So, finally decided to try out wet tumbling - looked at the Rebel package bit figured i would start with the Frankford to see how I liked it.  Ordered up the FART and a separator from Amazon which arrived today - so I headed up publix to pick up some Dawn and Lemishine and ran a few loads tonight.

First batch was 223 and I was a bit underwhelmed - this was a processed batch with primers removed, and while it didn't really make them any shinier (they had already been dry tumbled prior to processing on the 1050), it did clean up the primer pockets nice.  Now since my first time my "recipe' could have been off - I did three small squirts of dawn and a couple shakes of lemishine - yeah not very scientific - I know.  Next batch was some 45ACP that did not have the primer pockets removed, but had also been dry tumbled.  Same amount of dawn, but a couple more shakes of lemishine this time.  They definitely came out shinier.  Two hours on each run.  I guess I just need to tweak the measurements - or maybe the open primer pockets and  bottleneck brass just take longer...

Anyway, the interesting part - the 223 had all been processed on the 1050, so decaped, swaged, sized/trimmed with the RT-1550 and neck tension opened back up to 224 with an M expander die.  However, after wet tumbling and some drying time at 170* in the oven, the neck tension has dropped back down a full line on the neck tension gauge (from Ballistic Tools) which puts it around 221.  I checked quite a few rounds all all measured out the same at 221. And I know they were all 224 beforehand as I was checking them pretty regular coming off the press.  Not sure if it was the hot water, tumbling, or heating/cooling but the neck diameter definitely got smaller.

In the end, it's not a major issue I suppose as I'll just move the M die to the loading TH in the #2 position - I had been using a Univ. Decap die there just to clean up the flash holes and punch out any straggling media, but if wet tumbling I suppose I won't need to worry about that anymore so will expand on the loading TH vs the processing TH.

Run a debur tool into the case neck. Perhaps the edge got peened over a bit. Other than that, I got nothing. There is nothing going on in a wet tumbler that could cause the brass to shrink.

You said you opened them back up to .224? why would you open neck's up to 224?
Never mind I see what you said there., they measured 224 and went down to 221.

The more time spent in the wet tumbler, the more the case mouths will get peened from bumping into each other.

Deprime, wet tumble, and dry before you do any other case prep tasks.

Experiment with different amounts of time.  I find that between 1 and 2 hours is all that is needed in the wet tumble to get brass clean inside and out.  More than 2 hours and you're going to see peened case mouths.

YMMV

This is correct.

Yup. I've actually left cases in for 24 hours because I was too lazy to debur

This is how I do it.  I have a generic, one size fits all, decap die just for this.

I no longer wet tumble pistol cases.  It causes too much friction in my carbide sizing dies.

Did it work to your satisfaction?

I would never wet tumble unprimed cases, it defeats the purpose of wet tumbling and will trap water between the primer and case until it's eventually decapped.

.221" is a decent interior neck dimension, much better than .224" which would end up giving you zero tension to retain the bullet.

I'll try the suggestions thanks - I ran the 45 basically as a "trying out new toy" deal, but yeah I don't expect to run pistol brass through the wet tumbler generally, for one it hasn't been deprimed yet and also the sticking to the powder funnel that seems to be common on wet tumbled strait wall brass (with pins, anyway -withought pins I read it's not that bad).

I was expanding the neck to 224 with M die as they were ending up about 210/215 after trimming/sizing with the RT-1500 - so expanding to 224 for use with a Mr. Bullet Feeder.  Anything less they topple when the shell plate turns.  224 seems to be the accepted diameter to use on a progressive with bullet feeder from the research I did - but I can try it with less I suppose. 

General process was expected to be...

Processing TH
Univ. Decap
Swage
Size/Trim RT1500
Expand with M die to 224

Tumble to clean up lube and debur slightly

Then loading TH
Univ Decap to cleanup flash holes
Swage again to be sure
Prime
Powder
MBF
Seat
Taper die IF needed


But sounds like I need to change it up....

