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Posted: 5/24/2011 3:47:04 PM EST
I'm looking to purchase another upper (maybe BCM) but unfortunately as most of you know, BCM's bolt carrier groups are always out of stock. I saw in another thread that somebody mentioned the Rainer Arms BCG but didn't give alot of detail. So after searching and comparing the specs to the BCM, it seems to be of high quality.

My question to yall is, is it actually high quality or should I look else where? I'd like to get a BCM bolt carrier group but don't feel like playing the waiting game with them to get the BCG. Could yall recommend another BCG that is of high quality with a price similar to the Rainer Arms and BCM?

Thanks in advance
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 4:07:47 PM EST
Colt or LMT. I wouldn't go much beyond those.
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 4:20:51 PM EST

Originally Posted By Primos:
Colt or LMT. I wouldn't go much beyond those.

You have your answer.
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 4:25:37 PM EST
I have a Rainier BCG. Works great, everything looks good after about 1k rounds. They make good stuff.
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 4:30:42 PM EST
The same company that made the Rainier BCGs made Dennys BCGs. I have used Rainier Products before specifically their uppers and I have never had a bad experience with them. For the price range I would say it is a solid BCG. I have ran DSA, Rock River, LMT, Young MFG N/M and JP stainless tactical BCGs and I have never experienced a malfunction from any of them. Clean em dry and shoot em wet and you should be good with the Rainier. Dont be afraid to go outside of what people say on here. Not knocking anyone that believes in colt; but I dont buy into all of the Colt hype. They do have longevity in the AR buisness but it is also 2011 and manufacturers are able to build quality components.
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 4:32:12 PM EST
So Rainier is a no go? Why?

I can definitely find LMT but haven't really looked for Colt BCG's. Why is the LMT so much better than Rainier? Also, I can't find any specs on the LMT stating whether or not it is HP/MP tested and all that good stuff.
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 4:36:47 PM EST
I am using 3 Rainier BCG's in 3 different rifles. I have had zero issues. They are HPT/MPI tested like the others so I don't see how you can go wrong with using them.
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 4:36:54 PM EST
So some say No to Rainier and others say yes... To me from the specs they provide they seem like they are comparable to a BCM.

Oh and I definitely don't have the money to drop on a Colt BCG.
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 4:41:32 PM EST
The two guys above just told you that they are all good to go. As long as they are to mil-spec, you good to go. Some guys are sold on one or two brand names. How one can claim one is better the the other is beyond me.
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 4:51:46 PM EST
I wouldn't have a problem trusting a Rainier Arms BCG

I have BCM and LaRue BCGs and they have worked great so far. I would also feel safe going with Daniel Defense or Spikes
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 5:15:05 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/24/2011 5:15:51 PM EST by Primos]
Originally Posted By gargamel:
...Some guys are sold on one or two brand names. How one can claim one is better the the other is beyond me.


Because not all parts are created equal, and not all 'manufacturers' put out the same level of quality or same specs in a given product (that looks identical to the next). Maybe not you, but some people get a little funny when certain brands are mentioned, and go into a "you're just buying a name / i don't buy into the hype / my brand x is 'just as good as'" thing, largely because they have limited experience and/or they base much of their opinion on what they read on the internet (hearsay). BCM, Colt, and LMT have shown a level of competency in producing a product that has given ME the fewest issues. They're about the only companies whose major components I'll buy anymore.

I've never used Rainier's bcg, so I can't comment, however if they're just getting them from Y/M then I'd pass.

Back to the op, if the Colt is too much (it's not *that* much more..), then get an LMT for around 140. Same $ as everyone else.
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 5:19:38 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/24/2011 5:21:06 PM EST by camoman33935]
The Colt BCG's that I saw were over $200 which to some is good bit more. The extra money could be used for a rear sight or other parts.

Oh and is the LMT HP/MP tested and all the important stuff?
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 5:25:25 PM EST
I have two of the Denny bolts which are the same as the Rainier. They are gtg. I have purchased plenty of other components from Rainier and they are top notch.
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 5:27:23 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/24/2011 5:29:59 PM EST by ELPerdido]
Originally Posted By camoman33935:
The Colt BCG's that I saw were over $200 which to some is good bit more. The extra money could be used for a rear sight or other parts.

