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Godfryness
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Posted: 5/26/2013 6:46:20 PM
Just broke my current cheep Burris 3x9 scope so i need a new one. I have a ruger 10/22, it has a butler creek 20 in bull barrel that is floted, (sorry I can't remember the twist rate. I think it's 1:15). A Hoge rubber molded stock. The gun has a wever rail on it now but I plan on switching to a picatinny rail. I like to shoot as far as I can with it. There is field my buddies and I shoot at and I have hit a 6 in plate at 350 yeards with lots of try's and luck. Any ways please give me any recomdations for a good scope for the money. I have a baby on the way and don't want to spend hundreds. I am looking at a Simmions Whitetail classic with mil dot redical for $124.00. Please if someone knows of a better scope for the money please send me in the right direction. One thing I don't like about the Whitetail classic is it is huge!

P.Si did do a search before asking you guys. Found nothing and scopes and prices come and go all the time. Thanks for any help!

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/168462/simmons-whitetail-classic-rifle-scope-65-20x-50mm-adjustable-objective-mil-dot-reticle-matte
bimmertech87
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Posted: 5/26/2013 9:18:56 PM
You might take a look at the muller all purpose tactical scope. A lot of love for them around here and they are only 170 at swfa
Godfryness
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Posted: 5/26/2013 9:20:20 PM
Thanks, I will look into it!
98_1LE
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Posted: 5/26/2013 9:51:36 PM
Sightron has a fair priced rimfire 3x9 scope that is nice.
Andr0id
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Posted: 5/26/2013 10:09:24 PM
I use the .22 Nikon Prostaff on mine.

Ok, if a giant fiery hole opened in the ground and swallowed Congress and the White House and left everything around untouched I might say "Whoa WTF!!" - Ragin_Cajun
RockhoundTX
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Posted: 5/26/2013 10:22:36 PM
I would check what-ever Chinese scope happens to be on sale at Midway or Natchess. A few years back I picked up a couple of Trueglo scopes that were on sale for $65. Two had amazing optics, one was OK, and one was pretty bad. In the end it is just a numbers game. I did a comparison of the optics versus 8 other scopes I had around that ranged from $20 to $1400 and was pretty amazed at the results. Basically lined all the scopes up and tried to see how far away I could read the serial number of a dollar bill without trying to squint (all scopes were set at 9x power). The Chinese scope beat out a Bushnell 3200 and Bushnell 4200 by a couple of feet and was on-par with a high-end Leupold I had. There was a fairly clear distinction between the good scopes (Simmons 44Mag, Bushnell 3200/4200, Leupold) and the not-so-good scopes (Bushnell ScopeChief, BSA 3x-9x, some old Tascos, etc.). Of course the down-side is that even thought the optics were great on some of the Truglos the click adjustments sucked. No repeatability at all. However, for "set and forget" they worked perfectly. Wouldn't go into battle with one but for punching holes in paper they are great (have a Truglo fixed 32x on my tack-driver 10/22). Have not broken one yet.
Godfryness
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Posted: 5/26/2013 10:37:29 PM
Thanks for all the help, please list the going price for the scopes named. Thanks
toby1
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Posted: 5/26/2013 10:43:39 PM
Nikon Prostaff Rimfire 3-9x40 BDC150, paid about $139.00 at Cabelas. Excellent scope, beats the crap out my old Simmons.
Godfryness
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Posted: 5/26/2013 11:32:07 PM
Originally Posted By toby1:
Nikon Prostaff Rimfire 3-9x40 BDC150, paid about $139.00 at Cabelas. Excellent scope, beats the crap out my old Simmons.



Thank you for your imput. I was just looking at that scope.
Spitfire2626
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Posted: 5/27/2013 1:20:53 AM
A couple I would consider...

Nikon P-22 2-7X
http://www.opticsplanet.com/reviews/reviews-nikon-p-22-2-7x32mm-rifle-scope-2.html

Nikon P-223 3X
http://www.opticsplanet.com/nikon-p-223-3x32-bdc-carbine-rifle-scope.html

Burris FFII 2-7X
http://www.opticsplanet.com/burris-2x-7x-35mm-fullfield-ii-scopes.html

I have the Burris on an AR-15 and it works great. A good quality hunting scope for the money. The Nikon's look cool though and they have the modern features...
gcrookston
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Posted: 5/27/2013 6:38:57 AM
I've been pleased with the results I've achieved with the Weavers (so much so that after purchasing the silver one on top, I threw another one on my beater Savage). Dollar for dollar, they've proven pretty hard to beat.
squirrelslayer1
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Posted: 5/27/2013 7:07:05 AM
Check out the mueller.

I currently have a Viper PST 4-16x50, and I am infatuated with it.
I can save you a lot of money at OpticsPlanet.com. PM me for details.

"For our light and momentary troubles are achieving for us an eternal glory that far outweighs them all."
DakotaFAL
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Posted: 5/27/2013 8:48:06 AM
[Last Edit: 5/27/2013 8:48:26 AM by DakotaFAL]
My preference is always decent optics. Not high end, but not cheap either.

