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Posted: 2/7/2017 1:17:20 PM EDT
[#1]
Update:
Also looking at the Nightforce NXS 1-4. Since this will be an up-close carbine first and a down range carbine second, I really do want a light-ish, fast scope. for the same money ($1000-$1200) which is the way to go? I'm leaning USO, but there's more people out there with positive experience with the NF. |
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Posted: 2/7/2017 1:40:54 PM EDT
[#2]
I don't own any of the 3 scopes you've mentioned, I have looked though USO glass, NSX glass and the Razor on multiple occasions. Get the Razor, you won't be disappointed.
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Posted: 2/7/2017 1:45:24 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't own any of the 3 scopes you've mentioned, I have looked though USO glass, NSX glass and the Razor on multiple occasions. Get the Razor, you won't be disappointed. I'm certainly considering it. However, the weight issue is a consideration for me, as this will be a rifle I use for classes and such, not shooting from a bench or rest. |
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Posted: 2/7/2017 9:22:45 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm certainly considering it. However, the weight issue is a consideration for me, as this will be a rifle I use for classes and such, not shooting from a bench or rest. According to the Razor's (25.2oz) and SR4c's (19.84) specs 5.36oz separate them, both are heavy scopes. If you're after LW the Leupold VX-6 1-6x24 (13.4oz) is hard to beat. Leupold just updated the VX-6 line with the new VX-6 HD's and old VX-6 scopes are marked at clearance prices at some retailers, both scopes are another option. From what I've seen the Razor has the most impressive glass of the bunch, VX-6 scopes are nothing to sneeze at however. |
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Posted: 2/8/2017 10:53:54 AM EDT
[#5]
The SR-4C is an excellent optic. More rugged than both Nightforce and Vortex and I like the reticle better.
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Posted: 2/8/2017 12:22:18 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The SR-4C is an excellent optic. More rugged than both Nightforce and Vortex and I like the reticle better. To which reticle are you referring? There's a mil reticle and a Horus reticle. I'm tempted by the Horus, but don't care for the added cost on a 1-4x. |
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Posted: 2/8/2017 2:40:12 PM EDT
[#7]
I have one on my 14.0" gun.
Some thoughts--- It's extremely rugged. It's heavy, but quite compact in size. At 1X with the dot on it's very close to being an Aimpoint. I had service done on mine and it took USO 4 months to get it back to me. The button activated illumination control is a little awkward but it has good battery life and a 12 hour auto shut off timer so you won't have to dick with it very much. The zoom ring takes like 270 degrees of rotation to go from 1 to 4 magnification. |
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Posted: 2/8/2017 3:49:33 PM EDT
[#8]
Thabks, that matches most of what I've read.
May i ask why you sent it for service? Was the issue resolved? How would you compare it to a Night force 1-4? |
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Posted: 2/8/2017 5:05:34 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thabks, that matches most of what I've read. May i ask why you sent it for service? Was the issue resolved? How would you compare it to a Night force 1-4? I got mine used. The zoom ring was really tight when I got it and it didn't feel right. I called USO and they said send it in, we'll check it out. I wasn't super happy that it took so long to fix but everyone I talked to was nice and helpful. It came back looking and feeling perfect. They also updated the electronics for the red dot. I have not used the Nightforce Similar scopes I have used: Trijicon Accupower 1-4 (cross-hairs are very fine, illumination is not really daylight-bright)(I own this one, the rest on this list I have just borrowed) Trijicon Accupoint 1-4 (Green triangle reticle is amazing outdoors in most light.) Leupold 1-6 vx6 Firedot (Much lighter than the USO, the firedot is daylight visible) Weaver 1-7 Tactical (Also a dual focal plane design. Excellent Aimpoint-like dot combined with a nice FFP reticle. Field of view feels a little bigger than the USO) Lots of great 1-X scopes out there to choose from! |
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Posted: 2/8/2017 5:18:13 PM EDT
[#10]
Awesome, thanks!
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Posted: 2/9/2017 7:33:47 AM EDT
[#11]
I wouldn't buy a USO scope after reading about the turrets snapping off on some people.
