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Posted: 4/19/2016 9:32:07 PM EDT
I just opened up a case of .45 I purchased online and found out the vendor shipped me the wrong ammo. I had ordered a case of Magtech and was shipped a poorly packed case of Sellier & Bellot.
I'm kind of frustrated because I specifically wanted the Magtech (I've been very satisfied with all the other Magtech stuff I've used). My question is - is this worth complaining about? I don't think I've ever used S&B ammo before, but I wouldn't have paid quite what I did for it. I spent the $$$ expecting Magtech. What's the verdict? Shoot it? Ask for a partial refund?? Update I emailed, and to their credit, I already received a response. They apologize for the inconvenience and offered a 5% credit from the purchase price for the inconvenience, which I think is fair. Interestingly, they pointed out that S&B and Magtech are made by the same company, which I had no idea. I'm not sure if this is recent development or not. Anyway, I'm satisfied with the resolution. |
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[#1]
If you don't feel like the return hassle just shoot it, I shoot a good bit of S&B and have shot MagTec as well and they both run great in all of my guns. S&B I believe is made by Fiochhi, and its g2g.
I would however send them an email and let them know about the mix up, just so they know. They will most likely offer to exchange it or give you a discount on future orders. Plus like I said, ive shot plenty of S&B in several calibers and its good ammo. |
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[#2]
S&B is good to go ammo. However you should let them know they screwed up Who was the vendor ?
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[#4]
I've never had an issue with S&B ammo and I've shot thousands of it through various pistols and revolvers. Same with Magtech.
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[#5]
if it is not a different price, keep the S&B, it is good ammo.
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[#6]
Thanks for the advice, glad to see I didn't get completely hosed.
The vendor was Armsunlimited.com. I ordered a case of 9mm and a case of .45 on the same day. The 9mm shipped within 48 hours. After a week, I emailed and asked if they had the .45 in stock and when would it ship. They claimed that 'shipping' was backed up and said it would ship soon. It did in fact ship within 24 hours and I had it in a reasonable amount of time. I did email them to let them know, and I'll see what happens. I've ordered from them before and haven't had an issue. Obviously I should have just ordered from SGAmmo. Lesson learned. |
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[#8]
In my experience S&B has been more reliable than Magtech...
ETA: one thing to note is S&B is bronze jacketed not copper, and some barrels wont shoot it as accurately... |
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[#9]
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[#10]
Quoted:Interestingly, they pointed out that S&B and Magtech are made by the same company, which I had no idea. I'm not sure if this is recent development or not. Anyway, I'm satisfied with the resolution. View Quote That is interesting. I have heard little good about MagTech ammo in general, yet S&B has a very good rep. My experiences are somewhat jaded from some S&B shotgun shells I bought several years ago that were absolutely awful, OTOH, I bought a crap-ton of S&B 45ACP jacketed ammo from Sportsman's Guide back when the back-order scams were in full swing after the last ammo panic. From what I've shot of it, I find it to be perfectly good ammo - fairly clean and accurate, and is still probably the best bargain going for decent fully jacketed 45 ammo available these days. |
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[#12]
Quoted:
Where did you get that info regarding the jacket material? From a write-up on the Lucky Gunner website: "The 230 grain .45 ACP ammo that we tested utilizes a reloadable brass case with a non-corrosive primer and a traditional lead bullet with a copper full metal jacket. The individual cartridges come tightly packaged in a 50 round box with two plastic carriers of 25 rounds each. With a muzzle velocity of around 850 feet per second, it has moderate recoil for the .45, not quite what you'd get from high pressure defensive loads, but not the softest recoiling either, putting it at a comfortable meeting for use as training ammo." Looks like copper in the picture on the box too: https://www.impactguns.com/data/default/images/catalog/535/SBT_V311252U.jpg View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
