn't coerce anyone, so in a sense, He honors their decision. The other people, who seek God, have faith in Jesus, still screw everything up every day, but are not trusting in their own screw-ups, but trusting in His Grace, are not separated from God here, and won't be in Heaven. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 11:12:09 AM EDT
[#8]
Your life and beliefs have consequences. This is why believers should be encouraging those family members to seek Christ. Those who don't, don't. That is a tragedy in our Earthly selves. When we arrive we will have other things on our plate. I have family I don't think will be there. They have passed already. I have had friends who won't be there, they have passed already. Sad, now. Reminding myself to work harder.
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Posted: 4/24/2017 11:17:11 AM EDT
[#9]
The glory of God is the purpose of heaven. If the literal creator of all things is before you, you have nothing to love other than Him. He is, as a Christian and follower of our Lord Jesus Christ, to be our love.
As Christ said, let the dead bury their dead. And as an apostle said, for me to live is Christ, to die is gain. All these books of seeing family in heaven without the glory of God are pure lies and fiction. Ancestral worship. Christ is all in all. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 11:20:15 AM EDT
[#10]
A- good did not create all things
B- many have said heaven is different for everyone. C- nobody knows, and one can say anything they want. Know way to prove them wrong. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 11:22:45 AM EDT
[#11]
Read the book troll.
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Posted: 4/24/2017 11:32:49 AM EDT
[#12]
From the biblical point of view, families and spouses are earthly institutions; they aren't needed in heaven. It also explains that some things are beyond understanding, and as wonderful as these earthly institutions are (when going right) what is in store for us is much better. Things that don't sound too interesting to us now, such as constantly praising and worshiping God will be awesome. (It's what we were created to do, by the way.)
It's a hard concept to wrap your head around, even for believers. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 11:34:43 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Read the book troll. If so, the answer to his question isn't in there. If you assert that it is, post or IM me where. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 11:36:59 AM EDT
[#14]
One does not have to reconcile fantasy, when they allow themselves to admit that it is simply fantasy, and nothing more.
A.W.D. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 11:39:01 AM EDT
[#15]
God chooses who he wishes to. Already decided before the foundations of earth.
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Posted: 4/24/2017 11:39:11 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
by "the book" do you mean the bible? If so, the answer to his question isn't in there. If you assert that it is, post or IM me where. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 11:41:15 AM EDT
[#17]
The Bible says very little about heaven. It says a whole lot about Earth. Don't miss the point.
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Posted: 4/24/2017 4:36:19 PM EDT
[#18]
If you are a non-believer why do you care?
If you are sincere, then I would recommend you make an appointment with a local priest or bible study group for your answers. I doubt few here, including myself, could articulate an answer to satisfy you. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 5:13:57 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you are a non-believer why do you care? If you are sincere, then I would recommend you make an appointment with a local priest or bible study group for your answers. I doubt few here, including myself, could articulate an answer to satisfy you. Motivated enough to take time out of my schedule to talk to someone in real life, not really. GD is an interesting cross section for stuff like this. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 5:17:56 PM EDT
[#20]
I've always been told they are in your heaven.
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Posted: 4/24/2017 5:19:47 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've always been told they are in your heaven. If you know that they were only copies, or figments of your imagination, wouldn't that make it worse knowing the real ones were in turmoil or limbo? |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 5:28:27 PM EDT
[#22]
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Posted: 4/24/2017 5:34:42 PM EDT
[#23]
There is a passage in the bible where it talks about "even their will be removed". IE....you will be remembered no more....That might be a part of hell in that those who enter heaven have no memory of those in hell.
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Posted: 4/24/2017 5:41:38 PM EDT
[#24]
When David's son with Bathsheba died, he washed himself and rested in knowing that one day he would go to him.
"I shall go to him, but he will not return to me" When Absalom died while trying to overthrow his father David had a different attitude "Then the king was deeply moved, and went up to the chamber over the gate, and wept. And as he went, he said thus: “O my son Absalom—my son, my son Absalom—if only I had died in your place! O Absalom my son, my son!” When Revelation says there will be no pain or sorrow there, that's what it means. There will be no torment in the kingdom of God. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 5:43:33 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm reading a slight, but very common, misconception on Heaven. A lot of people focus on people in heaven. Loved ones, dogs, which people, what the people will look like, what the people will do, people, people, people. Heaven is all about the Glory of God. You are literally in the presence of God. God is Love, so there will be a kind of love, excitement, contentment, and celebration that we can't imagine, yet we long for. Without getting too deep, people decide for themselves to be separated from God here on earth. God doesn't coerce anyone, so in a sense, He honors their decision. The other people, who seek God, have faith in Jesus, still screw everything up every day, but are not trusting in their own screw-ups, but trusting in His Grace, are not separated from God here, and won't be in Heaven. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 5:46:57 PM EDT
[#26]
Send me large amount of money and I will tell you answer.
