KSG…..What’s the verdict?  Now that the prices have come down to reason I’ve been considering the purchase of a KSG shotgun for zombie control.  What is everyone’s opinion on them now that they’ve been out for a while and Kel-Tek has worked out the bugs.  I really like the concept but I have not had the opportunity to put one to the test.

I bought one last week, it works great.  It's not very heavy, so it thumps pretty good with slugs or buckshot but it's super fun to shoot and patterns really well for cylinder bore.  I just added a Magpul AFG but haven't shot it yet. I am going to make a review video within the next couple weeks after I get some more range time with it.  So far it has been 100% with any kind of ammo I can think of.

 

I totally agree with you about trusting the reviews found on the internet.  I know there are some Kel-Tec haters out there.  I have never owned a Kel-Tec so I have zero personal knowledge .  What I really find odd about the reviews on the KSG is how far apart they are.  There isn't any in middle ground.  They either hate it or love it,  It will not function or it functions with any ammo????  I've never seen such left to right reviews on anything

Most of the bad reviews I've seen they are working the slide like it's made of glass or something, the good reviews even mention you have to work it with authority. But it is amazing the difference between reviewers!  I can't wait to get one, waiting on $ here.

 

A buddy bought one and brought it out to the skeet field a week ago for us to see and mess with. I ran a few rounds through it and tried to hit a few birds. I have to say this gun was one of the biggest pieces of shit I've ever handled. The slide operation was balky. Everybody who handled it constantly had to clear short strokes and fiddle fuck with it to get the thing to chamber a round. The whole thing has an overall cheap feel -- plastic on plastic cheap. The one we were playing with had no sights yet so it was impossible to aim the thing. But a shotgun really isn't aimed when shooting a flying object, it's pointed. A shotgun should just come up and be an extension of the shooter. With a well-fitting shotgun, you don't need sights to hit a flying object (in fact, if you look at the sight, you'll miss). This thing felt totally foreign. The stock fits nobody. None of us had any luck connecting with targets. Even one of our best shooters -- a guy who can generally pick up any shotgun and run the field with it -- couldn't hit any flying targets with the Kel-Tec. The only guy who had any success was using it like a pistol, shooting one-handed.

OK, sure, this is not a skeet gun. It's not designed to hit flying targets. It's for close quarter combat. Well, most of the time whoever was running the thing wasn't looking downrange, he was looking down at the gun, trying to figure out what the fuck was wrong with it. My impression is that anybody who took this gun into a combat situation would soon be dead. You can't fight a fight while you're short-stroking or poking your fingers into the feeding mechanism trying to get rounds to feed.

And that stock! Holy fuck, why didn't they put a collapsible stock on the thing. The gun is WAY too short. So short to be unusable.

OK, that's my opinion, based on 15 minutes exposure to the Kel-Tec shotgun. Maybe I don't know how to run it. Maybe it needed to be broken in. Maybe, maybe .. . but for me, it's just not worth the effort. Give me a Remington 870 or Mossberg 500 any day. I wouldn't own (much less rely on) one of these horrendous things for love or money. This gun has one purpose: to separate people from their money. It has no practical capabilities as a shotgun -- it's not a reliable weapon and it sure is useless for any sporting purpose.

ETA: I have no problem with Kel-Tec per se. My wife owns a P32 and I carry Kel-Tecs in my pawnshop. I think their handguns are fine for what they are. This shotgun? Not so much . . .

My 15 minutes of exposure was much different than yours.  

Not as smooth as an 870, but worked 100 percent for me right out of the box.

I don't baby my pump shotguns.  I cycle them like my life depends on it, and they always work.

My KSG never had feed issues, or for that matter, any single malfunction.  It is one of the older ones as I got it about 2 years ago.

As for the "being too short," I have always been a NTCH guy, so tucking into the KSG was nothing new.

It didn't come with any sights, but I slapped some DD irons on there and it has been great.

"Authority" doesn't begin to describe it. We had to ram the slide home . . . often to the point that you couldn't keep the gun in firing position to cycle a round. And then you wanted to turn the gun over and look in the feed area to make sure the stroke was complete. It was nothing like a Remington 870 or Ithaca 37 where you can cycle it so smoothly that you have no trouble staying on target and connecting with thrown doubles.

