I have a K9 that usually lives in my safe. I like it and I shoot it well. However it doesn't get carried much simply because I have better holster options for my very trusty and sentimental PPK/S. Not here to debate caliber or whatever and actually I mostly carry my G19 or a 1911. Always have an M442 as backup either on my ankle during the rare occasion I wear long pants or in my pocket most of the time. Anyway, I have no real attachment to the Kahr and have considered trading it for an S&W Shield. Is there any reason to do this or not to do this? I have a box full of Glocks and a small pile of 1911s. At least one copy of most other popular handguns. But I don't have an M&P of any flavor.


RC

Kahr K9 is one of the few new pistols that is MIM free, reason enough to keep it.

If you like the Kahr, just keep it. The K9 is the only Kahr I like. Shields are relatively inexpensive, so instead of getting raped on your trade-in, I'd just buy the Shield outright.

I carry my K9. Good pistol.

I have both. The Shield is the weaker gun out of both. Try firing +P+ out of the Shield and you will wind up with bulged and ruptured cases. Not so much with the K9. The K9 will happily chug away all day with what ever ammo you care to put into it. Standard, +P and +P+, it's all good. I just had my slide cerakoted and an all blued K9 duo toned. What do you think?





Shield for comparison.

I'd keep the Kahr.

No reason to do it.

K9 was my first carry pistol in the late 90's, I owned it for years but its been gone for many many years and I do not miss it all - a Shield is now my routine carry item. There's more to an equation than the factory trigger...

I've never owned a K9 but I had a P9 and a PM9 in polymer.

I never found it to be a 100% reliable....  I would occasionally get a malfunction.

I sold both off and now own two Shield 9mm (wife carries one) and they have been outstanding.

I wish that I had the no-safety version but I haven't had or heard of the safety engaging accidentally.

The Shield 9mm is an excellent choice

I did install the Apex aluminum trigger and kit along with Ameriglo night sights and a stipple job.

Not sure if serious.     You're saying that the looong revolver-like pull of the Kahr is better than the crisp break (after you take up the trigger free travel) of the Shield?¿

I do have both and after I got some striker fired Glocks and M&P's the Kahr sits in the safe never to be carried again.

 

I decided to keep the Kahr and buy a Shield. Based on first impression I prefer the Kahr. I will shoot the shield tomorrow and report back.


Still waiting on the thus far mythical single stack Glock single stack 9mm.



RC

Let me just throw this into the mix

I have an old first gen P99. I have it because I have a Walther fetish. But relative to my G19s I feel like it is meh. How are the new Walthers?


RC

Good. The PPQ has one of the best triggers and is also one of the most ergonomic pistols. The PPS is a really good single stack 9mm. It's pretty much the same size as the Shield, except the barrel and slide are slightly longer. I believe it is also just the slightest, slightest bit slimmer than the Shield, but the difference is negligible.

But the Kahr reset is the length of the trigger pull. If you are used to stricker-fired resets it is hard getting used to it, especially when firing quickly.

I agree with this. With my Kahr I have to tell myself that I'm shooting a DA revolver. Sort of like my pump shotguns I don't trust myself to be able to use it proficiently under stress. I need to shoot it more to feel as confident as I do with Glocks and 1911s.


RC

I can't say that I've shot the Kahr, but if the trigger is anything like the Ruger LCP and LC9, then I have to vote Shield. I can't stand the long, heavy pull of the DAO style of pistols. My Shield has been a very nice little gun to carry and can be fun to shoot as well. Since I bought it, I have had zero failures with it. The trigger on mine seems pretty decent as well. I don't know that I would ever have it worked on except for the addition of night sights.

The Kahr trigger is not heavy but revolver-like long.  Its rather light.  Miles better than the LCP (haven't shot the LC9).

I have a CM9 and used it as my EDC for a year and a half.  I still like its concealability and finish for So FL weather but have recently switched to a Shield in 9mm with no safety*.  Why? Because the Shield's trigger is much closer to a Glock trigger in length of pull, break and reset.  I shoot Glocks a lot and it makes sense to carry something closer to my regular range and training guns.  While I don't find the CM9 unpleasant, I do agree with you that the Shield is more fun over a larger round count due to the larger grip.

