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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:36:45 AM EDT
[#1]
First, you have a fight, and lose, a horrifically catastrophic war, the armistice terms of which utterly gut what remains of your political systems, industry, and economy. You need to have a population full of embittered veterans who feel like they were stabbed in the back by various political factions in the society, which the veterans think cost them them the war. This needs to happen while your nearby neighbor is in the throes of a communist revolution. Your economy has to be totally fucked, with little hope of turning it around.
Then all you need is a demagogue, some public works projects, goose-stepping classes, a bit of nudism, a traditional scapegoat, and some on-time trains, and presto, you'll be rolling panzers through Poland in no time. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:37:38 AM EDT
[#2]
The Treaty of Versailles was pretty harsh on them. They needed to pay for WWI but some aspects of the armistice coupled with the Great Depression really put Germans in a bad place.
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:38:03 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: First, you have a fight, and lose, a horrifically catastrophic war, the armistice terms of which utterly gut what remains of your political systems, industry, and economy. You need to have a population full of embittered veterans who feel like they were stabbed in the back by various political factions in the society, which the veterans think cost them them the war. This needs to happen while your nearby neighbor is in the throes of a communist revolution. Your economy has to be totally fucked, with little hope of turning it around. Them all you need is a demagogue, some public works projects, goose-stepping classes, a bit of nudism, a traditional scapegoat, and some on-time trains, and presto, you'll be rolling panzers through Poland in no time. This. Also snappy uniforms. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:39:05 AM EDT
[#4]
They are doing it again.
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:39:21 AM EDT
[#5]
Read "The Coming of the Third Reich" by Richard Evans.
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:39:28 AM EDT
[#6]
So, in other words, it could happen to any nation. That doesn't quite cut it in my book. They willingly sold themselves to a pack of criminals, and willingly died for that pack of criminals? Doesn't make sense.
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:39:58 AM EDT
[#7]
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:40:42 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: First, you have a fight, and lose, a horrifically catastrophic war, the armistice terms of which utterly gut what remains of your political systems, industry, and economy. You need to have a population full of embittered veterans who feel like they were stabbed in the back by various political factions in the society, which the veterans think cost them them the war. This needs to happen while your nearby neighbor is in the throes of a communist revolution. Your economy has to be totally fucked, with little hope of turning it around. Then all you need is a demagogue, some public works projects, goose-stepping classes, a bit of nudism, a traditional scapegoat, and some on-time trains, and presto, you'll be rolling panzers through Poland in no time. This ams a good description. The debt portion is pretty good too. When you are paying factory workers per day because inflation is so bad that you can't wait until the end of the week, you have problems. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:41:32 AM EDT
[#9]
"Inside every German is a monster just waiting to come out"
Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:42:31 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This ams a good description. The debt portion is pretty good too. When you are paying factory workers per day because inflation is so bad that you can't wait until the end of the week, you have problems. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
First, you have a fight, and lose, a horrifically catastrophic war, the armistice terms of which utterly gut what remains of your political systems, industry, and economy. You need to have a population full of embittered veterans who feel like they were stabbed in the back by various political factions in the society, which the veterans think cost them them the war. This needs to happen while your nearby neighbor is in the throes of a communist revolution. Your economy has to be totally fucked, with little hope of turning it around. Then all you need is a demagogue, some public works projects, goose-stepping classes, a bit of nudism, a traditional scapegoat, and some on-time trains, and presto, you'll be rolling panzers through Poland in no time. This ams a good description. The debt portion is pretty good too. When you are paying factory workers per day because inflation is so bad that you can't wait until the end of the week, you have problems. Are you implying there is no hope for us then? Our debt is so much greater. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:42:34 AM EDT
[#11]
Money? When you run low on cash, you got to blame it on somebody or thing....  |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:42:51 AM EDT
[#12]
Follow up question: Why are they (specifically Merkel) doing what they are doing today?
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:43:10 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
"Inside every German is a monster just waiting to come out" Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile could be said of every human. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:43:47 AM EDT
[#14]
It's the end state of progressive thinking. Ultimately, if you believe that there is a utopia and that humans are perfectable, then you will subvert indvidual rights, all past morality, and ultimately all that is good in order to reach that utopia. Conversely, if you don't believe in human utopias and perfectability, then you want checks and balances on power and avoiding centralization of power.
There really are only 2 types of state: Those that accept that humans are not perfect, and thus have rule of law, and those who believe humans can be perfect, and thus have rule of men. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:44:51 AM EDT
[#15]
Look around you and seeeeeee......