A decent scope will have well made achromatic lenses and good lens coatings that produce a bright image, sharp focus and good resolution. A decent scope will also have accurate, repeatable adjustments with no back lash.

In my experience, people make a few common mistakes in scope selection. They mistake magnification for resolution and think that more magnification will let them see more detail at longer ranges. That would be the case if all things were equal, but in a low end scope they are not. More magnification requires more light, which means a larger objective. Ideally you'd want to be able to divide the objective lens diameter by the maximum magnification and get a number (the exit pupil) around 7. That's as wide as a young person's pupil can generally open, and that means in low light conditions, the eye is getting maximum benefit from the optics. Worst case, you don't want to let the exit pupil be less than about 5mm. When that happens you end up losing image brightness in anything other than full sun shine.

Large objective lenses are also exponentially more expensive to produce to the necessary level of quality, so an inexpensive 4-12x, 4-16, or 6.5-20x scope will invariably end up with a small exit pupil, low image brightness and a grainy image with low resolution. And the odds are the adjustments will not be repeatable and may not be properly aligned with the scope.

In a variable power scope there are 2 or 3 more lenses depending on the design, which causes more internal reflection and light loss making good lens coatings even more important, and the lenses must be perfectly aligned with virtually no play in the mechanism if the scope is to maintain zero as the power is changed. You'll get none of that in a cheap scope.

Parallax becomes more of an issue at higher magnifications and on a .22LR higher magnification is usually concurrent with a larger objective lens that makes it harder to maintain a consistent cheek weld, reducing the potential for your eye to be optically centered relative to the scope. That's important as you only get parallax errors when your pupil is not aligned with the axis of the scope and the farther off axis you are, the worse the apparent error becomes. The larger objective also increases the distance between the line of sight and the center of the bore and that creates a different kind of parallax that directly affects your trajectory and hold over - something that's very important with the .22LR and it's rainbow trajectory.

-----

So...rather than going big and getting sucked into the large objective, high magnification low cost marketing lie and buying a 4-12x40 or a 4-16x44 at a too good to be true price, consider:

1) A 2-7x33 Leupold. Even the VX1 versions has good optics with sharp image, repeatable adjustments and good image brightness. It comes in both rifle formats with a 150 yard parallax adjustment or a shotgun/muzzle loader format with a 75 yard parallax setting, and the list price is $264 with a duplex reticle or $289 with the LR duplex reticle. Street price ends up being around $190-$200. The optics on the Leupold VX2 2-7x33 are even better and it comes with finger adjustable turrets, but the list price is around $375 and the street price is around $300-$325.

2) A Leupold 3-9x40mm. The VX1 3-9x40mm again is available with either 75 yard or 150 yard parallax adjustment and the list price is $289 with a Duple reticle or $315 with a LR Duplex reticle, and again the street price runs around $50 less. The VX2 version lists for $374 with Duplex reticle or $412 with the LR duplex reticle.

3) A Leupold VX2 3-9x33 EFR. These are nice scopes, but pricey at $500. If you can find a used one you're in great shape. Optically speaking they are on par with the 3-9x40mm so unless you really need to shoot very accurately at very close range (under 25 yards) where the EFR adjustable objective is important, I'd recommend saving the money and getting #2 above.

Leupold also has VX1 and VX2 2-7x28mm scopes, but for the same money you can get one of their 2-7x33 scopes so I see no advantage worth the tradeoffs involved. Leupold also has 2-7x33 and 3-9x40 Rifleman scopes and they are a bit less expensive than the VX1s at $249 and $274 but you end up stick with their wide duplex reticle so for the extra $15, you're better off with the VX1.

4) The optics on Nikon's Monarch series scopes are very good and they have great finger adjustable turrets that I prefer over the VX2 as the index mark for the zero faces the shooter all the time. You can get a 2-8x32mm for $290, or a with a BDC reticle for $300.

5) NIkon's 3-9x40 Buckmaster offers decent optics and reliable adjustments at a decent price ($230), so it's also worth considering.

I've never been all that thrilled with Nikons Prostaff or Rimfire scopes, and with a price point of only $230 for the Buckmaster scopes, it's worth the extra $40 or $50 to step up a notch.
sbr-kam
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Posted: 5/27/2013 5:42:39 PM
i have a mueller apv, does more then what i need, but theeye relief does suck.
ar15newcomer
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Posted: 5/27/2013 8:22:35 PM
i have a nikon prostaff 3-9x40 and love it. very clear and great for the money and for a 22.
stangfan93
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Posted: 5/27/2013 8:35:20 PM
I Nikon Prostaff 4x32 rimfire scope on mine. I bought a few years before they rolled out variable powered rimfire scopes. It's nice and clear.
Godfryness
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Posted: 5/27/2013 11:29:22 PM
[Last Edit: 5/27/2013 11:37:25 PM by Godfryness]
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Godfryness
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Posted: 5/27/2013 11:37:59 PM
Originally Posted By DakotaFAL:
My preference is always decent optics. Not high end, but not cheap either.

A decent scope will have well made achromatic lenses and good lens coatings that produce a bright image, sharp focus and good resolution. A decent scope will also have accurate, repeatable adjustments with no back lash.

