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strawberrybill
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Posted: 9/23/2008 2:12:12 AM
After my brother saw my new Bushmaster he wanted one but couldn't afford it so he is looking at the DPMS Sportical. Any opinions?
Aimless
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Posted: 9/23/2008 4:49:12 AM
[Last Edit: 9/23/2008 4:51:43 AM by Aimless]
DPMS doesn't have the greatest reputation for reliability. suppose it depends on whether it'sa potential self defense gun or a shoot beer cans once in awhile gun. Personally I don't care for carbines with no front sight and the lack of a dust cover could be an issue depending on what he wants it for



I do like the barrel profile. No brass deflector either I'm guessing not chrome lined
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SoloTwo
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Posted: 9/23/2008 2:22:24 PM
Probably in the top 5 list of worst looking factory AR's.
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Aimless
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Posted: 9/23/2008 6:45:49 PM
[Last Edit: 9/23/2008 6:48:01 PM by Aimless]

Originally Posted By SoloTwo:
Probably in the top 5 list of worst looking factory AR's.


Hard to top the tuber



Or the Panther Pump

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SoloTwo
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Posted: 9/23/2008 7:10:54 PM
Ok, 3rd?
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dpmsguy
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Posted: 9/23/2008 7:14:36 PM
I have one and love it. It will shoot the following groups at 100 yards from Steadyrest.
XM193--1 1/2''
HSM V-max--1 1/2"
Am Eagle 55 fmj--1"
BH 55 fmj--1 1/4"
PMC--1 1/2"

I feel it is a great gun. More than what the price indicates.

Jimmy_Hoffa
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Posted: 9/23/2008 7:58:58 PM

Originally Posted By Aimless:
DPMS doesn't have the greatest reputation for reliability. suppose it depends on whether it'sa potential self defense gun or a shoot beer cans once in awhile gun. Personally I don't care for carbines with no front sight and the lack of a dust cover could be an issue depending on what he wants it for

www.dpmsinc.com/firearms/image.aspx?id=91&type=large

I do like the barrel profile. No brass deflector either I'm guessing not chrome lined

I am surprised that you, site staff, would bash DPMS, they obviously pay good money to advertise here (see DPMS icon above).

Anyways, I just finished a build using the same upper receiver and a lot of other DPMS parts. I like DPMS, I've never had a problem with there quality, however I handled one of those "pardus" stocks on a carbine at a show last week, it was so tight on the tube that I, a 200 pound body builder, had to use a lot of effort to extend it after I pushed it in. Others have reported them being loose, go figure.

As long as he gets the Sportical for a good price, it's a good gun.

BTW, I always wanted a tuber and was sadened to hear they had discontinued it before I could buy one.
SoloTwo
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Posted: 9/23/2008 9:31:57 PM

Originally Posted By Jimmy_Hoffa:
I am surprised that you, site staff, would bash DPMS, they obviously pay good money to advertise here (see DPMS icon above).


LOL, so you're saying that since they are a sponsor the site staff should give them nothing but praise?

Btw how many shots where in those groups.
"He hates these cans! Stay away from the cans!"

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M1911A15
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Posted: 9/23/2008 9:38:59 PM
height=8
Originally Posted By SoloTwo:
height=8
Originally Posted By Jimmy_Hoffa:
I am surprised that you, site staff, would bash DPMS, they obviously pay good money to advertise here (see DPMS icon above).hat
Btw how many shots where in those groups.


Maybe they should just not make comment either way....
SoloTwo
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Posted: 9/23/2008 9:55:26 PM

Originally Posted By M1911A15:

Originally Posted By SoloTwo:

Originally Posted By Jimmy_Hoffa:
I am surprised that you, site staff, would bash DPMS, they obviously pay good money to advertise here (see DPMS icon above).


LOL, so you're saying that since they are a sponsor the site staff should give them nothing but praise?

Btw how many shots where in those groups.


Maybe they should just not make comment either way....