Deprime
Wet Tumble
Then run through processing toolhead
Quick dry tumble to remove lube and debur necks slight.

Then I can store or go ahead and move to Lolding toolhead, ie
Univ Decap to clean up flash holes/media
Swage again to be sure
Prime
Powder
MBF
Seat
Taper Crimp if needed.

I'm running another smaller batch today testing different recipe so will shorten time as well.

I'll also try a few neck diameters with the MBF to see how low I can go and not have bullets topple moving to the seating die position.

The fit is an interference fit by at least 2 or 3/1,000 or so.

Even flat base jacketed rifle bullets usually have a rounded enough heel to allow them to start without any 'flare' applied to the case mouth.

When I load lead for BP cartridges an 'M' die makes things go smoother.

Much better results the 2nd time around...  less brass, filled FART completely with water, 3 squirts Dawn.

Still going to look at re-working the start to finish process overall as well.

Sounds like a job for some Hornady One-Shot, pistol brass being only thing that particular spray lube is useful for.

How does water get trapped in unprimed case???

Seemed to have yellowed back up after drying via oven - still nice and clean but less shine.  Read online dipping them in hot water with lemishine brings back the shine, which it does, but then you have wet brass again lol... confused.  Oh well I keep working at it.  Maybe air drying is better to keep the shininess?

I have to agree, avoid running chamfered/deburred cases through the FART, they will peen if run too long (and potentially impact length).

You should grab a 1/2 and 1 tablespoon measures from Walmart. I use 1 tablespoon lemishine for dirty range brass and 1/2 tablespoon for post sized brass to remove the royal case lube (and clean the primers).

Be careful how long you leave the brass in the tumbler when using 1 tbsp... it can discolor the brass and some brass like PPU appears more susceptible to leaching tin (I think). I've also noticed that lower pH will remove nickel coating too. For quicker processing, also load the FART with hot tap water (the rubber coating won't be damaged).

Use a car wash/wax soap instead of dawn. It coats the brass with the wax and bras won't tarnish nearly as fast. I've got some that has been sitting out for a few months that's still shiny.

3 cap fulls of wash/wax
2 45acp scoops of lemishine
3 hours for dirty deprimed brass

FART recipe: I use 1 tsb Dawn and 1 tsp Lemishine, works really good.

I've been wet tumbling my brass first since I buy dirty military brass.  I deprime and swage on 1st pass through the 1050.  2nd pass will be through the same univ decapping die, swage and will be trimmed with the RT1500 followed by the M die as suggested by fast friendly brass.



Tips and Tricks

The RT1500 is on the way so I'm not at that point yet.  I'm going to try it as above and also try it with the decapping and trimming in one pass to see.  I've read that a lot of 1050 owners do 2 passes with .223 without much complaints so we'll see but what FFB mentions does make sense.

Did a round of dirty brass from start to finish - instead of starting with brass I had already cleaned previously, and pretty pleased with the results...

Basically I de-primed only with Univ. Decap
Tumbled with 2 squirts Dawn and 1 soda cap of Lemishine - nice and shiny plus clean primer pockets
Then ran through the 1050 again to complete the swaging/size./trim, and a quick tumble after to clean off any case lube.

I think air drying is the key vs the oven - the oven takes away the bling.  Might try a dehydrator.

Going to fiddle with MBF and next tension next... :)

I use my Masterbuilt dehydrator with two ultrasonic cleaner trays full of brass. At 155 deg F I can dry 500 pieces of 308 brass in  about 90 minutes  (bone dry) in my garage with LA humidity.

Inside my house the drying time is only 45 min, but my wife frowns at me when I do that.

A Q-tip dipped in imperial sizing wax every 50 cases also works well on SS tumbled brass while sizing. I understand that the carbide expander balls also eliminate some of the scoring if you under lube.

Anyone notice any neck tension issues with the carbide expander ball and no neck lube?