Anyone use a cheaper ebay handguard?  I see free float handguards on eBay that look like the ones sold by our vendors here but are about half the price. What's the difference?  Cheaper material?  

What's going to happen if I use these cheaper handguards?  My current build is not a SHTF gun but more of a bring out 1-2x/year gun for fun at the range with my girlfriend type of gun.    I might experiment with one and see what's up.  Any input?

They are designed for Airsoft guns not a real firearm.

My buddy put one on a budget build and it hasn't had any issues. He ordered a quad rail and a keymod rail from eBay and then decided which to use once he got them both. The quad rail was SUPER heavy so he used the keymod hand guard and hasn't had any problems for a cheaper alternative. YMMV I guess.

I went out on a gamble and purchased a slim quad rail from bigcountryrifleaccesories. He doesn't sell much on eBay but has a website. It's rock solid and made in USA. My only complaint is there there aren't anti-rotation tabs and that you have to time the barrel but perfectly to get the screws in. If you're looking for a cheap rail, go with ALG or UTG PRO. The UTG pro is made in USA and is flawless.

Here's an eBay rail on my budget build.  Works good so far and haven't had any issues with my first 50 rounds through it.
On my nicer builds, I go with the brand name made in the USA rails.  

eBay hand guards have worked fine on my pistol builds. Haven't tried on a rifle.  

Al barrel nut, 300blk


Al barrel nut, 223 Wylde


Steel barrel nut, adds a lot of weight, 7.62X39

My experience was bad. I bought an NSR style rail. I had to return it as the mounting holes were drilled incorrectly to line up with barrel nut holes and the keymod holes were not tapered as they should (that didn't really bother me)

You're really rolling the dice with the cheaper ones. They might be great, but I've had a keymod handguard that didn't meet specs. The inner portion of the hole was not machined correctly and did not have the indent machined into it. As a result, the nut has nowhere to sit for tightening. It was basically un-useable. It usually boils down to the cost of accurate machining vs just getting close. Good alignment, fit, and finish all take more time, and that usually equates to higher price.

Doesn't mean that you won't get a good one cheap, just means that the odds are against it.  If I was going cheap, I'd want to make sure that I could inspect it before taking it home and be able to take it back if there is something wrong.

Recently used a "Davidson Defense" 15" (it appears to be an attempt to capitalize on the Daniels Defense name)  it is worth every penny of the $60 I paid for it and probably not a penny more.  I should say that I have YHM and Samson on most of my other stuff, but this was budget build .It uses a proprietary barrel nut then a clamp on system VERY similar to Samson.  Right away it was apparent that the proprietary barrel nut was soft and but it mounted timed fine. The screws that clamp the rail to the barrel nut were soft enough that the internal hex began to round as I tightened them (yes I was probably was half the problem) I went to see a machinist buddy who had a supply of quality machine screws and swapped him a sandwich for quality replacements . IMHO these are fine for a recreation gun and may even put one on My AR22  but for  duty rifle , save up the  cash and a buy a quality rail.
Here is is  my Budget Build

I hadn't considered the quality of the metal itself. That's pretty freakin' scary that the barrel nut might just twist off or fail while you're shooting.

And that's why some of insist on some basic quality verification. At least Mil-Spec tells you that it was built to a certain specification and they're not just winging it.

While chinese parts can be made to any spec the distributor wants, labor still makes up a large part of the price.   You pay a cnc operator $87 an hour (employer cost), while a chinese guy makes $87 a month.

Just to Clarify, I have no doubt the barrel nut will hold but it it the process of tightening it it  the finish came off as you can see in my picture and the "Teeth"  easil showed where the wrench applied torque. .

It seems certain vendors have sold some volume.   Makes me wonder if there are some diamond in the ruffs available. But how can you tell without a feedback and review page.  Makes me want to stick with my UTG rails.  But im still tempted.

I've used a few.  I generally stay away from anything Chicom on my guns, but like a primary arms RDS, it's 1/4 the cost (or less) of a quality RDS like a H1 or T1.  Yes, you might have issues with barrel nut wrenches fitting, parts will wear and ding faster and easier than a quality rail and you'll probably have issues with out of spec mounting like keymod or even the pica tinny rails.  But for non-duty weapons they have their place.  For me, the price point has to be under $60.  More than that and I'll fiND a deal on a quality rail even if it's used.  The EE is great for those deals.

Is that legal? I thought having a forward grip on a pistol made it an AOW

Pretty sure its -
Angled grip = OK
Vertical Grip = NOT OK

Vertical grip is fine of OAL is >26 inches

Angle forward grips are not considered a vertical grip by the ATFE non-convenience store.
Link to ATFE Letter

would it be a pistol if the OAL is greater than 26?

Keep in mind that if you were to sell that same chinese crap, you will get nothing for it...whereas you want to upgrade a quality rail for another...you can get something for the quality rail.  Chinese crap is money thrown away...just my opinion.  Look at Aero...starting at $65

Even quality parts used are generally only going to sell for 1/2 the original price.  So if the Chinese knockoffs sell for 1/2 the price of the originals...  then even if they are worth nothing used, you've still lost the same amount to depreciation...



Now if you can buy the good stuff used then you probably can turn around and re-sell it for about what you paid for it.

I recently sold a 12" spikes bar quad rail for around $100 or something like that. I paid over $200 for it a few years ago. Granted, it was an outdated quad rail that not too many desire anymore even though it's a well known name brand. So yeah, your point is valid on how the resell value is lower across the board for name brand vs Chinese parts.  It just depends on what your budget is and what you are wanting for that particular build.  I don't have a problem spending more on a higher end build if I know I'm going to keep that rifle for the long term.

