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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/16/2010 5:30:51 PM EDT
[#1]
[span style='font-weight: bold;']Originally Posted By JFASeems like the same old same old from the Grendel boys. To say the AA bolt is recessed because the 7.62x39 has thicker rim simply is not true. If that were so then that means the standard 7.62x39 bolts wouldn't work in the all the 7.62x39 chambered rifles that they have been working in all along, quite well.
The real reason I was told the AA bolts are recessed it to get rid of the tell tell circumference groove that is present in 5.56 bolts and it takes .011 of an inch to rid of it. Add that to the face depth that it was to begin with and you get the deeper .136 AA bolt. Bill A also stated that recessing the bolt face deeper also giving the bolt lugs more flex instead of breaking. My self and others are not buying that either. As far as the bolts AA doesn't make them they are contracted out and the same bolts are also bought by Lothar Walther as they will give you a 6.5 CSS chambered either for the standard 7.62 bolt or the enhanced steel recessed AA bolt. By the way the steel isn't proprietary because quite a few bolt makers use it. Come on John, let's get your facts more straight. Hmm....Lets see...He says that AA contracts out their bolt manufacture, you agree...looks like that fact is correct! He says the bolt is recessed because it allows more meat on the extractor claw, that is also correct, is it not? There may be additional reasons, but that reason is also correct. The deeper face does, in fact, allow more meat on the extractor. The recessing also does allow the lugs to flex more, decreasing the risk of breaking, so that reason is also correct. Looks to me like his facts are straight, and you are simply picking a fight. Bill |
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USA
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Posted: 11/16/2010 7:31:46 PM EDT
[#2]
Originally Posted By bwaites:
Originally Posted By JFASeems like the same old same old from the Grendel boys. To say the AA bolt is recessed because the 7.62x39 has thicker rim simply is not true. If that were so then that means the standard 7.62x39 bolts wouldn't work in the all the 7.62x39 chambered rifles that they have been working in all along, quite well.
The real reason I was told the AA bolts are recessed it to get rid of the tell tell circumference groove that is present in 5.56 bolts and it takes .011 of an inch to rid of it. Add that to the face depth that it was to begin with and you get the deeper .136 AA bolt. Bill A also stated that recessing the bolt face deeper also giving the bolt lugs more flex instead of breaking. My self and others are not buying that either. As far as the bolts AA doesn't make them they are contracted out and the same bolts are also bought by Lothar Walther as they will give you a 6.5 CSS chambered either for the standard 7.62 bolt or the enhanced steel recessed AA bolt. By the way the steel isn't proprietary because quite a few bolt makers use it. Come on John, let's get your facts more straight. [span style='color: green;']Hmm....Lets see...He says that AA contracts out their bolt manufacture, you agree...looks like that fact is correct! He says the bolt is recessed because it allows more meat on the extractor claw, that is also correct, is it not? There may be additional reasons, but that reason is also correct. The deeper face does, in fact, allow more meat on the extractor. The recessing also does allow the lugs to flex more, decreasing the risk of breaking, so that reason is also correct. Looks to me like his facts are straight, and you are simply picking a fight. Bill Bill, So you're a metallurgist now? Ever heard of metal fatigue? The flexing lugs is BS. Now let's address the extractor. List how may extractor tips have broker on the "other" bolts? I'll be waiting. |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/16/2010 7:45:43 PM EDT
[#3]
Bill,
So you're a metallurgist now? Ever heard of metal fatigue? The flexing lugs is BS. Now let's address the extractor. List how may extractor tips have broker on the "other" bolts? I'll be waiting. Nope, no metallurgist. I'm aware of metal fatigure, also aware some metals exhibit it long before others do. The fact that so few of these bolts have broken indicates he got something right. No need to wait, multiple other bolts are also designed with the same idea and you are aware of them, address your thoughts with them. I have seen multiple .223 extractor tips broken, never seen any in other extractors myself. Its a design intent, you can argue it all you want, but the designer stated that was his reason for doing it. Everything else is hearsay, stuff you were TOLD by someone other than the guy who designed it. You can snipe away, but when the facts are the facts, you are left with them. Bill Alexander designed it, he says that he designed it a certain way for a certain reason. He may have had multiple reasons for doing so for all I know, and chose to only state the reason that was the critical one for him, the one that made him adjust the design. Time to get over it. Its done, the design works, its in THOUSANDS of rifles, and there are very few complaints. You are simply picking nits here because you don't have elsewhere to do it, time to hunker down and start casting bullets!! 
