Site Notices
10/24/2014 2:42:22 PM
Author
Message
josho66
Offline
Posts: 180
Feedback: 100% (27)
Posted: 8/5/2010 4:22:47 PM
So I searched and didn't find anything here on the Spike's section. How do these install? I am building my first lower soon to be used with an ST-22 upper I have. I have never put together a lower before but I have seen how to do it and understand the basic idea. So how does this type of stock get installed to the lower? Also do you have to have a special tax stamp to use this since it makes the rifle under 16" when folded?
HardShell
Just happy to be here!
Offline
Posts: 27287
Feedback: 100% (73)
Link To This Post
Posted: 8/5/2010 4:35:41 PM
[Last Edit: 8/6/2010 5:19:57 PM by HardShell]

Originally Posted By josho66:
... Also do you have to have a special tax stamp to use this since it makes the rifle under 16" when folded?

Rifle BBL has to be at least 16"; OAL has to be at least 26" (barring further-restrictive state laws, etc.).

With a 16" bbl'd upper your OAL will still be >26", even with this stock. ETA: Apparantly not –– see below!!!

As to installation, I'll try to scan/post the instructions tomorrow unless someone already has a scan of them handy and beats me to it.

I am a CHRISTIAN, a CONSERVATIVE, and a REPUBLICAN... in exactly that order, and completely without apology.
josho66
Offline
Posts: 182
Feedback: 100% (27)
Link To This Post
Posted: 8/5/2010 4:44:01 PM
Originally Posted By HardShell:

Originally Posted By josho66:
... Also do you have to have a special tax stamp to use this since it makes the rifle under 16" when folded?

Rifle BBL has to be at least 16"; OAL has to be at least 26" (barring further-restrictive state laws, etc.).

With a 16" bbl'd upper your OAL will still be >26", even with this stock.

As to installation, I'll try to scan/post the instructions tomorrow unless someone already has a scan of them handy and beats me to it.



Yeah that was a mistype. I know the barrel length has to be 16", I was trying to say the overall length. Sorry about that. Thanks for the answer about the overall length with the folding stock. That was my main concern. I would really appreciate the install instructions, just to see how it goes in. I assume it's not that hard to do, was just curious before I lay out the money for it. It would be good to have a copy of them on the forum too as I searched and didn't see any.

gotta-love-ny
Offline
Posts: 64
Feedback: 0% (0)
Link To This Post
Posted: 8/6/2010 1:41:32 AM
Just to be clear , OAL with this stock folded is less than 26" , this is ok ?
HardShell
Just happy to be here!
Offline
Posts: 27301
Feedback: 100% (73)
Link To This Post
Posted: 8/6/2010 5:19:10 PM
[Last Edit: 8/6/2010 5:20:27 PM by HardShell]

Originally Posted By gotta-love-ny:
Just to be clear , OAL with this stock folded is less than 26" , this is ok ?

No, that isn't okay.

I haven't mounted mine yet (thank goodness!) and didn't realize that –– I figured the Spike's would have a warning to that effect on the ad for the stock, knowing that their rimfire bbl is set further back into the upper than a std. AR upper configuration (i.e., it has a 16" bbl but some of that length is inside the upper rcvr, unlike a centerfire upper/bbl).

I guess I'll have to measure the length of my CZ-22 upper and see if it is long enough to use with this side-folder without making my OAL too short.

I am a CHRISTIAN, a CONSERVATIVE, and a REPUBLICAN... in exactly that order, and completely without apology.
HardShell
Just happy to be here!
Offline
Posts: 27302
Feedback: 100% (73)
Link To This Post
Posted: 8/6/2010 6:24:12 PM
And here is the scan of the instruction sheet:



I am a CHRISTIAN, a CONSERVATIVE, and a REPUBLICAN... in exactly that order, and completely without apology.
gotta-love-ny
Offline
Posts: 65
Feedback: 0% (0)
Link To This Post
Posted: 8/6/2010 11:08:34 PM
So buy a st22 upper w/ fake can, folding stock and get a felony free !? Anyone have a idea how to make these work ? How is the barrel mounted further into the upper? With a flamming pig on the barrel it's over 26" but does not look as good as the fake can. Is there a fake can that can extend OAL 2.25 " - 2.5 " ?
SiVisPacem
Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum
Military
Offline
Posts: 520
Feedback: 100% (132)
Link To This Post
Posted: 8/7/2010 1:13:43 AM
The OAL is measured with the stock in the fully extended position, as far as Federal gun laws are concerned. Now, if you lived in Michigan, you would have to worry about the OAL with the stock collapsed or folded.