In my experience S&B has been more reliable than Magtech... ETA: one thing to note is S&B is bronze jacketed not copper, and some barrels wont shoot it as accurately... Where did you get that info regarding the jacket material? From a write-up on the Lucky Gunner website: "The 230 grain .45 ACP ammo that we tested utilizes a reloadable brass case with a non-corrosive primer and a traditional lead bullet with a copper full metal jacket. The individual cartridges come tightly packaged in a 50 round box with two plastic carriers of 25 rounds each. With a muzzle velocity of around 850 feet per second, it has moderate recoil for the .45, not quite what you'd get from high pressure defensive loads, but not the softest recoiling either, putting it at a comfortable meeting for use as training ammo." Looks like copper in the picture on the box too: https://www.impactguns.com/data/default/images/catalog/535/SBT_V311252U.jpg In 9mm S&B uses a brass jacket on their FMJ. Other calibers it tends to be the standard guilding metal (copper) jackets. |
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[#13]
Quoted: In 9mm S&B uses a brass jacket on their FMJ. Other calibers it tends to be the standard guilding metal (copper) jackets. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: In my experience S&B has been more reliable than Magtech... ETA: one thing to note is S&B is bronze jacketed not copper, and some barrels wont shoot it as accurately... Where did you get that info regarding the jacket material? From a write-up on the Lucky Gunner website: "The 230 grain .45 ACP ammo that we tested utilizes a reloadable brass case with a non-corrosive primer and a traditional lead bullet with a copper full metal jacket. The individual cartridges come tightly packaged in a 50 round box with two plastic carriers of 25 rounds each. With a muzzle velocity of around 850 feet per second, it has moderate recoil for the .45, not quite what you'd get from high pressure defensive loads, but not the softest recoiling either, putting it at a comfortable meeting for use as training ammo." Looks like copper in the picture on the box too: https://www.impactguns.com/data/default/images/catalog/535/SBT_V311252U.jpg In 9mm S&B uses a brass jacket on their FMJ. Other calibers it tends to be the standard guilding metal (copper) jackets. I had some brass 357sig. |
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[#14]
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[#15]
Quoted:
I just opened up a case of .45 I purchased online and found out the vendor shipped me the wrong ammo. I had ordered a case of Magtech and was shipped a poorly packed case of Sellier & Bellot. I'm kind of frustrated because I specifically wanted the Magtech (I've been very satisfied with all the other Magtech stuff I've used). My question is - is this worth complaining about? I don't think I've ever used S&B ammo before, but I wouldn't have paid quite what I did for it. I spent the $$$ expecting Magtech. What's the verdict? Shoot it? Ask for a partial refund?? Update I emailed, and to their credit, I already received a response. They apologize for the inconvenience and offered a 5% credit from the purchase price for the inconvenience, which I think is fair. Interestingly, they pointed out that S&B and Magtech are made by the same company, which I had no idea. I'm not sure if this is recent development or not. Anyway, I'm satisfied with the resolution. View Quote Shows you how much they know. CBC (Companhia Brasileira de Cartuchos) of Brazil purchased both S&B and MEN (Metallwerk Elisenhuette GmbH) of Germany. All three companies have their own factories and make their own separate brand of Ammunition. |
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[#17]
Quoted:
Interestingly, they pointed out that S&B and Magtech are made by the same company, which I had no idea. I'm not sure if this is recent development or not. Anyway, I'm satisfied with the resolution. View Quote Owned.... owned by the same company. ( not sure ) Like Chevy owns Cadillac... Toyota owns Lexus... So while owned by the same company... that does not mean QC is the same. |
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[#18]
Both are brand names of the same company.
http://www.sellierbellot.us/corporate Magtech appears in many cases to be a slightly lower price line. I have never had QA issues with either. S&B .45 ACP was used at Gunsite when I took classes there. 1200 rounds in six days. Swelling in my hand was not gone till Wednesday the next week. Won the class shoot off. Only 8 of us in class though. Bill Halverson and Mario Marchman. Glendale, CA PD. I have used a very small amount of Magtech in .357 mag and had no issues. |
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[#19]
The only FTF/ FTE I ever had with my Glock26 was Magtech ammo.
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[#20]
Of the two brands, I prefer S&B in .45ACP and I shoot a lot of it with no issues in SIGs, 1911s, and my 625-8 revolver.