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Posted: 2/9/2017 9:02:44 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wouldn't buy a USO scope after reading about the turrets snapping off on some people. I've read that also, but I haven't seen that in recent years....most of it was from at least 3 years ago if I remember right. Granted, you'll get a smaller sample size with USO due to cost. I do really like that it's going to be red dot bright. |
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Posted: 2/10/2017 8:34:27 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've read that also, but I haven't seen that in recent years....most of it was from at least 3 years ago if I remember right. Granted, you'll get a smaller sample size with USO due to cost. I do really like that it's going to be red dot bright. You're more forgiving than I of items at this price point. Regardless the Razor is a better scope. |
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Posted: 2/10/2017 9:06:47 AM EDT
[#14]
Do you want FFP or SFP?
Aren't you comparing apples to oranges? |
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Posted: 2/10/2017 9:34:01 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Do you want FFP or SFP? Aren't you comparing apples to oranges? FFP or SFP really doesn't matter to me on a 1-4/6 scope. FFP, to me, gets more important with more magnification. |
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Posted: 2/10/2017 9:36:40 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're more forgiving than I of items at this price point. Regardless the Razor is a better scope. Like I said, I've read a few instances of this happening. Has this been addressed in production? How often is it a problem? I don't know, because most of what I hear is that USO builds them very robustly. I'm not saying the Razor is or isn't "better," but I've ruled it out, because if I'm going to go with that heavy of a scope, I'm going to go with a 1-8 instead. I'm fully aware of how good the Razor is, especially in its use by military units. It's just not what I want. |
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Posted: 2/10/2017 10:58:27 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Like I said, I've read a few instances of this happening. Has this been addressed in production? How often is it a problem? I don't know, because most of what I hear is that USO builds them very robustly. I'm not saying the Razor is or isn't "better," but I've ruled it out, because if I'm going to go with that heavy of a scope, I'm going to go with a 1-8 instead. I'm fully aware of how good the Razor is, especially in its use by military units. It's just not what I want. Turrets snapping off is not what I would call robust. A better question is why deal with USO's potential problems at all when there are so many other quality manufacturers out there? |
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Posted: 2/10/2017 11:54:01 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're more forgiving than I of items at this price point. Regardless the Razor is a better scope. And in the same stroke you would recommend a Vortex Razor over a USOptics... They aren't really comparable. One is built for abuse, the other is built primarily as a 3-gun optic. The glass on the Razor HDII is nice, but I wouldn't take a 1-6 razor over a 1-4 USO. The reticle options on the Razor are junk in my opinion. And I've seen a couple of Razors bite the dust. I've also seen Aimpoints and ACOGs bite it. |
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Posted: 2/10/2017 12:55:45 PM EDT
[#19]
Roamin,
Definitely appreciate your opinion. I've tossed out one option (gotta whittle it down somehow), the Razor, not based on its comparison to USO, but because at the weight penalty of the Razor, I'd rather have a 1-8 scope. I've looked through a few Razors, and they're definitely good scopes, and pretty tough from all my research. I'm fairly close to ruling out the Nightforce based on illumination. However, I've also heard from several friends (one who's taken top shooter at a couple EAG courses with a NF 1-4) that the reticle is pretty fast, even without daylight bright illumination. It's also pretty light and robust. If I could get a Khales or Swarovski or similar 1-6 for the $1200, I would jump on it quicker than you could see, but that's not likely to happen. |
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Posted: 2/10/2017 11:57:49 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And in the same stroke you would recommend a Vortex Razor over a USOptics... They aren't really comparable. One is built for abuse, the other is built primarily as a 3-gun optic. The glass on the Razor HDII is nice, but I wouldn't take a 1-6 razor over a 1-4 USO. The reticle options on the Razor are junk in my opinion. And I've seen a couple of Razors bite the dust. I've also seen Aimpoints and ACOGs bite it. Absolutely I would recommend a Razor over a USO scope. Anytime I've hit on a manufacturer for having failures it's been common for a supporter of that manufacturer to show up and claim they've seen the opposing product fail as well, but they never have any sources to reference in support of their claim thus I chalk it up to BS and hear say. |
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Posted: 2/11/2017 1:58:37 PM EDT
[#21]
I worked at a firearms store that specialized in ARs and high-end optics etc. I saw my fair share of just about everything. I've seen failures from almost every single quality manufacturer out there including Aimpoint, Trijicon, USOptics, Schmidt & Bender, Nightforce, etc. Yes, I've seen Vortex optics that have been broken too. My point is that generally speaking, when it comes to build quality and components such as turrets and reticles, I would give the edge to USO over Vortex any day. Some quality control issues with some knobs isn't a big deal as long as they were rectified (and they were). USO 1-4 is a much better optic than a Vortex 1-6.