Oh and is the LMT HP/MP tested and all the important stuff?


You can buy a Colt BCG directly from Colt for $179.95

Colt BCG

I have purchased two from Colt and they send em FedEx right to my door
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 6:00:16 PM EST
My experience with Rainier products has always been good. I don't feel "parts are parts". Actually might be considered somewhat of a BCM fanboy. Using a Rainier BCG wouldn't bother me though. I feel your pain on the lack of availability on BCM BCGs. I got tired of waiting too and bought a couple $109 Spikes BCGs for Bravo uppers and am confident they will perform just as well. I've been hammering them good and hard and so far I have no reason to think otherwise. JMO though.
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 6:13:40 PM EST
thanks for all of the replies fellas. I haven't decided on a particular BCG yet but have another question since we're on the topic of BCGs.

What's the difference between a semi and a full auto BCG. I know that the full auto BCG has a reinforcement at the rear of the BCG that is the same length as the top while the semi doesn't. Is there any benefit in buying a F/A over a S/A? Will a F/A BCG work fine in a S/A rifle?

Thanks
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 6:30:15 PM EST
A FA BCG is heavier and slows down the cycle rate. They work fine in Semi autos. Hell, many of the major manufactures use FA BCGs in the semi autos.
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 6:48:27 PM EST
I think I'm gonna give the Rainier BCG a try. If it breaks (which I doubt it will) it is covered under a lifetime warranty. Thanks for the help guys.
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 9:57:00 PM EST
Link Posted: 5/24/2011 10:10:22 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/24/2011 10:17:29 PM EST by occasionalvisitor]
Palmetto State Armory is offering mil-spec MPI bolt carrier groups for $120, and you have the option of buying a charging handle for another $10. Spend $190, and shipping is free.

A friend of mine and I have purchased a pile of PSA parts lately, and we have been very happy with the quality of the parts and the service.

They are running killer deals on complete uppers ($400-$430 for 16" and 18" 5.56 and 6.8 flattops), and LPKs with Magpul furniture (and Ergo if you prefer). For instance, right now they have some in stock complete 14.5" 1/7 5.56mm (with pinned suppresor/hider to make 16") upper assemblies (fixed FSB, BCG, and M4 handguards) for $400. Extra cost options: quadrail (about $100), MOE handguards ($20), and rear MBUIS ($50).
Link Posted: 5/25/2011 5:13:34 AM EST
Here's a thought. Let's completely abandon the terms semi-auto and full-auto when referring to bolt carrier groups for our "Modern Sporting Rifles". I suggest we all immediately switch to "full-figured and slim-line" configurations!
Link Posted: 5/25/2011 5:31:49 AM EST
[Last Edit: 5/25/2011 5:36:25 AM EST by SA80Dan]
The Rainier BCG is GTG. Not only are the specs identical to the BCM one, they offer a lifetime warranty and will replace it if it breaks. Rainier are an excellent company and stand by the products they carry. It is also cheaper than the BCM one.

I really have to commend BCM for their complete and utter dominance of the BCG market....they have had one slick marketing campaign. Fact of the matter is, 99% of "Brand" companies make nothing (or at best, a very very limited amount of stuff) themselves in house. 99.9% of bolts all come from the same few production factories; the only difference between the "Brands" is the QC standards that are demanded by the brand company. BCM has imposed strict standards and have excelled at letting the world know it; others (such as Rainier here, or the Palmetto one) have equally strict standards and have stated as much, but the BCM internet momentum has a lot of people thinking BCM make all their own stuff, and it is BCM or nothing. And fair play to them, they are doing great in a competitive business. However, they (and LMT/Colt etc) are far from the only game in town.
Link Posted: 5/25/2011 6:33:46 AM EST
Originally Posted By SA80Dan:
The Rainier BCG is GTG. Not only are the specs identical to the BCM one, they offer a lifetime warranty and will replace it if it breaks. Rainier are an excellent company and stand by the products they carry. It is also cheaper than the BCM one.

