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Posted: 9/7/2014 2:00:10 PM EDT
[#1]
I have two rifles. One with a TLRs1 and the other TLR-HL the 630 is very bright. It reflects off my white walls and goes all over the place, including back into my face. At the range it lights up 100 yards like a champ. But my HD rifle is just the TLRs1 with its 300 lumens and I think its perfect.
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Posted: 9/7/2014 2:00:59 PM EDT
[#2]
I use the 630 lumen Streamlight (issued) on my duty pistol and the Surefire P2 Fury on my rifle and don't have any problems with "too bright". If anything, its more helpful in warehouse sized structures, but I haven't had any problems with them killing my vision in 500sq foot crack shacks.
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Posted: 9/7/2014 2:02:16 PM EDT
[#3]
I use a 600 and it can be a little bright bouncing off a white wall, but not to the point of affecting my vision. More lumens = more blinding power on your side too, as a secondary advantage. If I could get a car high beam mounted on my HD rifle I would do it. I think bright is better.
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Posted: 9/7/2014 2:09:48 PM EDT
[#4]
Thanks for the input guys. I have the Surefire M952V on my M16 which a great device, but it falls short in the field in brightness (including the IR setting). I'll keep it as is on the rifle only because it's a beast that can take a beating.
If I purchase a TLR it will be strictly for pistol application. |
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Posted: 9/7/2014 2:11:04 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thanks for the input guys. I have the Surefire M952V on my M16 which a great device, but it falls short in the field in brightness (including the IR setting). I'll keep it as is on the rifle only because it's a beast that can take a beating. If I purchase a TLR it will be strictly for pistol application. Whats wrong with one on a rifle. I feel the toggle is super natural on a rifle. |
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Posted: 9/7/2014 2:16:27 PM EDT
[#6]
While my experience is merely in training classes, I didn't find the X300 ultra to be too bright. Now it was a loaner I borrowed as my X300 was down for repair at the time.
I run the 170 lumen X300 on my pistol and 110 lumen M300A on my rifle and they work well for my needs though. But I'm not carrying them for my job so take my statements for what it's worth. If I were searching large areas regularly I would probably want a 500 lumen X300U or M600U. |
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Posted: 9/7/2014 2:21:31 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Whats wrong with one on a rifle. I feel the toggle is super natural on a rifle. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Thanks for the input guys. I have the Surefire M952V on my M16 which a great device, but it falls short in the field in brightness (including the IR setting). I'll keep it as is on the rifle only because it's a beast that can take a beating. If I purchase a TLR it will be strictly for pistol application. Whats wrong with one on a rifle. I feel the toggle is super natural on a rifle. Nothing wrong with it on my rifle per say, I'm just not in in the position to purchase more than one weapon light along with a new pair of boots and other assorted crap. Being rifle mounted, my Surefire has smacked a few rocks and trees with no issues. I'm not sure it the Streamlight is as robust. |
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Posted: 9/7/2014 2:31:09 PM EDT
[#8]
A lot probably has to do with your light sensitivity. I have a genetic defect of blue eyes which means I am very light sensitive. My 500 lumen Surefire can give me eye spots when flashed off a white wall in close quarters. YMMV.
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Posted: 9/7/2014 11:28:59 PM EDT
[#9]
As a general rule, IMO anything much over 200 lumens (assuming that the company measures lumens accurately) is probably too much for inside a house. I think 120-160 is about right for a weapon or smaller hand held light.
If you anticipate doing a lot of clearing duties outdoors or in large buildings like warehouses, then I would consider something higher than 200 but not much higher. |
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Posted: 9/7/2014 11:57:30 PM EDT
[#10]
I notice the lights over 200 tend to wash out my red dot so I had turn up the settings on the aimpoint micro. I honestly don't believe a light can be too bright or at least I haven't ran across one that was too bright.
Eta: didn't realize I was in the BOTS forum. You guys know your stuff and don't need my opinion. Lots of experts here will give great first hand experiences.
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Posted: 9/8/2014 2:13:34 AM EDT
[#11]
I picked up a Malkoff Hound Dog a few weeks ago as my new hand held, 900-1000 lumens. I now often find my TLR1s lacking and grab for the handheld when I'm clearing anything larger than a small house. I'm now looking to switch to the TLR1 HL.
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Posted: 9/8/2014 9:13:41 AM EDT
[#12]
I keep my old Streamlight M3 just for that reason. The TLR's have been too bright inside for my taste. The old halogen bulb in the M3 is just right for me.
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Posted: 9/8/2014 11:47:33 AM EDT
[#13]
I run an x300ultra on my Glock and a fury on my rifle. Not once have I said "I wish I had less light."