The Kahr has a good trigger and would work fine as an only firearm but I'm most used to Glocks.  The CM9 still a great pocket carry choice in 9mm over a .380.  The Shield is not a pocket gun.

* Anything more that a light, single layer shirt and I'm carrying a Glock.

I would just buy a shield ( my every day carry BTW) and sit on the Kahr until you run across someone looking to buy a ccw gun. You'll come out better- remember on a trade, the shop is looking to profit twice- once on the extra cash they ask to complete the trade, and once when they sell your trade-in.

I had a K40 and a CW9, much prefer my Shield I carry now.

If Walther made a PPS M2, with a button mag release instead of the toggle....

Ok.

So far we have someone who clearly has a bias against M&P, that obviously hasn't handled a Shield or a M&P with the new trigger, we have someone saying the shield is weak because you shouldn't shoot the extremely available +P+ subgun ammo through it, we have people complaining about crappy triggers.....then suggesting a PPS and someone drawing a comparison to it and a PPQ trigger () and so on.

So I'm wondering if there are more than maybe 3 people who have posted that have actually even shot both of these guns...

Both will serve you well.  The Kahr is more pricey than the shield but out of the box has a very smooth DAO trigger.  Downside is the long reset, which I have found causes me to shoot Kahr's a lot slower than other options and virtually non-existent aftermarket.  I am particular with sights, and the Kahr series has never had the support of other platforms.

The shield *that actually has a phenomenal reset* does have a gritty takeup and an overly heavy break.  However an 80 dollar apex trigger kit transforms it into the smallest CCW friendly single stack 9mm available with the absolute best trigger out there.  They can also be had for 300 bucks if you do your shopping, and have any sight option available for them that you want.

If you require night sights and like what is available for the Kahr, its a wonderful setup.  If you are a little more cost concerned, the Shield is a great weapon that will serve you just as well as the Kahr, I guess unless you want to shoot +P+ ammo through it

The appeal of Kahrs to me is the amazing availability of different sizes.  The shield is too bulky for pocket carry, where as some larger types may be able to tuck away a PM9.  

Both will serve you well.  It comes down to which is more comfortable for you to carry.

I have owned two Shields and sold both. The triggers really turned me off. I'm not one who believes in having to spend extra money to get the Shields trigger to feel nicer. I just don't like to modify my carry guns. I do however have 2 K9's in SS. I picked up the second one today in trade for a G19. The triggers are wonderfully smooth and they are very accurate soft shooting guns. I can't crank off rounds as fast as my G19, but I can get close and do it more accurately.

So.... 80 bucks to get one of the most reliable and proven drop in triggers ever developed for a firearm...you dont....believe in it?  

I promise you, its real.  And it wont create an issue for a carry gun.

To clarify, Kahr mags are a cheap design. The feed lips often lose rounds if you carry a mag in you pocket and my CW wouldn't drop mags until I squeezed the feed lips in a vice. The shield mags are a much better design.

I could shoot the Kahrs fairly well, but I can shoot a striker gun faster and more accurate.

Someday, I wouldn't mind buying a K9 Elite if I found a good deal on one.

 

I happen to have experience with the Shield (in 9mm and .40), the Kahr CW9, and the baby Glocks (26 and 27), as well as the Sprignfield XDS-9. I was a Kahr fan, and still am, but I like the XDS a lot, because I can shoot it very well. YMMV.

If 80 bucks is a bunch of extra money, you guys are in the wrong hobby; all of my M&P's get them.  400 bucks for the gun, 80 for the apex kit.  I have 480 into my M&P's.  Shields are 300 bucks right now.  380 and you have a perfectly serviceable single stack 9mm handgun with one of the best triggers you can get out of a polymer striker gun.  With the amount of money we all dump into firearms, you write off a wonderful option due to not wanting to spend 80 dollars to make a simple upgrade, just don't chop off the nose to spite your face, there are better ways to go.

I suppose I'm struggling to find a sub 400 dollar single stack out there, so I'm not sure what your cheaper options are, even over an upgraded shield?

