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Posted: 10/24/2001 2:48:44 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 2:52:20 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/24/2001 2:46:49 PM EST by Huero]
well, I guess we would all die. But I would certainly take some N.K. with me.
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 2:53:13 PM EST
During the war my father told me he was with several other family in similar situation and the mother did smother the child. She was a widow and it was her only child. Few days later she killed her self by jumping into a lake. I'm sure such things happens often in times of war. War IS hell on earth.
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 4:11:31 PM EST
It was the final episode of M*A*S*H. I do not have children and that is a tough hypothetical question. My hypothetical answer is: If I am with up to 20 close family and friends we are going to be so heavily armed that if need be we will all go down in one hell of a fire fight. Die on your feet......or on your knees. I prefer the former.
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 4:18:54 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/24/2001 4:17:16 PM EST by Kevin]
Originally Posted By VA-gunnut: If you don't have kids don't bother to answer because I doubt you would comprehend the what this might possibly do to you.
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Originally Posted By Huero: well, I guess we would all die. But I would certainly take some N.K. with me.
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I'm with Huero!! I also don't have kids but that certainly doesn't mean I can't comprehend. I have a niece & nephew, I as well as the rest of my family would die to protect them, [b]period!![/b]
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 4:26:04 PM EST
Depends if the kid was a bratty one. You know the kind, always screaming in restaurants. I dont have kids. BP
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 4:27:13 PM EST
My precious baby daughter means more to me than the lives of everybody else on this planet put together. Before I would kill her, I would initiate contact with the enemy and many would die. I will not sacrifice her for anybody.
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 4:30:31 PM EST
Pretty much what Golgo-13 said. I would not take the lives of my own children, nor would I allow anyone else to take them while I still drew breath. I would have to die before they did. God Bless Texas
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 4:44:08 PM EST
I don't have kids but I can say this. There would have to be a shitload of guys to take out me and 20 of MY family members. We're all hunters, ex-military, outdoorsmen/women, and so on. About 90% of us can shoot and shoot well. I figure it would take 45-50 people to take us all. Unless of course they had tanks, or some LAW rockets and stuff. That's a different story.
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 4:53:36 PM EST
Originally Posted By Golgo-13: My precious baby daughter means more to me than the lives of everybody else on this planet put together. Before I would kill her, I would initiate contact with the enemy and many would die. I will not sacrifice her for anybody.
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Agreed. A helluva firefight would ensue.
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 5:12:57 PM EST
I would first try to smother the kid enough so she passed out. Avoid combat at all costs, it would be too foolish to let 30 die for one.
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 5:23:24 PM EST
Made me remember something... Interesting how times have changed. I remember reading about back in the 1800's a mother and child were swept into a river. The father had to decide on who to save and he only had a chance to save ONE. He picked the mother. Why? Because he could always have more babies with the mother. I've heard quite a few stories like that about times in the 1800's. In todays time, probably 90+% would say they would save the child.
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 6:03:13 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 9:21:01 PM EST
I guess I was born a century to late, I agree with 7 (and Bill Cosby "I brought you in this world, I can take you out. I can make another one just like you." Yes this was in his standup on HBO). Although, I don't have any children of my own (that I know of). I have a feeling that my attitude will change when I make some of my own kids.
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 9:29:38 PM EST
Originally Posted By SS109: I would first try to smother the kid enough so she passed out. Avoid combat at all costs, it would be too foolish to let 30 die for one.
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THAT is the right answer! The "3rd" option...
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 9:30:03 PM EST
I have a 4 month old daughter and if anyone tried to hurt her they would have to get through me first. john
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 9:34:30 PM EST
I know my emotions would rip my heart out in both directions but i think i would "LIVE FREE OR DIE"
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 9:47:47 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 10:01:00 PM EST
Originally Posted By Guzzler: I guess I was born a century to late, I agree with 7 (and Bill Cosby "I brought you in this world, I can take you out. I can make another one just like you." Yes this was in his standup on HBO). Although, I don't have any children of my own (that I know of). I have a feeling that my attitude will change when I make some of my own kids.
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That was in his stand up loooong before HBO was even a glimmer onthe horizon... But it is a reat monologue [:)] Now this is a really tough one, because my kid has just passed puberty in to her teens [>Q]
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 10:08:47 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/24/2001 10:02:46 PM EST by Floater]
I dont have kids, but here is my answer, and I think the most realistic one. If you're with 15 or 20 of your family and friends, do you think ALL of those people would be willing to DIE for that one child? I think that the parents would be "all for" fighting, however, I believe that the majority would gang up on the parent(s), and end that child's life.
