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Posted: 1/10/2013 10:57:44 AM EDT
[#1]
Tag for an answer here as well. I have a couple of dry tumblers but I've been thinking about getting a wet. Never thought that the wet wouldn't remove the lube but I guess I could see how it might not depending on the additive.
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Posted: 1/10/2013 11:02:33 AM EDT
[#2]
No expert here at all.
I just got a dual drum rock tumbler to wet tumble from Harbor Freight. I had some 223 that was already sized using Hornady Unique wax that I had lying around (didn't remove lube after sizing, just threw in bin) that was only clean not shinny what so ever, ran through tumbler and it was free of lube and totally blinged out. I was thinking without SS media, just using soap and water you could tumble for 30-60 mins and it would be good enough...but I'm not sure. Next batch I will have to try. |
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Posted: 1/10/2013 11:14:32 AM EDT
[#3]
Just answered this last night in a tumbling thread, but once more...
I decap dirty cases with a Lee Universal decapper. Wet tumble and dry. Lube and size. I clean off lube with corn cob in a dry tumbler. I already had dry tumblers, so I put them to use. You can remove lube with a wet tumbler, just slower. Nothing wrong with just dry tumbling, you will just give up some bling. |
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Posted: 1/10/2013 11:16:42 AM EDT
[#4]
I wet tumble to clean the brass and pp well. I use a vibrating tumbler to remove lube.
One could use the wet tumbler to remove the lube, but it would cost you a lot of time. Lube removal in corn cob media only takes me about 45 minutes. Much quicker than wet tumbling. |
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Posted: 1/10/2013 11:16:55 AM EDT
[#5]
Quoted:
Just answered this last night in a tumbling thread, but once more... I decap dirty cases with a Lee Universal decapper. Wet tumble and dry. Lube and size. I clean off lube with corn cob in a dry tumbler. I already had dry tumblers, so I put them to use. You can remove lube with a wet tumbler, just slower. Nothing wrong with just dry tumbling, you will just give up some bling. Thanks for reposting... In my case, I have neither dry nor wet (just getting started). Wet seems to work very well, at least based on the 26 pages of posts I just read. If that's the case, I'm inclined to get a wet tumbler and try to make a go at it with only wet unless there is a compelling reason why that would not work. Slow is OK, so long as it works. |
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Posted: 1/10/2013 11:46:40 AM EDT
[#6]
No need for a dry tumbler in my opinion i wet tumble everything including lube off.
i don't like the dust and i love the bling from the wet tumbler. |
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Posted: 1/10/2013 11:51:15 AM EDT
[#7]
With wet tumbling only, you will just need 2 cycles of wet tumbling if you want to remove the lube by tumbling.
You could wipe lube off with a rag, but that gets old fast. |
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Posted: 1/10/2013 1:14:52 PM EDT
[#8]
I've been studying reloading for some time, but just recently began gearing up. Next purchase is a cleaning device, and I'm leaning towards a small ultra-sonic cleaner. Loading more for "accuracy on a budget" rather than volume. Came across this and found it interesting; lots of good info, but here's a small excerpt...
"POLISHING BRASS.... Smooth and uniform case mouths are very important in producing accurate reloads. Therefore, I don't polish my carefully prepared brass in a tumbler. During polishing, the case mouths are hammered against the other cases in the tumbler. The hammering rolls over a small lip or burr on the ID and OD of each case mouth. This peening process also locally work hardens the brass. These tiny rolled-over rings of brass at the case mouths are harder than the rest of the annealed neck. These rings and tiny peen marks are very obvious on new brass. If you look at your nice shiny cleaned cases out of the tumbler, you will see the battered case mouths!" Lots more, with good illustrations, here... http://varmintal.com/arelo.htm |
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Posted: 1/10/2013 1:25:55 PM EDT
[#9]
I decap primer then wet tumble, then resize, trim, and chamfer necks using VLD chamfer tool, followed by dry vibratory. Wet tumbling WILL ruin my new smooth round neck chamfer, so I dry VIBRATORY only afterwards to remove brass chips and lube. Sonic will work very well as last step also.