Bill |
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USA
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Posted: 11/16/2010 8:01:27 PM EDT
[#4]
Originally Posted By bwaites:
Bill,
So you're a metallurgist now? Ever heard of metal fatigue? The flexing lugs is BS. Now let's address the extractor. List how may extractor tips have broker on the "other" bolts? I'll be waiting. Nope, no metallurgist. I'm aware of metal fatigure, also aware some metals exhibit it long before others do. The fact that so few of these bolts have broken indicates he got something right. No need to wait, multiple other bolts are also designed with the same idea and you are aware of them, address your thoughts with them. I have seen multiple .223 extractor tips broken, never seen any in other extractors myself. Its a design intent, you can argue it all you want, but the designer stated that was his reason for doing it. Everything else is hearsay, stuff you were TOLD by someone other than the guy who designed it. You can snipe away, but when the facts are the facts, you are left with them. Bill Alexander designed it, he says that he designed it a certain way for a certain reason. He may have had multiple reasons for doing so for all I know, and chose to only state the reason that was the critical one for him, the one that made him adjust the design. Time to get over it. Its done, the design works, its in THOUSANDS of rifles, and there are very few complaints. You are simply picking nits here because you don't have elsewhere to do it, time to hunker down and start casting bullets!!
Bill Let me address your statement about few of these bolts being broken so he must have gotten something right. Well I'll tell you the reason for that and it's two fold. One the bolt is made of stronger tougher steel. The other reason is just about everyone knows know not to hot rod the 6.5 Grendel in the AR15 platform. All this crap has been on the internet for a good number of years and easily obtainable, that is until the 65Grendel site crashed. Now if that were true about the bolt lugs can flex more and survive longer then everyone else would have done that on all caliber.....but they have not. In fact some of gone the other way, knowing that the bolt actually tilts under pressure, putting all the stress on the two lugs adjacent the extractor, so some of them have relieved the other lugs so as to take that stress off the adjacent extractor lugs. No it's not time for me to get over it, it's time for the 65 Grendel crew to quit spreading the BS that you were told.
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/16/2010 8:49:29 PM EDT
[#5]
Originally Posted By JFA:
Originally Posted By bwaites:
Bill,
So you're a metallurgist now? Ever heard of metal fatigue? The flexing lugs is BS. Now let's address the extractor. List how may extractor tips have broker on the "other" bolts? I'll be waiting. Nope, no metallurgist. I'm aware of metal fatigure, also aware some metals exhibit it long before others do. The fact that so few of these bolts have broken indicates he got something right. No need to wait, multiple other bolts are also designed with the same idea and you are aware of them, address your thoughts with them. I have seen multiple .223 extractor tips broken, never seen any in other extractors myself. Its a design intent, you can argue it all you want, but the designer stated that was his reason for doing it. Everything else is hearsay, stuff you were TOLD by someone other than the guy who designed it. You can snipe away, but when the facts are the facts, you are left with them. Bill Alexander designed it, he says that he designed it a certain way for a certain reason. He may have had multiple reasons for doing so for all I know, and chose to only state the reason that was the critical one for him, the one that made him adjust the design. Time to get over it. Its done, the design works, its in THOUSANDS of rifles, and there are very few complaints. You are simply picking nits here because you don't have elsewhere to do it, time to hunker down and start casting bullets!!
