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Posted: 9/12/2023 11:41:01 AM EDT
[#1]
Originally Posted By Miami_JBT: Damn.  Agreed. He was a great businessman. He was a friend. He’s is and will be missed. |
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Posted: 9/12/2023 12:27:58 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By HipSh0T: Franklin Armory in Cason City, Nevada, they are doing well once again but unfortunately it's Franklin Armory who are shitbags. Why are they shitbags? |
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Posted: 9/12/2023 2:25:39 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BoomerShooter: Whenever i ordered from them a lady would email me and ask me if i wanted it shipped to my home or office. I always was treated well by them. Their customer service was outstanding. That seemed to be one area they never struggled in. |
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AK, USA
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Posted: 9/12/2023 3:35:50 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MK318: Outside of a name, what is there to save? They made nothing in house. They were essentially an assembler. They came on at the right time, 2011 was right before Obama’s second term, he was re-elected in 2012 and people were worried about an AWB, then you had Dec 2012 after Sandyhook was nuts and the market didn’t calm down for almost two years. I love the story and I’m glad people like Richard Dyke were around to save peoples jobs back then. However, since 2016 the market has cooled in a big way and they started a decline that they never fully recovered from. They weren’t the cheapest and they couldn’t be since they were buying all the parts to make their rifles. They didn’t make the best rifles and as time went on they offered even less quality while prices went up. They simply couldn’t compete with PSA who makes similar products at even lower prices. I expect companies like Del-ton and Aero Precision to be not too far behind WW. Del-tons least expensive rifle kit is $450. While over at PSA you can get a rifle kit for $299 PSA would gain nothing with the Windham Weaponry name. I don't disagree with your assessment of WW (and I don't know a ton about Del-ton), but I am curious as to why you expect Aero Precision to go the way of WW when they don't fit any of the reasoning you mention for WW to fold. Aero is a manufacturer. In fact, the firearms portion of their business is not the larger part. Aero Precision Holdings is a huge player in the military aerospace contracts world as a manufacturer of aerospace components. They're like the L3 of the aerospace world, if you will. Their products are manufactured in house. And they branched out to other platforms beyond the AR. They are now making suppressors and bolt gun chassis. I don't think we're gonna see them go away anytime soon. |
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Posted: 9/12/2023 6:17:19 PM EDT
[Last Edit: MK318]
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mobiushky: I don't disagree with your assessment of WW (and I don't know a ton about Del-ton), but I am curious as to why you expect Aero Precision to go the way of WW when they don't fit any of the reasoning you mention for WW to fold. Aero is a manufacturer. In fact, the firearms portion of their business is not the larger part. Aero Precision Holdings is a huge player in the military aerospace contracts world as a manufacturer of aerospace components. They're like the L3 of the aerospace world, if you will. Their products are manufactured in house. And they branched out to other platforms beyond the AR. They are now making suppressors and bolt gun chassis. I don't think we're gonna see them go away anytime soon. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By mobiushky: Originally Posted By MK318: Outside of a name, what is there to save? They made nothing in house. They were essentially an assembler. They came on at the right time, 2011 was right before Obama’s second term, he was re-elected in 2012 and people were worried about an AWB, then you had Dec 2012 after Sandyhook was nuts and the market didn’t calm down for almost two years. I love the story and I’m glad people like Richard Dyke were around to save peoples jobs back then. However, since 2016 the market has cooled in a big way and they started a decline that they never fully recovered from. They weren’t the cheapest and they couldn’t be since they were buying all the parts to make their rifles. They didn’t make the best rifles and as time went on they offered even less quality while prices went up. They simply couldn’t compete with PSA who makes similar products at even lower prices. I expect companies like Del-ton and Aero Precision to be not too far behind WW. Del-tons least expensive rifle kit is $450. While over at PSA you can get a rifle kit for $299 PSA