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Posted: 2/11/2017 2:18:46 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I worked at a firearms store that specialized in ARs and high-end optics etc. I saw my fair share of just about everything. I've seen failures from almost every single quality manufacturer out there including Aimpoint, Trijicon, USOptics, Schmidt & Bender, Nightforce, etc. Yes, I've seen Vortex optics that have been broken too. My point is that generally speaking, when it comes to build quality and components such as turrets and reticles, I would give the edge to USO over Vortex any day. Some quality control issues with some knobs isn't a big deal as long as they were rectified (and they were). USO 1-4 is a much better optic than a Vortex 1-6. Really, I think the Vortex has better glass and is a better scope. What specific aspects and features do you think make the USO a better optic than the Vortex? |
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Posted: 2/17/2017 1:22:20 PM EDT
[#23]
Better turrets, much better reticles, and better low-light transmission at higher magnifications. You know, the things that should be important in a quality scope.
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Posted: 2/18/2017 5:33:20 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Better turrets, much better reticles, and better low-light transmission at higher magnifications. You know, the things that should be important in a quality scope. I agree with you on the reticle, but; Better turrets? The turrets on both the Razor Gen 2 and SR4C are capped. The Razors turrets offer well machined knuling for grip, nicely defined clicks, and are a wide low profile turret with 49 MOA of adjustment in a single turn. Better light transmission at higher magnification? I'd be interested to hear your take on how the Vortex offers less light transmission with equal or better quality glass and a 10% wider 24mm objective than the USO's 22mm. Vortex glass being on par with USO glass as unpossible as it may seem it's true. Vortex put some of the best glass I've seen under $2k in the Razor Gen 2. I've spent enough time with USO scopes and the Razor to know I perfer the Razor's glass over USO. I find the Razor to have equal or better resolution and a warmer tint which I very much perfer and is what gives scopes an impressive image with vivid color and that pop that many associate with high quality glass. Many out there are unfamiliar with Vortex's higher end line of optics and shrug them off due to the fact that Vortex also offers low to mid tier optics as well thinking that Vortex is incapable of top level quality. This is an incorrect assumption if you need further convincing that glass in a Vortex Razor Gen 2 is indeed comparable to USO glass here's a link to a review of a 4.5-27x Razor Gen 2 in which it is stated as comparable to USO's 3-17x Link here. Unpossible! Please explain how the SR4c which is outdated, and now discontinued offers better turrets, and better light transmission? |
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Posted: 2/18/2017 9:22:13 AM EDT
[#25]
I wasn't speaking to the SR-4c specifically. Only stating my reasons for preferring USO.
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Posted: 2/19/2017 6:02:02 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
And in the same stroke you would recommend a Vortex Razor over a USOptics... They aren't really comparable. One is built for abuse, the other is built primarily as a 3-gun optic. The glass on the Razor HDII is nice, but I wouldn't take a 1-6 razor over a 1-4 USO. The reticle options on the Razor are junk in my opinion. And I've seen a couple of Razors bite the dust. I've also seen Aimpoints and ACOGs bite it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
You're more forgiving than I of items at this price point. Regardless the Razor is a better scope. And in the same stroke you would recommend a Vortex Razor over a USOptics... They aren't really comparable. One is built for abuse, the other is built primarily as a 3-gun optic. The glass on the Razor HDII is nice, but I wouldn't take a 1-6 razor over a 1-4 USO. The reticle options on the Razor are junk in my opinion. And I've seen a couple of Razors bite the dust. I've also seen Aimpoints and ACOGs bite it. Call me different, but I have never caught on to the Vortex craze, my buddy's have them, I have shot rifles it's them and there is no way in the world I would put Vortex is the same category with USO, no way. I have USO scopes and could not be happier. The only scopes I would consider are NF and SB, but SB is in another price bracket. 77 |
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Posted: 2/19/2017 9:28:01 AM EDT
[#27]
From all the comparisons I've seen the Burris XTR II 1-5x scopes are in the same line with very nice glass and have both SFP and DFP with the red illumated reticle in the SFP and the mil/bullet drop reticle on the FFP which let's use the bullet drop at any magnification. It has there MAD turrets which lets you leave them capped or uncapped and is 21oz which is a little lighter than the Vortex. Also has a lifetime warranty. I've never owned a variable scope but I'm looking to buy one now.