Bill Let me address your statement about few of these bolts being broken so he must have gotten something right. Well I'll tell you the reason for that and it's two fold. One the bolt is made of stronger tougher steel. The other reason is just about everyone knows know not to hot rod the 6.5 Grendel in the AR15 platform. All this crap has been on the internet for a good number of years and easily obtainable, that is until the 65Grendel site crashed. Now if that were true about the bolt lugs can flex more and survive longer then everyone else would have done that on all caliber.....but they have not. In fact knowing that the bolt actually tilts under pressure, putting all the stress on the two lugs adjacent the extractor, so some of them have relieved the other lugs so as to take that stress off the adjacent extractor lugs the adjacent extractor lugs. No it's not time for me to get over it, it's time for the 65 Grendel crew to quit spreading the BS that you were told. That has been done to the AA heavy use chromed bolt |
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Posted: 11/17/2010 10:23:09 AM EDT
[#6]
Originally Posted By jjar15:
For those 6.5 barrels chambered for the AA boltface, your only choice is an AA bolt. Their bolts are 'enhanced', and they offer a chromed version. For those 6.5 barrels chambered for a 7.62x39 boltface, there are many choices. Some are standard, some are 'enhanced', and both plain and chromed varieties of both are available. AR15 Performance offers the SuperBolt in 7.62x39, and LMT may still have some of their enhanced and chromed 'lobster tail' bolts left. Any idea which one Satern uses? And for fucksakes....I'm trying to learn something here, would the 6.5 haters start your own hatefull thread? Pretty please! I know some Grendel bolts have had issues, Hence the question. |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/17/2010 10:28:18 AM EDT
[#7]
Originally Posted By Rcd567:
Originally Posted By jjar15:
For those 6.5 barrels chambered for the AA boltface, your only choice is an AA bolt. Their bolts are 'enhanced', and they offer a chromed version. For those 6.5 barrels chambered for a 7.62x39 boltface, there are many choices. Some are standard, some are 'enhanced', and both plain and chromed varieties of both are available. AR15 Performance offers the SuperBolt in 7.62x39, and LMT may still have some of their enhanced and chromed 'lobster tail' bolts left. Any idea which one Satern uses? And for fucksakes....I'm trying to learn something here, would the 6.5 haters start your own hatefull thread? Pretty please! I know some Grendel bolts have had issues, Hence the question. Satern is a licensed Grendel manufacturer and only uses the AA bolt with the deeper bolt face. Bill |
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Posted: 11/17/2010 11:30:07 AM EDT
[#8]
Dang I click on this hoping Wolf came out with it's steel case ammo.
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Posted: 11/17/2010 4:47:22 PM EDT
[#9]
Originally Posted By bwaites:
Originally Posted By Rcd567:
Originally Posted By jjar15:
For those 6.5 barrels chambered for the AA boltface, your only choice is an AA bolt. Their bolts are 'enhanced', and they offer a chromed version. For those 6.5 barrels chambered for a 7.62x39 boltface, there are many choices. Some are standard, some are 'enhanced', and both plain and chromed varieties of both are available. AR15 Performance offers the SuperBolt in 7.62x39, and LMT may still have some of their enhanced and chromed 'lobster tail' bolts left. Any idea which one Satern uses? And for fucksakes....I'm trying to learn something here, would the 6.5 haters start your own hatefull thread? Pretty please! I know some Grendel bolts have had issues, Hence the question. Satern is a licensed Grendel manufacturer and only uses the AA bolt with the deeper bolt face. Bill Thank You Sir! |
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USA
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Posted: 11/17/2010 10:35:34 PM EDT
[#10]
Ok, I have one question. I have a Grendel overwatch from 2005 with a factory AA bolt. It is not "enhanced" or special or anything and is probably just a Beowulf bolt. I don't shoot it a lot but should I get one of the new enhanced bolts for safety?
There is nothing wrong with it, but it seems that from all of the posted problems...there will be or I am just dang lucky. Thats the problem with a maturing market. Every "NEW" makes someone's "OLD" wrong. |
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USA
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Posted: 11/17/2010 11:14:22 PM EDT
[#11]
Originally Posted By Trigon1:
Ok, I have one question. I have a Grendel overwatch from 2005 with a factory AA bolt. It is not "enhanced" or special or anything and is probably just a Beowulf bolt. I don't shoot it a lot but should I get one of the new enhanced bolts for safety? There is nothing wrong with it, but it seems that from all of the posted problems...there will be or I am just dang lucky. Thats the problem with a maturing market. Every "NEW" makes someone's "OLD" wrong. All AR 15 bolts have a life expectancy. Generally when a bolt breaks many shooters aren't aware of it until they clean the rifle and find a lug or two missing. Fortunately most of the failure are minor like that. With that said it's always a good idea to have a back up bolt. For that matter back up parts for the ones that normally wear. The enhanced bolt will give your bolt longer longevity, it won't turn it into a fire breathing magnum. You can shoot in confidence sticking with the factory ammo and adhering to the loading data presented by Alexander Arms. Enjoy your rifle. |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/18/2010 7:37:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: bwaites]
[#12]
Originally Posted By Rcd567:
Originally Posted By bwaites:
Originally Posted By Rcd567:
Originally Posted By jjar15:
For those 6.5 barrels chambered for the AA boltface, your only choice is an AA bolt. Their bolts are 'enhanced', and they offer a chromed version. For those 6.5 barrels chambered for a 7.62x39 boltface, there are many choices. Some are standard, some are 'enhanced', and both plain and chromed varieties of both are available. AR15 Performance offers the SuperBolt in 7.62x39, and LMT may still have some of their enhanced and chromed 'lobster tail' bolts left. Any idea which one Satern uses? And for fucksakes....I'm trying to learn something here, would the 6.5 haters start your own hatefull thread? Pretty please! I know some Grendel bolts have had issues, Hence the question. Satern is a licensed Grendel manufacturer and only uses the AA bolt with the deeper bolt face. Bill Thank You Sir! No problem!! See Below! |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 11/18/2010 7:59:08 PM EDT
[#13]
There is an advantage that many 6.5 Grendel users have availed themselves of from time to time.