would gain nothing with the Windham Weaponry name. I don't disagree with your assessment of WW (and I don't know a ton about Del-ton), but I am curious as to why you expect Aero Precision to go the way of WW when they don't fit any of the reasoning you mention for WW to fold. Aero is a manufacturer. In fact, the firearms portion of their business is not the larger part. Aero Precision Holdings is a huge player in the military aerospace contracts world as a manufacturer of aerospace components. They're like the L3 of the aerospace world, if you will. Their products are manufactured in house. And they branched out to other platforms beyond the AR. They are now making suppressors and bolt gun chassis. I don't think we're gonna see them go away anytime soon. Aero laid off some employees just last month. Local gun laws are causing some challenges in regards to production and distribution. In the past year their quality control and CS has suffered a noticeable hit in the past year. State taxes are going to continue to impact them. They are at a cross roads right now. They either stay and die a death of a thousand cuts or they move and take a hit that will be on their books for at least two years. With a major election on the horizon that is a huge gamble. The Aero Precision that is a firearms manufacture won’t stay around at the current rate. Aero Precision as a whole will be fine. When a limb gets gangrene you chop it off. You don’t let it take over the entire body. |
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 9/12/2023 6:32:58 PM EDT
[#6]
Their most common model that I've seen on dealer shelves is their Government model (Plain Jane 20 inch A4). Going by their website, the barrels on these appear to be decent quality, although I'm not sure who makes them:
"Barrel: 20” Gov’t. A2 Profile, Chrome Lined with A2 Flash Suppressor Barrel Material: 4150 Chrome Moly Vanadium 11595E Steel w. M4 Feed Ramps" |
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Posted: 9/12/2023 6:44:44 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RodDog: How large of a group buy would it take to keep them open It sucks that a company is closing and presumably good people will be out of a job, but why would you? They haven’t really been relevant in many years. Even if you did manage to put together a group buy to keep the doors open, how long you going to keep buying? As soon as you stop, they’re right back in the same predicament because they’re not offering anything marketable in 2023. |
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Posted: 9/12/2023 6:49:21 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By pb57: Their most common model that I've seen on dealer shelves is their Government model (Plain Jane 20 inch A4). Going by their website, the barrels on these appear to be decent quality, although I'm not sure who makes them: "Barrel: 20” Gov’t. A2 Profile, Chrome Lined with A2 Flash Suppressor Barrel Material: 4150 Chrome Moly Vanadium 11595E Steel w. M4 Feed Ramps" Green Mountain did. Their A2 FSB was a true A2 height FSB which was something that even PSA and H&R don’t get right. They are putting F height FSBs on their A2 rifles. They still haven’t updated their site to reflect this discrepancy though. That’s why people were asking WW for A2 and 727 clones since they had everything they needed to produce them with the exception of the A2 upper forgings which they could have bought but they were late to the game. |
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AK, USA
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Posted: 9/12/2023 8:10:20 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MK318: Aero laid off some employees just last month. Local gun laws are causing some challenges in regards to production and distribution. In the past year their quality control and CS has suffered a noticeable hit in the past year. State taxes are going to continue to impact them. They are at a cross roads right now. They either stay and die a death of a thousand cuts or they move and take a hit that will be on their books for at least two years. With a major election on the horizon that is a huge gamble. The Aero Precision that is a firearms manufacture won’t stay around at the current rate. Aero Precision as a whole will be fine. When a limb gets gangrene you chop it off. You don’t let it take over the entire body. Thanks. I wasn't aware of the layoffs. |
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CA, USA
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Posted: 9/12/2023 8:10:26 PM EDT
[#10]
They will not be the last. The AR market is so saturated with cheap kits, the company's heavy with personal will have a hard time. With the internet and you tube everybody now is an expert builder. At least until the rifle does not function reliably. I think you are going to see a big name or 2 within the next year or so.