BTW, if you actually put some rounds through an M&P or a Shield with a stock trigger, they actually smooth themselves out very quickly and are very nice, especially the new ones with the updated sear...but I guess I'm on the opposite side of you and am of the mindset that when it only costs 80 bucks to get a really nice trigger, it would be foolish not to.

No one said $80 is a bunch of money. What was said is that you should not have to spend extra money for something that you can already get from the factory. The Kahr triggers are nice from the factory especially if you shoot revolvers. You have made it quite clear that you are a M&P fan as well as a fan of the Apex trigger.  If that works for you, then life is good on your end. It does not work for everyone.  I personally dislike the triggers on the Shields and just plain do not shoot them well. The Kahr too ME has a better trigger even with the Apex trigger installed. Just like the Shield works for you, the Kahr works for me and many others. That is why we have choices. I also choose not to change anything other than sights on a carry gun. That is my personal choice.

As far as being in the wrong hobby when it comes to firearms and monies paid for firearms and parts, read some of my other posts and you will see that I have firearms that could pay for the purchase of 30 Apex triggers. Not wanting to spend $80 on a trigger does not mean one is not willing to pay for quality or is in the wrong hobby. We can agree to disagree.

To the OP, pick what works for YOU and have fun deciding.

I'll just throw my 2 cents in that isn't worth a whole lot and it's not even completely on track with the discussion.  But it might lighten the mood.  Well, maybe not.

I've had a G19 and My parents own a M&P 9 and .45.  I have no clue what people are talking about when they say the Smith's triggers suck.  I felt my G19 trigger was more of a challenge to use than either one of the stock M&P triggers.  And these were bought about 4-5 years ago, so I don't think they were the "updated" triggers that I thought I heard Smith doing to address the complaints.  IIRC, the break on the M&P's is a little more vague but lighter.  My G19 felt really heavy.  I never measured either though.  It could be I just got a heavier Glock trigger and the M&P's were on the better side of things, I don't know.  


And yeah, about the Kahr, it makes sense that it's going to be a little slower then a striker fired with a reset, but that doesn't necessarily have to be a bad thing.  I'm not sure if I was in an actual shooting I would be focusing on rapid firing.  But I could be wrong.  I think for some people the slower, longer pull might be beneficial.  I have found myself letting rounds go a little too early on my G19 and 1911's from feeling for the reset and applying a little more pressure than I wanted to a hair prematurely.  I realize that is a training thing and should be addressed, but a longer Double Action revolver pull, or Kahr pull alleviates those.  I'm not saying ND's I'm saying rounds that get sent a tiny hair bit early from just a hair too much pressure from my trigger finger while feeling for the reset.  I think for everyone's sake I'm better off having to go all the way back out.  It hasn't happened a lot, but I bet I'm not the only one that has done that.

And really, both a Glock and M&P trigger at their worst are usually a bit easier to wrestle with than my Colt DS.  

Agreed about preference and that kahrs have very smooth triggers. ...and of course to choose what works for the shooter, which was my point.  Both brands and types are totally serviceable weapons, and one can be upgraded easily/cheaply if the user feels its necessary.   That was my point, as I still own (and love) a kahr.

But the poster I quoted said exactly that the apex kit was "a bunch of money".

Buy a regular Kahr K9, get some Mothers aluminum polish and get a couple of rags. You will have a Kahr "Elite" in no time.

I hear so much talk on triggers on Kahrs, but I have yet to hear about the "New York Trigger". On most other Kahrs (the polymer guns and other calibers) they have a standard trigger pull. On the K9s they use the "New York trigger". Although it sounds like a heavier trigger pull, it isn't. The trigger when moved back about 1/4 of an inch does nothing. From there on the trigger is like a short double action pull. I personally like the NY trigger.

There is no way to compare the smoothness of the double action Kahr to the gritty, single action pull of the Shield. Even with the Apex kit, it's no where near as nice as the Kahr's double action IMHO.

Its all personal opinion.

I went to check out a Kahr and hated the trigger.

I normally shoot GLock, M&P and XD's so that maybe the big reason why I felt that way. Im just used to the striker fire poly pistol feel.