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Posted: 8/11/2001 7:09:29 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/11/2001 7:36:41 AM EST by Kalifornia]
It happened at around 1:30AM last night. My friend was driving and I was in the passenger seat. We were stopped at an intersection and once the light turned green we attempted to cross it. While crossing it, BANG! We got hit at about 40+ MPH on my side. We hit a small traffic light and start rolling in the middle of the intersection. My friend goes out the car and I see 3 guys come out the other car all wearing cowboy hats. One approaches me and helps me out the car, I was a little dazed and shocked. My friend calls the police and I ammediately ask other people if they saw anything. They didn't! Police get there and as soon as they do, 2 women, who were supposedly following the men run towards the police and tell them a story. To make a long story short, one of the women told the police she was the driver. The 5 men in cowboy hats & boots, didn't even have a license and couldn't speak any kind of english. All they had were work permits. We told the police that we seen just the 5 illegals come out one car while the women came out another. Damn it pissed me off. Now I hane a sore hip, sore arm, and my bad back is starting to give out again. What should I do? There was no witnesses except for the 2 ladies. I want to get these assholes but how? Damn illegals!!!!!
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 7:20:36 AM EST
"There was no witnesses except for the 2 ladies. I want to get these assholes but how?" Do you have uninsured motorist coverage with your policy? That should cover your losses from this. Your insurance company will then turn around and sue those other people involved. You will get your deductible back when(if)they recover. Make SURE you get a copy of the accident report, and make SURE the names and addresses of the witnesses are on there. But you got that before they could leave the scene, didn't you?
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 7:30:20 AM EST
The problem is, the witnesses were WITH the party. They were supposedly following each other to some salsa bar. The 2 ladies were in a seperate car, but one said she was driving the car that hit us which is pure BS! Only the 5 cowboy wannabees were in the car that hit us. I don't know if I have uninsured motorist coverage, I'll go check. My friend got all the reports the police gave us. Damn lying f'ers!
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 8:41:24 AM EST
When the light turns green, that is not a sign to proceed into the intersection, it is a sign that you may proceed into the intersection [b]IF THERE IS NO ONCOMING TRAFFIC![/b] Just because you have the green light doesn't mean your friend was right to proceed to cross the intersection! [u]Both[/u] drivers were at fault IMHO. You might wind up suing your friend's insurance company for any damages you may have sustained! BTW did the police issue any tickets? To whom? Have you ever seen a car run a red light? Eric The(ThenIt'sForeseeable!)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 8:50:56 AM EST
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: When the light turns green, that is not a sign to proceed into the intersection, it is a sign that you may proceed into the intersection [b]IF THERE IS NO ONCOMING TRAFFIC![/b] Just because you have the green light doesn't mean your friend was right to proceed to cross the intersection! [u]Both[/u] drivers were at fault IMHO.
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Eric, that is a huge crock of BS. The driver who RAN THE RED FRIGGING LIGHT is CLEARLY at fault both legally and ethically. What cop or judge is going to fault the driver who is legally attempting to cross an intersection on a green light if some idiot runs the red light and hits him? Where did you get that line of manure???
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 8:53:38 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/11/2001 8:51:24 AM EST by Gr8Scott]
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: Just because you have the green light doesn't mean your friend was right to proceed to cross the intersection! [u]Both[/u] drivers were at fault IMHO. Eric The(ThenIt'sForeseeable!)Hun[>]:)]
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So if I am shot at the range because some idiot didn't keep his finger off the trigger and then swept and shot me, then I must also be at fault using your logic. [whacko] Just brilliant! [rolleyes] [puke]
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 8:55:45 AM EST
Were they wearing white shoes? ;)
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 8:57:16 AM EST
So green light to you guys means 'floor it'?[>]:)]
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:16:17 AM EST
Welcome to the sometimes whacky world of auto accident law! What we have here is almost a textbook case for the operation of the [b]'last clear chance'[/b] rule! It may seem odd at first, but after a while the theory does make perfect common sense! I've been out of school so long, and don't EVER handle traffic cases (not even my OWN!), so I'm using the definition of the 'last clear chance' rule from law.com -
a rule of law in determining responsibility for damages caused by negligence, which provides that if the plaintiff (the party suing for damages) is negligent, that will not matter if the defendant (the party being sued for damages caused by his/her negligence) could have still avoided the accident by reasonable care in the final moments (no matter how slight) before the accident. The theory is that although the plaintiff may have been negligent, his/her negligence no longer was the cause of the accident because the defendant could have prevented the accident. Most commonly applied to auto accidents, a typical case of last clear chance would be when one driver drifts over the center line, and this action was noted by an oncoming driver who proceeds without taking simple evasive action, crashes into the first driver and is thus liable for the injuries to the first driver who was over the line. In the few states which apply the strict "contributory negligence" rule which keeps a negligent plaintiff from recovering damages from a negligent defendant, "last clear chance" can save the careless plaintiff's lawsuit.