You don't even have to wait for it....it is happening in THIS country right now. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:44:52 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Follow up question: Why are they (specifically Merkel) doing what they are doing today? She's a fucking commie, born and raised. West Germany should have banned any former East German from ever holding public office. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:44:55 AM EDT
[#17]
Do you not see the division happening right now?
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:45:40 AM EDT
[#18]
Lose the biggest war in history and get stuck with the bill while simultaneously fighting against internal Communist subversion.
Next boss, no more Mr Nice Guy. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:45:59 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Follow up question: Why are they (specifically Merkel) doing what they are doing today? I think Merkel is serving the interests of her old Soviet masters and doing her part to destroy the EU. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:46:12 AM EDT
[#20]
Oligarchy that gains power and is ruthless enough and has enough enforcers to kill its own will soon trickle down to lower levels of government (people like Rommel) and then to the people. Maybe.
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:46:13 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So, in other words, it could happen to any nation. That doesn't quite cut it in my book. They willingly sold themselves to a pack of criminals, and willingly died for that pack of criminals? Doesn't make sense. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:46:23 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The Treaty of Versailles was pretty harsh on them. They needed to pay for WWI but some aspects of the armistice coupled with the Great Depression really put Germans in a bad place. They deserved everything they got for unleashing communism on the world. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:46:32 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Lose the biggest war in history and get stuck with the bill while simultaneously fighting against internal Communist subversion. Next boss, no more Mr Nice Guy. some of that sounds familiar.......... |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:46:47 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
She's a fucking commie, born and raised. West Germany should have banned any former East German from ever holding public office. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Follow up question: Why are they (specifically Merkel) doing what they are doing today? She's a fucking commie, born and raised. West Germany should have banned any former East German from ever holding public office. And not just any Commie. She was Stasi, the most hardcore of them all. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:48:02 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's the end state of progressive thinking. Ultimately, if you believe that there is a utopia and that humans are perfectable, then you will subvert indvidual rights, all past morality, and ultimately all that is good in order to reach that utopia. Conversely, if you don't believe in human utopias and perfectability, then you want checks and balances on power and avoiding centralization of power. There really are only 2 types of state: Those that accept that humans are not perfect, and thus have rule of law, and those who believe humans can be perfect, and thus have rule of men. Ding ding ding Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:48:39 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They deserved everything they got for unleashing communism on the world. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The Treaty of Versailles was pretty harsh on them. They needed to pay for WWI but some aspects of the armistice coupled with the Great Depression really put Germans in a bad place. They deserved everything they got for unleashing communism on the world. Hell, the virus did not start with the Germans..............it was there even before Marx codified it. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:48:46 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They deserved everything they got for unleashing communism on the world. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The Treaty of Versailles was pretty harsh on them. They needed to pay for WWI but some aspects of the armistice coupled with the Great Depression really put Germans in a bad place. They deserved everything they got for unleashing communism on the world. You won't get any argument from me about that. Good point. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:49:32 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
"Inside every German is a monster just waiting to come out" Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile This kind of thinking is lazy and dangerous. A cop out. An excuse to not look into the past and see/understand exactly how another modern western nation could descend into the exact same dystopian hell they did. There is no special German penchant for violence or genocide. You fail. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:49:44 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are you implying there is no hope for us then? Our debt is so much greater. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: First, you have a fight, and lose, a horrifically catastrophic war, the armistice terms of which utterly gut what remains of your political systems, industry, and economy. You need to have a population full of embittered veterans who feel like they were stabbed in the back by various political factions in the society, which the veterans think cost them them the war. This needs to happen while your nearby neighbor is in the throes of a communist revolution. Your economy has to be totally fucked, with little hope of turning it around. Then all you need is a demagogue, some public works projects, goose-stepping classes, a bit of nudism, a traditional scapegoat, and some on-time trains, and presto, you'll be rolling panzers through Poland in no time. This ams a good description. The debt portion is pretty good too. When you are paying factory workers per day because inflation is so bad that you can't wait until the end of the week, you have problems. Are you implying there is no hope for us then? Our debt is so much greater. Are you getting paid twice a day so you can run to the store to buy food because the inflation is so bad? When you can answer yes to that, I can tell you its fo time. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:50:26 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ding ding ding Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