Wet stainless media tumbling WILL put irregularities on mouth of case. Caused by cases falling onto each other while tumbling Have you ever tried to seat a bullet without chamfering wouth of case. Its an ugly sight. The harder brass will shave the softer copper off bullet as it is being seated. ... |
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Posted: 1/10/2013 3:10:04 PM EDT
[#10]
Quoted: Wet tumbling WILL ruin my new smooth round neck chamfer, .... Wet stainless media tumbling WILL put irregularities on mouth of case. Caused by cases falling onto each other while tumbling You do realize that the cases are tumbling in water? They're not in some tandem-axle cement mixer falling 8 feet onto other cases, they're slowly falling through water (what, 6" at most?) onto a slowly rotating mass of pins and cases. You can't tell me that's going to cause damage. |
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Posted: 1/10/2013 6:25:24 PM EDT
[#11]
Quoted: I've been studying reloading for some time, but just recently began gearing up. Next purchase is a cleaning device, and I'm leaning towards a small ultra-sonic cleaner. Loading more for "accuracy on a budget" rather than volume. Came across this and found it interesting; lots of good info, but here's a small excerpt... "POLISHING BRASS.... Smooth and uniform case mouths are very important in producing accurate reloads. Therefore, I don't polish my carefully prepared brass in a tumbler. During polishing, the case mouths are hammered against the other cases in the tumbler. The hammering rolls over a small lip or burr on the ID and OD of each case mouth. This peening process also locally work hardens the brass. These tiny rolled-over rings of brass at the case mouths are harder than the rest of the annealed neck. These rings and tiny peen marks are very obvious on new brass. If you look at your nice shiny cleaned cases out of the tumbler, you will see the battered case mouths!" Lots more, with good illustrations, here... http://varmintal.com/arelo.htm  I disagree with that, case mouths don't get beat up when dry or wet tumbling if your doing it right. Wet tumbled 300 blk cases, see any beat up case mouths? Or just see bling?  Pistol too.
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Posted: 1/10/2013 8:04:08 PM EDT
[#12]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I've been studying reloading for some time, but just recently began gearing up. Next purchase is a cleaning device, and I'm leaning towards a small ultra-sonic cleaner. Loading more for "accuracy on a budget" rather than volume. Came across this and found it interesting; lots of good info, but here's a small excerpt... "POLISHING BRASS.... Smooth and uniform case mouths are very important in producing accurate reloads. Therefore, I don't polish my carefully prepared brass in a tumbler. During polishing, the case mouths are hammered against the other cases in the tumbler. The hammering rolls over a small lip or burr on the ID and OD of each case mouth. This peening process also locally work hardens the brass. These tiny rolled-over rings of brass at the case mouths are harder than the rest of the annealed neck. These rings and tiny peen marks are very obvious on new brass. If you look at your nice shiny cleaned cases out of the tumbler, you will see the battered case mouths!" Lots more, with good illustrations, here... http://varmintal.com/arelo.htm I disagree with that, case mouths don't get beat up when dry or wet tumbling if your doing it right. Wet tumbled 300 blk cases, see any beat up case mouths? Or just see bling? Pistol too.
This is ridiculous. Every time I see this, I get closer and closer to building a wet tumbler. I hate you, dryflash. 
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Posted: 1/11/2013 4:40:25 AM EDT
[#13]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I've been studying reloading for some time, but just recently began gearing up. Next purchase is a cleaning device, and I'm leaning towards a small ultra-sonic cleaner. Loading more for "accuracy on a budget" rather than volume. Came across this and found it interesting; lots of good info, but here's a small excerpt... "POLISHING BRASS.... Smooth and uniform case mouths are very important in producing accurate reloads. Therefore, I don't polish my carefully prepared brass in a tumbler. During polishing, the case mouths are hammered against the other cases in the tumbler. The hammering rolls over a small lip or burr on the ID and OD of each case mouth. This peening process also locally work hardens the brass. These tiny rolled-over rings of brass at the case mouths are harder than the rest of the annealed neck. These rings and tiny peen marks are very obvious on new brass. If you look at your nice shiny cleaned cases out of the tumbler, you will see the battered case mouths!" Lots more, with good illustrations, here... http://varmintal.com/arelo.htm I disagree with that, case mouths don't get beat up when dry or wet tumbling if your doing it right. Wet tumbled 300 blk cases, see any beat up case mouths? Or just see bling? Pistol too.
