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Posted: 11/15/2014 8:49:55 PM EDT
I found this searching the net; the O.G. gas piston M16. So, what became of it? Why or when did it fall off the pages of history?
Colt Automatic Rifle – Model M16A2 – May 1969 |
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Posted: 11/15/2014 9:09:32 PM EDT
[#1]
why....... noting was wrong with the gas tube
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Posted: 11/15/2014 9:12:28 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
why....... noting was wrong with the gas tube Because it's an interesting piece of history. That's why I posted this in the retro forum because they know the history of the M16 better than most. |
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Posted: 11/15/2014 9:18:38 PM EDT
[#3]
Thanks for posting that. Those are the clearest pics of the 703 I've seen yet. I know of at least one member here chasing that particular holy grail...
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Posted: 11/15/2014 9:27:24 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
why....... noting was wrong with the gas tube not according to Stoner's notes but hey, we all can't right 100% of the time right....... |
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Posted: 11/15/2014 9:27:43 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thanks for posting that. Those are the clearest pics of the 703 I've seen yet. I know of at least one member here chasing that particular holy grail... It grabbed my attention because it had features that were way ahead of its time for the M16. (i.e., top and side mounted slings and adjustable gas block (fsb). Also, in the report I noticed what looks a simple modification to counter carrier twist that "today's" piston AR's experience. It looks like they extended the carrier rails onto the tail-end of the carrier. Also, the lines of that upper receiver just has a slick look to it. |
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Posted: 11/15/2014 9:54:12 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
not according to Stoner's notes but hey, we all can't right 100% of the time right....... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
why....... noting was wrong with the gas tube not according to Stoner's notes but hey, we all can't right 100% of the time right....... Could we see a citation on that? My understanding is that the internal piston operating system IP was bought by Colt leading stoner to use pistons for the AR18. To date no Stoner piston gun has achieved the success of the AR15. |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 1:05:47 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thanks for posting that. Those are the clearest pics of the 703 I've seen yet. I know of at least one member here chasing that particular holy grail... Two .... 
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Posted: 11/16/2014 1:10:17 AM EDT
[#8]
The. 703
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Posted: 11/16/2014 1:14:01 AM EDT
[#9]
Long stroke!
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Posted: 11/16/2014 9:14:36 AM EDT
[#10]
Looks like a long stroke to me as well.
That was not what I was expecting to see. Are modern piston AR's short or long stroke? |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 9:24:30 AM EDT
[#11]
The long gas piston looks almost long enough to also serve as a guide rod for the recoiling carrier group to keep it from tilting.
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Posted: 11/16/2014 10:01:26 AM EDT
[#12]
My holy grail...been talking to a local machine shop about maybe recreating the parts for this thing. Oddly enough I think the hardest part (although not most expensive and time consuming) will be the handguard set up.
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Posted: 11/16/2014 10:12:05 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Looks like a long stroke to me as well. That was not what I was expecting to see. Are modern piston AR's short or long stroke? PWS is long stroke. Everything else currently on the market is short stroke. |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 10:17:44 AM EDT
[#14]
well one problem I see is the height over bore is ridiculous
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Posted: 11/16/2014 10:25:46 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
not according to Stoner's notes but hey, we all can't right 100% of the time right....... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