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The situation here is slightly different only in that Kalifornia was NOT the driver, so he is in the position of being totally free of any negligence whatsoever, and can sue everybody! I'm certain that if you check into the traffic rules and regulations of YOUR state, you will see that a [b]green light[/b], contrary to what we may have learned in childish games, does NOT mean simply [b]'GO'[/b], it most likely states that 'you may proceed into the intersection if the way is clear' or words to that effect! As I said, have you ever seen anyone run a red light? If you have, you are on notice that other drivers sometimes run red lights for a whole bunch of reasons, emergency, failed brakes, DWI(!), whatever! So it is up to YOU, as the Driver, to take such prudent steps as a reasonable man would take to protect both himself and his passengers. Period. Kalifornia, my friend, I'm just glad we're not talking with your family about a wrongful death suit against not only the other driver, but your friend, as well. So am I still full of manure?[:D] Eric The(CommonSenseDoesn'tAlwaysPrevail,ButHereIt­Does!)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:20:45 AM EST
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: When the light turns green, that is not a sign to proceed into the intersection, it is a sign that you may proceed into the intersection [b]IF THERE IS NO ONCOMING TRAFFIC![/b] Just because you have the green light doesn't mean your friend was right to proceed to cross the intersection! [u]Both[/u] drivers were at fault IMHO. You might wind up suing your friend's insurance company for any damages you may have sustained! BTW did the police issue any tickets? To whom? Have you ever seen a car run a red light? Eric The(ThenIt'sForeseeable!)Hun[>]:)]
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Are you by chance a personal injury [s]liar[/s] lawyer? That is the biggest bunch of happy horseshit I have heard come out of you.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:23:52 AM EST
Originally Posted By erickm: Your mixing common sense with legality.
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I could go a hundred ways with this one.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:24:29 AM EST
Post from Gr8Scott -
So if I am shot at the range because some idiot didn't keep his finger off the trigger and then swept and shot me, then I must also be at fault using your logic.
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Well, first off, it's not my logic that compels me to say that I thought BOTH Drivers were at fault, it's the collective wisdom of the Common Law that gives us the 'last clear chance' rule. And if you're shot at the range, [b]behind[/b] the firing line, then you're not negligent in any manner, now, are you? Eric The(ButIfYouWereMessingAroundDownrange...)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:29:06 AM EST
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: It may seem odd at first, but after a while the theory does make perfect common sense!
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Only to a lawyer.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:30:36 AM EST
Post from 1GUNRUNNER -
Are you by chance a personal injury liar lawyer? That is the biggest bunch of happy horseshit I have heard come out of you.
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No, I'm just a Constitutional Law Attorney who enjoys representing clients free of charge who have been charged with gun-law related crimes and infractions. [Now THAT, my dear Man, is the biggest bunch of happy horseshit that you'll ever hear come out of me!][:D] But thanks for your input! Eric The(HappyHorseshitDispensingLiar)Hun, Esq.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:32:50 AM EST
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: And if you're shot at the range, [b]behind[/b] the firing line, then you're not negligent in any manner, now, are you?
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Some lawyer could prove he was negligent for even being born. Eric you got me so riled up I have forgot most of my burrito eating illegal cowboy jokes I had!
