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Posted: 12/9/2014 12:48:39 AM EDT
Help me end a debate with a friend. I lube my BCG's with frog lube, applied on all the friction points, with a soaking Q tip and my finger. He takes a look at it and accuses me of shooting with my bolt dry. I give him the
 look. He further explains, the concept of "Shoot it wet" is dripping wet, and he states that the oil retained in the BCG, will self lubricate the barrel, from the reciprocating action, thus prolonging the barrel of the life.
I tried to explain that it is not good to have too much oil in the chamber and barrel, headspace issue, chamber supported case etc etc etc. Now he gives me the and then spouts.. Better to have too much than not enough. I know I have plenty on, liberal coating, just not oozing and dripping all over the place.
Truth be know.. I hate fucking oil all over my shooting glasses. So in your interpretation, what is shooting it wet. |
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Posted: 12/9/2014 12:57:13 AM EDT
[#1]
I have been shooting this platform for over 36 years. All I do is make sure the BCG is well lubed, but never excessive. I use Break Free lubricant which is like CLP. For Lube, from what I understand, is used by many these days. Just apply a liberal amount, but not to excess. It does not have to be dripping wet. Running it with an excessive amount of lube will only make a mess. You will have lube splatter everywhere.
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Posted: 12/9/2014 1:03:17 AM EDT
[#2]
Yeager says don't RUN IT WET
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Posted: 12/9/2014 1:11:42 AM EDT
[#3]
If I can see it shining, it's wet enough.
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Posted: 12/9/2014 1:17:37 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If I can see it shining, it's wet enough. Bingo! That was my argument with him. Thank you sir! like many things, there is a point of diminishing returns. ETA: after watching the video, we are both right.. point taken is have your BCG lubed. As to how much you want blowing out, it's up to you. |
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Posted: 12/9/2014 1:20:59 AM EDT
[#5]
I get my BCGs dripping wet after a cleaning.
I'm known by a few of my shooting buddies for regularly using the phrase, "I like my BCGs like I like my women. The wetter the better." 
No such thing as too much lube on a BCG, but a such thing as too little. I honestly chalk some of my flawless reliability track record with dozens of ARs and countless rounds up to how aggressively I lube my BCGs...and using FireClean as well. 
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Posted: 12/9/2014 1:29:00 AM EDT
[#6]
Nothing personal j_hooker, but I agree with your buddy. Rather have too much than not enough, you are incorrect about the "too much lube in the chamber causing problems with headspacing etc." The only AR's I've seen fail during a course are guys who's lube of choice had evaporated and left their gun dry and shitty. (They had not applied enough)
Applying small amounts to the contact points will probably get you though some light shooting at the local gun range, but not any type of extended fire. (carbine course) Alaska511 already posted this but: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=0f8_1361527144&comments=1 |
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Posted: 12/9/2014 1:39:44 AM EDT
[#7]
If I don't need to clean oil off my glasses after the first mag the gun was lubed just right.... I lube so all the friction points have a nice shine, dripping wet has me cleaning my glasses more than shooting
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Posted: 12/9/2014 5:41:06 AM EDT
[#8]
If its strictly a range gun then lube on contact points is all I'd use since I could always add more.
If its a serious personal defense gun that I use at my house/desert then I prefer it "dripping", and shooting it wet imo is when you take that first shot with all the lube burning off. ETA: Filthy 14 would not have lasted as long as it did with just contact point lube imo. |
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Posted: 12/9/2014 6:31:57 AM EDT
[#9]
What about using grease on the contact points? I've been doing that for a while now, but that usually only consists of shooting about 100 rounds a trip.
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Posted: 12/9/2014 8:37:36 AM EDT
[#10]
I put a decent amount on my BCG and during range time have been known to add more when I see it looks dry. I won't take it apart, just pull CH enough the BCG opens the ejection door, put lube, pull CH so the BCG is clear of the ejection slot and put lube on the other on the receiver wall.
Have never had a problem. Just something about seeing a dry BCG and knowing I am about to run it hard. |
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Posted: 12/9/2014 9:57:11 AM EDT
[#11]
Lube in the chamber causes increased back thrust on the bolt.
