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Knighthawk1911
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Posted: 7/6/2013 11:33:47 AM
I would like to add this poll to the AR Pistol Category to help myself out as well as others that are thinking about and/or building their first AR Pistol. I will be using this gun strictly for fun, however, far in the future I may get my stamp and convert it to an SBR. This should be a good way of answering the most common question about pistol builds in a simple way.
urbanredneck
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Posted: 7/6/2013 3:20:31 PM
[Last Edit: 7/6/2013 5:50:05 PM by urbanredneck]
11.5 or 10.5 are really practical SBR lengths. Short = loud with no silencer.

And check some charts for bullet velocities from the different lengths. Want to keep it sonic at 50 or 100 yards? I went with 11.5" on my pistol

But, you might want to consider shorter if you going to suppress...
jpk33
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Posted: 7/8/2013 9:13:21 PM
Voted 7.5 but I have it on a pistol with a kx3, plus a 8.2 300 BO on a pistol. The 11.5 resides on a sbr suppressed.
SYSTEM: Let's not rehash a locked & nuked thread
d16man
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Posted: 7/8/2013 9:50:49 PM
8.2/8.5 .300 BLK. with suppressor.
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Knighthawk1911
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Posted: 7/9/2013 7:48:54 PM
Thanks for the feedback guys! Keep it coming!
MOLON LABE
cmc201
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Posted: 7/10/2013 3:59:22 PM


Just finishing up a new one 10.5" Rainier Arms Select with their version of the 11" Evolution hand guard. Future SBR. Next will probaly be 11.5" or 12" in 5,56 and then a 7.5" in 9mm.
AlexBosco
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Posted: 7/10/2013 8:57:15 PM
[Last Edit: 7/10/2013 8:57:50 PM by AlexBosco]
I voted my most accurate 11.5 inch Colt upper on my RRA lower.


MB223PGH
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Posted: 7/11/2013 5:46:58 PM

Originally Posted By AlexBosco:
I voted my most accurate 11.5 inch Colt upper on my RRA lower.


http://i1303.photobucket.com/albums/ag159/alessandrorbosco/IMG_1896_zps64576ad7.jpg

where did you get that sb15? Did you backorder it from sig?
dalepres
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Posted: 7/12/2013 12:06:58 AM
Originally Posted By AlexBosco:
I voted my most accurate 11.5 inch Colt upper on my RRA lower.


http://i1303.photobucket.com/albums/ag159/alessandrorbosco/IMG_1896_zps64576ad7.jpg


Is that a vertical grip on your pistol?
RDTCU
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Posted: 7/12/2013 12:09:10 AM
Originally Posted By urbanredneck:
And check some charts for bullet velocities from the different lengths. Want to keep it sonic at 50 or 100 yards?


Are you trying to say that a short barrel will cause the bullet to go subsonic at 50-100yd?
RDTCU
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Posted: 7/12/2013 12:10:02 AM
[Last Edit: 7/12/2013 12:29:29 AM by RDTCU]
Originally Posted By dalepres:
Originally Posted By AlexBosco:
I voted my most accurate 11.5 inch Colt upper on my RRA lower.


Is that a vertical grip on your pistol?


I di'n't see nuffin...

Posting possibly illegal crap on the internet is a great idea...
OhShoot
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Posted: 7/12/2013 12:26:24 AM
[Last Edit: 7/12/2013 12:42:44 AM by OhShoot]
Originally Posted By RDTCU:
Originally Posted By dalepres:
Originally Posted By AlexBosco:
I voted my most accurate 11.5 inch Colt upper on my RRA lower.


Is that a vertical grip on your pistol?


I di'n't see nuffin...

Posting illegal crap on the internet is a great idea...


With the 11.5" barrel and full length receiver extension, it's likely legal 26". If the flash hider is permanently attached, it would be for sure.

- OS
AlexBosco
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Posted: 7/12/2013 10:42:26 AM
You know, sometimes I think you guys dont read the website articles and posts. We've discussed overall length of weapon a million times and yet we still get people saying it's not a good idea to post illegal weapons online. For those of you who know how to read here is the link that describes why placing a vertical foregrip on a barrel of 11.5 inches (giving the overall length of weapon over 26 inches) legal.

http://www.franklinarmory.com/PRODUCTS_XO-26.html
RDTCU
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Posted: 7/12/2013 10:47:38 AM
Originally Posted By AlexBosco:
You know, sometimes I think you guys dont read the website articles and posts. We've discussed overall length of weapon a million times and yet we still get people saying it's not a good idea to post illegal weapons online. For those of you who know how to read here is the link that describes why placing a vertical foregrip on a barrel of 11.5 inches (giving the overall length of weapon over 26 inches) legal.

http://www.franklinarmory.com/PRODUCTS_XO-26.html


So how long is it from the rear of the bare pistol tube to the end of the muzzle threads? If it's over 26", nevermind.