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Posted: 9/12/2023 8:34:55 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Musketjon: Damn. I bought one of their 20" govt models two years ago as my first-ever AR15. It's a quality rifle, but so much for the life time warranty. I swear, if it wasn't for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all. Last week I ordered a CLE nm float tube for it. I'm gonna' call CLE tomorrow and see if I can cancel the order. I guess resa.Le will be "good luck", pal. Damn. Shame. Jon |
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Posted: 9/12/2023 8:43:39 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By slappomatt: why does a warranty matter on a quality AR? in the odd chance you have an issue its not like there aren't 40 other companies making compatible parts. Not sure why you want to cancel an order for an upgrade. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By slappomatt: Originally Posted By Musketjon: Damn. I bought one of their 20" govt models two years ago as my first-ever AR15. It's a quality rifle, but so much for the life time warranty. I swear, if it wasn't for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all. Last week I ordered a CLE nm float tube for it. I'm gonna' call CLE tomorrow and see if I can cancel the order. I guess resa.Le will be "good luck", pal. Damn. Shame. Jon |
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Posted: 9/12/2023 9:01:02 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By slappomatt: why does a warranty matter on a quality AR? in the odd chance you have an issue its not like there aren't 40 other companies making compatible parts. Not sure why you want to cancel an order for an upgrade. When I sold guns it certainly made a difference to me. |
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 9/12/2023 9:27:16 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MK318: Green Mountain did. Their A2 FSB was a true A2 height FSB which was something that even PSA and H&R don’t get right. They are putting F height FSBs on their A2 rifles. They still haven’t updated their site to reflect this discrepancy though. That’s why people were asking WW for A2 and 727 clones since they had everything they needed to produce them with the exception of the A2 upper forgings which they could have bought but they were late to the game. I note that on their Government models the website says a 1:7 twist is featured but doesn't mention that a 1:9 twist version is (or was) available. These are $20-30 cheaper than the 1:7. Guess the 1:9 marches on. |
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IN, USA
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Posted: 9/12/2023 9:40:54 PM EDT
[#15]
So when will CDNN be blowing out parts like they did with the Remington, DPMS and Bushmaster stuff?
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Posted: 9/12/2023 9:42:45 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By SpankMonkey: Damn it. That sucks. This. They were the "Old Bushmaster" but evidently couldn't make it in this market. A shame, because they made great rifles, but just weren't "Tier 1" by the new alphabet standards. Really think the name did not help them as not many people seemed to know they were the Old (pre-merger) Bushmaster. Sorry to see them go. |
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Posted: 9/12/2023 10:32:01 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MK318: Green Mountain did. Their A2 FSB was a true A2 height FSB which was something that even PSA and H&R don't get right. They are putting F height FSBs on their A2 rifles. They still haven't updated their site to reflect this discrepancy though. That's why people were asking WW for A2 and 727 clones since they had everything they needed to produce them with the exception of the A2 upper forgings which they could have bought but they were late to the game. |
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Posted: 9/13/2023 12:06:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: HipSh0T]
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: Why are they shitbags? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: Originally Posted By HipSh0T: Franklin Armory in Cason City, Nevada, they are doing well once again but unfortunately it's Franklin Armory who are shitbags. Why are they shitbags? I dug up some links you can read but basically Franklin sued another small gun parts business because they were selling a binary type trigger. It ended up ruining the guy, and he was forced to close shop, made it worse because he was a friend to the retro forum. Shit was talked here in a thread, and someone from Franklin jumped on arfcom and started insulting long standing members of the Retro community, when they realized they fucked up, they tried backpedaling and deleting/editing the posts then lied about it. https://www.ar15.com/forums/AR-15/Retro-binary-triggers/123-778476/?page=1&anc=bottom#bottom |
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Posted: 9/13/2023 12:19:23 AM EDT
[Last Edit: DefenderAO]
[#19]
And Bushmaster remains...