Call Alexander Arms at (540) 639 8356 and talk to the guys who actually build them. And if you have some specific problem or question, Bill Alexander often gets on the phone and answers the question himself! Bill |
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USA
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Posted: 11/18/2010 10:12:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Forest]
[#14]
< Stay on topic! Warning Sent - F >
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Posted: 11/19/2010 12:45:41 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Gunwritr]
[#15]
< Off topic comments removed, in the future please use the [Report Button], thank you - F >
Will do Forest, thanks! 
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Posted: 11/19/2010 12:49:29 AM EDT
[#16]
Originally Posted By Trigon1:
Ok, I have one question. I have a Grendel overwatch from 2005 with a factory AA bolt. It is not "enhanced" or special or anything and is probably just a Beowulf bolt. I don't shoot it a lot but should I get one of the new enhanced bolts for safety? There is nothing wrong with it, but it seems that from all of the posted problems...there will be or I am just dang lucky. Thats the problem with a maturing market. Every "NEW" makes someone's "OLD" wrong. No your bolt is fine. You are good to go. |
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USA
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Posted: 11/19/2010 1:34:49 AM EDT
[#17]
Originally Posted By JFA:
< Stay on topic! Warning Sent - F > I can brown nose too Forest, will stay on topic.
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Posted: 12/6/2010 4:24:12 PM EDT
[#18]
Is the 6.5 Grendel site still up.
Can someone post a link. |
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Posted: 12/6/2010 5:12:06 PM EDT
[#19]
Originally Posted By BRONZ:
Is the 6.5 Grendel site still up. Can someone post a link. Nope, still down. Been down what seems a long time. No idea when/if it will be back up. www.65grendel.com |
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Posted: 12/9/2010 7:41:22 PM EDT
[#20]
Anyone tried the Lapua 144 gr. FMJ? Alexander Arms has some load data on it. Just curious.
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Posted: 12/9/2010 9:30:50 PM EDT
[#21]
Originally Posted By Rcd567:
Anyone tried the Lapua 144 gr. FMJ? Alexander Arms has some load data on it. Just curious. Yes, it is a mite bit heavy. The BC is through the roof, but I don't think you can drive it hard enough. If I remember correctly though, this is the load that Bill A. used to shoot through glass when it was first introduced..... |
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Posted: 12/10/2010 12:21:15 AM EDT
[#22]
Originally Posted By Gunwritr:
Originally Posted By Rcd567:
Anyone tried the Lapua 144 gr. FMJ? Alexander Arms has some load data on it. Just curious. Yes, it is a mite bit heavy. The BC is through the roof, but I don't think you can drive it hard enough. If I remember correctly though, this is the load that Bill A. used to shoot through glass when it was first introduced..... What is the BC and what velocity do you get from it in the Grendel? |
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IL, USA
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Posted: 12/10/2010 3:20:27 AM EDT
[#23]
Hornady 123 amax is .510 at 2620,
Phil |
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Posted: 12/10/2010 10:16:35 AM EDT
[#24]
Originally Posted By pmurphy:
Hornady 123 amax is .510 at 2620, Phil Most impressive - from what length barrel? |
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Posted: 12/10/2010 10:19:17 AM EDT
[#25]
Ballistic Coefficient: 0.636
I believe Bill A is getting around 2220 FPS out of a 24" barrel with his loads. Lapua's 139 scenar's BC is .615 I've got Grendels bigger brother (260 Remington) in a bolt gun and I'll play with these FMJ rounds in both guns. But believe your probably right in that it's a little heavy for the Grendel.