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Posted: 4/24/2017 5:49:54 PM EDT
[#27]
The "soul" and "heaven" as we think of them both today (and I assume by the way you asked your question, OP) is a recent creation.
In the Bible it deals with the here and now, not some fantasy afterlife in the clouds (my words). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soul_in_the_Bible https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heaven_in_Christianity In the Bible when you died you're dead until the end of the world and then your physical body comes back. In the old days people always thought the end of the world was coming soon, like 10 years away from whenever they wondered when the world was going to end. Also, Jesus was coming back always within the lifetime of whoever was wondering when Jesus was coming back. Even Jewish tradition doesn't really speak of an afterlife if I remember something I read once correctly. It's strictly with the here and now. I always wonder how I would be, or how the world would be if so many of us didn't have this fantasy of eternal life. Would we allow ourselves to waste so much time, to not spend as much time with this people we love and to appreciate every thing and every second of life rather than thinking...I have time, there's always an eternity in heaven. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 5:52:34 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm reading a slight, but very common, misconception on Heaven. A lot of people focus on people in heaven. Loved ones, dogs, which people, what the people will look like, what the people will do, people, people, people. Heaven is all about the Glory of God. You are literally in the presence of God. God is Love, so there will be a kind of love, excitement, contentment, and celebration that we can't imagine, yet we long for. Without getting too deep, people decide for themselves to be separated from God here on earth. God doesn't coerce anyone, so in a sense, He honors their decision. The other people, who seek God, have faith in Jesus, still screw everything up every day, but are not trusting in their own screw-ups, but trusting in His Grace, are not separated from God here, and won't be in Heaven. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 6:10:09 PM EDT
[#29]
Eternity = plenty of time to forget the people who didn't make it.
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Posted: 4/24/2017 6:10:32 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
God: "I'm going to create these highly flawed and imperfect beings, give them wildly powerful and irrational emotions and fairly low intelligence and zero perspective of the nature of the universe, hide myself from them and then act like it was their fault when they don't believe I exist. Oh, and then I'll punish them with endless torture when they don't follow directions in an old book, because I love them. Hey it was their choice! My hands are tied!" |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 6:14:49 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Literally everything you just said is contrary to what the Bible actually teaches. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 6:25:23 PM EDT
[#32]
You're not going to get the answer here.
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Posted: 4/24/2017 6:31:45 PM EDT
[#33]
I always understood that heaven was about communion with God and not about having all your friends and family there. I always thought my mom's idea of heaven was silly. We'll all be there with your aunt Prieta and your tia Ponchita and uncle Chelo. Give me a break.
I don't believe in any of it necessarily. I think consciousness may exist after death, but it wouldn't be in this dimension any longer. It doesn't matter because no one knows. I always tell my mom, a devout Catholic, that if there is a God he will probably send me to Hell. She denies it. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 6:33:54 PM EDT
[#34]
If I were to imagine "heaven", it would likely be any reality, relm, or dimension you choose to exist in. Standing around on a cloud listening to awful harp music with a bunch of self righteous christians and my Mom, would suck.
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Posted: 4/24/2017 6:35:46 PM EDT
[#35]
So let's say some guy fucks his niece. That's not nice. But later on he finds religion, says the magic words, and goes to heaven.
Meanwhile, his niece keeps the faith and whatnot and she dies. She goes to heaven too. So what happens when she runs in to her uncle in line at the cafeteria or something? |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 6:38:25 PM EDT
[#36]
Some will contend.......that Hillary, Bill, Chucky and Nancy will certainly without a doubt be there in Heaven.
Sorry, I think I got on the wrong elevator. Aloha, Mark |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 6:40:54 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
When David's son with Bathsheba died, he washed himself and rested in knowing that one day he would go to him. "I shall go to him, but he will not return to me" When Absalom died while trying to overthrow his father David had a different attitude "Then the king was deeply moved, and went up to the chamber over the gate, and wept. And as he went, he said thus: “O my son Absalom—my son, my son Absalom—if only I had died in your place! O Absalom my son, my son!” When Revelation says there will be no pain or sorrow there, that's what it means. There will be no torment in the kingdom of God. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 6:41:35 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Reminding myself to work harder. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 6:45:02 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
you can work your way into heaven? 