Link Posted: 10/24/2001 10:09:22 PM EST
As an intoxicated armchair commando, I'd probably say something on the lines of... Have one or even a two man team initiate contact with fire, and maneuver to lead them away. Don't give away your position unless the group is in imminent danger. Have a preplanned rally point or know where the destination is. Fire and run, fire and run. Pray a lot. In real life I'd probably just wet myself and scream like a little girl.
Link Posted: 10/25/2001 2:58:21 AM EST
During the war my father told me he was with several other family in similar situation and the mother did smother the child. She was a widow and it was her only child. Few days later she killed her self by jumping into a lake. I'm sure such things happens often in times of war.
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That is very sad to hear....And I can't bear myself to smother my child either. I will fight and take my chances, and if we will all get kill then so be it.
Link Posted: 10/25/2001 5:23:57 AM EST
Originally Posted By Floater: I dont have kids, but here is my answer, and I think the most realistic one. If you're with 15 or 20 of your family and friends, do you think ALL of those people would be willing to DIE for that one child? I think that the parents would be "all for" fighting, however, I believe that the majority would gang up on the parent(s), and end that child's life.
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You didn't read my original post, did you? I will not sacrifice my daughter for anyone. That includes other relatives. If you think her grandparents would want her sacrificed to preserve their own lives, then you have no idea how much people love their children or grandchildren. We will live together, or we will die together, but my child does not perish so that others may live.
Link Posted: 10/25/2001 5:34:15 AM EST
Originally Posted By Floater: I dont have kids, but here is my answer, and I think the most realistic one.
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Having a child of your [b]OWN[/b] will turn your outlook on this 180 degrees. Garunteed. I could [b]NEVER[/b] suffocate my own daughter, a kind of love exists between she and I that is [b]IMPOSSIBLE[/b] to understand if you haven't experienced it yourself. Attempt to suffocate her for me - one of us will die first. And I'm not the kind of person that makes statements like this for theatrical purposes.
Link Posted: 10/25/2001 5:41:23 AM EST
Let me put simply this way: I will not sacrifice the life of my child to save my own or anyone else....I will sacrifice my own life to save his and everyone else yes, but not the other way around. There is no second thought about it.
Link Posted: 10/25/2001 5:52:12 AM EST
The only 'crying' Lil' Spec would do is "Hooo Wwaaahhh!!" when he opened up on 'em with his .22. [uzi] Seriously, the third option by SS109 & others is the only solution, Or else divert the hostile force with 2 fire teams. NOBODY in my group is expendable, including the children.
Link Posted: 10/25/2001 5:53:37 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/25/2001 8:50:57 AM EST
I saw the same thing in the movie called Von Ryan's Express with Steve McQueen about some allied soldiers trying to escape Nazi Germany durring WWII, a baby was making a lot of noise, and it got smothered.
Link Posted: 10/25/2001 9:56:51 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/25/2001 9:59:42 AM EST by WSmac]
Then again, you have to think about the possiblility of your child being captured alive, while you are seriously wounded or dead. In more "primitive" societies there tends to be a completely different take on what life and death are about. Whether it's Native Americans, Koreans or Vietnamese, and possibly many other people I have not read about, the taking of a child's life or that of another member of the group for the greater good of the tribe is not malicious or necessarily cruel. I'm sure it's just as hard on the parents though. In preparation for fleeing an enemy with an infant or other uncontrollable person (mentally, or injured), measures need to be decided beforehand and items acquired to solve those potential problems. For the infant, medication or alcohol that would quiet the child would be appropriate. Smothering a child to unconciousness would be very tricky under the stresses involved. If the child stopped breathing there would likely be an attempt to resuscitate which would hopefully work, if there was time to sit there and try. Personally, I will not commit myself on hypothetical scenarios. WSmac
Link Posted: 10/25/2001 12:40:29 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/25/2001 1:03:00 PM EST
Originally Posted By Floater: If you're with 15 or 20 of your family and friends, do you think ALL of those people would be willing to DIE for that one child?
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Yes. These are the people I chose to spend the worst possible circumstances with. Every adult would die before one child. Zaz
Link Posted: 10/25/2001 1:33:14 PM EST
"The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few or the one." No, I don't have any kids, but would do what must be done and choose the lesser of two evils.
Link Posted: 10/25/2001 1:33:50 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/25/2001 1:41:10 PM EST
Originally Posted By AR_Rifle: Let me put simply this way: I will not sacrifice the life of my child to save my own or anyone else....I will sacrifice my own life to save his and everyone else yes, but not the other way around. There is no second thought about it.
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I'm with you... couldn't hurt my two boys for anything. But then again, if the wife starts her bitching... Anyway, I'd go for the third option as well, or even a hypodermic with a strong sedative.
