I came across an early parkerized GI Springfield Armory 1911 in a pawn shop recently, it's in great shape but it's only the pistol and a mag no box etc.. The serial number is a 4 digit so I called SA today and they dated it back to November 1985! Just wondering if anyone knew when SA started making civilian 1911s and if the early ones are worth a premium?

No, but my first or second run civvie Pro would be worth something if it wasn't beaten to hell.

Springfield Armory or SAI from geneseo is not the same manufacturer as the US Gov Springfield Armory in Mass. The gov arsenal is closed and SAI has the naming rights, and was founded in 1974.

I don't know if an early example is worth any more than a current one. Maybe a little to a collector. That is a NM framed gun which means it was built here, and not in Brazil by Imbel. For a long time Springfield imported frames from Imbel, though they were high quality. Being that it is four didgit, it's pretty cool. I'd buy it if the price was right.

I'd buy it given the chance

It's in great shape and they're asking $650, compared to getting a new RIA GI model around $400.

I had two of the very early Springers.They ran great.
They are not finished as good as the later ones.
I would not pay $650 for one,however.
Get a new MilSpec instead.

$650 is too rich for my blood on that. Sure like the parked finish and work gun look to it though


...............then again. I did just drop $900 on a brand new colt commander

650 is too high. More like 450-500 tops.

Maybe for 300 bucks.

SA used to sell 1911 "kit guns" did SA say if it was one of those.

They didn't mention it



 

Yeah I figured I could get them down on price.



 

No way on $650, Buds has new parked mil specs for around $571 right now.

With a serial number that low, I would double check

I think I'd pass, just to be free of any possibility of dimensional weirdness.

My 2012 blue book lists a National Match model that they claim was built 1988-90 and had Herrett wood stocks , Bo Mar adj sight and specially fitted frame and slide with a NM barrel and bushing.
$565 95% , $650 98%

Somehow this doesn't match real well with your gun ?(other than the NM stamp)


Standard model blue or parkerised
1985-90
98% $360
95% $330
90% $300    
retail list was $454 in 1990


These were ok guns but finish was only so so and they never really commanded higher prices except for some special models . Folks who are collecting 1911s do Colts or military models , I can't see any value except as a shooter .

Do you think this gun was just not used much or was it refinished? Does the barrel shroud and lock up lugs have much/any wear.
Has the throat been polished? ( I might guess a us built NM model might be tuned up a bit but I don't really know .)

What does it have for sights? I would also think a real NM gun would have something better than the tiny GI type but again I don't know.

The "Blue Book" is usually pretty good with models and dates but maybe if they offered a NM model in the 1988 catalog the factory was playing around with them before that.

Seems to me if the gun was really built to NM type specifications with a good tight barrel , tuned fit and trigger and something decent in sights it would be worth $500-600 or a bit more as a quality shooter.

If it is just a SA shooter that has a plain factory trigger and barrel with GI type sights that somehow had NM stamped on the frame its a $350 shooter

One mans opinion , take it for what you paid for it

I agree the price is to high considering I only paid right around $700 for my SA Range Officer (.45 not they ghey 9mm) and that was back in 2012. (New and its a NM serial pistol)tack driver too. (I can place 14 rounds in the head at 35 yards at the indoor H&H range in OKC.

Guys with a Springfield Armory serial number NM doesn't mean National Match.  If that were the case they sure made a lot of questionable "National Match" grade handguns in a variety of flavors.  It's just the SN prefix they use.  Frames that were built up into complete guns by Imbel, and sport the import markings, didn't come with that prefix.  Only the guns finished here in the US wear that prefix.

However the NM prefixed Springfields, at least based on the ones I've handled, showed a better fit and finish the non-NM pistols of the same era. I suspect that combined with the NM leads to much of the confusion.

The NM prefix only indicated that it was assembled and finished in Geneseo by "Springfield Armory", as opposed to the WW and N prefix guns, which are fully assembled and finished by Imbel in Brazil.  Some of the small parts differ between the two sources and generally the NM guns are better fitted and finished.

Also FWIW all current production SA's will have a NM prefix.  I'm staring at my parkerized loaded right now which was made in the middle of 2014 and it has a 6 digit SN with NM prefix.  

Springfield does not source frames from Brazil anymore, all are US made and have NM serial numbers.

The old Springfields were rough, had ugly frames, and weren't very high quality pistols at all.

older SA's also had thicker/squarer dust covers

 
Not the ones as old as the OP.

Look at gunbroker, even the beat to hell Pros demand a premium

I love mine

http://www.nps.gov/spar/index.htm  this Govt. facility made weapons for the US military from 1777 to the M14rifle


http://www.springfield-armory.com/ is a civilian company started in the 1970's that makes M1A ( M14 clones) 1911's and imports Croatian pistols they call XD's.   this company did not make USGI WWII 1911's.

2 years ago I traded a Remington youth shotgun for one that had no signs of ever being fired. It is one of my favorite shooting 1911s and has made a hell of a truck gun.
The price seems a bit too high but, I wouldn't hesitate to give them $400.00 for it after it sits at $650 for a few months.

The newer US-sourced guns do have much better fit and finish than the older Imbel guns, so I would favor getting a new NM-prefix Mil-Spec which will be an all-around well built pistol and a great base to start customizing.



As I understand it:



N-prefix and WW-prefix(GI Mil-Spec model) pistols were sourced from Imbel. They usually had two-piece barrels and will have import markings.



NM-prefix used to be made from Imbel forgings and finished in the US. Now for the past couple years they are entirely US-made. All NM-prefix pistols I have personally seen came with a 1-piece stainless barrel.



There are a few other SN prefixes you may encounter like the LW-prefix for alloy frames, and CRG for the Professional model and perhaps for other SACS models.



 

Holy crap... you're right.

The GI models and the Mil-Spec models were different guns. The differences were the Mil-Spec models had a larger set of three dot sights whereas the GI models had the small close to traditional size GI style sights and the Mil-Spec guns had a lowered and flared ejection port whereas the GI models did not. The GI models also had lanyard loops on the MSH. The Mil-Spec models had forward cocking serrations.

The GI models are easily identified by the absence of those features and a "WW" prefix on the serial number. None of the other Springfield models have the "WW" prefix.