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:32:50 AM EST
Only to a lawyer.
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Or to a Judge! You know the one running the show! Eric The(Course,He'sProbablyALawyer,Too)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:35:35 AM EST
Originally Posted By 1GUNRUNNER:
Originally Posted By erickm: Your mixing common sense with legality.
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I could go a hundred ways with this one.
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in every single area of thousands of stupid laws we have too right? BTW I accidently deleted that post when I was trying to edit it, just so just so no one thinks gunrunner made up words for me.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:35:50 AM EST
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: Eric The(Course,He'sProbablyALawyer,Too)Hun[>]:)]
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[b]EEEEXXXXXACTLY!!!!!!![/B]
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:39:31 AM EST
Now, GUNRUNNER, let's say you're riding in my car (forget you don't want to even be SEEN with a lawyer for even a minute). As we come to a stop light, I mention to you that I just remembered I'm late for a Legal Education Class on Abusing Widows and Orphans for Fun & Profit. As the traffic signals change and I have the green light to go, you tell me that you see a car coming from the right toward the intersection at a fast, I mean, really fast, rate of speed. I say, 'screw'em, I've got the green light, he HAS to stop. It's the Law!' Despite your screams, I pull out in front of the oncoming car! Feel better now? Eric The(AtLeastYour[u]Heirs[/u]GetToSueALawyer!)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:42:05 AM EST
So Eric if it was actual citizens instead of residents who hit him while running the red light and one of them got injured, could they get damages in court from "Kalifornia" for not being alert enough to see them run the red? what if it was just like he said and they were resident aliens or had a work permit and one of them got injured?
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:46:27 AM EST
I am a PO. I arrive at the scene of the accident. I take the statements of the two parties. I look for INDEPENDENT witnesses. There are none. WTFAISTD?
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:52:40 AM EST
I just got out of a law class in May, and I can tell you now, it was the illegal's fault. Also, if Eric the Nun will read his Driver's License Manual, it clearly, CLEARLY, states that a green light gives the go ahead to proceed. The yellow light is the one that allows you to proceed if it's clear, but it also means slow. The only way you can bust the illegals is to prove that they were the only people driving, and that's possible by fingerprinting the steering wheel. Do you think any woman with an illegal is smart enough to put her fingerprints on the wheel before anyone arrives. If the car was towed, have the police check it. If not, you're screwed.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:52:54 AM EST
Post from erickm -
So Eric if it was actual citizens instead of residents who hit him while running the red light and one of them got injured, could they get damages in court from "Kalifornia" for not being alert enough to see them run the red? what if it was just like he said and they were resident aliens or had a work permit and one of them got injured?
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Citizens, residents, WTF? How does anything I've said have to do with the nationality of anyone involved in this accident? You've lost me. Kalifornia is under no legal obligation to serve as the 'lookout' for his friend at all. Eric The(GottaGo)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:55:09 AM EST
Eric, like any good lawyer, you're muddying the waters. The quote you gave was CLEARLY referring to a CIVIL LAWSUIT FOR DAMAGES after an accident, NOT a legal determination of who was at fault by the LEO on the scene and the judge who adjudicates the case. I repeat, What cop or judge is going to fault the driver who is legally attempting to cross an intersection on a green light if some idiot runs the red light and hits him? Answer: none. Eric, you seem to be attempting a legal proof of the saying "better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak up and remove all doubt."
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 10:02:16 AM EST
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: Post from erickm -
So Eric if it was actual citizens instead of residents who hit him while running the red light and one of them got injured, could they get damages in court from "Kalifornia" for not being alert enough to see them run the red? what if it was just like he said and they were resident aliens or had a work permit and one of them got injured?
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Citizens, residents, WTF? How does anything I've said have to do with the nationality of anyone involved in this accident? You've lost me. Kalifornia is under no legal obligation to serve as the 'lookout' for his friend at all. Eric The(GottaGo)Hun[>]:)]
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nothing to do with nationality at all, citizenship status is what I'm asking about whether or not they are a citizen, resident alien or an illegal does it make any difference in a civil court? and could any of the above sue for damages after running a red light, hitting someone and injuring themselves which they wouldn't have been injured if the other driver had noticed them running the red and yielded his green to them?