why....... noting was wrong with the gas tube not according to Stoner's notes but hey, we all can't right 100% of the time right....... First off Stoner's number one goal was sales but he was never able to sell the AR10 in the numbers to be successful. His thinking then morphed into one upping the AK this is evident in his departure from precision to stamped steel and piston design hoping to sell large numbers to third worlds peasant armies and again was not able to sell any quantity. Finally he came full circle in teaming with KAC and revived the AR10 with the philosophy of using as many AR15 parts as possible to make it logistically compatible with the M16 but still really did not sell the number. Face facts piston weapons are inherently inaccurate and meant for peasant armies a stock M16A2 HBAR with MK262 will run circles around ANY piston "sniper" rifle. |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 10:44:10 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Looks like a long stroke to me as well. That was not what I was expecting to see. Are modern piston AR's short or long stroke? Most are short stroke. I know of one conversion (TNW's) to be a long stroke. If you notice in the pic, there appears to be a pin that attaches the piston to the carrier. TNW's long stroke still just strikes against the 'key' but it isn't attached Which makes sense as there is no room in the upper to pull the piston out from the rear |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 12:23:02 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Most are short stroke. I know of one conversion (TNW's) to be a long stroke. If you notice in the pic, there appears to be a pin that attaches the piston to the carrier. TNW's long stroke still just strikes against the 'key' but it isn't attached Which makes sense as there is no room in the upper to pull the piston out from the rear Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Looks like a long stroke to me as well. That was not what I was expecting to see. Are modern piston AR's short or long stroke? Most are short stroke. I know of one conversion (TNW's) to be a long stroke. If you notice in the pic, there appears to be a pin that attaches the piston to the carrier. TNW's long stroke still just strikes against the 'key' but it isn't attached Which makes sense as there is no room in the upper to pull the piston out from the rear I might have to disagree . I'll try to find a better pic, but look Closely at the charging handle, it's considerably taller Than a standard model. You can see it from some side shots too. I think the whole back of the upper is open, allowing the carrier And pinned piston rod to come out the back. Otherwise there is now way to get it out. |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 12:24:48 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I might have to disagree . I'll try to find a better pic, but look Closely at the charging handle, it's considerably taller Than a standard model. You can see it from some side shots too. I think the whole back of the upper is open, allowing the carrier And pinned piston rod to come out the back. Otherwise there is now way to get it out. He's talking about conversion kits, not the 703. I'd have to disagree as well though because PWS has their op rod attached to the carrier and it can be removed from the upper. |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 12:29:36 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My holy grail...been talking to a local machine shop about maybe recreating the parts for this thing. Oddly enough I think the hardest part (although not most expensive and time consuming) will be the handguard set up. A703 is probably the most ambitious project a retro head Could take on. The lower is no big deal, just put a slit in the stock. The upper on the other hand ..... Just about every part would have to Be made from scratch or modified without any specs to go off of. I think someone could simplify it by making it a gas gun. The tube would be easy to hide, it would also mean you wouldn't Have to make a upper from scratch, but add to the top like our 656 uppers. You could also do the same thing and maybe manipulate A modern piston system . One that has a captive rod that strikes the carrier But isn't pinned too it . Just ideas |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 12:34:56 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
He's talking about conversion kits, not the 703. I'd have to disagree as well though because PWS has their op rod attached to the carrier and it can be removed from the upper. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I might have to disagree . I'll try to find a better pic, but look Closely at the charging handle, it's considerably taller Than a standard model. You can see it from some side shots too. I think the whole back of the upper is open, allowing the carrier And pinned piston rod to come out the back. Otherwise there is now way to get it out. He's talking about conversion kits, not the 703. I'd have to disagree as well though because PWS has their op rod attached to the carrier and it can be removed from the upper. Gotcha on the kits. True a pws can, my Adams systems can be romoved independent of the carrier also. But If some one were trying to replicate a. 703, exactly. There Is no other way it comes out. The rod is pinned to the carrier. The only way To seperate the two is too remove them. At least that my opinion |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 12:48:11 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
well one problem I see is the height over bore is ridiculous I've seen pics of later 703s that were a bit lower. No worse than a lot of other piston guns. |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 1:13:43 PM EDT
[#22]
Neat.