In my experience, people make a few common mistakes in scope selection. They mistake magnification for resolution and think that more magnification will let them see more detail at longer ranges. That would be the case if all things were equal, but in a low end scope they are not. More magnification requires more light, which means a larger objective. Ideally you'd want to be able to divide the objective lens diameter by the maximum magnification and get a number (the exit pupil) around 7. That's as wide as a young person's pupil can generally open, and that means in low light conditions, the eye is getting maximum benefit from the optics. Worst case, you don't want to let the exit pupil be less than about 5mm. When that happens you end up losing image brightness in anything other than full sun shine.

Large objective lenses are also exponentially more expensive to produce to the necessary level of quality, so an inexpensive 4-12x, 4-16, or 6.5-20x scope will invariably end up with a small exit pupil, low image brightness and a grainy image with low resolution. And the odds are the adjustments will not be repeatable and may not be properly aligned with the scope.

In a variable power scope there are 2 or 3 more lenses depending on the design, which causes more internal reflection and light loss making good lens coatings even more important, and the lenses must be perfectly aligned with virtually no play in the mechanism if the scope is to maintain zero as the power is changed. You'll get none of that in a cheap scope.

Parallax becomes more of an issue at higher magnifications and on a .22LR higher magnification is usually concurrent with a larger objective lens that makes it harder to maintain a consistent cheek weld, reducing the potential for your eye to be optically centered relative to the scope. That's important as you only get parallax errors when your pupil is not aligned with the axis of the scope and the farther off axis you are, the worse the apparent error becomes. The larger objective also increases the distance between the line of sight and the center of the bore and that creates a different kind of parallax that directly affects your trajectory and hold over - something that's very important with the .22LR and it's rainbow trajectory.

-----

So...rather than going big and getting sucked into the large objective, high magnification low cost marketing lie and buying a 4-12x40 or a 4-16x44 at a too good to be true price, consider:

1) A 2-7x33 Leupold. Even the VX1 versions has good optics with sharp image, repeatable adjustments and good image brightness. It comes in both rifle formats with a 150 yard parallax adjustment or a shotgun/muzzle loader format with a 75 yard parallax setting, and the list price is $264 with a duplex reticle or $289 with the LR duplex reticle. Street price ends up being around $190-$200. The optics on the Leupold VX2 2-7x33 are even better and it comes with finger adjustable turrets, but the list price is around $375 and the street price is around $300-$325.

2) A Leupold 3-9x40mm. The VX1 3-9x40mm again is available with either 75 yard or 150 yard parallax adjustment and the list price is $289 with a Duple reticle or $315 with a LR Duplex reticle, and again the street price runs around $50 less. The VX2 version lists for $374 with Duplex reticle or $412 with the LR duplex reticle.

3) A Leupold VX2 3-9x33 EFR. These are nice scopes, but pricey at $500. If you can find a used one you're in great shape. Optically speaking they are on par with the 3-9x40mm so unless you really need to shoot very accurately at very close range (under 25 yards) where the EFR adjustable objective is important, I'd recommend saving the money and getting #2 above.

Leupold also has VX1 and VX2 2-7x28mm scopes, but for the same money you can get one of their 2-7x33 scopes so I see no advantage worth the tradeoffs involved. Leupold also has 2-7x33 and 3-9x40 Rifleman scopes and they are a bit less expensive than the VX1s at $249 and $274 but you end up stick with their wide duplex reticle so for the extra $15, you're better off with the VX1.

4) The optics on Nikon's Monarch series scopes are very good and they have great finger adjustable turrets that I prefer over the VX2 as the index mark for the zero faces the shooter all the time. You can get a 2-8x32mm for $290, or a with a BDC reticle for $300.

5) NIkon's 3-9x40 Buckmaster offers decent optics and reliable adjustments at a decent price ($230), so it's also worth considering.

I've never been all that thrilled with Nikons Prostaff or Rimfire scopes, and with a price point of only $230 for the Buckmaster scopes, it's worth the extra $40 or $50 to step up a notch.


Wow thank you so much for the lesion on scopes sr. I must admit I know very little. Once again thank you for your time!


KinnyJames
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Posted: 5/28/2013 9:00:58 AM

Originally Posted By Andr0id:
I use the .22 Nikon Prostaff on mine.

+1 it has the BDC
vm1970
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Posted: 5/30/2013 2:48:36 PM
Originally Posted By sbr-kam:
i have a mueller apv, does more then what i need, but theeye relief does suck.


+1 on the Mueller it has served me well on my 10/22.
"We are playing chess here motherfucker not checkers."
bluegrass_uk
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Posted: 5/30/2013 7:42:31 PM
[Last Edit: 5/30/2013 7:43:06 PM by bluegrass_uk]
I have been really happy with the Nikon EFR Rimfire Target scope. It is really worth considering. From what I understand it was developed for mid-range target 22 and air rifles and the AO allows for greater accuracy within the closer ranges that 22 is commonly used. If you check out the review on the major optics retailer you will see that most folk rate it very high in relation to other scopes at the price point.

Also, I prefer the target reticle over the BDC's, but I'm not a hunter.