Been playing with a couple of different optics options on the Tavor, but honestly was thinking of just mounting a set of Daniel Defense fixed iron sights on the thing and giving it a whirl (more durable than the integral BUIS)

Anyone else done that, or am I just crazy?

I did stock sights for a while. They blow. Very happy with my Primary Arms Micro Dot.

Yeah.. i'm a fan of the iron sights as well.  Wouldn't standard sights lower the sight plain more though?  I like the height of the integrated ones.  Do they make higher than normal sights or are standard AR height ones about all you can get?  I'd really not like to go through the hassle of two tiny risers.  I hate the idea of raising the sights on a rifle that has such a high HOB to begin with, but that damn rail is just so low!

Haven't tried sticking irons on it yet to compare to the BUIS, kind of waht I was wondering too (i.e. if they would be too low)

yeah.. my eotech is about an upper third co-witness with teh built in irons.  I'm guessing the normal height BUIS would be manageable, but less than optimal.

Turns out the buis on the Tavor are about 1/4" higher than AR sights mounted on the rail. Honestly, with the low height of that rail and a lot of people looking for spacers, etc, I wonder if a full replacement rail that is 1/2" higher would be something worthwhile?

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If the difference is 1/4" why would you want a 1/2" taller rail? Then everyone would be wanting shorter stuff...

I would rather have a spacer made for an optic mount, rather than replace the factory rail. hint hint...

.....I tried the BUIS

................. and the are "Back Up's for a reason..

Troy Micro sights might be the right height?   Any idea?

if normal troy sights are 1/4 inch lower than the integrated buis, then the micros would be waay too short IMO.

The micro sights are 1/4" lower than the regular sights so they wouldn't work at all.

I was particularly excited about the long top rail and sight radius of the Tavor and the potential ability to use iron sights.  However, I tried mounting Daniel Defense iron sights on the Tavor and found the following:

The AR15 design creates about a half inch more space between the sight plane and the cheek weld.  Trying to use standard iron sights designed for an AR on the Tavor means that the distance between the cheek weld and sight plane is compressed to the point that it makes it difficult to get the eye low enough to center the front post in the rear ghost ring.  Taller iron sights, such as the stock flip up iron sights of the Tavor, relieves this problem.  The stock flip up iron sights of the Tavor appear to middle cowitness with optics that are designed to lower 1/3 cowitness on an AR.

I'm in the process of setting up some 45 degree, off-set iron sights from the top rail.

With the way that I hold the rifle against my shoulder, and how my cheek comes in contact with the butt, it rolls very naturally to the off-hand side, and quickly brings auxiliary sights into play (I shoot a rifle right-handed).

It's a very easy motion, and is quite different from any of my other rifles.

I have a Burris AR-332 scope on mine. I haven't decided whether to keep it, but it works well in terms of the right height, and at close range I keep both eyes open with good superimposition of the dot on target (e.g. 8 to 20 feet).

G.

Sorry, meant since the stock sights are upper third co witness with an optic would the micros be a lower third?
looks like they would  then be too low matched to cheek weld to be usable

You're confused... allow me to paint you a picture. Forgive me if you already know all this...

The AR15 flattop rail is raised above the top of the stock (called the comb) roughly 0.590 inches.

The Tavor flattop rail is raised above the top of the stock roughly 1/4" or so.

Any AR15 optic mount or back up sight will be about 1/4" lower on the Tavor that it is on an AR15 type rifle.



The Troy micro sights are exactly 0.22 inches LOWER than the standard Troy AR15 folding iron sights.



The Tavor has integral back up sights that are HIGHER than any AR15 type back up sights, this is to compensate for the 1/4" drop in rail height.
If you put standard AR iron sights on the Tavor you will be at a disadvantage because you will have to drop your eye lower to get any sort of sight picture.
The Tavor integral back up sights are higher for a reason...


Now if you put Troy micro sights on a Tavor, You will be like Ray Charles and won't be able to see shit.
Troy micro sights on the Tavor rail will be roughly 1/2 inch LOWER than the integral back up sights.



Another point:
The AR "lower 1/3" optic mounts place the iron sights below the red dot or reticle. The iron sight is in the bottom third section of the glass if you split it into three places (while the red dot is in the middle of the glass obviously).

The standard "cowitness" optic mount places the iron sight in the same plane (same spot) as the back up iron sights. This places the red dot or reticle LOWER than a "lower 1/3" mount.

ie the "lower 1/3" mount is taller than the "cowitness" mount.



Now, if you place a standard AR15 cowitness mount on a Tavor, the red dot or reticle will NOT cowitness. The red dot or reticle will be BELOW the sight plane of the back up iron sights... you won't see shit...

If you use a "lower 1/3" AR15 mount on the Tavor, the red dot or reticle will COWITNESS with the integral back up sights.

Currently there is no way to get a true "lower 1/3" cowitness on the Tavor.
Someone needs to make a spacer that is 1/4" higher for the aimpoint line of red dots, like right the heck now (I really like lower 1/3 cowitness and do not like true cowitness ).


Hope that helped.

What model eotech are you using? With a 512 I'm getting absolute co-witness with the built in irons. Same with the Primary Arms M4 copy I put on at first but then decided to go with the eotech.

Duh, brainfarted when I wrote that.
With a 517 I get absolute co-witness. with a 512 it's upper 1/3.

Enough people have complained about the Tavor integral top rail being too low even for optics with "standard" mounts (Myself included) that I have considered maing a short run of rails that raise the height 1/4" to 1/2", and would use the parts from the integral BUIS on it.  

Was actaully thinking of doing a "short" rail that just was a raised rail between the two bolt locations, and was non-existant over the front handguard, as no one seems to mount anything there anyhow...would give more of an IDF look to the gun while keeping picatinny mounted optic compatibility.

This is for raising eotechs a bit, 1/3 of an inch to be exact.

https://www.primaryarms.com/Yankee_Hill_Machine_EOTech_CoWitness_Riser_M_p/yhm-220.htm

To clarify, I did not mean a bolt on spacer, but rather an entirely new top rail for the Tavor.  Several guys have mentioned they want a higher top rail, but one that looks factory and doesn't extend over the front top handguard (me included!)

The shim that comes on the Sparc places the irons in line for a perfect cowitness.  That setup also got me loving the Tavor BUIS.  

At the moment, I'm just running backup iron sights (put the Sparc back on the AK74) and they are fine.  2" @100 yards isn't difficult with them.

I'm still debating what optic to put on it, honestly I think I'm just going to wind up putting a Mepro m21 on it.  Tube style dots just look on it IMO and EOtech would look weird on it too.  Maybe too many pictures with the M21 have swayed my thought process?

LOL, could be- I don't like the blue tint of the M21, but after trying several optics I went back to it for lack of anything that seemed to work better.

Please make a copy of the short IDF issue optic rail that will allow the real dual throw lever M21 meprolight optic to be cowitnessed with the BUIS.

Email sent for more info- need to see some pics!

Is this the mount you are referring to?

That's one of them, it appears that it is a one piece rail with the integral rail grabbers.  The other version appears to be a shorter rail section that is just screwed into the existing rail grabbers like the ones used on the us-iwi long rail to secure it to the barrel.