I really have to commend BCM for their complete and utter dominance of the BCG market....they have had one slick marketing campaign. Fact of the matter is, 99% of "Brand" companies make nothing (or at best, a very very limited amount of stuff) themselves in house. 99.9% of bolts all come from the same few production factories; the only difference between the "Brands" is the QC standards that are demanded by the brand company. BCM has imposed strict standards and have excelled at letting the world know it; others (such as Rainier here, or the Palmetto one) have equally strict standards and have stated as much, but the BCM internet momentum has a lot of people thinking BCM make all their own stuff, and it is BCM or nothing. And fair play to them, they are doing great in a competitive business. However, they (and LMT/Colt etc) are far from the only game in town.


+1 Rainier is FANTASTIC gear. Good to great prices (got my 12.5" Noveske Crusader barrel with Switchblock delivered from them for about 5% less than Noveske's list delivered price) and FANTASTIC customer service.

GTF is putting it mildly
Link Posted: 5/25/2011 7:01:55 AM EST
Yep-Rainier BCG is GTG
Link Posted: 5/25/2011 8:27:36 AM EST

Originally Posted By SA80Dan:
The Rainier BCG is GTG. Not only are the specs identical to the BCM one, they offer a lifetime warranty and will replace it if it breaks. Rainier are an excellent company and stand by the products they carry. It is also cheaper than the BCM one.

I really have to commend BCM for their complete and utter dominance of the BCG market....they have had one slick marketing campaign. Fact of the matter is, 99% of "Brand" companies make nothing (or at best, a very very limited amount of stuff) themselves in house. 99.9% of bolts all come from the same few production factories; the only difference between the "Brands" is the QC standards that are demanded by the brand company. BCM has imposed strict standards and have excelled at letting the world know it; others (such as Rainier here, or the Palmetto one) have equally strict standards and have stated as much, but the BCM internet momentum has a lot of people thinking BCM make all their own stuff, and it is BCM or nothing. And fair play to them, they are doing great in a competitive business. However, they (and LMT/Colt etc) are far from the only game in town.
Yes, definitely stay away from BCM, LMT and Colt BCGs. It will make it easier for me to get them.

Link Posted: 5/25/2011 8:50:04 AM EST
Originally Posted By wetidlerjr:

Originally Posted By SA80Dan:
The Rainier BCG is GTG. Not only are the specs identical to the BCM one, they offer a lifetime warranty and will replace it if it breaks. Rainier are an excellent company and stand by the products they carry. It is also cheaper than the BCM one.

I really have to commend BCM for their complete and utter dominance of the BCG market....they have had one slick marketing campaign. Fact of the matter is, 99% of "Brand" companies make nothing (or at best, a very very limited amount of stuff) themselves in house. 99.9% of bolts all come from the same few production factories; the only difference between the "Brands" is the QC standards that are demanded by the brand company. BCM has imposed strict standards and have excelled at letting the world know it; others (such as Rainier here, or the Palmetto one) have equally strict standards and have stated as much, but the BCM internet momentum has a lot of people thinking BCM make all their own stuff, and it is BCM or nothing. And fair play to them, they are doing great in a competitive business. However, they (and LMT/Colt etc) are far from the only game in town.
Yes, definitely stay away from BCM, LMT and Colt BCGs. It will make it easier for me to get them.



I probably will to be honest.... those few bucks are a few bucks.... ;)

That's not what I was saying though....and ya know it; top quality parts all....but so's the others.
Link Posted: 5/25/2011 8:57:45 AM EST

Originally Posted By SA80Dan:
Originally Posted By wetidlerjr:

Originally Posted By SA80Dan:
The Rainier BCG is GTG. .. And fair play to them, they are doing great in a competitive business. However, they (and LMT/Colt etc) are far from the only game in town.
Yes, definitely stay away from BCM, LMT and Colt BCGs. It will make it easier for me to get them.
I probably will to be honest.... those few bucks are a few bucks.... ;)
That's not what I was saying though....and ya know it; top quality parts all....but so's the others.
Humor
(But DO stay away !)