It's accurate in each of my guns too. |
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[#21]
Um yeah, I must have been drinking, yeah I meant brass. I have no idea where bronze came from
Also to add, the S&B I have experience with is 9x19, 9x18, and 9x17. All of which have a brass jacket in S&B. I figured it was so across the whole line... |
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[#22]
Quoted:
I just opened up a case of .45 I purchased online and found out the vendor shipped me the wrong ammo. I had ordered a case of Magtech and was shipped a poorly packed case of Sellier & Bellot. I'm kind of frustrated because I specifically wanted the Magtech (I've been very satisfied with all the other Magtech stuff I've used). My question is - is this worth complaining about? I don't think I've ever used S&B ammo before, but I wouldn't have paid quite what I did for it. I spent the $$$ expecting Magtech. What's the verdict? Shoot it? Ask for a partial refund?? Update I emailed, and to their credit, I already received a response. They apologize for the inconvenience and offered a 5% credit from the purchase price for the inconvenience, which I think is fair. Interestingly, they pointed out that S&B and Magtech are made by the same company, which I had no idea. I'm not sure if this is recent development or not. Anyway, I'm satisfied with the resolution. View Quote |
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[#23]
And I'd rather shoot Magtech, their brass is way better for reloading and their factory ammo is more accurate out of my guns.
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[#24]
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[#25]
It's just ball range ammo. Either are fine and I can't tell the difference between any of the better fmj loads out there.
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[#26]
Quoted:
And I'd rather shoot Magtech, their brass is way better for reloading and their factory ammo is more accurate out of my guns. View Quote There brass may be better and it may be more accurate when it fires but I wouldn't trust it. I see a lot of failures with ut at the range I work at. 9 and .40 seem to be fine but .45 seems to be underpowered enough to not eject in a lot of guns and one shooter was having problems with his colt trooper. 2-3 rounds per cylinder would not fire. We switched him to blazer brass and it fired 100%. (38spl btw) |
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[#27]
Quoted:
There brass may be better and it may be more accurate when it fires but I wouldn't trust it. I see a lot of failures with ut at the range I work at. 9 and .40 seem to be fine but .45 seems to be underpowered enough to not eject in a lot of guns and one shooter was having problems with his colt trooper. 2-3 rounds per cylinder would not fire. We switched him to blazer brass and it fired 100%. (38spl btw) View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
Quoted:
And I'd rather shoot Magtech, their brass is way better for reloading and their factory ammo is more accurate out of my guns. There brass may be better and it may be more accurate when it fires but I wouldn't trust it. I see a lot of failures with ut at the range I work at. 9 and .40 seem to be fine but .45 seems to be underpowered enough to not eject in a lot of guns and one shooter was having problems with his colt trooper. 2-3 rounds per cylinder would not fire. We switched him to blazer brass and it fired 100%. (38spl btw) FWIW, the USAMU issued MagTech 9mm to the entire firing line during the 2015 M9 EIC matches, and it ran without a hitch in the issue M9 I was using. I can't speak for anyone else on the line that day, but I had zero problems. |
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[#28]
Quoted:
FWIW, the USAMU issued MagTech 9mm to the entire firing line during the 2015 M9 EIC matches, and it ran without a hitch in the issue M9 I was using. I can't speak for anyone else on the line that day, but I had zero problems. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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Quoted:
And I'd rather shoot Magtech, their brass is way better for reloading and their factory ammo is more accurate out of my guns. There brass may be better and it may be more accurate when it fires but I wouldn't trust it. I see a lot of failures with ut at the range I work at. 9 and .40 seem to be fine but .45 seems to be underpowered enough to not eject in a lot of guns and one shooter was having problems with his colt trooper. 2-3 rounds per cylinder would not fire. We switched him to blazer brass and it fired 100%. (38spl btw) FWIW, the USAMU issued MagTech 9mm to the entire firing line during the 2015 M9 EIC matches, and it ran without a hitch in the issue M9 I was using. I can't speak for anyone else on the line that day, but I had zero problems. I've used Magtech by the cases for courses and training in both .45 and 9x19, never any issue. Complete trust in it with all of my guns too. I've learned long ago that actual experiences and not recreational armchair experts biased inexperience's is where the actual truths lay. Between Thursday night steel challenges and doing other things I am easily burning over 10,000 rounds a year in just 9x19 alone and Remington, Perfecta, Blazer, Speer, Federal, Magtech, S&B, and Fiocchi have all been flawless. I've seen Magtech work in an SP101, GP100, and a Henry .357 and all have gone bang. The .45 is not under powered at all as they have cycled with no problems two 1911's and a USP45. I've even tested their defensive ammo with their current bonded stuff, under powered is the understatement here. I'll keep using Magtech and recommend it to all of my friends. |
