User Panel
Posted: 2/29/2012 12:50:08 PM EDT
I own a small shop that custom builds ARs and Uppers for people as well as NFA items. I placed a $1650.00 parts order on 2/23 with Del-Ton, I called to check and make sure each item was in stock. Once I had confirmed each item was in stock I hit the submit button on my internet order. The morning of 2/28 morning I get the following email for Del-ton:
Hi, We are sorry, but at this time rifle parts are back ordered indefinitely. We can keep your order on back order if you wish, however we cannot give any time frame on when it may be shipped. We are sorry for any inconvenience. The items that are available for shipment on this order include the lower receivers, sling swivel and rivet. Please let me know if you would like for me to send available items. Thanks, Del-Ton Inc. I called Del-ton (2/28) to see what had caused the back ordered. I was told that that on 2/27 Del-tons Higher ups had held a sales meeting and decided to halt shipment of parts orders that had been placed but not processed so that Distributor demand for complete rifles could be met. After a long conversation with a very nice woman who answers the phones I was told that out of my $1650 order they could send the $0.20 front swivel rivet and nothing else, not even the lowers. I had already ordered another $600 worth of parts that Del-ton does not carry form a different seller to complete the uppers I needed to build for our customers. I decided to cancel the order rather than sit on a permit back order list for the parts that I needed this week. The same parts I was told " Yes everything on your list is in stock, the parts will ship out soon, they just need to process the order which takes at least a few days". During my phone call on 2/28 I was told the Distributors have priority, which I can understand, to a certain extent. What I cannot understand or believe is that Del-ton would do this to their other customers who already have standing orders and a history of buying from them in the past. I own a small shop that does custom builds, that order was for parts that were going to some of my companies' customers who were expecting a finished product by a certain date. A date that was given to our customers after I talked with Del-ton and after I was told that we would have the parts in our shop shortly thereafter. I spent yesterday on the phone with many distributors trying to get the parts in time for us meet the dead line with our customers. I cannot even begin to tell you how disappoint and annoyed we are with Del-ton pulling the rug out from under us after taking our order for parts that were in stock ready to ship. I could understand taking back orders from the day of the sales meeting forward on new orders. But to put existing orders on indefinite back order after telling us these item were in stock ready to ship is not acceptable. Our business was counting on their word that the parts would be here. We choose to cancel the order. I asked the very nice lady who answered the phone call to share our extremely disappointed feelings with the higher ups at Del-ton. Clearly the decision was not her fault and she was very professional and nice to talk with which I want to point out to her credit. I also explained that we would not be purchasing anything from them again. I just wanted to share how little Del-ton seems to care about their repeat customers. We have had good dealings in the past with Del-Ton, but we are dissapointed in them now. |
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Honestly, sit back and weigh how much you spend with Delton every year and how much their distributors likely spend every year. Tell me which you think is the better business choice to make.... I'm not saying it's right thing to do, but probably the best choice in a shitty situation.
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Enigna,
I understand the need to take care of the distributors, im sure that is very important customer to take of. I am just really disappointed that they thought it was ok to do that to us. We surly are not a big shop but most places would not treat any customer like that. |
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Quoted:
Enigna, I understand the need to take care of the distributors, im sure that is very important customer to take of. I am just really disappointed that they thought it was ok to do that to us. We surly are not a big shop but most places would not treat any customer like that. Sometimes it's a Catch-22. Especially when it comes to parts shortages, there's only so many parts to fill all the orders with, someone is getting screwed and whoever is getting screwed will probably take their business elsewhere, better it be the shop that only spends a few thousand a year vs the shop that spends tens of thousands a year. I really doubt they *want* to screw you, but they had to screw someone and made the hard call. |
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We apologize for having to do this. We plan it to be only temporary. We prefer to offer US made milspec parts and if we must wait a little while to offer a quality product we will. We will not settle for foreign made parts just to make an extra buck. Our demands are extremely high right now due to recent SHOT Show, distributor demands, and it being election year. I think many remember how Nov. 5, 2008 was and are preparing earlier. We are a rifle manufacturer, so rifles come first. We have learned of shortages with raw materials and we are preparing for it by backordering parts that are needed to complete rifles.
We hate that we have to cut back small parts and certain builds due to demands. We hope that you understand and we hope that this is only very temporary until the supply meets demands better. Sorry for the inconvenience. Laura |
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What are expected lead times for complete rifles and complete uppers right now?
I placed a small parts order two weeks ago and I am wondering when I should put in my order for the upper. |
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I just sent an email to cancel my order.. 1 week is enough.. now parts are showing not in stock..