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 10:03:23 AM EST
Dude, I don't mean to be rude and impersonal, but why, oh why, do you live in Kalifornia???? I mean like this is the sorta stuff that goes on there all the time at a very high level. You're just gonna be Kalifornicated by that State until you wake-up and realize that being in Kalifornia is so totally un-cool.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 11:27:20 AM EST
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: Now, GUNRUNNER, let's say you're riding in my car (forget you don't want to even be SEEN with a lawyer for even a minute). As we come to a stop light, I mention to you that I just remembered I'm late for a Legal Education Class on Abusing Widows and Orphans for Fun & Profit. As the traffic signals change and I have the green light to go, you tell me that you see a car coming from the right toward the intersection at a fast, I mean, really fast, rate of speed. I say, 'screw'em, I've got the green light, he HAS to stop. It's the Law!' Despite your screams, I pull out in front of the oncoming car! Feel better now? Eric The(AtLeastYour[u]Heirs[/u]GetToSueALawyer!)Hun[>]:)]
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Now that's funny! Note to self: Don't go for a ride with the crazy Texas lawyer.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 12:41:51 PM EST
Newspeak. Lawyerspeak. 2+2=5. The Republic is lost.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 1:27:22 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/11/2001 1:26:34 PM EST by OLY-M4gery]
Eric the Hun is using the legal logic of if you were there it is partly your fault. You don't have a right to proceed at a green light unless it is afe to do so. Of course requiring people to assume that all other drivers are maniacs is flawed logic. If you had to labor under that assumption top legal speed would be about 15 mph, just so you could react to the insame action of the other driver without causing a crash. If course in this case no crash could have occurred if the other driver hadn't willfully decided to violate the law and drive without a licanse. All of the damage in this case springs from that unlawful intentional act. If he wasn't driving, iliegally, there could not have been a crash as the other car wouldn't have been there. Also you should try to find out who owns the car. Because whoever recklessly allowed access to the vehicle, by an un-licensed driver, certainly contributed to this crash occurrring. Or, you could decide that if the woman that claimed to be the driver wants to be the driver so be it. Sue her until she cant possess loose change, due to the liens from your lawsuit.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 3:56:59 PM EST
First in this thread subject case I'm betting the fault will be found with the "Cowboys." I'm also betting Kalifornia may have to threaten to sue or sue his friend's insurance co. for medical bills he incurs. Being hit by people without insurance is bad all around. I'll back Eric on the idea a green light doesn't give you the right of way. I won a case in small claims on that basis. I was making a left turn and was hit by a guy coming through the intersection. His defense was "the light was green" and I should have yielded to him. I was able to show that I was already in the intersection as he approached it, of three lanes of traffic two had stopped to let me complete my turn and he changed lanes in order to pass the two stopped lanes and use the third open lane to pop out and hit me. There were other supporting points about his speed, the stopped cars obscuring his and my views and actual point of impact but the Judge said he should have paid attention to the stopped cars to drive with caution and the green light did not automatically give him the right of way. Kalifornia, I hope this goes smoothly for you and I would suggest you don't dwell on wether or not they are punished. They might get off lightly in this instance but I still wouldn't want to trade places with them.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 4:18:30 PM EST
No, I'm just a Constitutional Law Attorney who enjoys representing clients free of charge who have been charged with gun-law related crimes and infractions.
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That sounds like an interesting profession. I'll take the chance to change the subject and ask how successful you have been with your 2nd amendment cases. Enquiring minds want to know...