Usually though, prototypes of failed concepts eventually get discarded. While one rifle doesn't sound like it takes up that much space, all the other incomplete prototypes, jigs, and pieces end up taking up valuable space in the development area. New team comes in, see's prior teams failed idea, and doesn't see any reason to clutter up the shelves. So out it goes to scrap. It's probably gone. |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 1:19:24 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Neat. Usually though, prototypes of failed concepts eventually get discarded. While one rifle doesn't sound like it takes up that much space, all the other incomplete prototypes, jigs, and pieces end up taking up valuable space in the development area. New team comes in, see's prior teams failed idea, and doesn't see any reason to clutter up the shelves. So out it goes to scrap. It's probably gone. Looks like colt saved everything . Here are the two different 703s Hanging at Reed knights 
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Posted: 11/16/2014 1:38:14 PM EDT
[#24]
Trimdad,
As Morg will tell you now that my 656 is complete (well i mean it's not 100% but close enough until i obsess over it again), I have been toying with several ways to achieve the 703. I've looked into modifying a PWS piston system so that it would outwardly resemble a 703 (although height of gas system over the bore etc would be different), or using a short stroke. The PWS is probably the easiest option. However then i got to thinking well hell if i'm going to go that far I might as well go a little further and just go the whole hog. I am no machinist but I have a good eye and know some very skilled engineers and machinists who I think would help. Clearly unless I can get the exact dimensions, materials etc the work is going to take a long time. I am dedicated to get it done though. Now if only the medical and marital issues with wifey would calm down so I could free up some funds it might speed up the process a little. |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 1:43:16 PM EDT
[#25]
wasn't this design used in the Taiwanese Type 65 rifle?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T65_assault_rifle |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 1:51:13 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Trimdad, As Morg will tell you now that my 656 is complete (well i mean it's not 100% but close enough until i obsess over it again), I have been toying with several ways to achieve the 703. I've looked into modifying a PWS piston system so that it would outwardly resemble a 703 (although height of gas system over the bore etc would be different), or using a short stroke. The PWS is probably the easiest option. However then i got to thinking well hell if i'm going to go that far I might as well go a little further and just go the whole hog. I am no machinist but I have a good eye and know some very skilled engineers and machinists who I think would help. Clearly unless I can get the exact dimensions, materials etc the work is going to take a long time. I am dedicated to get it done though. Now if only the medical and marital issues with wifey would calm down so I could free up some funds it might speed up the process a little. Ya... You almost have to factor the wife aspect into every build  .
I moved all my gun stuff out to the garage where she doesn't see it. No doubt this model can be built, it's always a question Of money , talent and time. When the handgaurds are on ( Which I agree- will be difficult) no one will know what type Of system is on it. That's why , like you, I thought maybe using a modern System, maybe improving the design ?. Hell ... Nobody around here understands these old Guns anyway |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 1:53:00 PM EDT
[#27]
It would be nice if we could get better pictures ..
Need to tour knights place |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 3:27:34 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
First off Stoner's number one goal was sales but he was never able to sell the AR10 in the numbers to be successful. His thinking then morphed into one upping the AK this is evident in his departure from precision to stamped steel and piston design hoping to sell large numbers to third worlds peasant armies and again was not able to sell any quantity. Finally he came full circle in teaming with KAC and revived the AR10 with the philosophy of using as many AR15 parts as possible to make it logistically compatible with the M16 but still really did not sell the number. Face facts piston weapons are inherently inaccurate and meant for peasant armies a stock M16A2 HBAR with MK262 will run circles around ANY piston "sniper" rifle. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
why....... noting was wrong with the gas tube not according to Stoner's notes but hey, we all can't right 100% of the time right....... First off Stoner's number one goal was sales but he was never able to sell the AR10 in the numbers to be successful. His thinking then morphed into one upping the AK this is evident in his departure from precision to stamped steel and piston design hoping to sell large numbers to third worlds peasant armies and again was not able to sell any quantity. Finally he came full circle in teaming with KAC and revived the AR10 with the philosophy of using as many AR15 parts as possible to make it logistically compatible with the M16 but still really did not sell the number. Face facts piston weapons are inherently inaccurate and meant for peasant armies a stock M16A2 HBAR with MK262 will run circles around ANY piston "sniper" rifle. AR piston guns can be very accurate. |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 3:39:29 PM EDT
[#29]
Quoted:
I found this searching the net; the O.G. gas piston M16. So, what became of it? Why or when did it fall off the pages of history? http://aftermathgunclub.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Colt-703-a.jpg Colt Automatic Rifle – Model M16A2 – May 1969 Woah, check out the selector. Looks like it's a 4 POS. Strange sight to see one pointing downward. After zooming way in, it looks to me like the selector layout is- AUTO SAFE. SEMI BURST |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 3:44:16 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Woah, check out the selector. Looks like it's a 4 POS. Strange sight to see one pointing downward. After zooming way in, it looks to me like the selector layout is- AUTO SAFE. SEMI BURST Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I found this searching the net; the O.G. gas piston M16. So, what became of it? Why or when did it fall off the pages of history? http://aftermathgunclub.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Colt-703-a.jpg Colt Automatic Rifle – Model M16A2 – May 1969 Woah, check out the selector. Looks like it's a 4 POS. Strange sight to see one pointing downward. After zooming way in, it looks to me like the selector layout is- AUTO SAFE. SEMI BURST Fairly certain that's typical for a 4 position selector. |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 3:45:53 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Fairly certain that's typical for a 4 position selector. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I found this searching the net; the O.G. gas piston M16. So, what became of it? Why or when did it fall off the pages of history? http://aftermathgunclub.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Colt-703-a.jpg Colt Automatic Rifle – Model M16A2 – May 1969 Woah, check out the selector. Looks like it's a 4 POS. Strange sight to see one pointing downward. After zooming way in, it looks to me like the selector layout is- AUTO SAFE. SEMI BURST Fairly certain that's typical for a 4 position selector. I've never seen a 4 pos selector. Never even heard of one. |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 4:07:08 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Gotcha on the kits. True a pws can, my Adams systems can be romoved independent of the carrier also. But If some one were trying to replicate a. 703, exactly. There Is no other way it comes out. The rod is pinned to the carrier. The only way To seperate the two is too remove them. At least that my opinion Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I might have to disagree . I'll try to find a better pic, but look Closely at the charging handle, it's considerably taller Than a standard model. You can see it from some side shots too. I think the whole back of the upper is open, allowing the carrier And pinned piston rod to come out the back. Otherwise there is now way to get it out. He's talking about conversion kits, not the 703. I'd have to disagree as well though because PWS has their op rod attached to the carrier and it can be removed from the upper. Gotcha on the kits. True a pws can, my Adams systems can be romoved independent of the carrier also. But If some one were trying to replicate a. 703, exactly. There Is no other way it comes out. The rod is pinned to the carrier. The only way To seperate the two is too remove them. At least that my opinion I was talking about the conversion kits. I am not familiar with the PWS but did see pics of the rod attached to the carrier. Does it utilize a regular upper or is it specialized to allow the piston head to be removed from the rear? Also is there a tube that the piston rides in under the handguard? |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 4:09:23 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've never seen a 4 pos selector. Never even heard of one. I don't think they're that common, I've never seen one IRL. IIRC, Colt developed it for the AICW competitions, although it could very well be older than that. |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 4:49:06 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't think they're that common, I've never seen one IRL. IIRC, Colt developed it for the AICW competitions, although it could very well be older than that. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I've never seen a 4 pos selector. Never even heard of one. I don't think they're that common, I've never seen one IRL. IIRC, Colt developed it for the AICW competitions, although it could very well be older than that. Imagine how much that FCG/LPK/lower would be worth. I don't even want to think about it lol |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 4:51:01 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Imagine how much that FCG/LPK/lower would be worth. I don't even want to think about it lol Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I've never seen a 4 pos selector. Never even heard of one. I don't think they're that common, I've never seen one IRL. IIRC, Colt developed it for the AICW competitions, although it could very well be older than that. Imagine how much that FCG/LPK/lower would be worth. I don't even want to think about it lol The original? No clue. I've seen Colt 4 position FCGs for sale over on subguns. They were more than I'd want to pay, but they weren't that bad. Couple hundred IIRC. |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 4:56:43 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