I ordered all the same parts for like $15 higher and they shipped same day from another supplier.. |
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I don't want this to sound like I'm jumping on the complaint band wagon too, but I have tried to contact Del-Ton via their Chat feature twice and I waited over 45 mins waiting for someone to answer, yet the system said I was next. I read the post about that Megan was the only one that handled Chat, yet when I replied "I doubt it." to the canned system response of "We are sorry for the delay" or similar, Megan sent a reply of "I'm sorry", but never answered my question.
I tried calling and it went to voicemail so I emailed almost 4 days ago and haven't received a response yet. My issue is minor and can probably be resolved in a minute or two, but I have been trying for 2 weeks or so to get this resolved. I understand about being busy, but at some point an additional or temporary investment in customer service may be required. GP |
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Quoted:
Honestly, sit back and weigh how much you spend with Delton every year and how much their distributors likely spend every year. Tell me which you think is the better business choice to make.... I'm not saying it's right thing to do, but probably the best choice in a shitty situation. Lying to customers, even if they are not your biggest or best, is not a way to run a business properly. I take notice of businesses that do that here and put them on my never buy from them list. |
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Beware Delton. The quality of your weapons was always up for vigorous debate on the forums and every discussion seemed to end in very positive reviews.
One thing that was never in doubt was your 100% grade on customer service. Unfortunately this issue will travel like wildfire on the forums and could possibly lead to a "CS down grade". While mechanical issues can be easily rectified, customer service can only be earned through an extended period of time but lost almost immediately. While high volumne dealer sales are attractive in the short span please don't forget your bread-an-butter who will also buy from these dealers or directly from you........or not. |
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So I'm guessing the upper receiver I ordered on 2/25 ain't coming any time soon.
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I don't mind Del-ton meeting a demand with the distributors. Business is about making money but it pisses me off that they took our order while telling me "yes we have that In stock and will ship it out to you" only to come back a basically say "we have the stuff you ordered and that we promised you but we are giving it to someone more important".
I have made a point to cross post this on many forum sites and to date the threads have been viewed about 4500 times Some of which have over 40 responses. I am seeing a pattern of many people saying they are not surprised by Del-ton throwing customers under the bus and they are taking the opportunity to tell others about their disappointing orders from Del-ton. I have to wonder how many people have parts on order with Del-ton who will not see the parts they ordered due to the sudden "back order" of parts that are actually on hand? Considering there is a thread 5 pages long in this forum of people asking "where's my order" maybe I shouldn't have been so surprised when Del-ton failed to deliver. |
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Quoted:
I own a small shop that custom builds ARs and Uppers for people as well as NFA items. I placed a $1650.00 parts order on 2/23 with Del-Ton.... Time to establish a relationship with CMT or other industry suppliers. Using Delton parts certainly will not help your percieved brand value. |
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We do apologize that we have had to back order some of our items. We did this after much careful consideration on our end. As I'm sure many of you know, the industry has gone nuts. We've both seen, and heard from various outlets that things are already much busier than they were in 2008 when Obama got elected. We have also changed the way our rifles are distributed within the past few weeks. Between both of things things, the influx of orders has been phenomenal. We had much deliberation, and decided to back order the small part components that go into our rifles. We have back ordered all open orders we had for them, and marked them all out of stock on our dealer web site. This was done so we can keep up the production of our rifles, as well as uppers and rifle kits that are on order, on our retail, dealer and distributor side. We feel like this is the best move, both for our business and for our customers as well. It was a hard decision to make because we do know that these dealers are the foundation of our business, but to keep the majority of parts shipping we feel it was what needed to be done. If we continued to ship all orders that had yet to be shipped, and continue to take more orders we would rapidly deplete our inventory and be unable to fulfill the rifle kit, upper and rifle orders that we've got. We have increased our orders for these small parts, but our suppliers cannot ramp up production to where we need overnight. We anticipate our supply loosening up within the next month or two, and as soon as that happens, the parts will be available on our site to start shipping again.