Link Posted: 5/25/2011 9:07:37 AM EST
[Last Edit: 5/25/2011 9:20:53 AM EST by camoman33935]
I have another question....not about BCGs but the upper halfs themselves. Are LMT's uppers just as good as BCM? I ask because 1) I don't particularly like the big white "BCM" billboard on the side of the upper reciever (just a cosmetic thing for me not too huge of a deal) and 2) If the LMT upper is just as good as BCM then I could just order everything I need from Rainier and save on shipping.
Link Posted: 5/25/2011 9:12:55 AM EST
Stripped uppers....same story. So long as they are 7075 and in spec, GTG. LMT, most certainly.
Link Posted: 5/25/2011 9:19:51 AM EST
No they're not stripped uppers they're the complete ones minus the BCG that Rainier offers.

This one: LMT UPPER
Link Posted: 5/25/2011 9:42:38 AM EST
I see....given a complete basic carbine length upper like like, I wouldn't differentiate between either LMT or BCM; I'd buy whichever one was cheaper to be honest - both top companies.
Link Posted: 5/25/2011 1:41:22 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/25/2011 1:42:48 PM EST by Bretshooter]
Even though The Chart is gone, the information which led to it is still there. With it, you are properly informed to make a decision without needing some one making it for you.

Edited to add "needing"
Link Posted: 5/25/2011 2:55:01 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/25/2011 2:57:21 PM EST by 9divdoc]
Originally Posted By camoman33935:
I have another question....not about BCGs but the upper halfs themselves. Are LMT's uppers just as good as BCM? I ask because 1) I don't particularly like the big white "BCM" billboard on the side of the upper reciever (just a cosmetic thing for me not too huge of a deal) and 2) If the LMT upper is just as good as BCM then I could just order everything I need from Rainier and save on shipping.


Just got a stripped upper from Rainier today....very nice....Mega iirc....with a small, tasteful, (almost imperceptible) silhouette of snow capped Mt. Rainier...

Although I "wuddna" cared if it was some huge ass dog paw logo...

Rainier stuff is good stuff.....

But they also handle LMT which is also good stuff.....

Either way you're good to go...as long as you have a back up bolt....

Two is one...and one is none.
Link Posted: 5/25/2011 3:34:08 PM EST
My Rainer/Denny's Thunder Bolt is approaching 9K rounds combined SA/FA without a problem.
Then there's that lifetime warranty....

For less then the price of Colt, LMT, BMC or even PSA (I got mine for $115 shipped)?

And a Colt is how much? with what warranty?
Link Posted: 5/25/2011 5:28:57 PM EST
I wouldnt hesitate to use anything from Rainier, they have a damned good reputation in the business.



Although Ive never bought from them, I would. No particular reason I guess. I just have my usual vendors. Probably because I dont like to order any further away than Texas. I hate waiting on shipping times.


Link Posted: 5/25/2011 6:18:54 PM EST
I am going with the Rainier BCG on my next build. I am sure if I have any problem Rainier will take care of it.
Link Posted: 5/25/2011 7:01:01 PM EST
I've spent quite a bit of money at Rainier Arms, both online, and at their store in person. They are a good group of people who take care of their customers. They won't stamp their name on anything that isn't good to go, and they won't stock anything on their shelves unless they would use it themselves. If for some odd reason you do run into a problem with something of theirs, I know they'll make it right for you.

Buy with confidence.
Link Posted: 5/26/2011 4:04:13 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/26/2011 4:05:29 PM EST by camoman33935]
Thanks for all yalls help. I placed my order just a few minutes ago. I decided to go with a BCM 16" M4 upper, Rainier BCG, Magpul MBUS rear sight & MOE handguards, and a WOA charging handle. Hopefully it'll be in soon the wait always kills me when I order stuff lol.
Link Posted: 5/26/2011 4:23:28 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/26/2011 4:28:33 PM EST by mikecnorthwest]
Originally Posted By weaponoutfitters:


The problem is that for some of us (like us in WA state) state laws can be poorly written. According to WA state, if one has the option to use semi-auto specific parts, they must use it, LOL!