The idea that I am going to sell something in the future does not even come into the equation when I purchase something.

Agreed, especially with the political climate that is out there now, if I buy something firearm related i'm not getting rid of it unless its ammo for training...

Sure, I don't fault people for appreciating nice stuff...  But there are reasons why different products of different price points are on the market...  Because people's wants and desires can vary.

Now some inexpensive stuff is indeed crap...  but unfortuantely some expensive stuff is too...

And sometimes there are things that are just plain a bargain...  I've bought a few inexpensive knock off items that were just as good maybe even better than some very expensive ones.  I bought some grips that were < $10 that as far as I can tell are just as well made and of similar materials to others I've seen for sale for around 3x the price.  The simpler something is the more likely an inexpensive copy will be serviceable of course...  but things like rails are out there enough now that the designs are easy to copy and the Chinese are getting better at making stuff that actually works all the time.

What I always find amazing about these types of threads, is that companies that are American actually use the Chinese companies to make the product for them and then sell them as American products, there CNC machines works just as well as ours, most of the stuff for the AR platform is a simple CNC program.

Just because a company claims it is American, does not mean the parts they are selling you were actually made in America, I have seen parts from India, China, England, Bangladesh, you really never have a sure way to know where they are coming from.

And please don't get me wrong I am 100% for American products, but I have seen so many instances of products coming from other companies to know better.

I have a dozen of the cheap eBay handguards.

They're made of aluminum. They are strong enough to beat in someone's skull.

Just like the aluminum valve covers on my scrambler (motorcycle), they're made in China.

I purchased them because they are cheap. If you are going to have more than 3 AR type rifles, unless you're rich you better have a few that are budget builds.
Jeez, since when did trying to save money become an act of treason??

The  economist Milton Friedman addressed the issue of "dumping" of subsidized goods on countries importing products (like the cheap Chinese handguards). His point was take advantage of it while you can. It saves the consumer money, which can then be spent on whatever he or she chooses (ammo for me).
If a country sells another country goods that are priced below market value, it ultimately will lead to the collapse the exporting country's industry due to smart consumers (including corporations) buying up all of the product that they can, and then reselling it.

A perfect example of Chinese manufacturing for me is watches. The Chinese make copies of Valjoux chronographs that are less than $50 retail for each movement.
A wholesale Swiss Valjoux movement will be over $200. Most of the Chinese movements will last a year or more, but aren't worth the money to repair.
All of the Valjoux movements will last hundreds of years if properly maintained and repaired.

Do you want a watch you can throw away in a year or 2?
Do you want a watch your grandkids can wear?

It's a choice. We're lucky we have those.

Matrix is as cheap as I'll go. Hell of a deal for budget rails.

Thumbs up for the write up!  

While your letter clearly shows that the angle grip is OK, it makes absolutely no sense. Whether the foregrip is vertical or angled should not make any difference since it is clearly adding a second grip. At that point the pistol is no longer "designed to be held and fired by the use of a single hand"  How are we supposed to keep up with all these ambiguous rulings?




ADDING A VERTICAL FORE GRIP TO A HANDGUN
“Handgun” is defined under Federal law to mean, in part, a firearm which has a short stock and
is designed to be held and fired by the use of a single hand…. Gun Control Act of 1968, 18
U.S.C. § 921(a)(29).

Under an implementing regulation of the National Firearms Act (NFA), 27 C.F.R. § 479.11,
“pistol” is defined as:
… a weapon originally designed, made, and intended to fire a projectile (bullet) from one or
more barrels when held in one hand, and having (a) a chamber(s) as an integral part(s) of, or
permanently aligned with, the bore(s); and (b) a short stock designed to be gripped by one hand
and at an angle to and extending below the line of the bore(s).
The NFA further defines the term “any other weapon” (AOW) as:
… any weapon or device capable of being concealed on the person from which a shot can be
discharged through the energy of an explosive, a pistol or revolver having a barrel with a smooth
bore designed or redesigned to fire a fixed shotgun shell, weapons with combination shotgun and
rifle barrels 12 inches or more, less than 18 inches in length, from which only a single discharge
can be made from either barrel without manual reloading, and shall include any such weapon
which may be readily restored to fire. Such term shall not include a pistol or revolver having a
rifled bore, or rifled bores, or weapons designed, made, or intended to be fired from the shoulder
and not capable of firing fixed ammunition. 26 U.S.C. § 5845(e).

ATF has long held that by installing a vertical fore grip on a handgun, the handgun is no longer
designed to be held and fired by the use of a single hand. Therefore, if individuals install a
vertical fore grip on a handgun, they are “making” a firearm requiring registration with ATF’s
NFA Branch. Making an unregistered “AOW” is punishable by a fine and 10 years’
imprisonment. Additionally, possession of an unregistered “AOW” is also punishable by fine and
10 years’ imprisonment.

Awe,

I love the ATF, asked 10 agents the same question and you will receive 20 different answers.

Different communities cover their own topics repeatedly.  Like we talk about the legalities making firearms from 80% receivers or 14.5" barrels + pinned muzzle devices, the pistol sub forum talks about legalities of what grip you can have on your pistol at different lengths and how it changes the definition.  

Pistol + Angled fore grip = Pistol
Pistol >26" + vertical grip = Firearm
Pistol <26" + vertical grip = AOW


Outside of our little worlds, most wouldn't have a clue to the laws around it all.  But we need more common sense firearms laws.

Just got this option by email... pretty inexpensive for a keymod rifle hand guard that includes a steel barrel nut. Not sure if OP is looking for something similar priced or less expensive.  
http://www.deltateamtactical.com/Davidson-Defense-AR-15-Free-Float-Keymod-Trapezoid-Quad-Rail-Handguard--15_p_5000.html