ETA: As for working the slide like it's made of glass, I'm reminded that the smoothest pump shotgun ever made was probably the Remington 31. The old-timers describe that gun as feeling like the slide was on ball bearings. I'm sure combat has its own considerations, but when shooting skeet or sporting clays, you have to connect with multiple targets launched simultaneously at 50 mph. The gun stays mounted while you connect with the first target, pick up the second bird and fire. Doubles are a big reason that most clays shooters choose double guns or automatics. You can shoot these games with a pump, though, and I've done it many times. With a good shotgun, an experienced shooter can operate a pump as fast as a semi-auto (perhaps faster). But a smooth action is a must. You shouldn't have to work the slide "with authority." The slide should practically operate itself. After all, the task at hand is not just to feed another round. The task is to hit the target.

I suppose that's why they make all those flavors of ice cream. Everybody's tastes are different.

I had a similar experience trying out my buddies KSG.

In case anyone is wondering about the durability of the KSG, check this out:
KSG shock test, Multiple Drop test and Explosion test video=> https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=QAcYErAoVP0&list=FLjWpjj75hT5ITG9QAKI0Xdw


Mine is a gen 2 and pretty much cycled everything I fed it reliably, even the mini shells.

-

You guys are scaring me now! Gen1 or 2? (For the guys that has trouble) I guess at least if I get one and don't like it, I shouldn't have trouble selling!

It's hard to argue with that test. The Kel-Tec is clearly well-suited for throwing on the ground, down steps and off of balconies . . .

I may have been seeing things wrong but it sure seemed like that guy had a lot of short-strokes and FTF's. He was very quick and smooth in clearing them but I thought I saw him having to double stroke quite a bit.

This is exactly what I am talking about.  Why get scared because one guy says it doesn't make a good skeet gun.

 

Well, not to bite on the bait too hard but I will say this . . . the average skeet or sporting clays shooter has more experience with shotguns than any mall ninja or You Tube video jockey. We shoot more rounds in a summer than most ARFcommers will shoot in a lifetime. We know shotguns. A skeet shooter indeed. The same day my buddy brought out his Ket-Tec, we also ran a "riot round" with everybody shooting skeet with 18-20" barreled pump guns. Scores were pretty darn good . . . 21 or 22 out of 25, on average . . . the short barrel and the pump actions of our Remingtons and Mossbergs were not much of a disadvantage. Nobody even dreamed of trying it with the Kel-Tec.

I never said my experience was definitive or the be-all, end-all. It is what it is. I'm a guy who shoots shotguns, a LOT of shotguns, and shoots them a LOT. I know shotguns. Shotguns are a friend of mine  . . . and that Kel-Tec, my friend, is no shotgun (wonder how many folks will get that reference) . . . anyway, my opinion is just flavor for the soup. No more, no less. Absolutely do your own research and form your own opinion. FWIW (which may be nothing), my experience with the KSG was almost exactly like the guy in the video posted above. So, forget what I say, but watch that video. Hell, watch the video where they toss the gun down the stairs. Notice how often the guy looks down at the gun with a WTF? sort of pause . . .

Bottom line: You pays your money and you takes your chances. Watch the you tube videos. Go ahead and buy one and try it out. Like somebody else said, you'll probably be able to sell it pretty easily if you don't like it.

Had similar outing at the skeet field one day as Bladeswitcher,

The owner tried a round of skeet with 0 hits so it got passed around and I had a wack at 3 birds managed to chip 1.

Like said you had to pump it with authority and then you had the ejecting hulls chewing up your arm.

No sights on the gun to reference the bird and barrel for lead, your eye is way too high over the bore line, like tying to shoot your regular shotgun with the butt under your arm pit. I think if it had an ar type front flip sight it would have been a better.

Being a 3gun shooter also, I see no advantage to this gun for 3gun, slow and hard to operate especially the loading system.

Longevity under hard use with all the plastic is anyones guess, pretty sure it would not make the torture test my poor old 3gun shotgun has taken over the last 10+ years.

Range toy sure why not, serious go to gun or gaming NO Thanks.

I think you would get your ass handed to you by those versed and probably not so versed in better weapons in short order.