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IL, USA
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Posted: 12/10/2010 8:51:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: pmurphy]
[#26]
Originally Posted By pmurphy:
Hornady 123 amax is .510 at 2620, Phil Hornady test 24" barrel. But, mine is a 26" barrel. I'm going to ask Hornady to load some with Superformance powder. Should yield an additional 200fps. Phil |
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Posted: 12/10/2010 8:59:59 PM EDT
[#27]
Originally Posted By Gunwritr:
Originally Posted By Rcd567:
Anyone tried the Lapua 144 gr. FMJ? Alexander Arms has some load data on it. Just curious. Yes, it is a mite bit heavy. The BC is through the roof, but I don't think you can drive it hard enough. If I remember correctly though, this is the load that Bill A. used to shoot through glass when it was first introduced..... Further investigation...it may have been Nosler's 120 gr. FMJ that Bill used? Not sure, although I can't find those Nosler FMJ for sale anywhere. 
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Posted: 12/10/2010 9:15:26 PM EDT
[#28]
Originally Posted By pmurphy:
Originally Posted By pmurphy:
Hornady 123 amax is .510 at 2620, Phil Hornady test 24" barrel. But, mine is a 26" barrel. I'm going to ask Hornady to load some with Superformance powder. Should yield an additional 200fps. Phil they run at around 2580 out of my 20 inch barrel |
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Posted: 12/10/2010 9:16:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Gunwritr]
[#29]
Originally Posted By Rcd567:
Originally Posted By Gunwritr:
Originally Posted By Rcd567:
Anyone tried the Lapua 144 gr. FMJ? Alexander Arms has some load data on it. Just curious. Yes, it is a mite bit heavy. The BC is through the roof, but I don't think you can drive it hard enough. If I remember correctly though, this is the load that Bill A. used to shoot through glass when it was first introduced..... Further investigation...it may have been Nosler's 120 gr. FMJ that Bill used? Not sure, although I can't find those Nosler FMJ for sale anywhere.
No, he shot the ballistic glass with 144 Lapua FMJs and it was a factory load way back in the beginning. I have fired a bit of it. It has been years since I loaded it, let me look for my data ETA I ran the 144 grain Lapua's at 2,479 fps from a 24 inch barrel using AA2520 they shot ok. I do not see much of a velocity drop going from 24 to 20 inches so you could probably run them at 2,420 fps from a 20 inch gun. the BC is so high on this projectile that if you ran them at 2,200 fps from a 12 inch barrel it would still retain 1,000+ ft-lbs at 400 yards! |
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WI, USA
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Posted: 12/10/2010 9:39:43 PM EDT
[#30]
the BC is so high on this projectile that if you ran them at 2,200 fps from a 12 inch barrel it would still retain 1,000+ ft-lbs at 400 yards! gotta love those slippery bullets! |
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Posted: 12/11/2010 1:34:19 AM EDT
[#31]
Not just for ARs anymore
Spent the last couple days on the range with a new rifle from Krebs Custom actually a prototype chambered for 6.5mm Grendel. It's basically an AK-74 pattern rifle but with his rail over the top cover. Barrel weight is the same as factory. Pretty cool rig. You can hammer stuff up close, like a standard AK. Recoil is a bit milder than 7.62x39mm, but very close. I ran it on steel out to 300 yards and then stepped out to 550 yards. Impressed I shot groups at 550 yards. Thing is holding 2 MOA at 550 yards with Wolf's 120 grain MPT load. I had one box left so stepped it out to 800 yards. Target was an 11.5x20 inch LaRue sniper target. I calculated the elevation and let fly. The wind was gusting quite a bit but I flattened the LaRue on my 3rd shot. Then did it two more times in a row before I missed a wind change. I scored 7 hits at 800 yards.....with an AK. Pretty nice day today......
For the rest you will have to wait for the next Book of the AK47 coming out in a couple months 
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Posted: 12/11/2010 9:07:42 AM EDT
[#32]
Originally Posted By Gunwritr:
For the rest you will have to wait for the next Book of the AK47 coming out in a couple months... Tease. Seriously, that is a nice looking Kalsh. |
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Posted: 12/12/2010 7:12:24 AM EDT
[#33]
800 yd. AK......Damn.