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 4:24:54 PM EST
I am glad everyone was ok. Hope you have good insurance, if not I would consider buying as much as possible. Sorry to hear of your trouble.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 4:31:24 PM EST
I hate when that happens. Lucky no one is dead. I had a similar experience last weekend in Oakland, CA, while my wife and I were on our way to Jack London Square at about 4:00 PM. We exited off the 580 freeway onto 11th or 12th and were heading south towards Broadway, in Oakland's Chinatown. I stopped at a red light and when the light turned green, just as I'm inching into the intersection, this car full of Chinese runs the red light in front me. They would have nailed my pregnant wife as the car was coming from her direction. I was inching out, so I had planty of time to stop. No damange so far. So, I tell my wife, "F*cking Chinese, can't drive worth a sh*t!" She says, "I know, remember my accident last year..." So, just as I'm about to continue to pull into the interection, I looked in the direction the first car came from and right then another car load of Chinese runs the same red light! This was perhaps 3-4 seconds after the first car ran the light. I assume they were following the first car. These cars were full of adults with children. Anyway, if I had not stopped after the first car ran the light and taken the time to really look, I would have been nailed for sure and my wife would probably be 6' under today.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 8:38:11 PM EST
As much as what Eric says makes me want to vomit, hes right. I used to work as a PI and took hundreds of written statements from people involved in auto accidents. The was an unwritten rule we used to follow to nail the 'opposing' driver - if we could get them to admit that there was something they could have done to avoid the accident. Just remember, dont talk to anyone, ANYONE who calls or visits you unless you can be damn sure that they are from you buddy's insurance company. Make it perfectly clear that your friend could have done nothing to avoid the accident due to 'the high rate of speed' the other vehicle was travelling at and the other driver never even applied their brakes!! - Dont know the circumstances of your accident, but thats a good start for your possible and upcoming statement [;)]
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:19:41 PM EST
Post from TRW -
Originally posted by Eric The Hun - No, I'm just a Constitutional Law Attorney who enjoys representing clients free of charge who have been charged with gun-law related crimes and infractions.
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That sounds like an interesting profession. I'll take the chance to change the subject and ask how successful you have been with your 2nd amendment cases. Enquiring minds want to know...
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You are right that being a Constitutional Law Attorney would be a very interesting profession indeed! You need to look at the following paragraph, however, because I admitted to GUNRUNNER that I wasn't such a lawyer, I was just dishing out some happy b.s. to counter his cruel assertion that I may have been a personal injury lawyer! I've always wanted to become more familiar with criminal laws regarding gun issues, but I'm afraid that I've never had any clients who were charged with gun law infractions to justify my specializing in such an area of the law. Now if [b]I were charged with some gun law violation[/b], you damn well better believe I would become familiar with ALL facets of that law! Eric The(SorryToDisappointYou)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:38:51 PM EST
Post from Rikwriter -
Eric, like any good lawyer, you're muddying the waters. The quote you gave was CLEARLY referring to a CIVIL LAWSUIT FOR DAMAGES after an accident, NOT a legal determination of who was at fault by the LEO on the scene and the judge who adjudicates the case. I repeat, What cop or judge is going to fault the driver who is legally attempting to cross an intersection on a green light if some idiot runs the red light and hits him? Answer: none.
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I don't believe that Kalifornia is interested in seeing someone got to jail for any traffic offense committed the other evening, he is more interested in determining whether he'll get paid for any injuries he's received. That, my friend, is a CIVIL LAW matter. So we're not even talking about CRIMINAL LAW here, because, if we were, then it is just as likely that BOTH drivers are criminally liable for the accident! The illegals for running the red light and Kalifornia's friend for failure to yield, or failure to take reasonable steps to avoid an accident. Now, I'm not sufficiently familiar with California(?) traffic laws to say that Kalifornia's friend has committed any offenses under those laws, THAT'S WHY I SPECIFICALLY ASKED HIM IF THE POLICE ISSUED ANY TICKETS!!!! THAT would sure be a sign of some traffic violation, would it not???? Sheesh! You guys need to keep your eyes on the ball on this one! Eric The(CanIMakeItAnyPlainer?)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 9:49:07 PM EST
I had this happen to me once. I went through a light that just turned green on my motorbike and to my suprise there was a work truck still crossing the intersection that I didn't see because of cars in the other two lanes. Well, we became intimately connected, though slowly thanks to good brakes. Anyhew cop said that I had a duty to avoid an accident regardless of the signal, since they were already in the intersection. Got pissed off but looked it up in the vehicle code and he was right. Don't remember exactly where I found it as it was fifteen years ago. About a week after the accident I noticed that the way they were going was not allowed and that they were still in the intersection because they were waiting to let cars turn left in front of them. Cop should have figured this out at the scene. No real damage happened though, I was just pissed.