Dammit. Stop that. Everytime I come in here I find a thread where you're showing off some shiny cases, a bench full of equipment, or a stack of freshly loaded rounds and I start drooling all over my keyboard. Do you know how many keyboards you've cost me?  At least you haven't made it into my wallet yet, I've resisted the urge to splurge after seeing your goodies. I'm not sure how much longer I can hold out though if you keep doing this
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Posted: 1/11/2013 4:54:14 AM EDT
[#14]
Come join us on the wet side.
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Posted: 1/11/2013 5:31:01 AM EDT
[#15]
just for you guys on the edge
bling brass is the only way to go. build your own tumbler and it will save you some $$$ 
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Posted: 1/11/2013 6:25:55 AM EDT
[#16]
Quoted:
just for you guys on the edge
bling brass is the only way to go. build your own tumbler and it will save you some $$$ http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y124/BIGGDAWG800/main%20album/IMG_20130102_172455_633.jpg http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y124/BIGGDAWG800/main%20album/IMG_20130102_111620_629.jpg http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y124/BIGGDAWG800/main%20album/IMG_20121227_184744_147.jpg http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y124/BIGGDAWG800/main%20album/IMG_20121227_184807_429.jpg I'm sad...and jealous 
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Posted: 1/11/2013 6:31:42 AM EDT
[#17]
I use the wet tumbler for both cleaning and lube removal.
I don't want any case lube or media dust left in the case mouth after the final cleaning, neck tension is increased by double just from friction when the case neck is completely clean of all contaminates. For lube removal you need only wet tumble for about 15-20 mins max, the case lube is removed very fast with hot water and a little soap. Wet tumble or dry tumble the bullet jacket will still get scraped during seating(especially FB bullets) if the neck isn't flared before seating, if you load on a single stage or prefer the slower method chamfer the case mouths before loading and not before lube removal. I don't know why so many people chamfer rifle case necks but they flair all pistol cases, it's just as easy to flair rifle case necks to eliminate needing to chamfer and it actually help reduce run-out if the neck is only flared just enough to start the bullet like with a pistol case. EWP |
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Posted: 1/11/2013 8:13:58 AM EDT
[#18]
Another thing about wet tumbling.
It doesn't leave ANY dust on the case to build up in your die and scratch your brass. Those of you that dry tumble, look at your brass and see if you have any scratches on the neck. If you do, you need to clean your die and dust off the cases better. |
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Posted: 1/11/2013 9:20:31 AM EDT
[#19]
Quoted:
Just answered this last night in a tumbling thread, but once more... I decap dirty cases with a Lee Universal decapper. Wet tumble and dry. Lube and size. I clean off lube with corn cob in a dry tumbler. I already had dry tumblers, so I put them to use. You can remove lube with a wet tumbler, just slower. Nothing wrong with just dry tumbling, you will just give up some bling. Only thing I do differently, since I no longer own a dry tumbler, is to wet tumble a second time to remove lube and that's not much tumbling time at all. I like to keep a supply of prepped brass available so the drying time is not a consideration for me. |
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Posted: 1/11/2013 2:00:51 PM EDT
[#20]
I own both and use them both. I use them in different situations. I use the wet tumbler with stainless steel pins, or ceramic rods (depending on caliber), for cleaning range brass to get a base line and for initial inspection. I decap to tumble wet, as the full benefit of wet tumbling can only be gotten with deprimed cases.
I wet tumble all my black powder cartridge cases. I dry tumble when I'm in a hurry, don't have time to deprime, or am using cases that are known to be in good shape and only require cleaning for smokeless powder loads. I do not tumble cartridges after loading to remove lubricant. I used to, but found that such a practice greatly reduces the life of tumbling media. I clean lube from cases with alcohol while watching T.V. The wet process is really more involved and much more time consuming than dry tumbling. I would only recommend a wet tumbler to someone who shot black powder cartridge guns, or to someone who is very, very fussy about the condition of their cases. On the other hand, when you wet tumble, your case come out looking brand new. Clean primer pockets make primer seating go a lot more smoothly, and clean case necks make for more consistent bullet tension. |
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Posted: 1/11/2013 7:52:50 PM EDT
[#21]
Quoted: I checked that tumbler out at HF. It doesn't say it in the description but I assume it is sealed so you can wet tumble with it or did you have to make some modifications?No expert here at all. I just got a dual drum rock tumbler to wet tumble from Harbor Freight. I had some 223 that was already sized using Hornady Unique wax that I had lying around (didn't remove lube after sizing, just threw in bin) that was only clean not shinny what so ever, ran through tumbler and it was free of lube and totally blinged out. I was thinking without SS media, just using soap and water you could tumble for 30-60 mins and it would be good enough...but I'm not sure. Next batch I will have to try. |
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Posted: 1/11/2013 8:24:11 PM EDT
[#22]
I wet tumble and use the same wet tumbler dry with walnut shells to remove lube.