Why?
"He hates these cans! Stay away from the cans!"

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Jimmy_Hoffa
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Posted: 9/23/2008 10:03:12 PM

Originally Posted By SoloTwo:

Originally Posted By M1911A15:

Originally Posted By SoloTwo:

Originally Posted By Jimmy_Hoffa:
I am surprised that you, site staff, would bash DPMS, they obviously pay good money to advertise here (see DPMS icon above).


LOL, so you're saying that since they are a sponsor the site staff should give them nothing but praise?

Btw how many shots where in those groups.


Maybe they should just not make comment either way....


Why?

Why take their money and let them advertise here if the people who own/run the site think their product sucks? I call hipocrit. I'm just saying, I'd be pissed if I spent that kind of money just to have site staff stear folks away from my product.
M1911A15
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Posted: 9/23/2008 10:11:10 PM
height=8
Originally Posted By Jimmy_Hoffa:
height=8
Originally Posted By SoloTwo:
height=8
Originally Posted By M1911A15:
height=8
Originally Posted By SoloTwo:
height=8
Originally Posted By Jimmy_Hoffa:
I am surprised that you, site staff, would bash DPMS, they obviously pay good money to advertise here (see DPMS icon above).hat
Btw how many shots where in those groups.


Maybe they should just not make comment either way....


Why?

Why take their money and let them advertise here if the people who own/run the site think their product sucks?hipocrit. I'm just saying, I'd be pissed if I spent that kind of money just to have site staff stear folks away from my product.


Agreed. And if they said that it's the best there is, no one would give it much creedence because of the advertising dollars being earned. The best thing would to be diplomatic and not make comment either way. They have a right to their opinion, of course, but it would be better left unsaid.
curiomatic
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Posted: 9/23/2008 10:19:40 PM
The current issue of AMERICAN RIFLEMAN has a write-up on the sportical. I'd advise him to save up some more money and buy an AR with a forged milspec upper. That BCG needs a dust cover.
accordingtoome
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Posted: 10/27/2008 5:59:34 PM
I just picked up one this weekend at the Gun show.. I walked past it three times but I kept coming back. I just could not pass up the price. I was out the door for under 701.00 with 2 extra 30 round mags. To tell you the truth I think this rifle is amazing.. not a flaw, blemish anywhere. Inside and out it looks like solid shooter.. I just hope it shoots as good as it looks. It was exactly what I was looking for.
arwolve10
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Posted: 10/29/2008 12:08:47 AM
I own one couldn't pass up the price works flawlessly wish it had a dust cover.
Prophet67
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Posted: 1/8/2009 7:27:05 PM
[Last Edit: 1/8/2009 7:28:52 PM by Prophet67]
I have one on lay-away at my local gun store and my bro purchased one outright at the same time. We went and shot it the following weekend and it's a nice firearm for the price. It will be my first AR style rifle and I view it as what they advertise it as: an entry-level AR. It is very accurate and great for home self defense. As far as the lack of a shell deflector is concerned, it ejected well out from the face of the shooter in fact, it ejects it a little farther than I would like but I figure I'll just trim the ejector spring a little and fix that. Don't wanna go "treasure hunting" for my brass if ya know what I mean! lol

As for the lack of a dust cover, I can't speak to that yet as I am just entering AR scene as I said before but really, if I am gonna trudge thru the wilderness in end-times or something then that's what My AK's are for. For a fun shooting gun at an entry level price I would say go for it! My plan is to get it and possibly at a later date get the 6.8 upper IF Obama-Lama-Ding-dong doesn't make the new AWB the first thing he put's his chicken scratch on. I only plan on using it for target and maybe a little hog hunting. Also, tell him that Scottsdale gun club's online store is selling AP4's for $999.00 http://www.sgcusa.com/
Good luck to all of us in the coming Year...God know's were gonna need it.
accordingtoome
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Posted: 5/19/2009 1:24:08 PM
Just to come back to this subject real quick. i have taken this out 3 times shooting and its been a dream to shoot. 400 rounds of dirty wolf ammo and not a single mishap. i would like a dust cover but i really don't miss it.
BUDUKO
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Posted: 5/19/2009 1:41:38 PM
Tell him to look for the DPMS M4 clone, they're out there, check RGUNS, they maybe instock.