If you read my first response you would see that I already bought one and tried it out.  And mine functions flawlessly.  I will also be making my own YouTube video when I get time to get back to the range.  I have actually had more than 15 minutes with a KSG and looked at it from a perspective other than a skeet shooter.  I own a BT-99, its a great gun I shoot tons of trap with it.  But that wouldn't influence my opinion of the KSG.  The only real problem I have with your "review" is that you took it to a clay range and obviously are comparing it to other clay guns then you say "if someone took this into combat they would be dead".  I mean really?

So you took a 18.5" barrel bullpup shotgun clay shooting with no sights, and wonder why you didn't break clays?

 

I am a fan-boy of bullpups so...

Love my KSG and have had none of the functioning issues others have complained about.  It LOVES the mini-shells and holds 23 when loaded up.  The other issue with the spent hitting the wrist?  I've fired mine a lot and have handed off to others but haven't experienced this issue.

Racking the slide isn't as horrible as some have posted - or mine is smoother than their action - dunno.  It does require a solid movement.  You cannot baby the action.  But perhaps each KSG is slightly different...?  I'd find the places where the slide and forearm are making contact and do some sanding and silicone application...

The YouTube video of the prison guards testing the KSG really surprised me, that thing is tough! I don't think anyone buys this for trap, it would be awful. I've got a Benelli M2 for trap and hunting. Also a red dot on there would probably make trap doable?
 

Bladeswitcher,

How long ago did your buddy purchase his KSG?  Could it have been old stock or used?  I'm asking because I'm wondering if it was a gen 1 or 2?  I know there were some problems with the gen 1 but I was told Kel-Tec fixed the issues in the gen 2.  I really love the concept of a compact shotgun that holds 14 rounds.  I own many shotguns from 870s to nice over and unders but nothing would work for home defense as well as a KSG.  Trying to wield a full size shotgun in your house is just not practical and having 14 rounds to blast at the opposition could be sweet when you are awakened in the night and thrust into a high stress situation.  However, if the KSG doesn't function, the concept won’t be worth a damn.  I'm still leaning toward purchasing one and making my own evaluation.  Like everyone has said, they are easy to sell.

I don't know how old his is. I'm assuming it's relatively recent production.

A KSG for home defense? Are you nuts? According to arfcom conventional wisdom, only an AR-15 will do . . .

As for the rest, I'm just offering my initial impressions, which were not good. I wouldn't suggest you take my word over those who own the gun, love the gun and are glad for their purchase. Clearly, they are more qualified to comment. That said, I stand by my belief that the KSG was just about the biggest piece of shit firearm I've ever handled . . . especially given the price that people are paying for these . . . Oh, and all the folks who think I was dissing the KSG because it wasn't a good skeet gun are . . . well, let's just say they missed the point . . . I was dissing it because it wouldn't function even 50 percent of the time and the ergonomics were terrible. That those facts were evidenced while trying to hit moving targets at a skeet field is quite beside the point.

As I said, you pays your money, you takes your chances. If nothing else, you should try to find one to try before you buy.

+1 here. I'll have to report back when I get a KSG, but the PMR-30 is amazing! Way more than I expected

I don't own a Krieghoff and likely never will. I do own a couple of Japanese o/u shotguns. I'm pretty confident I paid less for my guns than a lot of people are paying for Kel-Tec KSGs. What some people paid for these KSG's would buy a very nice clays gun. You could certainly buy almost any good tactical type shotgun for what KSGs were bringing.

It's pretty hard to play the shotgun snob card when people are dishing out $800 for a $500 Kel-Tec . . .

Damn, you guys are lucky, here in Long Island they run $1100, and that's before tax and only if you can find one in stock.

I paid 850 for my ksg. I don't know any clay gun that you can buy new for that.
 

Love my Gen 2

from my original comment:

THAT’S WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT!!!!  Just look at that KSG next to those 870s!  Over twice the ammo capacity with the same length barrel in a package almost half the size.  If the KSG performs well, you can't deny it is a superior combat/zombie killin weapon!  