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Posted: 9/13/2023 1:14:26 AM EDT
[Last Edit: MK318]
[#20]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By chumpmiester: Which was one of the reasons I bought my A2 barrel and handguard kit from Windham. I bought an A2 upper one time from PSA and returned it right away since it had the F marked FSB and a 6/3 elevation drum on an A2 upper. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By chumpmiester: Originally Posted By MK318: Green Mountain did. Their A2 FSB was a true A2 height FSB which was something that even PSA and H&R don't get right. They are putting F height FSBs on their A2 rifles. They still haven't updated their site to reflect this discrepancy though. That's why people were asking WW for A2 and 727 clones since they had everything they needed to produce them with the exception of the A2 upper forgings which they could have bought but they were late to the game. Not to get off topic but that is what soured me on the whole H&R thing. They sort of threw the A2 series together. Incorrect FSB and rear sight was too much for me. I bought a few WW A2 barrel kits over the years for various builds. The Green Mnt barrels were exceptional. I actually placed a backorder with them a few months back that they never did deliver before closing their doors. I can’t see where they charged my card either so no harm no foul.  Attached FileI really think if they would have secured those A1 and A2 forgings back in 2017, they’d be printing money right now. There is a huge retro market. They had people who were with Bushmaster back in the early days of GWOT and made things like some of the first free float handguards. They just never seemed interested in tapping into that market. They were trying to sell LEO patrol rifles. It was as if they still had that Bushmaster big govt contract mindset. |
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Posted: 9/13/2023 7:15:59 AM EDT
[#21]
I have always had good experiences with them.
I ordered a complete flat top upper yesterday. Hope it ships. |
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Posted: 9/13/2023 8:50:54 PM EDT
[#22]
My second AR was a XM15E2S Bushmaster. Bought it right at the beginning of 1994 Ban.
I ran over 15K thru that gun. And when 2 locking lugs broke during a class. (And kept running) They send me a new one, free of Charge. Shame that they will no longer be around. |
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Posted: 9/13/2023 9:06:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: TGWLDR]
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Harv24: My second AR was a XM15E2S Bushmaster. Bought it right at the beginning of 1994 Ban. My first AR, same year. ^^^^^ Great gun. |
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Posted: 9/15/2023 1:14:49 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: When I sold guns it certainly made a difference to me. |
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Posted: 9/15/2023 4:59:11 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By slappomatt: rule #1 don't sell guns. He meant for a living |
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Posted: 9/15/2023 5:13:02 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CouchCommando22: He meant for a living Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By CouchCommando22: Originally Posted By slappomatt: rule #1 don't sell guns. He meant for a living Correct |
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Posted: 9/15/2023 5:32:18 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By slappomatt: rule #1 don't sell guns. |
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Posted: 9/15/2023 9:04:01 PM EDT
[#28]
Of you are looking to get a Windham Weaponry rifle, the Windham Weaponry range is staying open. I got a Facebook message saying they still had a lot of Windham rifles.
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Posted: 9/16/2023 9:38:10 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MK318: Not to get off topic but that is what soured me on the whole H&R thing. They sort of threw the A2 series together. Incorrect FSB and rear sight was too much for me. I bought a few WW A2 barrel kits over the years for various builds. The Green Mnt barrels were exceptional. I actually placed a backorder with them a few months back that they never did deliver before closing their doors. I can't see where they charged my card either so no harm no foul. I really think if they would have secured those A1 and A2 forgings back in 2017, they'd be printing money right now. There is a huge retro market. They had people who were with Bushmaster back in the early days of GWOT and made things like some of the first free float handguards. They just never seemed interested in tapping into that market. They were trying to sell LEO patrol rifles. It was as if they still had that Bushmaster big govt contract mindset. While Windham was using the wrong upper for their A1's, the C7 upper they did use is now desirable too. I ended up using a DPMS A2 upper I had with the Windham barrel and handguards. I have been extremely pleased on how the barrel shoots. It is very accurate even with surplus M855 ammo. Plus everything is correct for an A2 to include sourcing the handguards from the same manufacturer as Colt and FN. Windham definitely missed the boat with not securing a steady and reliable source for the A1, C7, and A2 forgings. Retro rifles have definitely become more popular in the last few years. |
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Posted: 9/16/2023 12:25:08 PM EDT
[#30]
Unaware of their impending closing, I ordered a dissipator upper with A1 handguards. Very happy I got it. Sad that I won't be able to order more from them.
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PA, USA
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Posted: 9/19/2023 9:32:57 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Musketjon: Damn. I bought one of their 20" govt models two years ago as my first-ever AR15. It's a quality rifle, but so much for the life time warranty. I swear, if it wasn't for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all. Last week I ordered a CLE nm float tube for it. I'm gonna' call CLE tomorrow and see if I can cancel the order. I guess resa.Le will be "good luck", pal. Damn. Shame. Jon This is a ridiculous comment. If you ever have an issue, just fix the issue. It's an AR, not some one of a kind rarity. |
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Posted: 9/28/2023 12:37:58 PM EDT
[#32]
One of my Maine made Bushmasters.