To tell you the truth, thats more of a plinking rifle, at least with the clone he''ll feel that he has a more rounded rifle and wont worry about little bs that'll bug him like the dust cover.

Are those models supposed to contend with BMs carbon line?
dryroasted
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Posted: 5/19/2009 2:57:01 PM
I have a dpms M4 clone ( I guess that is what you would call it )
shoots everything I feed it ..... has been a great rifle
BUDUKO
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Posted: 5/19/2009 3:39:10 PM
Originally Posted By dryroasted:
I have a dpms M4 clone ( I guess that is what you would call it )shoots everything I feed it ..... has been a great rifle


Well, ever since hearing about Colt and their "Don't f*cking call that M4 looking thing an M4" deal, I've been trying to walk a fine line. I thought I heard that it was settled but I keep reading post where owners describe theirs as M4gereys. So, I don't know, all I know is, I don't want Colts Gestapo coming to my house and breaking things and intimidating me like Bill Gates did to Homer in that one episodes of the Simpsons.
dmhays
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Posted: 5/19/2009 4:00:38 PM
Originally Posted By Jimmy_Hoffa:
Originally Posted By Aimless:
DPMS doesn't have the greatest reputation for reliability. suppose it depends on whether it'sa potential self defense gun or a shoot beer cans once in awhile gun. Personally I don't care for carbines with no front sight and the lack of a dust cover could be an issue depending on what he wants it for

www.dpmsinc.com/firearms/image.aspx?id=91&type=large

I do like the barrel profile. No brass deflector either I'm guessing not chrome lined

I am surprised that you, site staff, would bash DPMS, they obviously pay good money to advertise here (see DPMS icon above).

Anyways, I just finished a build using the same upper receiver and a lot of other DPMS parts. I like DPMS, I've never had a problem with there quality, however I handled one of those "pardus" stocks on a carbine at a show last week, it was so tight on the tube that I, a 200 pound body builder, had to use a lot of effort to extend it after I pushed it in. Others have reported them being loose, go figure.

As long as he gets the Sportical for a good price, it's a good gun.

BTW, I always wanted a tuber and was sadened to hear they had discontinued it before I could buy one.



I dont think aimless was "bashing" dpms at all. He was simply giving the op some things to keep in mind if he is interested in one. The fact that it is a very entry level AR without a front sight, shell deflector, or dust cover can be deal breakers to some. I used to own a DPMS and had very few problems with it, but it still had more problems with it than any of my others. It is fine for a paper puncher but I would never use a DPMS for self defense because I simply dont trust them enough. I would much rather spend the extra few hundred bucks for an RRA or S&W. Of course, I would also rather pay a few hundred bucks more than the RRA and get an lmt or colt too. It all just depends on what the AR will be used for. With the sportical, you really dont have any room to grow with it. It is so basic, that once you want to graduate to more than just shooting targets, it has reached its full potential and its time to get something new. If you go with something like the RRA, you can use it for target practice and you can use it for self/home defense. Once you get into the colts/lmts/noveskes, they will pretty much do anything you need them to (within the limits of a firearm). Sportical is not worth it imo.