We feel that we've done everything we can on our end to keep our customer service at an exemplary level. It has been a hard decision to make, and not an easy one to convey to our customers. But, we have tried to let everyone know as soon as we can what will not be shipping ASAP so they can either back order the items or find them somewhere else. The parts are in stock, and when the customer called, we did have every intention of shipping them, but as happens sometimes, things change on a dime. When this happens, we do our best to let our customers know as soon as possible. As always, we have people to answer the phones during our normal business hours, and we answer all of our emails within a few days. We also have live chat available on our web site during business hours, but we realize this has become a little bit of a bottleneck. When we first started, one person to handle it was plenty, but not anymore. We're working on getting more people up and running with that so wait times are not as long, and Megan does not have 6 chats going, in addition to answering the phones. We are also working 6 days a week, 12 hour days to get your orders out, and are in the process of hiring more people to keep up with the increased demand. We do appreciate each and every order we receive, and thank you all for your patience. We will do our best to get supply back up to where the demand is and keep your orders coming out as fast as we can. Please feel free to call or email with any questions. Tony |
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AR15fan,
We do deal with CMT /STAG as well as many others, Del-ton parts where used to do "budget builds" for customers who are more interested in price then if it was built from the best quality parts. Often those builds are bare bones, Standard HGs, non chrome lined barrels, phosphate bolts rather then Chrome or Nickle Boron, these guns are directed at the budget minded shooters. We are upfront with people and explain the differance between "budget" and "quality preformance" builds and the parts that go into each parts. I understand what your say I see how it many not look the best to be using Delton parts, but they where only used on the low dollar stuff. If you walk in the shop and ask for a "nice rifle" theres alot of options out there for the parts that we can use. Certain parts fit the needs of certain customers, while other customers want / need name brand parts. |
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Quoted:
As always, we have people to answer the phones during our normal business hours, and we answer all of our emails within a few days. Tony 5 days and 19 hours since I sent my email...you saw my post and no email or IM. I'm seriously thinking of sending it back so you can give it to one of your distributors. Complete lip service. |
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Quoted:
We do apologize that we have had to back order some of our items. We did this after much careful consideration on our end. As I'm sure many of you know, the industry has gone nuts. We've both seen, and heard from various outlets that things are already much busier than they were in 2008 when Obama got elected. We have also changed the way our rifles are distributed within the past few weeks. Between both of things things, the influx of orders has been phenomenal. We had much deliberation, and decided to back order the small part components that go into our rifles. We have back ordered all open orders we had for them, and marked them all out of stock on our dealer web site. This was done so we can keep up the production of our rifles, as well as uppers and rifle kits that are on order, on our retail, dealer and distributor side. We feel like this is the best move, both for our business and for our customers as well. It was a hard decision to make because we do know that these dealers are the foundation of our business, but to keep the majority of parts shipping we feel it was what needed to be done. If we continued to ship all orders that had yet to be shipped, and continue to take more orders we would rapidly deplete our inventory and be unable to fulfill the rifle kit, upper and rifle orders that we've got. We have increased our orders for these small parts, but our suppliers cannot ramp up production to where we need overnight. We anticipate our supply loosening up within the next month or two, and as soon as that happens, the parts will be available on our site to start shipping again. We feel that we've done everything we can on our end to keep our customer service at an exemplary level. It has been a hard decision to make, and not an easy one to convey to our customers. But, we have tried to let everyone know as soon as we can what will not be shipping ASAP so they can either back order the items or find them somewhere else. The parts are in stock, and when the customer called, we did have every intention of shipping them, but as happens sometimes, things change on a dime. When this happens, we do our best to let our customers know as soon as possible. As always, we have people to answer the phones during our normal business hours, and we answer all of our emails within a few days. We also have live chat available on our web site during business hours, but we realize this has become a little bit of a bottleneck. When we first started, one person to handle it was plenty, but not anymore. We're working on getting more people up and running with that so wait times are not as long, and Megan does not have 6 chats going, in addition to answering the phones. We are also working 6 days a week, 12 hour days to get your orders out, and are in the process of hiring more people to keep up with the increased demand. We do appreciate each and every order we receive, and thank you all for your patience. We will do our best to get supply back up to where the demand is and keep your orders coming out as fast as we can. Please feel free to call or email with any questions. Tony The proper way to deal with it would be to stop accepting orders, fill the backlogged one's, build your firearms until demand is satisfied, and reopen the parts sales to customers. Anything less isn't customer service I would think is acceptable. |
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From MrM4
Del-ton parts where used to do "budget builds" for customers who are more interested in price then if it was built from the best quality parts
Your assumptions are foolish. I see you and your customers all the time. "I paid $1600 for this xyz....I know it will work" Did you not just see the post about a Colt failing after 100 rounds or the LMT that had a broken extractor by even less round count? Shit breaks. Get over yourself and your brand myopia. Does Del-Ton have issues sometimes? Sure, they had a bad batch of bolts come through but made it right if you had an issue. That's what matters. Sorry they had a policy switch that got you caught in a bad situation. It unfortunate but the association with cheap builds/poor quality is silly. |
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Quoted:
I don't mind Del-ton meeting a demand with the distributors. Business is about making money but it pisses me off that they took our order while telling me "yes we have that In stock and will ship it out to you" only to come back a basically say "we have the stuff you ordered and that we promised you but we are giving it to someone more important". That's a shit sandwich. People and businesses are only as good as their word. If your word is not good you are useless. Do not lie, do not steal, and do not tolerate those who do. |
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Quoted:
From MrM4 Del-ton parts where used to do "budget builds" for customers who are more interested in price then if it was built from the best quality parts
Your assumptions are foolish. I see you and your customers all the time. "I paid $1600 for this xyz....I know it will work" Did you not just see the post about a Colt failing after 100 rounds or the LMT that had a broken extractor by even less round count? Shit breaks. Get over yourself and your brand myopia. Does Del-Ton have issues sometimes? Sure, they had a bad batch of bolts come through but made it right if you had an issue. That's what matters. Sorry they had a policy switch that got you caught in a bad situation. It unfortunate but the association with cheap builds/poor quality is silly. I appreciate your responce, while I do not disagree that ANYTHING mechanical can fail, there is a differance in the quality and strength of parts from 1 manufacture to the next. To assume that all parts are the same is a bit naive |
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I appreciate your responce, while I do not disagree that ANYTHING mechanical can fail, there is a differance in the quality and strength of parts from 1 manufacture to the next. To assume that all parts are the same is a bit naive
Agreed. I think their can be differences. Those differences don't translate to anything but internet hype and beating your chest that you have the premium brand. I find the stratification of high or low end to be unhelpful at best. My Del-Ton bolt has the same damn steel, spec, and "MP" on it as anyone that has foolishly paid more because they want to be praised by their peers. Even when shit does break, who backs up their stuff? That's the better question. Hell, I even called in to Del-Ton and asked about my rear BUIS needed to be adjusted a touch to the left because maybe the FSB was canted. We talked about it, and they were like "send it in and we will make it right if it bothers you" I decided it doesn't matter because its not a functional issue. What more could you ask for from them for backing up their work? Sorry again you are having supply issues. I will again affirm that its bullshit you got cut off mid-order. I just took issue with the characterization that Del-Ton parts belong on your turd builds. Its pure silliness. Good luck. |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
We do apologize that we have had to back order some of our items. We did this after much careful consideration on our end. As I'm sure many of you know, the industry has gone nuts. We've both seen, and heard from various outlets that things are already much busier than they were in 2008 when Obama got elected. We have also changed the way our rifles are distributed within the past few weeks. Between both of things things, the influx of orders has been phenomenal. We had much deliberation, and decided to back order the small part components that go into our rifles. We have back ordered all open orders we had for them, and marked them all out of stock on our dealer web site. This was done so we can keep up the production of our rifles, as well as uppers and rifle kits that are on order, on our retail, dealer and distributor side. We feel like this is the best move, both for our business and for our customers as well. It was a hard decision to make because we do know that these dealers are the foundation of our business, but to keep the majority of parts shipping we feel it was what needed to be done. If we continued to ship all orders that had yet to be shipped, and continue to take more orders we would rapidly deplete our inventory and be unable to fulfill the rifle kit, upper and rifle orders that we've got. We have increased our orders for these small parts, but our suppliers cannot ramp up production to where we need overnight. We anticipate our supply loosening up within the next month or two, and as soon as that happens, the parts will be available on our site to start shipping again. We feel that we've done everything we can on our end to keep our customer service at an exemplary level. It has been a hard decision to make, and not an easy one to convey to our customers. But, we have tried to let everyone know as soon as we can what will not be shipping ASAP so they can either back order the items or find them somewhere else. The parts are in stock, and when the customer called, we did have every intention of shipping them, but as happens sometimes, things change on a dime. When this happens, we do our best to let our customers know as soon as possible. As always, we have people to answer the phones during our normal business hours, and we answer all of our emails within a few days. We also have live chat available on our web site during business hours, but we realize this has become a little bit of a bottleneck. When we first started, one person to handle it was plenty, but not anymore. We're working on getting more people up and running with that so wait times are not as long, and Megan does not have 6 chats going, in addition to answering the phones. We are also working 6 days a week, 12 hour days to get your orders out, and are in the process of hiring more people to keep up with the increased demand. We do appreciate each and every order we receive, and thank you all for your patience. We will do our best to get supply back up to where the demand is and keep your orders coming out as fast as we can. Please feel free to call or email with any questions. Tony The proper way to deal with it would be to stop accepting orders, fill the backlogged one's, build your firearms until demand is satisfied, and reopen the parts sales to customers. Anything less isn't customer service I would think is acceptable. Exactly this, you dont **** existing orders you set a drop dead date tof XX/YY and annouce that **** and let the chips fall where they may btu again its easier to just blame the Black Messiah than to simply to have responsive business model with staff that is lightly cross trained |
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Again, we do apologize this was the stance we had to take. I can assure you that it was not done to hurt or upset any of our dealers. We had to do what we felt was best for the company, even though it wasn't an easy decision or one that was liked. We are doing everything we can to ramp up production, supply and employees to keep up with the increased demand across the board.
Tony |
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