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Posted: 9/28/2023 12:55:20 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TGWLDR: My first AR, same year. ^^^^^ Great gun. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TGWLDR: Originally Posted By Harv24: My second AR was a XM15E2S Bushmaster. Bought it right at the beginning of 1994 Ban. My first AR, same year. ^^^^^ Great gun. Same here, but in 1999. Got the lower through a local FFL, ordered the upper from Brownells, and found some 30 round mags at a gun show in Tucson. |
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Posted: 9/28/2023 2:52:37 PM EDT
[#34]
Well that sucks. First non Colt AR I ever bought was a Windham made Bushmaster. We are probably going to see more of this going forward, low prices are great, unless your a manufacturer.
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Posted: 9/28/2023 3:29:08 PM EDT
[#35]
I really have no idea why people are discussing Bushmasters like they were brought down from Mount Olympus.
I was contacted by a small Police Department almost 20 years ago to P.M. their Bushmaster Patrolman AR’s. They had six and stated none of them would cycle, first thing I looked at was the Bolt Carrier Keys….sure enough, not staked and were loose. ALL SIX! These were rifles sent from Bushmaster directly to a Law Enforcement agency and AFTER A FEW YEARS THEY WOULDNT RUN! I properly installed the Carrier Keys, and they ran fine afterwards and are still running fine today. Bushmaster should never shipped rifles they knew were going in harms way with these issues. |
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GA, USA
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Posted: 9/28/2023 6:00:05 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By PursuitSS: I really have no idea why people are discussing Bushmasters like they were brought down from Mount Olympus. ABC!!! |
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GA, USA
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Posted: 9/28/2023 6:02:36 PM EDT
[#37]
Having said that...they were "just another AR-15". A niche market is a damn hard place to thrive in!
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WA, USA
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Posted: 9/28/2023 6:48:52 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By PursuitSS: I really have no idea why people are discussing Bushmasters like they were brought down from Mount Olympus. I was contacted by a small Police Department almost 20 years ago to P.M. their Bushmaster Patrolman AR’s. They had six and stated none of them would cycle, first thing I looked at was the Bolt Carrier Keys….sure enough, not staked and were loose. ALL SIX! These were rifles sent from Bushmaster directly to a Law Enforcement agency and AFTER A FEW YEARS THEY WOULDNT RUN! I properly installed the Carrier Keys, and they ran fine afterwards and are still running fine today. Bushmaster should never shipped rifles they knew were going in harms way with these issues. Apparently it must have been after you saw those Old Windham made Bushmaster's that they must have started staking carrier keys, because the one I had (bought new in 2003) came with a staked gas key. It was pretty weak staking though, and it had a reputation for not being sufficient. Old Bushmaster was also known for purple receivers, canted FSBs, soft FCG parts, not finishing under the FSB and not staking their castle nuts. As Windham Weaponry they did make improvements on some of their Old Bushmaster issues, but in a few ways they were still the same. |
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Posted: 9/28/2023 6:52:22 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By PursuitSS: I really have no idea why people are discussing Bushmasters like they were brought down from Mount Olympus. I was contacted by a small Police Department almost 20 years ago to P.M. their Bushmaster Patrolman AR's. They had six and stated none of them would cycle, first thing I looked at was the Bolt Carrier Keys .sure enough, not staked and were loose. ALL SIX! These were rifles sent from Bushmaster directly to a Law Enforcement agency and AFTER A FEW YEARS THEY WOULDNT RUN! I properly installed the Carrier Keys, and they ran fine afterwards and are still running fine today. Bushmaster should never shipped rifles they knew were going in harms way with these issues. |