For the record, I dont think you should be able to scrutinize site staff when you aren't even a paying member of this site yourself
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Poincianacab
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Posted: 5/19/2009 6:55:56 PM
Perhaps he like me is not a member because of all the crap that comes from a lot of members and bashing done on the sight unless it is a RRA. No doubt the sportical will do just fine for what it is intended for. Ive seen crap from just about all the makers but just try to bash RRA and see what happens. If you think they are the bee's knee's just look at the sticky http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=66&t=282974 and ask why are so many people still having the problem yet no one seems to want to bring it up in the AR discussion forum but tuck it away in a sticky.So you and all you sycophants keep loving your RRA overpriced toys.
Malf
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Posted: 5/19/2009 7:10:39 PM
Originally Posted By dmhays:
Originally Posted By Jimmy_Hoffa:
Originally Posted By Aimless:
DPMS doesn't have the greatest reputation for reliability. suppose it depends on whether it'sa potential self defense gun or a shoot beer cans once in awhile gun. Personally I don't care for carbines with no front sight and the lack of a dust cover could be an issue depending on what he wants it for

www.dpmsinc.com/firearms/image.aspx?id=91&type=large

I do like the barrel profile. No brass deflector either I'm guessing not chrome lined

I am surprised that you, site staff, would bash DPMS, they obviously pay good money to advertise here (see DPMS icon above).

Anyways, I just finished a build using the same upper receiver and a lot of other DPMS parts. I like DPMS, I've never had a problem with there quality, however I handled one of those "pardus" stocks on a carbine at a show last week, it was so tight on the tube that I, a 200 pound body builder, had to use a lot of effort to extend it after I pushed it in. Others have reported them being loose, go figure.

As long as he gets the Sportical for a good price, it's a good gun.

BTW, I always wanted a tuber and was sadened to hear they had discontinued it before I could buy one.



I dont think aimless was "bashing" dpms at all. He was simply giving the op some things to keep in mind if he is interested in one. The fact that it is a very entry level AR without a front sight, shell deflector, or dust cover can be deal breakers to some. I used to own a DPMS and had very few problems with it, but it still had more problems with it than any of my others. It is fine for a paper puncher but I would never use a DPMS for self defense because I simply dont trust them enough. I would much rather spend the extra few hundred bucks for an RRA or S&W. Of course, I would also rather pay a few hundred bucks more than the RRA and get an lmt or colt too. It all just depends on what the AR will be used for. With the sportical, you really dont have any room to grow with it. It is so basic, that once you want to graduate to more than just shooting targets, it has reached its full potential and its time to get something new. If you go with something like the RRA, you can use it for target practice and you can use it for self/home defense. Once you get into the colts/lmts/noveskes, they will pretty much do anything you need them to (within the limits of a firearm). Sportical is not worth it imo.

For the record, I dont think you should be able to scrutinize site staff when you aren't even a paying member of this site yourself


How is the sporticle so basic that you after shooting targets it's reached its full potential? I really would like to know seeing as DPMS sells the upper on its own and quite a few people around here have posted pics of rifles built with them. Last time I checked it was just as modular as a upper with a dust cover and forward assist. For $700 it's a good deal IMO, and you could upgrade the bolt, bolt carrier, barrel, etc as need be and still come in at a respectable rate. Not everyone needs or wants a colt/lmt/noveske (granted they are very nice) and just because it's an entry level model doesn't mean it's a pos and can't be upgraded.

dmhays
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Posted: 5/19/2009 8:21:12 PM
Originally Posted By Poincianacab:
Perhaps he like me is not a member because of all the crap that comes from a lot of members and bashing done on the sight unless it is a RRA. No doubt the sportical will do just fine for what it is intended for. Ive seen crap from just about all the makers but just try to bash RRA and see what happens. If you think they are the bee's knee's just look at the sticky http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=66&t=282974 and ask why are so many people still having the problem yet no one seems to want to bring it up in the AR discussion forum but tuck it away in a sticky.So you and all you sycophants keep loving your RRA overpriced toys.