Some religions that come with Divine DLC say you have to be a good enough person or you don't make it, |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 6:45:56 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Read the book troll. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 7:18:11 PM EDT
[#41]
Quoted:
I know this will likely turn into a mess, but to those that believe I have an honest question. As a precursor, I am a non-believer, haven't been to church since I was a kid. If heaven is supposed to be paradise, free of pain and sorrow, how can that be reconciled with the possibility of loved ones that have fallen off the path, or with non-believers not being allowed in? It seems like if your family was excluded you would spend eternity full of sorrow, amplified more if they were suffering in hell. It is my belief, which I have no scriptural basis for, that people not in heaven will be forgotten. I don't share this often as people lose their minds over what I have just decided I believe. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 7:35:46 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It is my belief, which I have no scriptural basis for, that people not in heaven will be forgotten. I don't share this often as people lose their minds over what I have just decided I believe. There's actually an impossibly gorgeous garden with the most fragrant blooms that no human eye has seen nor mind's eye imagine. At the edge is a balcony from which you can watch every sunrise in the universe happen at once, and an endless tourmaline aurora shimmers overhead. If you peer over the edge of the velvety carved marble balustrade, you can peer far, far down through the creamy pink clouds to see into Hell where your brother, who played dungeons and dragons and stopped going to church, screams while he frantically tries to shove his entrails back into his abdomen, only to have them torn away again by skeletal hounds. And then once you're bored, you go play cotton candy handball and take a dip in the ice cream river. Heaven sure is great! |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 7:39:06 PM EDT
[#43]
I'm not a believer, but I would imagine here and everyone here would be pretty unimportant relative to how great heaven is supposed to be.
I can't imagine anything good enough to make me want an eternity of it. (Am I in before the shit show?) |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 7:42:29 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So let's say some guy fucks his niece. That's not nice. But later on he finds religion, says the magic words, and goes to heaven. Meanwhile, his niece keeps the faith and whatnot and she dies. She goes to heaven too. So what happens when she runs in to her uncle in line at the cafeteria or something? |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 7:42:30 PM EDT
[#45]
I get what you're saying, OP.
Also, why couldn't Gandalf just fly the One Ring to Mount Doom on an Eagle and toss it in? |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 7:45:25 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Which one? Each religion has its own sacred texts.
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Posted: 4/24/2017 7:51:01 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I get what you're saying, OP. Also, why couldn't Gandalf just fly the One Ring to Mount Doom on an Eagle and toss it in? |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 7:57:10 PM EDT
[#48]
Fuck it. I'll bite. I'm a non-believer, but at one time I did my best to completely immerse myself in the theology. My reading was that the multitude surrounding the throne have no true individual will. Their definitions fade and they're swept up in the grandeur/majesty/truth/worship of a higher dimension/the creator. Assuming hell is the absence of the deity, paradise is losing oneself in the presence/consciousness of the deity. The corporeal world becomes as meaningless as any concept of self. All saved would be unified/reunited w/ a state of perfection through grace. There wouldn't be room for individual ego/self. Obviously I was incredibly popular in Southern Baptist Sunday school.
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Posted: 4/24/2017 8:00:12 PM EDT
[#49]
Hitler was a self-professed Christian. That is what he claimed. According to what some believe, if Hitler accepted Jesus as his personal savior and asked forgiveness before he died, Jesus's blood sacrifice "paid" for even Hitler's sin. As a result, Hitler is now in heaven partying with JC and enjoying an eternity of joy and celebration.
The Jews who refused to accept Jesus, and instead died keeping their Jewish faith, they are screaming in eternal torment. Because somehow that is justice and love. Seriously, a sane five year old has a better sense of morality than this. This isn't divinely inspired, it's just insane. If the star of the Bible is real, and this is actually how he is running things, he isn't deserving of anything but contempt. |
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Posted: 4/24/2017 8:06:22 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hitler was a self-professed Christian. That is what he claimed. According to what some believe, if Hitler accepted Jesus as his personal savior and asked forgiveness before he died, Jesus's blood sacrifice "paid" for even Hitler's sin. As a result, Hitler is now in heaven partying with JC and enjoying an eternity of joy and celebration. The Jews who refused to accept Jesus, and instead died keeping their Jewish faith, they are screaming in eternal torment. Because somehow that is justice and love. Seriously, a sane five year old has a better sense of morality than this. This isn't divinely inspired, it's just insane. If the star of the Bible is real, and this is actually how he is running things, he isn't deserving of anything but contempt. |
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