wasn't this design used in the Taiwanese Type 65 rifle? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T65_assault_rifle Nope, Tiawan modified the AR-18 short stroke system. If anybody copied the 703, it was the Koreans in the K-2.. |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 4:57:30 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The original? No clue. I've seen Colt 4 position FCGs for sale over on subguns. They were more than I'd want to pay, but they weren't that bad. Couple hundred IIRC. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I've never seen a 4 pos selector. Never even heard of one. I don't think they're that common, I've never seen one IRL. IIRC, Colt developed it for the AICW competitions, although it could very well be older than that. Imagine how much that FCG/LPK/lower would be worth. I don't even want to think about it lol The original? No clue. I've seen Colt 4 position FCGs for sale over on subguns. They were more than I'd want to pay, but they weren't that bad. Couple hundred IIRC. That's surprisingly cheap. That's not a whole lot more than I see 3 pos FCGs selling for |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 5:27:51 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's surprisingly cheap. That's not a whole lot more than I see 3 pos FCGs selling for Those might have been the Tapcos that I saw going for that price. SAW sells the Colt when Colt is making them, looks like they're currently out of production http://www.specializedarmament.com/products/Fire_Control_Set_Four_Way-1179-298.html |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 9:30:46 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
First off Stoner's number one goal was sales but he was never able to sell the AR10 in the numbers to be successful. His thinking then morphed into one upping the AK this is evident in his departure from precision to stamped steel and piston design hoping to sell large numbers to third worlds peasant armies and again was not able to sell any quantity. Finally he came full circle in teaming with KAC and revived the AR10 with the philosophy of using as many AR15 parts as possible to make it logistically compatible with the M16 but still really did not sell the number. Face facts piston weapons are inherently inaccurate and meant for peasant armies a stock M16A2 HBAR with MK262 will run circles around ANY piston "sniper" rifle. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
why....... noting was wrong with the gas tube not according to Stoner's notes but hey, we all can't right 100% of the time right....... First off Stoner's number one goal was sales but he was never able to sell the AR10 in the numbers to be successful. His thinking then morphed into one upping the AK this is evident in his departure from precision to stamped steel and piston design hoping to sell large numbers to third worlds peasant armies and again was not able to sell any quantity. Finally he came full circle in teaming with KAC and revived the AR10 with the philosophy of using as many AR15 parts as possible to make it logistically compatible with the M16 but still really did not sell the number. Face facts piston weapons are inherently inaccurate and meant for peasant armies a stock M16A2 HBAR with MK262 will run circles around ANY piston "sniper" rifle. no offense but wow, what a stupid and ignorant response |
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Posted: 11/16/2014 10:00:00 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
no offense but wow, what a stupid and ignorant response Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted:
Quoted:
why....... noting was wrong with the gas tube not according to Stoner's notes but hey, we all can't right 100% of the time right....... First off Stoner's number one goal was sales but he was never able to sell the AR10 in the numbers to be successful. His thinking then morphed into one upping the AK this is evident in his departure from precision to stamped steel and piston design hoping to sell large numbers to third worlds peasant armies and again was not able to sell any quantity. Finally he came full circle in teaming with KAC and revived the AR10 with the philosophy of using as many AR15 parts as possible to make it logistically compatible with the M16 but still really did not sell the number. Face facts piston weapons are inherently inaccurate and meant for peasant armies a stock M16A2 HBAR with MK262 will run circles around ANY piston "sniper" rifle. no offense but wow, what a stupid and ignorant response I agree with you in fact, but this is the retro forum. Please show some restraint in your responses. You say no offense, yet offend him. Lighten up. It's just a discussion. 
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Posted: 11/16/2014 11:04:59 PM EDT
[#41]
Looks very similar to the Daewoo K2.
And notice the bolt carrier. It would appear that the upper receiver has internal rails, just like almost every gas piston gun. |
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Posted: 11/17/2014 10:05:03 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I agree with you in fact, but this is the retro forum. Please show some restraint in your responses. You say no offense, yet offend him. Lighten up. It's just a discussion.
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
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why....... noting was wrong with the gas tube not according to Stoner's notes but hey, we all can't right 100% of the time right....... First off Stoner's number one goal was sales but he was never able to sell the AR10 in the numbers to be successful. His thinking then morphed into one upping the AK this is evident in his departure from precision to stamped steel and piston design hoping to sell large numbers to third worlds peasant armies and again was not able to sell any quantity. Finally he came full circle in teaming with KAC and revived the AR10 with the philosophy of using as many AR15 parts as possible to make it logistically compatible with the M16 but still really did not sell the number. Face facts piston weapons are inherently inaccurate and meant for peasant armies a stock M16A2 HBAR with MK262 will run circles around ANY piston "sniper" rifle. no offense but wow, what a stupid and ignorant response I agree with you in fact, but this is the retro forum. Please show some restraint in your responses. You say no offense, yet offend him. Lighten up. It's just a discussion.