I absolutely agree and I am in NO WAY an RRA fanboy. I am actually the opposite. I think RRA makes some quality stuff, but the fanboys are the exact reason I don't own one. I've heard so much crap about rra's "fit and finish" I wanna puke. With that being said, I still think RRA makes higher quality stuff than DPMS. If anything qualifies as a "toy" i would think the sportical would fit that perfectly. I know my dpms panther lite fit that category. That's why it got traded for something better.
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accordingtoome
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Posted: 5/19/2009 8:32:31 PM
You know i was watching the Magpul DVD AOTTC and those guys are running some high end stuff, bling bling optics, good ammo.... and i did see a few stovepipes and jams, misfeeds, double feeds, whatever. I have taken my sportical out and run some crap through it as well as match grade stuff and so far,, NADA a problem.. my round count i think is around 800 or so. For a Cheap rifle i think this is a deal and a half.
dmhays
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Posted: 5/19/2009 8:43:16 PM
Originally Posted By Malf:
Originally Posted By dmhays:
Originally Posted By Jimmy_Hoffa:
Originally Posted By Aimless:
DPMS doesn't have the greatest reputation for reliability. suppose it depends on whether it'sa potential self defense gun or a shoot beer cans once in awhile gun. Personally I don't care for carbines with no front sight and the lack of a dust cover could be an issue depending on what he wants it for

www.dpmsinc.com/firearms/image.aspx?id=91&type=large

I do like the barrel profile. No brass deflector either I'm guessing not chrome lined

I am surprised that you, site staff, would bash DPMS, they obviously pay good money to advertise here (see DPMS icon above).

Anyways, I just finished a build using the same upper receiver and a lot of other DPMS parts. I like DPMS, I've never had a problem with there quality, however I handled one of those "pardus" stocks on a carbine at a show last week, it was so tight on the tube that I, a 200 pound body builder, had to use a lot of effort to extend it after I pushed it in. Others have reported them being loose, go figure.

As long as he gets the Sportical for a good price, it's a good gun.

BTW, I always wanted a tuber and was sadened to hear they had discontinued it before I could buy one.



I dont think aimless was "bashing" dpms at all. He was simply giving the op some things to keep in mind if he is interested in one. The fact that it is a very entry level AR without a front sight, shell deflector, or dust cover can be deal breakers to some. I used to own a DPMS and had very few problems with it, but it still had more problems with it than any of my others. It is fine for a paper puncher but I would never use a DPMS for self defense because I simply dont trust them enough. I would much rather spend the extra few hundred bucks for an RRA or S&W. Of course, I would also rather pay a few hundred bucks more than the RRA and get an lmt or colt too. It all just depends on what the AR will be used for. With the sportical, you really dont have any room to grow with it. It is so basic, that once you want to graduate to more than just shooting targets, it has reached its full potential and its time to get something new. If you go with something like the RRA, you can use it for target practice and you can use it for self/home defense. Once you get into the colts/lmts/noveskes, they will pretty much do anything you need them to (within the limits of a firearm). Sportical is not worth it imo.

For the record, I dont think you should be able to scrutinize site staff when you aren't even a paying member of this site yourself


How is the sporticle so basic that you after shooting targets it's reached its full potential? I really would like to know seeing as DPMS sells the upper on its own and quite a few people around here have posted pics of rifles built with them. Last time I checked it was just as modular as a upper with a dust cover and forward assist. For $700 it's a good deal IMO, and you could upgrade the bolt, bolt carrier, barrel, etc as need be and still come in at a respectable rate. Not everyone needs or wants a colt/lmt/noveske (granted they are very nice) and just because it's an entry level model doesn't mean it's a pos and can't be upgraded.



I'm sorry, but once you upgrade the bolt, bolt carrier, barrel, etc... it is no longer the same gun. I am talking about the $700 factory platform. Once you start upgrading all that shit, then its the same as trading it up for something better. I would never drop 4 or 500 bucks on upgrading an entry level dpms when you could just buy an LMT to begin with. I will refine my original statement. The sportical is so basic that once you want to graduate from just shooting targets, it's current state has reached its full potential and its time to either get something new or upgrade all the important parts. The sportical is only worth it if it is being used for a target gun only.

"Whether you are buying your first AR rifle, or need an affordable yet accurate plinking gun, the Panther “Sportical”™ is for you." -straight from the DPMS website. Maybe you should just argue with the designers as to its use
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