I am not sure how significant the increase is, but I avoid the situation on general principle. I have seen problems with under lubed weapons many times. |
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Posted: 12/9/2014 10:06:55 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No such thing as too much lube on a BCG, but a such thing as too little. This is my position as well. An AR15 MUST have lubrication to properly function. And liberal lubrication will overcome a multitude of other problems (like lack of cleaning). And on the flipside, you won't hurt the gun at all by having too much lubrication than necessary. So I always err on the side of more rather than less. |
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Posted: 12/9/2014 10:10:57 AM EDT
[#13]
Just curious how the "run it wet" crowd feels about this approach. Lube is discussed at the 8:40 mark
lubed? |
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Posted: 12/9/2014 5:03:15 PM EDT
[#14]
I lube mine dripping wet, except for a boresnake only clean every 1000 rounds, never an issue using whatever, steel, nickel, brass, etc in dusty desert conditions. Whatever excess is too much, it runs off or burns up anyways. IMO there is no need to be overly anal about it. Lube it wet, shoot, rinse and repeat.
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Posted: 12/9/2014 5:22:11 PM EDT
[#15]
I run my BCG wet. Larry Vickers resolved this issue when he submerged a whole AR in oil.
Figure this you would not run your car engine with a little oil why run the BCG (which is a piston) with very little lube. James Yaeger is right on the Glock about over lubrication but only in the firing pin channel it should not be over lubricated. |
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Posted: 12/9/2014 5:26:56 PM EDT
[#16]
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Posted: 12/9/2014 5:31:41 PM EDT
[#17]
This gun went through zero cleanings, 1000 rounds and eleventeen pounds of mud over three days of running and gunning.
All I did was keep adding lube, and it kept shooting.  |
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Posted: 12/9/2014 5:41:22 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This gun went through zero cleanings, 1000 rounds and eleventeen pounds of mud over three days of running and gunning. All I did was keep adding lube, and it kept shooting. https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-GZcc96pZLq4/UtapLAIFaaI/AAAAAAAAPG4/oFqoN85_us4/w960-h640-no/1488214_622163854497092_1303982519_n.jpg barely even dirty. |
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Posted: 12/9/2014 5:46:58 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: barely even dirty. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: This gun went through zero cleanings, 1000 rounds and eleventeen pounds of mud over three days of running and gunning. All I did was keep adding lube, and it kept shooting. https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-GZcc96pZLq4/UtapLAIFaaI/AAAAAAAAPG4/oFqoN85_us4/w960-h640-no/1488214_622163854497092_1303982519_n.jpg barely even dirty. I just jump on every chance to post that pic, because it's badass.
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Posted: 12/9/2014 5:55:09 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This gun went through zero cleanings, 1000 rounds and eleventeen pounds of mud over three days of running and gunning. All I did was keep adding lube, and it kept shooting. https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-GZcc96pZLq4/UtapLAIFaaI/AAAAAAAAPG4/oFqoN85_us4/w960-h640-no/1488214_622163854497092_1303982519_n.jpg and.... right click save
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Posted: 12/9/2014 5:57:56 PM EDT
[#21]
I agree on sopping wet lube. Lots of it, even though I run a nickel boron BCG. The entire system needs lots of oil everywhere except in the chamber and barrel. I'm not so sure about OP's choice of frog lube, however. What say ye all about choice of lube? My preference is a full synthetic motor oil, same as I run in my turbocharged car engine, which, by the nature of how turbochargers work, is a very hostile and dirty environment.
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Posted: 12/9/2014 5:58:26 PM EDT
[#22]
I like to use Frog Lube, put the paste on according to their procedure, wipe the large amounts of FL off, then apply the liquid on top of that.
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Posted: 12/9/2014 6:35:20 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This gun went through zero cleanings, 1000 rounds and eleventeen pounds of mud over three days of running and gunning. All I did was keep adding lube, and it kept shooting. https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-GZcc96pZLq4/UtapLAIFaaI/AAAAAAAAPG4/oFqoN85_us4/w960-h640-no/1488214_622163854497092_1303982519_n.jpg You had three days and didnt have time to clean it ? Too macho for me . 
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Posted: 12/9/2014 7:29:45 PM EDT
[#24]
Google Filthy 14.