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USA
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Posted: 12/12/2010 12:11:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Zhukov]
[#34]
Originally Posted By Gunwritr: Not just for ARs anymore Spent the last couple days on the range with a new rifle from Krebs Custom actually a prototype chambered for 6.5mm Grendel. It's basically an AK-74 pattern rifle but with his rail over the top cover. Barrel weight is the same as factory. Pretty cool rig. You can hammer stuff up close, like a standard AK. Recoil is a bit milder than 7.62x39mm, but very close. I ran it on steel out to 300 yards and then stepped out to 550 yards. Impressed I shot groups at 550 yards. Thing is holding 2 MOA at 550 yards with Wolf's 120 grain MPT load. I had one box left so stepped it out to 800 yards. Target was an 11.5x20 inch LaRue sniper target. I calculated the elevation and let fly. The wind was gusting quite a bit but I flattened the LaRue on my 3rd shot. Then did it two more times in a row before I missed a wind change. I scored 7 hits at 800 yards.....with an AK. Pretty nice day today...... For the rest you will have to wait for the next Book of the AK47 coming out in a couple months http://i583.photobucket.com/albums/ss273/Gunwritr/Krebs65x38mmGrendelAK.jpg Well Dave, I'd have to see that because I don't believe it. To get 2 inch groups at 550 yards you'd have to be getting somewhere in the neighborhood of .40 inch groups at 100 yards...with Wolf ammo? Come on. How about some proof? With an AK pattern rifle none the less. <Unnecessary comment removed - Z> |
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LA, USA
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Posted: 12/12/2010 1:27:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: uptown1]
[#35]
Originally Posted By Gunwritr:
I ran it on steel out to 300 yards and then stepped out to 550 yards. Impressed I shot groups at 550 yards. Thing is holding 2 MOA at 550 yards with Wolf's 120 grain MPT load. Originally Posted By JFA:
Well Dave, I'd have to see that because I don't believe it. To get 2 inch groups at 550 yards you'd have to be getting somewhere in the neighborhood of .40 inch groups at 100 yards...with Wolf ammo? Come on. How about some proof? With an AK pattern rifle none the less. <Unnecessary comment removed - Z> JFA, there's a big difference between 2 MOA at 550yds and 2in at 550yds. around 9.517" difference |
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USA
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Posted: 12/12/2010 2:39:21 PM EDT
[#36]
You are correct, but there is no doubt that Dave deliberately stated that way to make it sound much better. Does sound better then saying it shot into 9 point some inches at 550 yards doesn't it?
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LA, USA
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Posted: 12/12/2010 2:45:08 PM EDT
[#37]
Originally Posted By JFA:
You are correct, but there is no doubt that Dave deliberately stated that way to make it sound much better. Does sound better then saying it shot into 9 point some inches at 550 yards doesn't it? 9.517 is the difference between 2 MOA and 2in @ 550 yds. 2 MOA @ 550 yds is a ~ 11.517" group. |
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USA
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Posted: 12/12/2010 2:54:36 PM EDT
[#38]
Originally Posted By uptown1:
Originally Posted By JFA:
You are correct, but there is no doubt that Dave deliberately stated that way to make it sound much better. Does sound better then saying it shot into 9 point some inches at 550 yards doesn't it? 9.517 is the difference between 2 MOA and 2in @ 550 yds. 2 MOA @ 550 yds is a ~ 11.517" group. Then what is so great about that? |
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USA
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Posted: 12/12/2010 3:17:01 PM EDT
[#39]
Well I'll tell you what, Dave got me on that one. I admit I did read it wrong and seen it as 2 inches. Dave I apologize for reading it wrong and being negative about it. So how much better you think that rifle would do with premium ammo? You know I shoot cast bullets. I've some old milsurps that will beat that 2 moa at 550 yards.
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Posted: 12/13/2010 1:44:58 PM EDT
[#40]
Originally Posted By JFA:
Then what is so great about that? If you actually shoot at those distances you'd know 2moa at 500 is damn good shooting - especially from a 16" kalishnakov. Hell 2moa is good shooting no matter the distance, much more impressive when you realize wind is far more tricky when you start shooting a quarter of a mile and more. Nice to see somebody finally produce an AK in 6.5 G. |
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Posted: 12/13/2010 4:52:51 PM EDT
[#41]
Originally Posted By Gunwritr:
Not just for ARs anymore Spent the last couple days on the range with a new rifle from Krebs Custom actually a prototype chambered for 6.5mm Grendel. It's basically an AK-74 pattern rifle but with his rail over the top cover. Barrel weight is the same as factory. Pretty cool rig. You can hammer stuff up close, like a standard AK. Recoil is a bit milder than 7.62x39mm, but very close. I ran it on steel out to 300 yards and then stepped out to 550 yards. Impressed I shot groups at 550 yards. Thing is holding 2 MOA at 550 yards with Wolf's 120 grain MPT load. I had one box left so stepped it out to 800 yards. Target was an 11.5x20 inch LaRue sniper target. I calculated the elevation and let fly. The wind was gusting quite a bit but I flattened the LaRue on my 3rd shot. Then did it two more times in a row before I missed a wind change. I scored 7 hits at 800 yards.....with an AK. Pretty nice day today......
