I want to touch you.

When investigating the theft of a particular item, yes.  

PSA: Burglary investigations live and die by serial numbers.  Write them down, take pictures of the data plates, make an oil painting, however you choose to do it, record the make/model/serial number of your valuable items.

Wow - I'd stay away from lightning storms for a while if I were you!  Talk about jinxing yourself....

I know Johnrudes used to have the serial # stamped on the freeze plug (s) on the engine block. Don't know if they still do?

As far as checking engine SN's while in line at the ramp, hell yes, and check the trailer and hull VIN's too.

Fuk thieves.

The got-damned Germans ain't got nuthin to do with it!!!!!!!!!!!

I honestly can't believe what I'm reading

What about the fish finders, plotters and radio? They might be hot too.

Might as well have them run the serials on your boat day load out too, right?

"You know what officer, here... run my driver's license, VINs and plates too. Ya never can be too vigilant."

It called a deterrent to boat motor theft. Has nothing to do with feels unless you feel
freedom is being allowed to possess stolen items.  

Most likely serial numbers on chart plotters etc would not be in the NCIC and would not
be easy to check a serial number on. Boat motors would be more likely to be in there and
again most motors have the serial number on the outside of the motor.

so, to deter boat motor theft, we treat everyone like a suspect and detain them to run their boat motor SN with zero PC or RAS -- other than it's a boat motor.

Right.

No detainment to run number. Same way they run tag numbers daily.

All of you that claim you can get to the ramp and launch your boat without a couple minutes of
stopped time for the prep and waiting your turn are full of it.

so if I am on the ramp, launching my boat, and an LEO says "STOP! I must run your serial number," can I tell him to get lost?

Generally speaking... yes.

herp and derp like always.

I don't tell cops to get lost.

For one thing boat prep for launching is a routine between my wife and I.

Best to stand back unless you want to give secks.

Putting your boat in should never make more than two minutes... one minute if you've got help.

And it would take seconds to look at a serial number. But I have been to a ramp very few times where
I was not waiting my turn to put in.

It gets surrendered one step at a time.  Three generations later and it's a different country.

Dude they are recording all of your phone calls, emails and texts and having LEOS's look at the serial
number on your boat motor is taking your freedom away?

You guys suggesting that LEO's checking for stolen boat motors takes your freedom is laughable.
In fact very ignorant. The fact that people can pretty much buy and use stolen
outboards with impunity is where we are losing our freedom.

It's ARFCOM my friend, did you expect a different attitude?

It's par for the course here to take a topic and spin it well beyond the intended purpose. You posed a simple question involving attitudes about letting (consent) LE run a boat motor number, as you see, it spun off into a "when will it end"... "fuck em, got a warrant?" way.

Like I posted early on in this thread... NO ONE in this thread gives a crap how LE recovers their property... when contacted to come get it, I guarantee NO ONE will ask about the legality surrounding the recovery... they will just be glad they got it back.

I've had plenty of citizens over time just come right out and flat ask me to "bend the rules" in order to favor them concerning their case, especially in cases involving suspects they think violated them... funny how that shit works. If I had a $1 for every time someone said "I don't care how you (fill in the blank)... just do it" I'd have enough for a nice dinner out and a few beers. Yet something tells me those same people would shit a brick if I violated THEIR right(s)... again, people are funny that way.

Bottom line in all of this... there are those who won't mind a couple minutes interaction and there are those who believe such interaction will lead to a great stomp down of rights... each are entitled to their own take on the matter.

I know but do not understand the resistance, I always let the CC guy check my boat so that
I would get the sticker showing that it was in order. Kept others from stopping later. I am well
aware of threats to our privacy, but also know how people change their tunes when things
happen to them.

1991 Mercury Mariner 25 hp

SN 06257794 ( It is hand scribbled on book. Best I can Do.)

All my love,  Iamhere

When I've told angry citizens about the legal reasons why we can or can't do something, when it was related to their issue, problem, or case... you would be surprised at the "I don't give a crap about that..." responses I've got. Sometimes, I quite surprised. I get those responses from time to time from ALL types of people... including quasi sovereign and known anti-gov types... the kind that wouldn't help me at all in time of need yet kick and scream for service when it directly effects them.

Just two weeks ago I handled a complaint against one of our Detectives from a guy who usually makes our (LE) life difficult and he harasses City Hall and all things .gov because he expected LE to confront and get a confession out of someone he "thought" stole his lawnmower. He wanted us to stop and investigate EVERY vehicle fitting a certain description until we found his mower. He went on to insist we identify who owns said vehicles, and give the information to him, as he could "get a confession out of them"... Such attitudes by victims are not uncommon and vary in degree.

This is my life... I'm not making this stuff up.

I visit A LOT of other gun boards on the internet... only on ARFCOM do I consistently see such hard-line attitudes concerning LE and related topics.

Hang on a minute while I call that in....

Thanks dude, I wanted to meet you anyway. Bring Miami JBT WITH YOU.

YOU MIGHT NEED SOME HELP  

Yep.  There is nothing special about old boat motors.  If we're going to start a campaign to look for them why not all other stolen property.  "Sir, can you turn your lawn mower off for a second, i need to run the serial.  Oh hey, that's a nice ATV under your carport, let me check that too while I'm here."

