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Posted: 6/13/2017 12:01:05 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm a systematic guy. So far the first round feeds perfectly into a rifle. Then the rim shears. That's where I am. Once I get great extraction then the gas tuning via gas block, or buffer, etc start to have. I'm still stuck at the beginning. I bought a POF with their E2 extraction chamber. Supposedly a cousin to the fluted chamber of HK (and others). Supposedly helped with extraction. Choke. I do agree, it could be this batch of ammo as well. |
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Posted: 6/13/2017 12:01:38 PM EDT
[#2]
I forgot: 500 trouble free rounds of Wolf over one weekend without cleaning.
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Posted: 6/13/2017 2:03:44 PM EDT
[#3]
I beleive the prominent issue with steel ammo and extraction is blowback of residue into the chamber.
Steel cases do not form as tight a seal with the chamber wall compared to brass. The less elastic case then permits carbon and fowling to push into the chamber eventually making things kinda yucky and potentially sticky. What really will stop your gun is if you shoot x amount of steel through it and then switch to brass. Any carbon built up in the chamber will be grabbed on by the brass as it obturates and causes a stuck case. While i dont knownthe surefire way to ensure you get a reliable barrel on the first try, i would think a nice chamber polish would make it harder for the carbon to build up on any ridges and it should excape easier during extraction. Just a guess but thats what i would do. My old 16 inch bushy barrel has seen many rounds of wolf in its day and it ran fine with the oversized gas port and horrible carbine gas system. 
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Posted: 6/13/2017 2:07:27 PM EDT
[#4]
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Whats the secret? In my limited experience, just chokes after a couple to a mag of rounds. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I run steel through all sorts of Ar-15s and have no problems. Run hard and fast. No probs. |
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Posted: 6/13/2017 2:10:44 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I had a POF Puritan with the E2 chamber. I probably fired 500 rounds through it before deciding piston ARs are like nipples on a man...unnecessary. |
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Posted: 6/13/2017 2:11:57 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I forgot: 500 trouble free rounds of Wolf over one weekend without cleaning. |
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Posted: 6/13/2017 4:40:51 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The Puritan came in several configurations. The one I own is chambered 5.56 and is DI. I believe there were three combinations.  .
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Posted: 6/14/2017 2:11:47 AM EDT
[#8]
Faxon makes some nice barrels at a great price, building a rifle with Gunner barrel currently. BA and FN barrels are great also. I have a PSA melonite barrel barrel that shoots 55g .223 and 5.56 with good accuracy and they can be had for around $90. If you want low cost PSA. Quality and accurate Faxon or BA. Military grade chrome lined FN. Any will have a long life and are GTG.
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Posted: 6/14/2017 1:18:13 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The Puritan (and Minuteman) were the 16.5" piston models .https://pof-usa.com/the-puritan-556/ As I stated earlier. The Puritan came in several configurations. |
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Posted: 6/17/2017 1:00:04 AM EDT
[#10]
I suggest chrome lined just for the chrome lined chamber. Make sure it is 5.56 chambered, not 2002 DPMS-ish sorta-kinda 5.56.
Steel cased ammo with neck sealant will make a mess, which is why you don't see as much .223 using that anymore. Avoid that. If the primer sealant makes a mess you can clean it out with alcohol. |
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Posted: 6/17/2017 3:38:52 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That is incorrect. I have a Puritan in 556 and DI furthermore it is right on their webpage. https://pof-usa.com/the-puritan-556/ As I stated earlier. The Puritan came in several configurations. |
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Posted: 6/17/2017 3:44:10 AM EDT
[#12]
Oh - you're questioning which POFs I had?
The piston version of the Puritan and the Minuteman (same piston gun as the Puritan except the POF guy was engraved on the magwell and they had MagPul FCS). The was because I'm no longer into piston ARs.