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Posted: 9/28/2023 6:53:20 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 556Cliff: Apparently it must have been after you saw those Old Windham made Bushmaster's that they must have started staking carrier keys, because the one I had (bought new in 2003) came with a staked gas key. It was pretty weak staking though, and it had a reputation for not being sufficient. Old Bushmaster was also known for purple receivers, canted FSBs, soft FCG parts, not finishing under the FSB and not staking their castle nuts. As Windham Weaponry they did make improvements on some of their Old Bushmaster issues, but in a few ways they were still the same. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 556Cliff: Originally Posted By PursuitSS: I really have no idea why people are discussing Bushmasters like they were brought down from Mount Olympus. I was contacted by a small Police Department almost 20 years ago to P.M. their Bushmaster Patrolman AR's. They had six and stated none of them would cycle, first thing I looked at was the Bolt Carrier Keys .sure enough, not staked and were loose. ALL SIX! These were rifles sent from Bushmaster directly to a Law Enforcement agency and AFTER A FEW YEARS THEY WOULDNT RUN! I properly installed the Carrier Keys, and they ran fine afterwards and are still running fine today. Bushmaster should never shipped rifles they knew were going in harms way with these issues. Apparently it must have been after you saw those Old Windham made Bushmaster's that they must have started staking carrier keys, because the one I had (bought new in 2003) came with a staked gas key. It was pretty weak staking though, and it had a reputation for not being sufficient. Old Bushmaster was also known for purple receivers, canted FSBs, soft FCG parts, not finishing under the FSB and not staking their castle nuts. As Windham Weaponry they did make improvements on some of their Old Bushmaster issues, but in a few ways they were still the same. |
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Posted: 9/28/2023 8:09:02 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By PursuitSS: I really have no idea why people are discussing Bushmasters like they were brought down from Mount Olympus. I was contacted by a small Police Department almost 20 years ago to P.M. their Bushmaster Patrolman AR’s. They had six and stated none of them would cycle, first thing I looked at was the Bolt Carrier Keys….sure enough, not staked and were loose. ALL SIX! These were rifles sent from Bushmaster directly to a Law Enforcement agency and AFTER A FEW YEARS THEY WOULDNT RUN! I properly installed the Carrier Keys, and they ran fine afterwards and are still running fine today. Bushmaster should never shipped rifles they knew were going in harms way with these issues. I bought a Bushy in like 2001, and it shit the bed on day one due to loose carrier key screws. |
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Posted: 9/29/2023 3:22:40 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 1168RGR: I bought a Bushy in like 2001, and it shit the bed on day one due to loose carrier key screws. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 1168RGR: Originally Posted By PursuitSS: I really have no idea why people are discussing Bushmasters like they were brought down from Mount Olympus. I was contacted by a small Police Department almost 20 years ago to P.M. their Bushmaster Patrolman AR’s. They had six and stated none of them would cycle, first thing I looked at was the Bolt Carrier Keys….sure enough, not staked and were loose. ALL SIX! These were rifles sent from Bushmaster directly to a Law Enforcement agency and AFTER A FEW YEARS THEY WOULDNT RUN! I properly installed the Carrier Keys, and they ran fine afterwards and are still running fine today. Bushmaster should never shipped rifles they knew were going in harms way with these issues. I bought a Bushy in like 2001, and it shit the bed on day one due to loose carrier key screws. We’ve become kind of spoiled in the past 10-15 years when it comes to QC and ARs. Back in the 90s and early 00s, quality control was hit or miss, even with manufactures like Colt. A lot of issues that buyers fret over now days, were deemed acceptable by the masses back then. It is sad that Windham closed because Windham was Bushmaster and even though they were kind of low tier by todays standards, back in the day they were considered one of the better options. Windham closing is something else from my childhood that is no longer existing and is yet another thing reminding me that I am getting old. |
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Posted: 9/29/2023 3:46:00 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MK318: We’ve become kind of spoiled in the past 10-15 years when it comes to QC and ARs. Back in the 90s and early 00s, quality control was hit or miss, even with manufactures like Colt. A lot of issues that buyers fret over now days, were deemed acceptable by the masses back then. It is sad that Windham closed because Windham was Bushmaster and even though they were kind of low tier by todays standards, back in the day they were considered one of the better options. Windham closing is something else from my childhood that is no longer existing and is yet another thing reminding me that I am getting old. During the AWB, it was just common knowledge that ARs are unreliable. Of course, this isn’t true, but commercial guns of the time were often pretty shitty, and that colored expectations and gun-counter discussion (many of us weren’t on the internet back then). Add in the factor of buying mags at gun shows, and its not hard to see where the low expectations came from. I think for a lot of buyers, “does it take 30 rounders?” was the biggest part of the decision matrix for buying a rifle. And yeah, Windham going under is saddening for the reasons you mentioned. |