(But why have a VFG with the fancy arm strap thingy? )
AlexBosco
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Posted: 7/12/2013 11:44:51 AM
It is over 26 inches in length. That upper was used with a friend of mine who lost his arm and leg in an IED in Iraq. We were doing testing from 7 inch uppers to 14.5 inch using different type sights at different ranges. That upper is normally mounted on one of our full auto M16 A2's...When my buddy was testing the weapon we removed the foregrip and added a viridian green laser/light.
MB223PGH
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Posted: 7/12/2013 5:05:39 PM
where did you get that sb15?
AlexBosco
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Posted: 7/12/2013 5:15:25 PM
From Sig
deuc224
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Posted: 7/14/2013 1:47:32 AM
i think the word pistol should mean a small barrel
TBoneDetroit
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Posted: 7/14/2013 8:49:03 AM
[Last Edit: 7/14/2013 8:52:22 AM by TBoneDetroit]
Voted 7.5 inch because that's what I have on mine (also with a KX3). A 10.5 inch might be more practical/better for ballistics, but I needed to remain under 26 inch in order to be able to carry it legally in Michigan as a pistol. Could maybe be under at 10.5 inch without the muzzle device (which should not count since it's neither pinned nor welded, the established method for it to count in LOA WRT SBRs). But that is a gray area I didn't want to delve into (I may build another in the future to explore the 10.5 inch).

Does anyone have a link to some ballistics charts for the 7.5 vs the 14.3 or others?

T Bone (Detroit).
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DocMike
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Posted: 7/14/2013 11:05:34 PM
[Last Edit: 7/14/2013 11:20:59 PM by DocMike]
I went with a bit of old school 11.5" for mine. I'd really like to SBR it but for now living in the Republik of Illinois I'll just have to settle for a pistol.



Doc
peligro113
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Posted: 7/14/2013 11:35:02 PM
[Last Edit: 7/14/2013 11:36:01 PM by peligro113]
11.5 if you are going to run a silencer if not 7.5



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RDTCU
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Posted: 7/14/2013 11:40:27 PM
Originally Posted By peligro113:
11.5 if you are going to run a silencer if not 7.5

<a href="http://s1187.photobucket.com/user/peligro113/media/Guns/DSCF0056.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i1187.photobucket.com/albums/z381/peligro113/Guns/DSCF0056.jpg</a>

http://www.ar15.com/media/viewFile.html?i=42089&prev=1


You can safely run a .308 can on a 7.5", which is handy if you've only got one rifle can
GarrettJ
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Posted: 7/16/2013 6:14:00 AM
Originally Posted By OhShoot:
With the 11.5" barrel and full length receiver extension, it's likely legal 26". If the flash hider is permanently attached, it would be for sure.

Why would you need to permanently attach the flash hider? That only applies when you want to count the FH as part of the barrel. You don't permanently attach your buffer tube, do you? And it still counts toward your OAL.
LastRites
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Posted: 7/16/2013 7:14:19 AM
Originally Posted By GarrettJ:
Originally Posted By OhShoot:
With the 11.5" barrel and full length receiver extension, it's likely legal 26". If the flash hider is permanently attached, it would be for sure.

Why would you need to permanently attach the flash hider? That only applies when you want to count the FH as part of the barrel. You don't permanently attach your buffer tube, do you? And it still counts toward your OAL.


So he could get the OAL greater than 26" to classify the gun as a firearm so he can utilize a VFG legally. If the OAL is greater than 26" without the muzzle device then the muzzle device wouldn't have to be pinned.
RDTCU
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Posted: 7/16/2013 7:38:24 AM
Originally Posted By LastRites:
Originally Posted By GarrettJ:
Originally Posted By OhShoot:
With the 11.5" barrel and full length receiver extension, it's likely legal 26". If the flash hider is permanently attached, it would be for sure.

Why would you need to permanently attach the flash hider? That only applies when you want to count the FH as part of the barrel. You don't permanently attach your buffer tube, do you? And it still counts toward your OAL.


So he could get the OAL greater than 26" to classify the gun as a firearm so he can utilize a VFG legally. If the OAL is greater than 26" without the muzzle device then the muzzle device wouldn't have to be pinned.


Yep, and about the buffer tube, it's required for the gun to function, unlike the muzzle device, that's the difference.
GarrettJ
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Posted: 7/16/2013 7:40:00 AM
[Last Edit: 7/16/2013 7:47:01 AM by GarrettJ]
Originally Posted By LastRites:
So he could get the OAL greater than 26" to classify the gun as a firearm so he can utilize a VFG legally. If the OAL is greater than 26" without the muzzle device then the muzzle device wouldn't have to be pinned.


I understand that. But why would the muzzle device need to be permanently attached to be considered in the OAL measurement? Nothing else on the gun is "permanently attached".

If you are trying to bring the total length of the barrel to over 16", it makes sense that you have to permanently attach whatever extension you are using. ATF has published guidance on how to do this to their satisfaction.

But there is no requirement when measuring for overall length that any attachments be "permanent", whether on the muzzle, back end, or anywhere else. Otherwise you could remove the buttstock from a number of rifles and get a functioning firearm less than 26".
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