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Posted: 2/19/2017 12:20:45 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Call me different, but I have never caught on to the Vortex craze, my buddy's have them, I have shot rifles it's them and there is no way in the world I would put Vortex is the same category with USO, no way. I have USO scopes and could not be happier. The only scopes I would consider are NF and SB, but SB is in another price bracket. 77 Vortex makes a wide variety or products in many different price ranges. To be more specific I didn't say Vortex was comparable with USO I said that I thought the Vortex Razor Gen II was better than USO. I own S & B, MK8, & Kahles glass and there is no way USO compares to any of them. To my eye USO glass is very unimpressive when compared with other exotic scopes. USO' s resolution is high but the color is flat, has no pop. I think USO glass is very comparable to my VX-6. USO isn't without issue as a company with the knobs breaking. The SR-8C also has significant optical problems, from pincushion distortion, poor eyebox, and curvature of field at high power that makes the image appear out of focus. |
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Posted: 2/20/2017 8:28:33 PM EDT
[#29]
I have to pipe in here. I resisted low power variables for a long time. Ran my carbines at work and home with primarily Aimpoint T-1's and T-2's. As I got older, I began seeing grapes instead of a clean red dot. Over the past two years I have toyed with my team-mates' Vortex, Nightforce, Schmidt and Bender, Kahles, and USO scopes.
I finally put up the cash for the USO SR-4C and mounted it on a KAC SR15. The red dot is SFP, the reticle is FFP, which is a genius combination, in my opinion. The dot is easily equal to the Aimpoint in every light condition. The glass is excellent. I have run this optic through monthly training, and several week-long "classes." I am hard on my kit, and I must say that the USO is truly built like a tank. I am not sure what happened to the turrets in those unfortunate events that are all over the internet. My only small quips would be the weight on the light carbine, and the eye box that takes a little bit of work to get familiar with. I am very happy with the SR-4C and would highly recommend it. USO built mine when I ordered it. And their CS was excellent. |
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Posted: 2/21/2017 9:06:42 AM EDT
[#30]
Thanks everyone. I just took the plunge into a less expensive option and bought a Steiner P4Xi, which left me with enough money in my budget to get a higher end optic as well. At this point, I'm juggling between something like an SR-4C and Trijicon's new 1-8 (plus seeing if there's anything coming out soon).
I realized that I could get a decent 1-4 in a more affordable package, then save more money for an optic with more magnification for a hybrid Recce / SPR do-it-all gun. I'm still not ruling out the SR-4C, as it's one of those scopes I've just always wanted for some unexplained reason, but I'm holding off my purchases right now. Now, if I could get one of the SR-4C's with the Horus reticle for what some of the used USO's have been going for...that would probably be different! |
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Posted: 2/21/2017 1:55:47 PM EDT
[#31]
Natchez has the Weaver tactical 1-5x24 on sale for $490, great deal on it too normal price is $700. Weaver Tactical 1-5
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Posted: 2/21/2017 2:04:06 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Natchez has the Weaver tactical 1-5x24 on sale for $490, great deal on it too normal price is $700. Weaver tactical 1-5 Wrong link destination. |
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Posted: 2/21/2017 2:09:26 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Wrong link destination. Fixed TY. Can you edit please. |
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Posted: 2/21/2017 8:29:53 PM EDT
[#34]
I looked at both reticles before deciding on the regular "mil-dot". The Horus just doesn't seem to apply to the low power magnification. After using the regular reticle, I realized that the Horus was a no-go on this particular scope...for me.
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