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Posted: 12/9/2014 7:30:00 PM EDT
[#25]
Topic Moved
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Posted: 12/9/2014 7:57:01 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You had three days and didnt have time to clean it ? Too macho for me . Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: This gun went through zero cleanings, 1000 rounds and eleventeen pounds of mud over three days of running and gunning. All I did was keep adding lube, and it kept shooting. https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-GZcc96pZLq4/UtapLAIFaaI/AAAAAAAAPG4/oFqoN85_us4/w960-h640-no/1488214_622163854497092_1303982519_n.jpg You had three days and didnt have time to clean it ? Too macho for me . the point is that if the gun will run dirty for three days, it will run clean right out of my trunk for the few hours I need it. |
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Posted: 12/9/2014 8:36:35 PM EDT
[#27]
If I can see oil stains around the pins on the outside of the lower and where the upper meets the lower, then I am gtg.
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Posted: 12/12/2014 9:53:27 AM EDT
[#28]
Sweet Pic Brother.
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This gun went through zero cleanings, 1000 rounds and eleventeen pounds of mud over three days of running and gunning. All I did was keep adding lube, and it kept shooting. https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-GZcc96pZLq4/UtapLAIFaaI/AAAAAAAAPG4/oFqoN85_us4/w960-h640-no/1488214_622163854497092_1303982519_n.jpg |
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Posted: 12/12/2014 1:51:36 PM EDT
[#29]
I keep my BCG wet. I give it a good hose down with either CLP or Slip 2000 EWL until the BCG is soaked and is dripping. I've never had an issue doing this and I don't clean until I've fired close to 1k rounds, although in my last cleaning session I probably had half that many and just cleaned out of boredom.
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Posted: 12/12/2014 2:06:09 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This gun went through zero cleanings, 1000 rounds and eleventeen pounds of mud over three days of running and gunning. All I did was keep adding lube, and it kept shooting. https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-GZcc96pZLq4/UtapLAIFaaI/AAAAAAAAPG4/oFqoN85_us4/w960-h640-no/1488214_622163854497092_1303982519_n.jpg Watery mud could be lube
Badass pic
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Posted: 12/13/2014 11:15:13 AM EDT
[#31]
Why anyone would want to throw oil on every round right before it goes in the chamber to be fired is beyond me, but thats exactly what happens when you run wet, if you don't think so then shoot a few rounds wet and pull the mag, the top few rounds are covered with oil. ya real smart in more ways than one.
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Posted: 12/20/2014 12:38:16 PM EDT
[#32]
FWIW OP I too use FrogLube CLP and have adjusted the amount of CLP I use because of that (I don't use or need as much). I also now don't have that CLP spray in the face while shooting which is nice. I have noticed it doesn't take no where near as much CLP using the FL to keep my BCG wet and running perfectly. I have used various CLPs at one time or another and some of them, IMO, needed to be sprayed/reapplied frequently to keep the BCG wet enough for me. IMO with FL a little goes a long way and it works very well for me. I have seen bone dry and literally dripping wet rifle BCG's over the years. To each their own I suppose however, I will say that in my experience this platform's BCG likes to be wet/properly lubed and that is how I roll with my rifle. I hope this helps.
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Posted: 12/20/2014 2:51:46 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryThanks everybody this is James Yeagar with Tactical Response, reminding you your responsibility to be ready for the fight, NEVER ENDSSSSSSSSSS Yeager is.....special. His heart is in the right place but he was dropped on his head a few too many times.
OP- I run my shit soaking wet. The FCG,BCG, hammer face are all pretty damn wet. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 12:13:54 AM EDT
[#34]
I run my AKs and ARs dripping wet. If my shooting glasses don't have oil on them at the end of the day then they didn't have enough lube.
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Why anyone would want to throw oil on every round right before it goes in the chamber to be fired is beyond me, but thats exactly what happens when you run wet, if you don't think so then shoot a few rounds wet and pull the mag, the top few rounds are covered with oil. ya real smart in more ways than one. Makes no difference, oil doesn't hurt ammo. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 12:34:59 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why anyone would want to throw oil on every round right before it goes in the chamber to be fired is beyond me, but thats exactly what happens when you run wet, if you don't think so then shoot a few rounds wet and pull the mag, the top few rounds are covered with oil. ya real smart in more ways than one.  This guy. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 7:05:25 AM EDT
[#36]
It's not so much about the ammo, it's the grip of the chamber walls of the rifle when the case is covered with oil and then fired.You wonder why there are busted bolt lugs?