It's the end state of progressive thinking. Ultimately, if you believe that there is a utopia and that humans are perfectable, then you will subvert indvidual rights, all past morality, and ultimately all that is good in order to reach that utopia. Conversely, if you don't believe in human utopias and perfectability, then you want checks and balances on power and avoiding centralization of power. There really are only 2 types of state: Those that accept that humans are not perfect, and thus have rule of law, and those who believe humans can be perfect, and thus have rule of men. Ding ding ding Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile man makes law, man is not perfect, law is not perfect..........state is not perfect either way. Interesting. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:50:33 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hell, the virus did not start with the Germans..............it was there even before Marx codified it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The Treaty of Versailles was pretty harsh on them. They needed to pay for WWI but some aspects of the armistice coupled with the Great Depression really put Germans in a bad place. They deserved everything they got for unleashing communism on the world. Hell, the virus did not start with the Germans..............it was there even before Marx codified it. It was the spirit of the age. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:50:38 AM EDT
[#32]
Quoted:
As cultured as it was, as educated as it was, as apparently civilized as it was just how did it happen? How did it become as insane, mad, deranged, demented, crazed and depraved as it did? What does it say about other cultures? Other countries? Us in general? Greed. Power. Vengeance. These are all powerful and wicked motivators. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:51:43 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think Merkel is serving the interests of her old Soviet masters and doing her part to destroy the EU. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Follow up question: Why are they (specifically Merkel) doing what they are doing today? I think Merkel is serving the interests of her old Soviet masters and doing her part to destroy the EU. She may be serving her old masters still, but not to destroy the EU. Co-opt it maybe. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:51:51 AM EDT
[#34]
Couldn't happen in modern times. Go ahead and turn in your evil assault rifles now.
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:52:07 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Are you getting paid twice a day so you can run to the store to buy food because the inflation is so bad? When you can answer yes to that, I can tell you its fo time. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
First, you have a fight, and lose, a horrifically catastrophic war, the armistice terms of which utterly gut what remains of your political systems, industry, and economy. You need to have a population full of embittered veterans who feel like they were stabbed in the back by various political factions in the society, which the veterans think cost them them the war. This needs to happen while your nearby neighbor is in the throes of a communist revolution. Your economy has to be totally fucked, with little hope of turning it around. Then all you need is a demagogue, some public works projects, goose-stepping classes, a bit of nudism, a traditional scapegoat, and some on-time trains, and presto, you'll be rolling panzers through Poland in no time. This ams a good description. The debt portion is pretty good too. When you are paying factory workers per day because inflation is so bad that you can't wait until the end of the week, you have problems. Are you implying there is no hope for us then? Our debt is so much greater. Are you getting paid twice a day so you can run to the store to buy food because the inflation is so bad? When you can answer yes to that, I can tell you its fo time. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:54:52 AM EDT
[#36]
You need a cool new salute that looks like the leader wants to initiate a high five with you.
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:54:58 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
She may be serving her old masters still, but not to destroy the EU. Co-opt it maybe. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Follow up question: Why are they (specifically Merkel) doing what they are doing today? I think Merkel is serving the interests of her old Soviet masters and doing her part to destroy the EU. She may be serving her old masters still, but not to destroy the EU. Co-opt it maybe. How do you co-opt something like Islam? because there is going to be a lot of it around when she and her cronies are through. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:55:41 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: would you admit that as it stands now our country, in fact most countries are living on borrowed time? or governments if you would. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: First, you have a fight, and lose, a horrifically catastrophic war, the armistice terms of which utterly gut what remains of your political systems, industry, and economy. You need to have a population full of embittered veterans who feel like they were stabbed in the back by various political factions in the society, which the veterans think cost them them the war. This needs to happen while your nearby neighbor is in the throes of a communist revolution. Your economy has to be totally fucked, with little hope of turning it around. Then all you need is a demagogue, some public works projects, goose-stepping classes, a bit of nudism, a traditional scapegoat, and some on-time trains, and presto, you'll be rolling panzers through Poland in no time. This ams a good description. The debt portion is pretty good too. When you are paying factory workers per day because inflation is so bad that you can't wait until the end of the week, you have problems. Are you implying there is no hope for us then? Our debt is so much greater. Are you getting paid twice a day so you can run to the store to buy food because the inflation is so bad? When you can answer yes to that, I can tell you its fo time. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:56:08 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You need a cool new salute that lookalike the leader wants to initiate a high five with you. ??   
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:56:15 AM EDT
[#40]
dude you're watching the same thing here right now. Our country has lost it's damn mind.
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:57:55 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How do you co-opt something like Islam? because there is going to be a lot of it around when she and her cronies are through. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Follow up question: Why are they (specifically Merkel) doing what they are doing today? I think Merkel is serving the interests of her old Soviet masters and doing her part to destroy the EU. She may be serving her old masters still, but not to destroy the EU. Co-opt it maybe. How do you co-opt something like Islam? because there is going to be a lot of it around when she and her cronies are through. Good old fashioned genocide. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:58:53 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You need a cool new salute that looks like the leader wants to initiate a high five with you.