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Posted: 6/17/2017 3:45:39 AM EDT
[#13]
The Puritan Upper was marked with the "E2" symbol where BCM places their BFH marking. Minuteman had the E2 on the barrel.
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Posted: 6/17/2017 4:00:24 AM EDT
[#14]
Not GD...sorry.
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Posted: 6/19/2017 7:27:51 PM EDT
[#15]
I use DD, PSA, and BCM barrels with steel cases and almost never have problems.
The only real exception to the rule is Tula Ammo. I can run 1k of brown bear with no stoppages but Tula will eventually give me a stick case and a ripped off cartridge rim. Clean your guns properly, lube them properly and they'll run Day and night. |
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Posted: 6/19/2017 7:38:42 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Nitride is not 100% with steel case. |
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Posted: 6/20/2017 2:28:46 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
We strongly disagree with that statement. Nitride actually has a lower coefficient of friction that standard barrel chrome. (1) LWRC M6IC Basic (2) LWRC M6IC Enhanced (2) Sig Sauer Sig556 (1) Sig Sauer Sig556 Classic I'm sure there are others I'm forgetting about. Over the past 5-6 years I've owned A LOT of rifles with nitrided bores. Stuck cases aren't uncommon with steel case ammo. Sluggish extraction and ripped rims are also common. I've never had this happen to a chrome lined rifle. I have no way of quantify chamber dimensions. It could be that tight chambers coupled with nitride are to blame. I can only report that I've had stuck cases in nitride. I've fired MANY MANY MANY thousands of rounds of Wolf Steel through dozens of BCMs, Colts and Daniel Defenses without a single hicup. (Fired another 150rds at lunch today. Will fire another 150 on Thursday, and probably between 3-500 over the weekend). I've fired thousands of rounds of Wolf Steel through various chrome lined Arsenal SGL21, SLR106, SLR107 without a stuck case (I did have feeding problems with one SLR106 ... it was one of the first 1000 imported and didn't have feedramps). Again, sample of one but I'll take chrome lining over nitride every single time. |
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Posted: 6/20/2017 2:31:51 PM EDT
[#18]
Which costs more? Chrome lining or nitride?
If nitride is superior (and cheaper) why doesn't the military adopt it? They seem to be about saving money with infantry arms (look at the handgun they just adopted  and they stopped buying the SCAR-L in part because of cost).
I see a lot of cheap nitrided barrels (from PSA, S&W, etc). I don't see a lot of same price chrome lined barrels. This leads me to believe chrome costs more in general. Therefore, why wouldn't the military adopt the superior product and save money? I'm not a nitride / ferritic nitrocarburizing hater. I think it has its place, but I'm not convinced it is in the bore of a military rifle. |
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Posted: 6/20/2017 2:36:07 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Which costs more? Chrome lining or nitride? If the answer is nitride why doesn't the military switch to it? They're all about cutting corners with infantry arms (look at the handgun they just adopted )...so why wouldn't they select nitride over chrome if it were cheaper? Remember, they stopped buying the SCAR-L because of cost.The US Military uses both Nitride and Chrome lined barrels depending on their intended usage. We go into significant technical detail on this in other threads. They did not stop using the SCAR because of cost. |
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Posted: 6/20/2017 2:38:26 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They did not stop using the SCAR because of cost. |
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Posted: 6/20/2017 2:39:28 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Why did they stop using the SCAR? |
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Posted: 6/20/2017 2:40:56 PM EDT
[#22]
SOCOM abandons FN SCAR
"Details provided exclusively to Military.com reveal that SOCOM, the Tampa-based command that oversees the training and equipping of SEALs, Green Berets, Air Force Special Tactics Teams and Marine SOC groups, will stop purchasing the 5.56 mm Mk-16 Special Operations Forces Combat Assault Rifle and might require all units who now have them to turn the new weapons back into the armory. “The Mk-16 does not provide enough of a performance advantage over the M-4 to justify spending USSOCOM’s limited … funds when competing priorities are taken into consideration,” officials at USSOCOM said in an email response to questions from Military.com. “Currently, three of USSOCOM’s four components receive the 5.56 mm M-4 from their parent service as a service common equipment item.” I guess you can't believe anything on the internet or perhaps I have a reading comprehension issue. However, "doesn't have enough performance advantage to justify spending limited funds" tells me two things: 1) It had some measurable advantage over the M4 or it would have read "the M4 has superior performance"; 2) It was a cost based decision. |
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Posted: 6/20/2017 2:47:09 PM EDT
[#23]
Scar program was expensive...