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Posted: 1/11/2013 8:43:55 PM EDT
[#23]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I checked that tumbler out at HF. It doesn't say it in the description but I assume it is sealed so you can wet tumble with it or did you have to make some modifications?
No expert here at all. I just got a dual drum rock tumbler to wet tumble from Harbor Freight. I had some 223 that was already sized using Hornady Unique wax that I had lying around (didn't remove lube after sizing, just threw in bin) that was only clean not shinny what so ever, ran through tumbler and it was free of lube and totally blinged out. I was thinking without SS media, just using soap and water you could tumble for 30-60 mins and it would be good enough...but I'm not sure. Next batch I will have to try. If I'm not mistaken, all rock tumblers are watertight. But anyways, I'm know the HF one is at least. |
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Posted: 1/11/2013 10:39:34 PM EDT
[#24]
I have both and use both extensively. Some brass only gets tumbled in the vibratory tumbler with corn cob. I go through enough 9mm that it's just not practical to me to go through the increased time necessary to wet tumble. Other brass typically gets a short run in the dry tumbler before being prepped. Then a run through the wet tumbler after it's completely prepped before loading so it looks brand new. Others do it a little different but that's what works for me. If I didn't have either and was only able to get one to start, I'd start with dry. It's a lot more practical to use. Wet tumbled brass looks great and I really like it but having your brass that clean just isn't that necessary. Reloaders have gotten by for years only dry tumbling. Truth be told I've reloaded a lot of pistol brass that was never tumbled for the first few years I reloaded. Good luck!
JS |
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Posted: 1/12/2013 3:40:12 AM EDT
[#25]
I'll add my 40 years of experience of tumbling comment.
Wet is a more recent method. First only was walnut media with red rouge coating. Later came the corn cob media. In the mid 2000's came the ceramic and now the stainless pins. We started with Thumblers Tumblers then vibratory came out and seems we're back to Thumblers Tumblers again for the wet. 15 min in vibratory tumbler with corn cob to remove lube. Never had any case mouths damaged with any method. Media dust never affected any of my shooting. I shoot HP Match, Benchrest & BPCR Long Range. Problem with wet tumbling is you can't use your brass until it gets dried. You can't clean them and load them in the same day. I tried oven drying and water was still left in smaller neck bottle neck brass ie. 223. For BP shells I made a drying rack to turn them upside down and put in front of my furnace to dry overnight. If I don't put them in front of a heat source they aren't dry the next morning. Loading damp brass isn't a good thing. Best way I found to dry large quantities of 223 brass was to clean them in the summer when it's over 80 or better yet 90 and spread them on cookie sheets and put out on the porch in the hot sun. I don't care any more if my brass is shiny bright so I don't tumble for long periods, longest may be 2 hrs. I didn't see any reference to drying the cases in this thread. I'd like to hear how others get 223 brass dried, quickly? Just my 2 cents worth. |
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Posted: 1/12/2013 4:14:51 AM EDT
[#26]
I towel dry then dump cases back in vibratory and corn cob media for final drying, but I only clean 100 cases at a time. Less case mouth damage this way. When I say damage, i do not mean cases are destroyed. I mean minor case mouth imperfections.
I wonder what are the long term effects of wet stainless pin tumbling. Doesn't this type of tumbling harden the surface of cases. Wouldn't this cause cases to crack sooner. I know annealing will soften brass .... |
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Posted: 1/12/2013 5:52:35 AM EDT
[#27]
When a tumbling thread comes up it always brings out the best case prOn.