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[#29]
Quoted:
If you hadn't quoted this, I would never had seen this as I have that person on ignore for a very good reason and this proves it. What he see's as "failures" I do not trust as the truth at all. I've used Magtech by the cases for courses and training in both .45 and 9x19, never any issue. Complete trust in it with all of my guns too. I've learned long ago that actual experiences and not recreational armchair experts biased inexperience's is where the actual truths lay. Between Thursday night steel challenges and doing other things I am easily burning over 10,000 rounds a year in just 9x19 alone and Remington, Perfecta, Blazer, Speer, Federal, Magtech, S&B, and Fiocchi have all been flawless. I've seen Magtech work in an SP101, GP100, and a Henry .357 and all have gone bang. The .45 is not under powered at all as they have cycled with no problems two 1911's and a USP45. I've even tested their defensive ammo with their current bonded stuff, under powered is the understatement here. I'll keep using Magtech and recommend it to all of my friends. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted:
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And I'd rather shoot Magtech, their brass is way better for reloading and their factory ammo is more accurate out of my guns. There brass may be better and it may be more accurate when it fires but I wouldn't trust it. I see a lot of failures with ut at the range I work at. 9 and .40 seem to be fine but .45 seems to be underpowered enough to not eject in a lot of guns and one shooter was having problems with his colt trooper. 2-3 rounds per cylinder would not fire. We switched him to blazer brass and it fired 100%. (38spl btw) FWIW, the USAMU issued MagTech 9mm to the entire firing line during the 2015 M9 EIC matches, and it ran without a hitch in the issue M9 I was using. I can't speak for anyone else on the line that day, but I had zero problems. I've used Magtech by the cases for courses and training in both .45 and 9x19, never any issue. Complete trust in it with all of my guns too. I've learned long ago that actual experiences and not recreational armchair experts biased inexperience's is where the actual truths lay. Between Thursday night steel challenges and doing other things I am easily burning over 10,000 rounds a year in just 9x19 alone and Remington, Perfecta, Blazer, Speer, Federal, Magtech, S&B, and Fiocchi have all been flawless. I've seen Magtech work in an SP101, GP100, and a Henry .357 and all have gone bang. The .45 is not under powered at all as they have cycled with no problems two 1911's and a USP45. I've even tested their defensive ammo with their current bonded stuff, under powered is the understatement here. I'll keep using Magtech and recommend it to all of my friends. IIRC, that was the first time I ever used MagTech 9x19, and I was kind of surprised the AMU didn't use Winchester or another domestic producer. It worked just fine, though, so I have no complaints and certainly wouldn't hesitate to add some to my stash when its on sale. I also used some MagTech in a Coonan 1911 (.357 magnum) and it worked okay, except for the occasional jam which I attribute more to the poorly maintained rental piece than the ammo. I've used all of the ammo brands you've listed without any trouble, and in fact I've RARELY come across poor quality rounds, with the exception of Wolf steel case which I don't shoot anyhow. Though, I do remember a bad batch of PMP .45 ACP several years ago, which just absolutely stunned me to say the least. |
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[#30]
I've probably shot more S&B than Magtech, but that's because I was first exposed to S&B back in 1991. I've not had any problems with it. I probably started buying and trying Magtech in the early 2000s. I can't say I've ever had a problem with it either. I've reloaded brass from both and never experienced any problems with either companies brass either. Now with S&B, Magtech, and MEN all falling under the CBC corporate umbrella, the quality seems pretty similar, though I've found that the MEN seems even a touch more accurate, clean and consistent. But the Czech and Brazilian offerings are not far behind the German stuff.
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[#31]
i'm pretty sure the owner of battlefield vegas said they almost exclusively use magtech as their range ammo.
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