For the rest you will have to wait for the next Book of the AK47 coming out in a couple months http://i583.photobucket.com/albums/ss273/Gunwritr/Krebs65x38mmGrendelAK.jpg OK, now you have my attention. AK + 6.5G = what I want for Christmas! |
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Posted: 12/13/2010 8:04:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Gunwritr]
[#42]
In my humble opinion 2 MOA at 550 yards is very respectable.
The 600 yard 10 ring in NRA High Power is 12 inches after all. Consistently hitting a LaRue at 800 yards with an AK? All the more impressive. But that is just me.... |
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AR, USA
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Posted: 12/13/2010 9:56:06 PM EDT
[#43]
Originally Posted By Gunwritr:
In my humble opinion 2 MOA at 550 yards is very respectable. The 10 ring in NRA High Power is 12 inches after all. Consistently hitting a LaRue at 800 yards with an AK? All the more impressive. But that is just me.... Sounds impressive to me also. Thanks for keeping us updated on the 6.5 Grendal world. Krebs makes some top notch AK's, on my list of" next AK purchase." |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 12/16/2010 10:08:37 PM EDT
[#44]
Hey guys,
I'm thinking about swapping out the barrel on my 16" AA upper and I'm having a little trouble finding one. I'm looking for something in the 18-20" range. (Preferably 20") I don't mind dropping the coin, just looking for the most accurate/consistent one I can get my hands on. Thanks for any help, -Pat |
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Posted: 12/16/2010 10:22:06 PM EDT
[#45]
Originally Posted By He_Shoot_Me:
Hey guys, I'm thinking about swapping out the barrel on my 16" AA upper and I'm having a little trouble finding one. I'm looking for something in the 18-20" range. (Preferably 20") I don't mind dropping the coin, just looking for the most accurate/consistent one I can get my hands on. Thanks for any help, -Pat Pat, Check out AA's site as they were having a sale on some of the Satern barrels. |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 12/16/2010 11:10:14 PM EDT
[#46]
Thanks RCD!
I'm waiting on a call back from them. (Called late in the day..PST) I called asking for some advise on what to do about a malfunction that happened to me this weekend with my new AA upper. Hopefully they will be calling back soon, as I've begun to worry some the more I think about it. The upper would go into full battery at home with no ammo in it, so I presumed everything was okay and was dying to get it out to the range. Using factory Hornady ammo it would not go into full battery and was about .3" + from doing so. That round was jammed in there so bad I couldn't extract the round with the charging handle, nor get it in with the forward assist. So while I walked out to the truck to call a buddy for some advise the range master got loose with a screwdriver and got it out. So we tried again with oil dripping off of it....same problem, but it closed just a little more. After 3 or 4 try's it did and I fired the weapon. After thinking about that....it probably wasn't the smartest thing I've ever done. (Just in case you're wondering; the answer is Yes, the bolt was lubed prior to this, just not dripping. After that, it shot without a single malfunction. What has me worried is the fact that it happened in the first place and there's a nice little grove cut in every single piece of brass shot. I'm extremely green to gas guns, so I have no clue as to what might have been the problem, and what's causing the grove. I'm lacking confidence in the chamber and this is why I'm considering a new barrel. I figured if I do get another barrel for it I may as well get a longer one while I'm at it for a little added velocity. (Trying to keep it super sonic past 1,000) If anyone would like to chime in with some thought's, I would be grateful. Thanks, -Pat |
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Posted: 12/17/2010 9:54:02 AM EDT
[#47]
Originally Posted By He_Shoot_Me:
Thanks RCD! I'm waiting on a call back from them. (Called late in the day..PST) I called asking for some advise on what to do about a malfunction that happened to me this weekend with my new AA upper. Hopefully they will be calling back soon, as I've begun to worry some the more I think about it. The upper would go into full battery at home with no ammo in it, so I presumed everything was okay and was dying to get it out to the range. Using factory Hornady ammo it would not go into full battery and was about .3" + from doing so. That round was jammed in there so bad I couldn't extract the round with the charging handle, nor get it in with the forward assist. So while I walked out to the truck to call a buddy for some advise the range master got loose with a screwdriver and got it out. So we tried again with oil dripping off of it....same problem, but it closed just a little more. After 3 or 4 try's it did and I fired the weapon. After