 I'm going to have to pull the trigger one of these days and get the double tumbler from HF and make the move to wet.
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Posted: 1/12/2013 9:22:41 AM EDT
[#28]
Quoted:
I didn't see any reference to drying the cases in this thread. I'd like to hear how others get 223 brass dried, quickly? I throw my 223 brass in the oven on the warm setting (170 degrees) for 30 minutes after wet tumbling. I towel dry them first and I have two cookie sheets to spread them out on. They come out of the oven completely dry. One thing that does annoy me about it is that sometimes the stainless steel media gets stuck in the flash holes. My last batch had about 3 percent with this problem. |
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Posted: 1/12/2013 7:09:44 PM EDT
[#29]
Quoted: I'll add my 40 years of experience of tumbling comment. Wet is a more recent method. First only was walnut media with red rouge coating. Later came the corn cob media. In the mid 2000's came the ceramic and now the stainless pins. We started with Thumblers Tumblers then vibratory came out and seems we're back to Thumblers Tumblers again for the wet. 15 min in vibratory tumbler with corn cob to remove lube. Never had any case mouths damaged with any method. Media dust never affected any of my shooting. I shoot HP Match, Benchrest & BPCR Long Range. Problem with wet tumbling is you can't use your brass until it gets dried. You can't clean them and load them in the same day. I tried oven drying and water was still left in smaller neck bottle neck brass ie. 223. For BP shells I made a drying rack to turn them upside down and put in front of my furnace to dry overnight. If I don't put them in front of a heat source they aren't dry the next morning. Loading damp brass isn't a good thing. Best way I found to dry large quantities of 223 brass was to clean them in the summer when it's over 80 or better yet 90 and spread them on cookie sheets and put out on the porch in the hot sun. I don't care any more if my brass is shiny bright so I don't tumble for long periods, longest may be 2 hrs. I didn't see any reference to drying the cases in this thread. I'd like to hear how others get 223 brass dried, quickly? Just my 2 cents worth.   Fast drying in winter on wood stove. 140 degrees for 15 minutes.  HF $25 dehydrator takes 2 hours. A pan in the summer sun is the easiest. But it rains a lot where I'm from. |
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Posted: 1/13/2013 1:47:29 AM EDT
[#30]
Quoted:
I'll add my 40 years of experience of tumbling comment. Wet is a more recent method. First only was walnut media with red rouge coating. Later came the corn cob media. In the mid 2000's came the ceramic and now the stainless pins. We started with Thumblers Tumblers then vibratory came out and seems we're back to Thumblers Tumblers again for the wet. 15 min in vibratory tumbler with corn cob to remove lube. Never had any case mouths damaged with any method. Media dust never affected any of my shooting. I shoot HP Match, Benchrest & BPCR Long Range. Problem with wet tumbling is you can't use your brass until it gets dried. You can't clean them and load them in the same day. I tried oven drying and water was still left in smaller neck bottle neck brass ie. 223. For BP shells I made a drying rack to turn them upside down and put in front of my furnace to dry overnight. If I don't put them in front of a heat source they aren't dry the next morning. Loading damp brass isn't a good thing. Best way I found to dry large quantities of 223 brass was to clean them in the summer when it's over 80 or better yet 90 and spread them on cookie sheets and put out on the porch in the hot sun. I don't care any more if my brass is shiny bright so I don't tumble for long periods, longest may be 2 hrs. I didn't see any reference to drying the cases in this thread. I'd like to hear how others get 223 brass dried, quickly? Just my 2 cents worth. What the Kool-aid factory has to say about it Dillon has no plans to introduce a liquid tumbler. Three reasons;First:You must first deprime the brass before wet cleaning it, adding an extra step. Second: after the brass is clean, you have to wait for the brass to dry before you can load it.Third and most important: The carbon residue inside the case acts as a lubricant on the powder funnel. If this is absent, greater effort is required to pull the case off the powder funnel. Brass is cleaned to remove the dirt,grit & chunks from the case so it doesn't scratch the dies, or more importantly, the chamber of your firearm. Cleaning the interior of the case does not improve accuracy.