I’m not bashing the 870, I own 2.  They are a tried and true shotgun and I think everyone should have at least one in their gun collection.  However, if the KSG is a performer, my 870 will see very little use.  In fact, it will only be used for hunting purposes and no longer have a place in my closet for home protection (The KSG will have to prove itself).

Sounds like you've made your decision. Report back and tell us how you like the gun.

Get one for those of us that have to wait until next year! Downsides of farming I suppose, once year pay that is never the same!

 

For me... i like the idea but not gonna spend the money till theres a feature for auto tube switch or alternate feeding. Keltec wont because the tubes count as magazines and then it cant be sold everywhere.

It's very easy to switch from one tube to the other, and even easier with an aftermarket
lever extension. ( I can reach mine and easily flip it with my thumb)That shouldn't be a deal breaker.

Link??

 

I got mine from ebay, it was made by Hitech customs

http://www.hitechcc.com/

Thanks!  I put some mpro7 on mine and worked it back and forth about 100 times and its really smooth and easy now but I wouldn't mind a longer lever.

 

Auto switch or alternate feeding would be awesome, that's the only positive thing I saw about the UTAS

 

10mm


You say you are a trap shooter, you should know how  a shotgun points and the use of sights really does not exist when the gun fits you.

Yep, I have worn out parts and broken broken others in some of the biggest names in plastic guns after many 1000's of rounds.

I  have owned  K gun and sold it,  it wouldn't break birds any better than  any of the other lower dollar shotguns I have owned.

Bring that KSG to a 3gun match see how it fairs.  This simulates combat and what this shotgun is designed for, right?

It is a shotgun so it should shoot bird, buck and slugs.

When you shoot  10,000+ shells  through the KSG Please let us know how it held up.

I  

To be fair, 10,000+ shells is probably wear out just about any pump shotgun on the market.

I'm no pro trap shooter, I just go sometimes. I'm very consistent 23/25 from 16' with a few 24's and 22's mixed in. I can count how many times I've broken 25, they gave me an ATA patch lol. I was just pointing out that there is a difference between a clay gun and a combat gun. Just like a target gun and a field gun.

 

"Mossberg claims the Model 500 is the only shotgun to pass the U.S. Army's Mil-Spec 3443E test, "a brutal and unforgiving torture test with 3,000 rounds of full power 12 gauge buckshot"."

 

Ok, I agree, 10,000rds. is high for buck or slug.

I agree we are comparing apples to oranges, the OP asked for experiences and opinions and that is what he got.
We told of OUR run with the gun. Just so happened it was on the skeet field.

Yes, I have broken the plastic parts in the grip area on handguns thru heavy use and fatigue, a non issue for this discussion anyway other than it's material.

Being a shotgun shooter since about 1980, 10,000rds has been passed by all of my shotguns and the only one that broke along the way was a K-80. Now gone.
One of my Brownings has easily 30,000+ thru it. No failure. Admittedly all target rounds.
Shooting it today at least another 125 rds.

I have an 1100 that has had the snot run out of it at 3gun all bird, buck and slug, and been shot at skeet and sporting clays regularly since 1998 still GTG.
I love putting guys on trailer with it extended shot tube and all at skeet & sporting.

Most all the above probably meaningless so set up some parameters where the KSG should do well and or exceed and we can go from there, probably in another thread so we don't muddy up the OP thread any more.

I own bullpups and enjoy them, however not my goto shtf weapons of choice.

Hope the KSGs prove out for you.

http://youtu.be/oD78qqs5DU8

I wonder if the guy who did that video thought that the KSG was more effective at blowing up pumpkins and water bottles than any other 12 gauge shotgun. He sure had a lot of video of exploding objects.

Hahaha I made the video that's my channel.

 

I just figured the emphasis would be more on the operation of the gun, rather than the effect on the pumpkin.

I think I said it over and over...you pull the slide back and it works fine. I even showed the specific part of the gun to watch for that wouldn't let it load if you short stroked it. People can only stand so much talking, and honestly there isn't much else to say. It fed every kinda ammo I could find, and works 100%. Wear a wrist band.

 

Maybe you could market a Kel Tec wrist band.

I'll make custom ones, any logo.

 

OK, but you have to autograph it . . .

It would also be helpful if anyone work mention of they used a V1 or 2 KSG. From what I've been reading the V2s are running much better.