ATF doesn't care how short the rifle is with the stock folded, as long as it is more than 26" with the stock unfolded and extended. It doesn't even matter that the rifle can be fired with the stock folded.
If you want peace, prepare for war.

Ne desit virtus. - Let valor not fail.
josho66
Offline
Posts: 184
Feedback: 100% (27)
Link To This Post
Posted: 8/7/2010 9:57:58 PM
Originally Posted By SiVisPacem:
The OAL is measured with the stock in the fully extended position, as far as Federal gun laws are concerned. Now, if you lived in Michigan, you would have to worry about the OAL with the stock collapsed or folded.

ATF doesn't care how short the rifle is with the stock folded, as long as it is more than 26" with the stock unfolded and extended. It doesn't even matter that the rifle can be fired with the stock folded.


Not being disrespectful, but can someone confirm this? I just want to make sure I have the right info before I order and install this stock.
botld92z
Offline
Posts: 21
Feedback: 0% (0)
Link To This Post
Posted: 8/8/2010 1:45:48 AM
Originally Posted By josho66:
Originally Posted By SiVisPacem:
The OAL is measured with the stock in the fully extended position, as far as Federal gun laws are concerned. Now, if you lived in Michigan, you would have to worry about the OAL with the stock collapsed or folded.

ATF doesn't care how short the rifle is with the stock folded, as long as it is more than 26" with the stock unfolded and extended. It doesn't even matter that the rifle can be fired with the stock folded.


Not being disrespectful, but can someone confirm this? I just want to make sure I have the right info before I order and install this stock.


According to Wikipedia

Short barreled rifles (SBRs) - this category includes any firearm with a buttstock and either a rifled barrel under 16" long or an overall length under 26". The overall length is measured with any folding or collapsing stocks in the extended position. The category also includes firearms which came from the factory with a buttstock that was later removed by a third party.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Firearms_Act

Also from here

http://forum.pafoa.org/nfa-class-3-title-ii-34/20540-sbrd-ar15-brief-guide-my-experience.html

Box 4f. Overall length – if there is a collapsible stock this should be OPEN when measuring


From another wikipedia article

Overall length is measured between the extreme ends of the gun, along a centerline which passes through the middle of the barrel. For rifles fitted with folding or telescoping stocks (such as U.S. Carbine M1A1), US Federal guidelines state that measurement is made with the stock unfolded as intended for use as a rifle; exception is made for rifles with easily detachable shoulder stocks, which shall be measured with shoulder stock detached. Some states such as California measure overall length with the stock folded.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Short_barreled_rifle
ODS9091
Offline
Posts: 267
Feedback: 100% (8)
Link To This Post
Posted: 8/8/2010 9:28:46 AM
Look in here

Originally Posted By Stan_TheGunNut:
Revised 10/17/09 to provide hot links.

4f: State the overall length in inches. Obviously this will depend on barrel length and the type of stock you have. The measurement is made with the collapsible stock fully extended.

Lastly, you can click here for all the forms you'll ever need for NFA stuff that are available in a pdf format that you can fill in and print. This includes the paperwork to take a SBR out of state. The link is to the ATF website so all the forms should be current. The Form 1, Form 4, and others are near the middle of the page.
ATF Forms



ImpacTT
Offline
Posts: 52
Feedback: 100% (28)
Link To This Post
Posted: 8/9/2010 11:01:19 PM
how about some pics ?
JoshAston
'Course, that ain't exactly Plan A
Military
Offline
Posts: 7563
Feedback: 100% (30)
Link To This Post
Posted: 8/9/2010 11:12:27 PM
Some states require OAL to be measured with the stock folded, but federal law states that it's to be fully extended.
Remember, Remember, the 5th of November