point taken, apologies to all |
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Posted: 11/18/2014 12:52:50 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
wasn't this design used in the Taiwanese Type 65 rifle? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T65_assault_rifle Quote HistoryQuoted:
wasn't this design used in the Taiwanese Type 65 rifle? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T65_assault_rifle In looks maybe, but it is a short stroke vs. a long stroke system. It's actually a lot closer to the Stoner 63, both in looks and operation. What was that company that briefly made 63 clones at the turn of the century? Robinson Arms? Too bad the design never took off. Quoted:
Quoted:
Neat. Usually though, prototypes of failed concepts eventually get discarded. While one rifle doesn't sound like it takes up that much space, all the other incomplete prototypes, jigs, and pieces end up taking up valuable space in the development area. New team comes in, see's prior teams failed idea, and doesn't see any reason to clutter up the shelves. So out it goes to scrap. It's probably gone. Looks like colt saved everything . Here are the two different 703s Hanging at Reed knights  My favorite rifle in those pictures is colt's "Next Gen" M16 ACR Rifle that completed in the early 90s for replacement of the M16A2. Seemed like an interesting take on the M16 rifle. Was basically an A2 with a collapsible stock, different muzzle device, a high vent rib, and a chopped carry handle that fired new duplex rounds, but could still fire conventional 5.56 ammo. the high bulky looking rib was supposed to aid in point shooting. Would be neat to fire it. |
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Posted: 11/21/2014 6:11:04 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In looks maybe, but it is a short stroke vs. a long stroke system. It's actually a lot closer to the Stoner 63, both in looks and operation. What was that company that briefly made 63 clones at the turn of the century? Robinson Arms? Too bad the design never took off. My favorite rifle in those pictures is colt's "Next Gen" M16 ACR Rifle that completed in the early 90s for replacement of the M16A2. Seemed like an interesting take on the M16 rifle. Was basically an A2 with a collapsible stock, different muzzle device, a high vent rib, and a chopped carry handle that fired new duplex rounds, but could still fire conventional 5.56 ammo. the high bulky looking rib was supposed to aid in point shooting. Would be neat to fire it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
wasn't this design used in the Taiwanese Type 65 rifle? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T65_assault_rifle In looks maybe, but it is a short stroke vs. a long stroke system. It's actually a lot closer to the Stoner 63, both in looks and operation. What was that company that briefly made 63 clones at the turn of the century? Robinson Arms? Too bad the design never took off. Quoted:
Quoted:
Neat. Usually though, prototypes of failed concepts eventually get discarded. While one rifle doesn't sound like it takes up that much space, all the other incomplete prototypes, jigs, and pieces end up taking up valuable space in the development area. New team comes in, see's prior teams failed idea, and doesn't see any reason to clutter up the shelves. So out it goes to scrap. It's probably gone. Looks like colt saved everything . Here are the two different 703s Hanging at Reed knights http://i1271.photobucket.com/albums/jj633/TRIMDAD/716E397E-FC25-49E3-8A7A-A21E870AFA65-2310-00000275E0F20EB0_zpsf88b651c.jpg My favorite rifle in those pictures is colt's "Next Gen" M16 ACR Rifle that completed in the early 90s for replacement of the M16A2. Seemed like an interesting take on the M16 rifle. Was basically an A2 with a collapsible stock, different muzzle device, a high vent rib, and a chopped carry handle that fired new duplex rounds, but could still fire conventional 5.56 ammo. the high bulky looking rib was supposed to aid in point shooting. Would be neat to fire it. I like the flattops with the Garand NM rear sights myself... |
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Posted: 11/21/2014 8:15:34 PM EDT
[#45]
I got to build all those now! Damn! Will it ever end? |
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Posted: 11/21/2014 10:59:04 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I got to build all those now! Damn! Will it ever end? It gets worse.... http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_123/661169_Melvin_Johnson_Weapons_For_The_Future_Prediction.html |
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Posted: 11/24/2014 6:01:46 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't think they're that common, I've never seen one IRL. IIRC, Colt developed it for the AICW competitions, although it could very well be older than that. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I've never seen a 4 pos selector. Never even heard of one. I don't think they're that common, I've never seen one IRL. IIRC, Colt developed it for the AICW competitions, although it could very well be older than that. I'm a bit late to the party, but at least one member here has a factory 605 with the 4-pos selector. The selector is notched on the bottom to allow it to pass over the nubs on the lower: 
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Posted: 11/24/2014 7:15:16 PM EDT
[#48]
FWIW, the current Colt 4-position selector positions are now 0-1-3-A. The DPMS (also sold by Tapco) 4-position kits are 0-A-1-3.
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Posted: 11/24/2014 8:33:40 PM EDT
[#49]
I can't think of any reason why anyone in their right mind would want a 4 position selector.
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Posted: 11/24/2014 9:04:38 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I can't think of any reason why anyone in their right mind would want a 4 position selector. I would like the 2rd BURST, AUTO, SEMI FCG for a working carbine. You can place the selector either on SEMI or 2rd BURST from a low ready, since the selector is relieved. AR15 cyclic rate is a bit fast to make controlled 2rd bursts in AUTO mode. There were some 2rd BURST prototypes in the early 1960's. A MLGS carbine had it. 
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