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Posted: 1/13/2013 5:52:54 AM EDT
[#31]
snip What the Kool-aid factory has to say about it Dillon has no plans to introduce a liquid tumbler. Three reasons;First:You must first deprime the brass before wet cleaning it, adding an extra step. Second: after the brass is clean, you have to wait for the brass to dry before you can load it.Third and most important: The carbon residue inside the case acts as a lubricant on the powder funnel. If this is absent, greater effort is required to pull the case off the powder funnel. Brass is cleaned to remove the dirt,grit & chunks from the case so it doesn't scratch the dies, or more importantly, the chamber of your firearm. Cleaning the interior of the case does not improve accuracy. The part in blue I agree with with pistol cartridges, not bottleneck rifle cartridges. A quick tumble in plain corn cob will restore the lubricant if it proves a problem for you. |
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Posted: 1/13/2013 6:19:31 AM EDT
[#32]
Quoted:
I'll add my 40 years of experience of tumbling comment. Wet is a more recent method. First only was walnut media with red rouge coating. Later came the corn cob media. In the mid 2000's came the ceramic and now the stainless pins. We started with Thumblers Tumblers then vibratory came out and seems we're back to Thumblers Tumblers again for the wet. 15 min in vibratory tumbler with corn cob to remove lube. Never had any case mouths damaged with any method. Media dust never affected any of my shooting. I shoot HP Match, Benchrest & BPCR Long Range. Problem with wet tumbling is you can't use your brass until it gets dried. You can't clean them and load them in the same day. I tried oven drying and water was still left in smaller neck bottle neck brass ie. 223. For BP shells I made a drying rack to turn them upside down and put in front of my furnace to dry overnight. If I don't put them in front of a heat source they aren't dry the next morning. Loading damp brass isn't a good thing. Best way I found to dry large quantities of 223 brass was to clean them in the summer when it's over 80 or better yet 90 and spread them on cookie sheets and put out on the porch in the hot sun. I don't care any more if my brass is shiny bright so I don't tumble for long periods, longest may be 2 hrs. I didn't see any reference to drying the cases in this thread. I'd like to hear how others get 223 brass dried, quickly? Just my 2 cents worth. After a quick toweling off of the excess water I put the brass in a large bowl and blow dry it with a hair dryer, it only take about 5+ min's to completely dry 200 .223 cases. MY process for reloading 200 pieces of brass I just fired at the range: 1. decapp brass(10 min's) 2. wet tumble brass (1 hr) 3. separate & dry brass(20 min's) 4. lube, size, & trim in one pass on progressive press(30 min's) 5. wet tumble to remove lube(25 min's) 6. separate & dry brass(20 min's) 7. dump brass into empty case bin and load on 550B (30 min's) So from once fired to loaded in a little over 3 hr's +/- 30 min's EWP |
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Posted: 1/14/2013 6:02:47 AM EDT
[#33]
Question for the wet tumblers.
When tumbling to remove lube do you or do you think it's necessary to have the SS pins in there or would water and soap suffice? I ask this is I have the HF dual drum model and I don't have a media separator at the moment, I just dump out 90% of the water and hand pick them out. It gets old fast...until then I was thinking just water and soap might do the trick that way I can just dump through an old pasta strainer I have. I tumbled up 360 9mm and 80 223 yesterday that were the funkiest, surface corroded junk looking range brass...they all look brand new after only 2 hours in the tumbler.
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Posted: 1/14/2013 10:48:50 AM EDT
[#34]
Quoted: Question for the wet tumblers. When tumbling to remove lube do you or do you think it's necessary to have the SS pins in there or would water and soap suffice? I ask this is I have the HF dual drum model and I don't have a media separator at the moment, I just dump out 90% of the water and hand pick them out. It gets old fast...until then I was thinking just water and soap might do the trick that way I can just dump through an old pasta strainer I have. I tumbled up 360 9mm and 80 223 yesterday that were the funkiest, surface corroded junk looking range brass...they all look brand new after only 2 hours in the tumbler. Never wet tumbled without the pins. Try it and see. An old collander, and you have a media separater. Check Goodwill or other thrift store. |
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Posted: 1/14/2013 10:51:58 AM EDT
[#35]
dryflash
I have tumbled without pins before they came in on some semi dirty brass, it was 9mm and they came out pretty clean, not super blinged but clean. However I wasn't sure if that by itself would be enough to remove the lube. I will try it out this week and report back. |
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