That's ONE way of looking at it.

Besides, after 90 days, the stolen record entry in NCIC/FCIC Articles File (which is where these type items go) will self-purge. Permanent entries include Motor Vehicles, Vessels, and Firearms for the most part.

I did not have any idea that boat motors did not stay in the NCIC longer than 90 days. That is
a travesty since the cost of boat motors are so high now. Like I posted above, a 15 hp motor is well
over 2k and a 300 hp is around 30k. That is not chump change. Data storage is cheap, why would
they purge that data? I used to be in contact with them regularly when I handled vehicle theft
claims. I wish I still was as I would like to question them about that.

A 10 year old 10 hp motor if running is worth an easy 500 to 800 dollars.

It's not the data storage that is the issue, it's the record maintenance requirement.

All NCIC/FCIC entries have to be validated from time to time. SOMEONE has to contact the victim and make sure the record(s) are still accurate and up to date, including contact information. Logistically, due to the vast amount of thefts that occur DAILY, it would be come quite burdensome and expensive.

REMOVED - NOT EVEN REMOTELY FUNNY  - SGB

I assure you, it does not suck to be me... I love my job, my position, and I'm quite blessed personally and professionally. I don't deal with scum bags all day... you assume much. I don't assume everyone has the same attitude, I just know while you might not "ask" LEO to bend the rules, I'm quite confident you would not object if they did w/o your input... sell that self-righteous stuff to someone else.

My experiences in LE are quite varied. I'm the Special Operations Lieutenant at my SO, I'm over a five man K-9 Team, a three man TAC Team, a eight man Traffic Squad, the FTO program, Aviation, and I'm the SWAT Commander of a 20-man team. I also supervise the LE Service contracts we have with three municipalities consisting of nine deputies and act as a liaison between the City Govt. and the Sheriff's Office... I guess you could say I'm a Chief of Police over three small PD's. So my daily experiences involve professionals from a variety of career fields in a variety of positions.

I'm in-line with you... married 29 years, two kids, two grandkids, and my family and I have all had limited LE contact just like you. No you're not rare... neither am I... what does this have to do with the topic?

Yes... the job has morphed into something it should not be, happened years ago and it's getting worse. "Letting" someone look at your boat motor has nothing to do with giving up your rights as you make the choice... more spin.

Where in this thread does ANYONE say we should sit idly by while our rights get further eroded? I like my rights... you think you have a monopoly on that? More spin considering the topic. In all the years I've ben on this site I've been quite consistent with my beliefs and attitudes... I'm not at either end of the spectrum.

Where in this thread does/did the topic of dirt bag cops and/or the debate of their existence come in? I don't see ANY cop bashing in this thread per se, just people saying they would not allow a check of their boat motor number as they feel it will/can lead to other things... how? I don't know.

If people don't want their stuff looked at... more power to them... but doing so is quite benign, debatably helpful, and probably won't result in all of us getting rounded up someday and put into camps...

So all you have to do is hide the motor for 3 months and all is well. That sucks.

I have a neighbor that has been bringing home ATV's , loaded lawmower trailers, boats
etc for a couple years. I have been leery, but thought that he could not be dealing in stolen
merchandise because surely he would be in fear of being checked.

Now I am more leery now. Funny how I have never heard anything about checks on
stolen guns and the like from people that have had them stolen. Is there a data
base in FL that cross references serial numbers on computerized incident reports.

No... not necessarily... just means if the number is run the Officer won't get an NCIC/FCIC hit. We have had people "find" their stuff after a period of time, and despite the lack of an entry, it's still stolen property subject to recovery and possible charges for the person in possession.

I helped recover a stolen Sako Rifle some years back after the guy who bought it, and thought it was legal, called a friend to ask why it would not fire. The "friend", who is a "gun guy", called a local shop and asked some gunsmith questions... the rifle was actually stolen from the shop's son in a residential burglary. It was the uniqueness/rareness of the rifle, an old Sako chambered in .223, that led to the discovery/recovery.  

When we encounter stolen property, whether via NCIC/FCIC hit response, victim self-discovery, or any other method, the possessor is given an opportunity to account for how they came into possession of the property. Within our state statute, there are circumstances that could get an otherwise innocent person charged with the original theft as there is no "Possession of Stolen Property" law in FL. Depending on their story of how they acquired the property, of special interest is the price one pays for an item, they could get charged with the original theft.

If your reference to hearing about the checks on stolen guns is in reference to the record entry validation process, I don't know what to tell you. Some people move, change their phone number, etc. and never update the agency who has their case.

At least atv's are titled.  Although with no registration it's just another tax.

ive experienced first hand the lack of leo response for stolen motorcycles.  Had the perp caught with multiple bikes in a uhaul and they didn't give 2 shits, "take it up with your insurance company."  I'm sorry if I'm not more enthusiastic about a serial number applied to a sticker.

I'd be interested in the details concerning this...

Are you saying YOU caught someone with YOUR bikes, which were stolen, and LE said too bad, take it up with your insurance?