"The fact is, the Mk-16 program was expensive and consumed a lot of resources for a weapon that didn’t really offer any signficant combat-relevant advantages over the Colt M4A1 Carbine. " |
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Posted: 6/20/2017 2:49:28 PM EDT
[#24]
This isn't a SCAR died thread so I apologize to the OP.
When I see someone promoting a product that isn't "main line" with people that go into harms way I tend to hear "marketing". It makes me curious about what products they make or sell. In the end, I think chrome vs nitride is a lot like 9mm vs 45Acp or AK vs AR. It really comes down to what do you want, and who do you trust. I've had chrome lined ARs continuously for the past 33 years. I'm 100% comfortable with them. My experience with nitrided rifles hasn't been 100%. None of these products came from FAXON so I can't comment on their products. Again, I'm a very small sample but I've owned / used a significant amount of ARs over the last three decades. I'm not pointing fingers or making accusations. I can only say what I've experienced personally. |
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Posted: 6/20/2017 3:04:10 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
When I see someone promoting a product that isn't "main line" with people that go into harms way I tend to hear "marketing". It makes me curious about what products they make or sell. RogueNathan - no offense was intended. Hope you didn't take it as such. |
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Posted: 6/20/2017 4:33:27 PM EDT
[#26]
In my opinion the best barrels on the market are on sale at Riflegear.com right now. FN CHF chrome lined barrels are $231 right now.
No offense to Faxon, I have got to see a couple of their samples and I think they are quality. If I were buying a new nitride barrel I would go Faxon route. But if I wanted a chrome lined barrel and wanted the best, the FN CHF barrels are what I would buy, and have many times over. |
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Posted: 6/20/2017 5:25:22 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In my opinion the best barrels on the market are on sale at Riflegear.com right now. FN CHF chrome lined barrels are $231 right now. No offense to Faxon, I have got to see a couple of their samples and I think they are quality. If I were buying a new nitride barrel I would go Faxon route. But if I wanted a chrome lined barrel and wanted the best, the FN CHF barrels are what I would buy, and have many times over. My Daniel Defense CHF CL LW is a personal favorite. I also like BCM's BFH ML CL but find Colt CL to be more accurate. The difference is minor, but I do notice it. |
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Posted: 6/20/2017 7:06:55 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've had two or three FN CHF CL barrels also. My Daniel Defense CHF CL LW is a personal favorite. I also like BCM's BFH ML CL but find Colt CL to be more accurate. The difference is minor, but I do notice it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
In my opinion the best barrels on the market are on sale at Riflegear.com right now. FN CHF chrome lined barrels are $231 right now. No offense to Faxon, I have got to see a couple of their samples and I think they are quality. If I were buying a new nitride barrel I would go Faxon route. But if I wanted a chrome lined barrel and wanted the best, the FN CHF barrels are what I would buy, and have many times over. My Daniel Defense CHF CL LW is a personal favorite. I also like BCM's BFH ML CL but find Colt CL to be more accurate. The difference is minor, but I do notice it. |
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Posted: 6/21/2017 10:32:52 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The BCM started it's life in a FN hammer forge. |
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Posted: 6/21/2017 12:20:33 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've heard that FN provides the HF blanks to BCM, but I don't know if anyone has verified it? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The BCM started it's life in a FN hammer forge. |
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