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I run my AKs and ARs dripping wet. If my shooting glasses don't have oil on them at the end of the day then they didn't have enough lube. Makes no difference, oil doesn't hurt ammo. Quote HistoryQuoted:
I run my AKs and ARs dripping wet. If my shooting glasses don't have oil on them at the end of the day then they didn't have enough lube. Quoted:
Why anyone would want to throw oil on every round right before it goes in the chamber to be fired is beyond me, but thats exactly what happens when you run wet, if you don't think so then shoot a few rounds wet and pull the mag, the top few rounds are covered with oil. ya real smart in more ways than one. Makes no difference, oil doesn't hurt ammo. |
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Posted: 12/21/2014 7:29:34 AM EDT
[#37]
I completely submerge mine in motor oil. Vickers did this and it works fine
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Posted: 12/21/2014 8:13:41 AM EDT
[#38]
Keeps my gun cabinets from rusting....
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Posted: 12/21/2014 5:48:06 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's not so much about the ammo, it's the grip of the chamber walls of the rifle when the case is covered with oil and then fired.You wonder why there are busted bolt lugs? Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's not so much about the ammo, it's the grip of the chamber walls of the rifle when the case is covered with oil and then fired.You wonder why there are busted bolt lugs? Quoted:
I run my AKs and ARs dripping wet. If my shooting glasses don't have oil on them at the end of the day then they didn't have enough lube. Quoted:
Why anyone would want to throw oil on every round right before it goes in the chamber to be fired is beyond me, but thats exactly what happens when you run wet, if you don't think so then shoot a few rounds wet and pull the mag, the top few rounds are covered with oil. ya real smart in more ways than one. Makes no difference, oil doesn't hurt ammo. A dry gun can and will break lugs. It happens due to the design limitations. Read about filthy14, was run wet it's entire life. 43,800+ rounds fired, one broken bolt at around 16,000 rounds (was pretty much filthy dirty it's whole life- but wet). I could care less how others run theirs, I'll run mine wet, very wet. Is bad advice when someone tells others to not run wet... ARs need lubrication.
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Posted: 12/22/2014 8:20:10 PM EDT
[#40]
If you are a casual shooter that sometimes takes his AR to the range (slow firing), then a light sheen of lube (oil or grease) is all one needs
on the carrier rails and on the bolt. As a side note: Do NOT put lube in the chamber or barrel before firing. Chromed barrels (I cannot speak about melonite/nitrided barrels) do not need lube. Chromed chambers do not need lube. If you train (carbine courses) or use your rifle daily (MIL/LEO/Security/etc), then you need to ensure you run it WET. The bolt is wet and the exterior rails on the carrier are nice and well lubricated. Again, this can be oil or grease. To explain further, as one increases the amount of shooting, the bolt group loses lubrication from mechanical and thermal effects. Shoot more, need more lube. Experiment and see for yourself: Next time at the range, wipe down the inside of the upper (where the carrier reciprocates) with a clean, dry rag. This is to remove any residual lube. Put a 'barely visible' coat of lube on your bolt and on the carrier rails. Then, see how many magazines you can shoot slow fire (about one round every 10 seconds...so the weapon barely heats up). Now, try the experiment again but shoot as many rounds as you can (at a rate of about one round per second) to get the weapon nice and hot. Again not mag dumps, just a good, steady rate of fire to heat up the barrel, chamber, and bolt group. You'll see that at a slow rate of fire, a very small amount of lube is just fine and the weapon will run. As you increase weapon heating, you will definitely incur stoppages from a lack of lube. Bottom line: If you run the weapon hard enough to get it hot, you should run it as wet as possible. |
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Posted: 12/24/2014 10:48:22 PM EDT
[#41]
Y'all might want to look at this video.
Here is the link if my embedding skills are weak. https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=p9bOT_d60LM Vulcan94 |
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