They can fuck off unless they have a warrant. 

That's the spirit....

I don't think people have to be 'anti-police' to not want to be stopped, or delayed, while going about their daily life.  If I get pulled over and they ask to search my car I'm pleasant but refuse.  If I was in line at the boat ramp (I almost never am in line...get there early!) and a cop looks at my outboard then I don't care, but if I'm getting ready to back in then I wouldn't be happy to have to stop because somebody's 6 hp Tohatsu got stolen so lets check my 250 Yamaha to see if it's a match.  I don't think everyone on this thread is saying it would escalate to a total loss of rights but they are drawing comparisons to show that being stopped to check your stuff because anything can be stolen doesn't make sense in a free society.  Having something stolen sucks, and I hate thieves, but while random checks on the population as a whole may turn up some stolen stuff I'd think those resources are better spent in high-crime areas.

Agree... people should be free to pick and choose what, when, where, how, and why concerning non-intrusive voluntarily cooperation with LE and choosing NOT to do does not make one "anti-police".

Roommate in college, his bike was stolen from apartment, caught the guys loading it up into a uhaul, hauled ass over, followed them, called police, had plate number, truck number, direction of travel on i95, continuous position updates.  No thanks, we will send an officer to file a report. 

Cop that that showed up was a little surprised as well, but what could he do at that point.  said file an insurance claim, all the info on the trucks is either stolen/bogus most likely anyways.  

Talking almost 20 years ago now, so that's the gist of it, may not be 100% accurate now 

There are a lot of possibilities that caused the end result... so who knows... thanks for the additional as it paints a different picture.

It's a liability gamble for a department to have or encourage a person follow a suspect... people can thank greedy lawyers for that, because it's not because of lazy cops.

I once had to let a stolen car go because of the pursuit policy... victim was pissed and I felt like a useless turd.

I had a handgun stolen in an auto burglary in Jacksonville.  Before you yell at me, I was traveling from another part of the state, staying in a hotel and attending a conference on a college campus.  Thus, I didn't want to leave the gun in the hotel, and could not carry on campus or else it would have been safe in my briefcase... but enough about gun free zones.

The gun was recovered during drug search warrant in Miami.  (So much for the anti-gunner's claim that I 95 is an iron highway north to NJ and NY.)

The gun was not evidence in a crime, and the gun was not used in a crime.  It was just in the house that the warrant was served on.

So Miami contacts Jacksonville and Jacksonville tracks me down...  Tells me to contact Miami to get me gun back.

Miami evidence custodian says that I need to find an FFL that will accept shipment and then 4473 the gun back to me.

So, I did. Ready to pay the transfer fee, I then contacted Miami with the shipping info.  They changed their mind.  Now they wanted me to contact my local LEA to accept shipment and return it to me, and in addition, now they wanted a FedEX account number to pay for shipping since shipping was going to cost 35 dollars.  Sheriff says "no", they never heard of such a thing and didn't want to be involved.

I asked Miami what the procedure would be if the stolen item was a camera.  She said that she would put it in a box and ship it to me, no questions asked.  BUT, this was a gun.

I asked what condition the gun was in.  Custodian says she does not know and can't look.  I ask if they could just take the (hi cap) magazine out of the gun and ship it to me (as it was probably worth more, at the time, than the gun.)

She said no, that was a gun part.

I told her to melt the gun.

(If someone has my nice .40 with a hi cap mag I hope they ND their left knee with it.)

So much for recovering stolen stuff.

Had a shipment of guns stolen, but investigator said that even though they knew who did it, they didn't have enough for a warrant even though a neighborhood teenager described seeing a stainless steel PPKS in the house in question.  I guess everyone has a ss ppks.

I have not had a lot of luck with the "recovering stolen property" thing.

So, you probably should not expect a lot of help from me unless you are working an actual case.  Then I will give you all the time and assistance I can.  If your fishing, don't bother me.  (no pun intended)

I'll never understand why some agencies act that way with firearms... the victim gets to be a victim again... it's pure BS.

At our agency, we box that stuff up and send it back to the entering agency, whose case it is anyway, without delay. I'm glad I work for an agency that is pro-gun. In fact, one of our detectives recently sent a recovered Browning BAR rifle to an out of state agency, total time in our possession was just a couple days IIRC.

I am glad your agency is that way and I have always seen you as an upstanding person.

I have been here long enough to know you are one of the good guys.  I speculate that your LEA is on of the good agencies in at least part because of your leadership.

I also know (some of my best friends are cops and firefighters) that most LEOs are good guys and most LEA mean no harm to the law abiding public.

As in any occupation, it is the few bad buys that make the news and in my case leave a bad taste.  And is some cases it is not even the sworn officers that are the jerks.

LEOs have a thankless job.  Every once in a while I get to thank them and tell them I appreciate what they do.

With that said, someday I would like to meet a nice FWC officer.  That is still my one life's ambitions.  What is it with those guys anyway?  I've been told it is better now, but I gave up hunting and fishing because of the abuse.  No, I don't want FWC checking my "anything."  They don't need any more excuses to be jerks.

Sorry brother, I don't have any special powers with wives...you're on your own there.