thinking about that....it probably wasn't the smartest thing I've ever done. (Just in case you're wondering; the answer is Yes, the bolt was lubed prior to this, just not dripping. After that, it shot without a single malfunction. What has me worried is the fact that it happened in the first place and there's a nice little grove cut in every single piece of brass shot. I'm extremely green to gas guns, so I have no clue as to what might have been the problem, and what's causing the grove. I'm lacking confidence in the chamber and this is why I'm considering a new barrel. I figured if I do get another barrel for it I may as well get a longer one while I'm at it for a little added velocity. (Trying to keep it super sonic past 1,000) If anyone would like to chime in with some thought's, I would be grateful. Thanks, -Pat Do you know which barrel you have? |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 12/17/2010 2:55:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: He_Shoot_Me]
[#48]
Originally Posted By Rcd567:
Originally Posted By He_Shoot_Me:
Thanks RCD! I'm waiting on a call back from them. (Called late in the day..PST) I called asking for some advise on what to do about a malfunction that happened to me this weekend with my new AA upper. Hopefully they will be calling back soon, as I've begun to worry some the more I think about it. The upper would go into full battery at home with no ammo in it, so I presumed everything was okay and was dying to get it out to the range. Using factory Hornady ammo it would not go into full battery and was about .3" + from doing so. That round was jammed in there so bad I couldn't extract the round with the charging handle, nor get it in with the forward assist. So while I walked out to the truck to call a buddy for some advise the range master got loose with a screwdriver and got it out. So we tried again with oil dripping off of it....same problem, but it closed just a little more. After 3 or 4 try's it did and I fired the weapon. After thinking about that....it probably wasn't the smartest thing I've ever done. (Just in case you're wondering; the answer is Yes, the bolt was lubed prior to this, just not dripping. After that, it shot without a single malfunction. What has me worried is the fact that it happened in the first place and there's a nice little grove cut in every single piece of brass shot. I'm extremely green to gas guns, so I have no clue as to what might have been the problem, and what's causing the grove. I'm lacking confidence in the chamber and this is why I'm considering a new barrel. I figured if I do get another barrel for it I may as well get a longer one while I'm at it for a little added velocity. (Trying to keep it super sonic past 1,000) If anyone would like to chime in with some thought's, I would be grateful. Thanks, -Pat Do you know which barrel you have? Yes, it's their 16" tactical model. I can't remember it's twist rate at the moment. I'm assuming it's one of their button rifle type's because of the price. I don't know who made it for them, I just know that they didn't make it. (Was told this when I ordered) I did read an article where the author said the barrel of the 14.5" tactical model he was testing was made for them by Daniel Defense. Maybe that's who made my 16" model, I'm just not sure. -Pat |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 12/17/2010 7:53:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: ttrmike]
[#49]
Sabre Defense makes the Tactical model barrel, high quality stuff.
What kind of marks do the spent cases have? I have the 16in Tactical model and all my cases have a ding about midway up the body. From what I understand thats caused by a buffer that is too light (over gassed gun) and the cases are striking the end of ejection port right before the deflector. But that wouldn't really explain your feeding issues. BTW, the twist rate on the tactical models in 1 in 7.5 |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 12/17/2010 8:42:07 PM EDT
[#50]
Thanks for the info Mike!
I to am having the same problem with it putting a "ding" in the case, but figured the solution to that would be a heavier buffer as you mentioned. So before firing the rifle I did install a Spikes ST-12 thinking it was close enough in weight to an H2 in an attempt to keep the brass from getting dinged-up in the first place. No joy with that move. My next plan is to install a heavy duty spring...I'm thinking about a Wolff, but am open to other suggestions. If it doesn't do the trick, I'll move-up to a H3. It is currently ejecting the brass between the 1 to 2 o'clock position, and I'm shooting for 3 to 4 o'clock. The other mark that it's putting into the brass is the one that has me wondering what's going on. It's a perfectly straight line/shallow groove being sliced down the length of the case from the shoulder to bottom of the cartridge. It's not very deep, but is visible. A scratch if you will. -Pat |
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