Link Posted: 10/26/2001 3:23:11 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/26/2001 3:18:12 AM EST by Golgo-13]
Originally Posted By oneshot1kill: As a family man, and an ex Marine, I would certainly fight the enemy with all of my heart and soul, no matter how scared I may be. I am in a small situation right now where some 17 Y.O. low life punched my 12 year old girl in the face for bumping into him by accident. This hood has no idea that I already know who he is, but he crossed the line by screwing with my children, and will be held accountable for his actions by yours truly. this is minor compared to your scenario, but it illustrates how far parents will go to protect thier children.
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For a lout of this type, the proper payback is to put him in a burlap sack and beat him with a baseball bat (I recommend the Louisville Slugger Hank Aaron signature model) until [b]you[/b] get tired. Give him an extra swat or two for all the other fathers of daughters out here.
Link Posted: 10/26/2001 3:38:13 AM EST
Making this statement:
Originally Posted By mejames: "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few or the one."
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Makes this statement unnecessary:
No, I don't have any kids, but would do what must be done and choose the lesser of two evils.
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Having your [b]OWN[/b] child will drastically change your interpretation of the word "Love." It's a wonderful thing that happens to every parent.
Link Posted: 10/26/2001 3:40:34 AM EST
Originally Posted By VA-gunnut: Since so many think they would fight it out first, how many have actually thought of how they would deal with small childeren in a hypothetical SHTF scenario?[uzi]
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The question wasn't "How would I fight?" I'm not sure how I would. I [i]am[/i] positive I would [i]not[/i] suffocate my child, though.
Link Posted: 10/27/2001 6:09:20 PM EST
Originally Posted By zazou:
Originally Posted By Floater: If you're with 15 or 20 of your family and friends, do you think ALL of those people would be willing to DIE for that one child?
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Yes. These are the people I chose to spend the worst possible circumstances with. Every adult would die before one child. Zaz
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Just how sure are you?
Link Posted: 10/28/2001 8:08:40 AM EST
As stated in Braveheart, "Every man dies, not every man lives." I know what awaits me and my children when we die. Better to die with honor making a fight, then live at the price of murdering my child.
Link Posted: 10/28/2001 8:15:19 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/28/2001 8:26:43 AM EST
maybe the kid was just hungry, couldn't the mother feed the child or something?
Link Posted: 10/28/2001 11:29:28 AM EST
Good question, my girls are grown and could fight on there own if need be. However Charly, my grandson was here today, he is 1 year old and a handful to say the least. Hurt him? I think not, how about I try to lead the bad guys away. There are always options, and if dieing in place is it, we take as many as we can with us.
Link Posted: 10/28/2001 11:32:06 AM EST
Stick the mommas tit in the childs mouth. It always works. They couldn't show it on TV.
Link Posted: 10/28/2001 12:53:13 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/28/2001 12:48:46 PM EST by crashburnrepeat]
hahahah, mejames, you didn't need to tell us you don't have kids, we can tell from your statement that you don't. I know we all like to be keyboard commandos (tm) and hard guys but I don't think there's one guy/gal here who'd actually smother their own kids to death under this situation. I respect your opinion and I'm not flaming but just remember this discussion when you have your own kids and laugh at the folly of your statement. There are several possible solutions to this hypo; 1)smother the child to unconsciousness. It wouldn't be that hard to do. Humans are surprisingly resilient. 2)Use ether, medication, alchohol to keep the child sedated. 3)See any of the other "fighting" responses above, all of them are good. Come on, this is the AR15.COM team we're talking about here! We'd all have our pre-ban, flash hider'd, collapsing stocked AR's with a knee high pile'O Hi-Cap magazines sitting next to us. If you got 19 people with arms dug in, it would take a couple hundred to get you out (of course minus heavy artillery) I have a three day old daughter sitting on my lap right now, I'd die before I smothered her. And I'd make anyone else in my party who tried to smother her die. Painfully. Crashburnrepeat.
Originally Posted By mejames: "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few or the one." No, I don't have any kids, but would do what must be done and choose the lesser of two evils.
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Link Posted: 10/28/2001 1:12:01 PM EST
Originally Posted By DoubleFeed: I did unexpected receive an SHTF scenario from my "adopted" sister. She asked me if I could get her some gas masks, specifically for her two kids (5 year old girl and the boy is under a year). Her daughter adores me (I think she has a crush on me hehe). It is fairly common knowledge that gas masks for children don't exist or are extremely rare. The question is, in the case of chemical attack to lethal levels for the kids, could I pull the trigger on them, knowing that they might either survive, or die a long excruciating death? War is HELL indeed.
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It may be a little more expensive than 2 rounds of ammo... But... Check out the "Little Ranger" and "Baby Ranger" series of breathing apparatus. They are positive pressure units and use a lithium battery powered blower to draw outside air through an M95 style filter. I think they run around 500-800 bucks each. Good insurance IMHO.
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