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OH, USA
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Posted: 10/1/2023 4:46:49 PM EDT
[#44]
Well they’re back:
https://www.bushmaster.com/company/about-bushmaster/ |
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IA, USA
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Posted: 10/1/2023 5:01:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: TGWLDR]
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By charleslee1: Well they’re back: https://www.bushmaster.com/company/about-bushmaster/ Not quite. https://www.guns.com/news/2021/02/15/bushmaster-announces-a-comeback In September 2020, in the bankruptcy auction of Remington Outdoor Company, Crotalus Holdings, Inc. purchased the Bushmaster trademarks. In August 2021, Bushmaster Firearms Industries, Inc. revived the brand name with a new business headquartered in Carson City, Nevada. Current happenings: "We have begun discussions with Keenan Auction Company to determine the best course of action for a full liquidation which should happen within the next month or so." |
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OH, USA
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Posted: 10/1/2023 5:28:40 PM EDT
[#46]
Yeah I don’t know what’s going on? It says “store” but I read elsewhere that they were auctioning stuff today.
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Posted: 10/1/2023 5:59:46 PM EDT
[#47]
Originally Posted By charleslee1: Well they’re back: https://www.bushmaster.com/company/about-bushmaster/ Originally Posted By charleslee1: Yeah I don’t know what’s going on? It says “store” but I read elsewhere that they were auctioning stuff today. You understand Bushmaster and Windham are two different companies right? Current Bushmaster has nothing to do with old Bushmaster. Bushmaster today is owned by Franklin Armory the binary trigger company. Windham took over the plant that the old Bushmaster operated in and is now closing up. |
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Posted: 10/1/2023 6:26:00 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: You understand Bushmaster and Windham are two different companies right? Current Bushmaster has nothing to do with old Bushmaster. Bushmaster today is owned by Franklin Armory the binary trigger company. Windham took over the plant that the old Bushmaster operated in and is now closing up. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: Originally Posted By charleslee1: Well they’re back: https://www.bushmaster.com/company/about-bushmaster/ Originally Posted By charleslee1: Yeah I don’t know what’s going on? It says “store” but I read elsewhere that they were auctioning stuff today. You understand Bushmaster and Windham are two different companies right? Current Bushmaster has nothing to do with old Bushmaster. Bushmaster today is owned by Franklin Armory the binary trigger company. Windham took over the plant that the old Bushmaster operated in and is now closing up. This is correct information |
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Posted: 10/1/2023 6:28:14 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By PursuitSS: I really have no idea why people are discussing Bushmasters like they were brought down from Mount Olympus. I was contacted by a small Police Department almost 20 years ago to P.M. their Bushmaster Patrolman AR’s. They had six and stated none of them would cycle, first thing I looked at was the Bolt Carrier Keys….sure enough, not staked and were loose. ALL SIX! These were rifles sent from Bushmaster directly to a Law Enforcement agency and AFTER A FEW YEARS THEY WOULDNT RUN! I properly installed the Carrier Keys, and they ran fine afterwards and are still running fine today. Bushmaster should never shipped rifles they knew were going in harms way with these issues. My son came up with a "pre-ban" Bushmaster faux XM-177 with a P&W "moderator." We took it out to shoot and it was a single-shot. Yep, loose bolt carrier keys. 
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Posted: 10/1/2023 7:30:23 PM EDT
[#50]
Another example of failing to recognize the market. wW was never going to compete with the big buys after they sold out to Freedom Group. They should have jumped into the niche market of A1 and A2 rifles like PSA/H&R is right now. Could have kept them alive.
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