What WA state law says you have to use semi-auto specific parts? I can go to Rainier Arms and buy a full auto BCG over the counter, correct?
Link Posted: 5/26/2011 6:30:49 PM EST
Wow, no love for the DD. That is another option for you thrown into the mix.
Link Posted: 5/26/2011 7:02:03 PM EST
Link Posted: 5/26/2011 11:26:32 PM EST
Link Posted: 5/26/2011 11:28:58 PM EST
Link Posted: 5/27/2011 5:54:51 AM EST
Originally Posted By hertboi2010:
The same company that made the Rainier BCGs made Dennys BCGs. I have used Rainier Products before specifically their uppers and I have never had a bad experience with them. For the price range I would say it is a solid BCG. I have ran DSA, Rock River, LMT, Young MFG N/M and JP stainless tactical BCGs and I have never experienced a malfunction from any of them. Clean em dry and shoot em wet and you should be good with the Rainier. Dont be afraid to go outside of what people say on here. Not knocking anyone that believes in colt; but I dont buy into all of the Colt hype. They do have longevity in the AR buisness but it is also 2011 and manufacturers are able to build quality components.


Who makes the Rainier and Denny's BCGs?
Link Posted: 5/30/2011 2:50:01 PM EST
According to WA state, if one has the option to use semi-auto specific parts, they must use it,

That's incorrect info.


Link Posted: 5/30/2011 3:13:48 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/30/2011 3:15:31 PM EST by fmfcorpsman]
Originally Posted By gargamel:
The two guys above just told you that they are all good to go. As long as they are to mil-spec, you good to go. Some guys are sold on one or two brand names. How one can claim one is better the the other is beyond me.


Thank you!!! Give this man a medal. I have felt that way for years. Get something you know to be quality and all is well.
Link Posted: 5/30/2011 3:54:42 PM EST
Originally Posted By Unicorn:
Originally Posted By RainierArms-Sales:
Originally Posted By mikecnorthwest:
Originally Posted By weaponoutfitters:


The problem is that for some of us (like us in WA state) state laws can be poorly written. According to WA state, if one has the option to use semi-auto specific parts, they must use it, LOL!



What WA state law says you have to use semi-auto specific parts? I can go to Rainier Arms and buy a full auto BCG over the counter, correct?


Correct!




The laws says that parts made solely and exclusively for use in machine guns are illegal. Only the fire control group fit's that definition.


This

And kudos to Rainier. I just walked in from putting my first rounds through my new AR10 upper from Rainier. Rainier assembles using Troy Battlerail. They did a great job. Thanks Rainier!

Link Posted: 5/30/2011 4:29:14 PM EST
Originally Posted By hertboi2010:
The same company that made the Rainier BCGs made Dennys BCGs. I have used Rainier Products before specifically their uppers and I have never had a bad experience with them. For the price range I would say it is a solid BCG. I have ran DSA, Rock River, LMT, Young MFG N/M and JP stainless tactical BCGs and I have never experienced a malfunction from any of them. Clean em dry and shoot em wet and you should be good with the Rainier. Dont be afraid to go outside of what people say on here. Not knocking anyone that believes in colt; but I dont buy into all of the Colt hype. They do have longevity in the AR buisness but it is also 2011 and manufacturers are able to build quality components.


Ive ran Dennys super duty bolts real hard and they work great, but i would be comfortable with lots of different brands

you would be surprised with how many companies out there are actually towing the line when in comes to .mil spec standards

Spikes
LMT
Daniel Defense
Dennys Super Duty
Rainier Arms
BCM
Noveske
LaRue
Colt

there's lots of options, all of these i would feel perfectly comfortable taking to a 1000+ round carbine class
Link Posted: 6/2/2011 12:09:06 PM EST
[Last Edit: 6/2/2011 12:18:31 PM EST by camoman33935]
Well the UPS guy decided to drop off a little present today...my BCM Upper!

Specs:
BCM 16" M4 upper
Magpul MOE handguards
Magpul MBUS rear sight
Rainier Arms BCG
WOA Charging Handle
Stag Arms lower reciever
DPMS LPK
ACE Skeleton stock

Since this thread was about the Rainier Arms BCG I'll go ahead and state that it seems like a high quality BCG. It was a little stiff when I got it but I cleaned it and lubed it up with some CLP. It loosened up a little bit but not too much. I'm sure it'll loosen up after firing it a little.


Here's a pic of it all put together let me know what yall think. I'm thinking of replacing the ACE stock with a Magpul MOE stock.

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