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Posted: 9/8/2014 2:13:11 PM EDT
[#14]
The issue I had with one of the bright LED weapon lights was loss of night vision when the light reflected off of a light surface, like a white wall. When clearing a building using the light on for a second and off for a few, seeing spots when the light goes off sucks. I'll agree that outside I want as much light as possible, but indoors I like it a little dimmer.
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Posted: 9/9/2014 5:07:54 PM EDT
[#15]
My partner and I tried the 300 and 600 lumen versions out as part of a testing project for our training LT last year. We cleared a vacant building that had both small and large rooms and is in a hole so it's pitch black inside.
We both felt that more light=better regardless of the situation. Even though it destroys your night vision, we thought that both lights did that and there wasn't an appreciable difference between them. There was a HUGE difference between both of them and the 150 lumen old TLR we have now. At longer distances we were told that the 300 lumen version was a "focused" beam and the 600 was just a spread out beam. We found that at longer ranges, the increased output of the 600 lumen version overwhelmed any advantage you got out of a focused beam and the spread out beam actually allowed you to see MORE of your target. In both of our experiences, the amount of light you're shooting into the room/at a perpetrator would be more overwhelming to the opponent than it would be a hinderance to you. We wholeheartedly recommended the 600 lumen version and were overruled by two high ranking members who preferred the 300 lumen version. Because there was no agreement, we're stuck with the 150 lumen version.  All that said, if I were going to spend my own money on a weapon light, 100 times out of 100 it would be the TLR-1 HL (600 lumens). It's a fantastic weapon light.
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Posted: 9/9/2014 5:50:43 PM EDT
[#16]
Another thing to consider is that not all walls are white obviously. Getting splashback from white walls is one thing, but going into a room or house that has painted walls really effects the spashback of the high lumen lights. I've got x300Ultra on my handguns and rifles. I want to get a x3 Fury or whatever it's called (the 1000 lumen version) for my .308 rifle. Just as a test, last night I went and shined the Fury on the different walls in my house and in my office, and the differences was pretty significant. My house has several walls that are blue, red, and grey. There was a distinct and large difference between hitting the non-painted walls versus the painted walls. Same with the office in that the walls are an orange-ish color.
I would rather have the high lumens because you're going to affect your night vision anytime you turn on a white light. There's not really a such thing as "light discipline" in most LE circles. Someone's always going to have a light on so your night vision is generally going to be shot. Might as well sear the BG's retinas while you're at it. Hope it helps some. |
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Posted: 9/10/2014 12:08:49 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There's not really a such thing as "light discipline" in most LE circles. Someone's always going to have a light on so your night vision is generally going to be shot. No kidding, I generally keep my flashlight off when I'm on foot looking for someone. There's enough light to see in most streets and alleys. There's a couple people who like to walk right behind me with a flashlight on, usually pointed right at my back. The 600+ lumen lights are very blinding. If you're clearing a building with a bright flashlight, your eyes will adjust to some extent. If you enter a small, dark room and suddenly flood it with light, people inside will have a much harder time seeing than you. The regular LED TLR1 is just about useless in a large warehouse. |
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Posted: 9/11/2014 1:41:12 AM EDT
[#18]
Lumens is a non-issue with proper tactics. I have 650 lumens on my AR light and it doesn't blind me.
People who complain about high lumen lights blinding themselves or ruining their night vision are probably using their light wrong. |
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Posted: 9/11/2014 3:11:49 PM EDT
[#19]
I've never found myself searching or clearing a house (or anything else for that matter) and wishing I had less light. I have, however, found myself wishing for more light on many occasions.
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Posted: 9/11/2014 10:42:49 PM EDT
[#20]
A diffuser helps quite a bit with high output lights, toning down the hotspot does wonders for me. The nice thing is that you can pop the diffuser off if you need more throw.
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Posted: 9/15/2014 1:58:47 AM EDT
[#21]
Pistol is ~150 lumen. Rifle is around 300. We rarely use rifles on indoor jobs so each suites it task. I firmly do believe you can have to bright of a light for indoors, more is not always better.
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Posted: 9/15/2014 2:12:38 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I use a 600 and it can be a little bright bouncing off a white wall, but not to the point of affecting my vision. More lumens = more blinding power on your side too, as a secondary advantage. If I could get a car high beam mounted on my HD rifle I would do it. I think bright is better. |
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Posted: 9/15/2014 12:03:03 PM EDT
[#23]
I run a TLR-1 HL on both my pistol and my rifle. Works like a champ and love it.
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