That wasn't an uncommon thing back then. There are pictures of American children doing it when reciting the Pledge of Allegiance. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:59:06 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
dude you're watching the same thing here right now. Our country has lost it's damn mind. actually what got me thinking was I was listening to some Beethoven and I had to wonder how the same culture, country that could turn out a Beethoven could also turn itself over to a bunch of fucks like the Nazis. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:59:28 AM EDT
[#44]
Germany wasn't an anomaly. Look up the Assyrians, the first known empire, and their brutality. They weren't as different from us as pop culture would have you believe. Humanity has murdered, raped, tortured and enslaved its way through history, and the only difference with German is industrialization. Had you given poison gas, impressive uniforms, and railroads to Tamerlane, his genocides would have likely looked about the same.
Horrific things are in every person, even those of us who are supposedly civilized, and it doesn't take much beyond an authority figure saying it's okay to bring that out. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 12:59:56 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Good old fashioned genocide. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Follow up question: Why are they (specifically Merkel) doing what they are doing today? I think Merkel is serving the interests of her old Soviet masters and doing her part to destroy the EU. She may be serving her old masters still, but not to destroy the EU. Co-opt it maybe. How do you co-opt something like Islam? because there is going to be a lot of it around when she and her cronies are through. Good old fashioned genocide. which side will be the inflictors? |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 1:00:15 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: would you admit that as it stands now our country, in fact most countries are living on borrowed time? or governments if you would. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: First, you have a fight, and lose, a horrifically catastrophic war, the armistice terms of which utterly gut what remains of your political systems, industry, and economy. You need to have a population full of embittered veterans who feel like they were stabbed in the back by various political factions in the society, which the veterans think cost them them the war. This needs to happen while your nearby neighbor is in the throes of a communist revolution. Your economy has to be totally fucked, with little hope of turning it around. Then all you need is a demagogue, some public works projects, goose-stepping classes, a bit of nudism, a traditional scapegoat, and some on-time trains, and presto, you'll be rolling panzers through Poland in no time. This ams a good description. The debt portion is pretty good too. When you are paying factory workers per day because inflation is so bad that you can't wait until the end of the week, you have problems. Are you implying there is no hope for us then? Our debt is so much greater. Are you getting paid twice a day so you can run to the store to buy food because the inflation is so bad? When you can answer yes to that, I can tell you its fo time. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 1:01:34 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: actually what got me thinking was I was listening to some Beethoven and I had to wonder how the same culture, country that could turn out a Beethoven could also turn itself over to a bunch of fucks like the Nazis. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: dude you're watching the same thing here right now. Our country has lost it's damn mind. actually what got me thinking was I was listening to some Beethoven and I had to wonder how the same culture, country that could turn out a Beethoven could also turn itself over to a bunch of fucks like the Nazis. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 1:03:01 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Germany wasn't an anomaly. Look up the Assyrians, the first known empire, and their brutality. They weren't as different from us as pop culture would have you believe. Humanity has murdered, raped, tortured and enslaved its way through history, and the only difference with German is industrialization. Had you given poison gas, impressive uniforms, and railroads to Tamerlane, his genocides would have likely looked about the same. Horrific things are in every person, even those of us who are supposedly civilized, and it doesn't take much beyond an authority figure saying it's okay to bring that out. I guess, as was borne out by the Milgram experiments. but even there you had a percentage refuse and tell the examiner to fuck off. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 1:05:03 AM EDT
[#49]
I have to go to bed, so I'll try to write something more in depth tomorrow.
But a parting thought: people comparing the collapse of Weimar Germany and the rise of Nazism to anything going on in America right now don't have a damn clue just exactly how bad things were in Germany from 1918 on. Not a damn clue. Our politics, debt, leaders, etc are all certainly fucked. But comparatively, we're writing at a 3rd grade level in being fucked, and pre Nazi Germany was writing multiple post doc theses on the subject. |
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Posted: 6/29/2016 1:07:06 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The Treaty of Versailles was pretty harsh on them. They needed to pay for WWI but some aspects of the armistice coupled with the Great Depression really put Germans in a bad place. This. In some ways, WW II was brought about by how WW I ended. In some ways, the Germans were right to be concerned about the Soviets. That doesn't mean that they were right to do what they did...but they were correct that the Russians were coming. Plus, they really wanted some payback for WW I. |
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