Link Posted: 8/11/2001 10:06:45 PM EST
Originally Posted By Kalifornia: Now I have a sore hip, sore arm, and my bad back is starting to give out again. What should I do? I want to get these assholes but how? Damn illegals!!!!!
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I'm not a professional like some of our esteemed Members but having lived in California for years and knowing a number of individuals who were in similar prediciments such as yours here goes: If the illegals have no insurance which is probably the the case you have two options. You can sue the piss out of your soon to be ex friend or: Rub generous amounts of Ben Gay on the afflicted areas of your maimed body and move on with your life. The truth of the matter is that no one will go after the illegals because it is not worth their time (or money).
Link Posted: 8/12/2001 3:53:30 AM EST
Post from Getsome -
The truth of the matter is that no one will go after the illegals because it is not worth their time (or money).
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Precisely why the Friend's insurance policy is going to be an issue if and when Kalifornia or his attorney decide to make a claim for any personal injuries which he may have sustained in this accident. It's called going after 'the deep pockets.' It may not be the best thing for these guys' friendship, but nobody wants either unpaid doctor's bills, or continued suffering over a situatio that [b]could have been avoided[/b]. I've seen so many folks run red lights that I purposefully let other cars pull away from the intersection when the light turns green before I do simply so they can take the brunt of any collision that a redlight-running idiot might cause! [b]It's called 'defensive driving.'[/b] And it's what I owe myself and the loved ones that I have in the car with me. Eric The(AndAnyFriendsThatLawyersSuchAsMyselfMaySt­illHaveLeft!)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 8/12/2001 9:06:16 AM EST
Thanks A LOT for the advice. MAny good ones. I think I'm going to call an attorney to see what we can do. I don't really give a damn about getting paid, I just want these assholes to not get away with this BS. The illegals (guys) didn't have any drivers licenses, but the girls (I think citizens) had drivers licenses and took the blame for driving. I'm sure she had insurance and am sure the illegals didn't. Maybe thats why she took the blame. The lady also is trying to say that we ran a red light. I don't see any way my friend could have gotten out of the collision. I'm sure the illegals could have though. I didn't even hear any brakes screeching from them. All I heard was a loud BANG. Well, I hope this doesn't happen to you guys. This is pure BS. Grrrrrrrrrrrr. I will, however, go to the hospital and see what they can suggest about my back. My back used to hurt around 2 years ago, but it is starting to come back again. My friend is trying to sue too. She claims that something happened to her rib and that she her neck is hurt from the collision with the traffic light pole. I hope this all goes well. I really don't want to see anyone go to jail.
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 12:59:07 AM EST
Mattja: how nice of you to stereotype Chinese into a single group of drivers. Let's see if this ring a bell in your oh-so-f---ed up logic! "F---ing gunowners, shooting up school children!" " Yeah, remember the neo-nazi who shot at the jewish kids?" how about it? not so great to be on the receiving end of it, is it? perhaps you could actually think a little next time before opening up the big mouth that spouts off nothing useful.
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 1:34:42 AM EST
Kalifornia You better get that back and the other injuries checked out real good. Back injuries have a tendancy to get worse over time. And go to a real Doctor, meaning a MD not a chiropracter. Have the Doc take at least x-rays and possibly a MRI. [b]Trust me on this one, back pain always gets worse over time!![/b] And you can't tell what's wrong with a simple touch of the hands. Plus the bills can easily run as high as $50,000 or more!!! sgtar15
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 4:30:27 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/13/2001 4:49:14 AM EST by saleen]
Moses, Fingerprint the wheel?? You are kidding right? I'm surprised Eric hasn't jumped on this one so I'll enlighten you on that theory. First, if the car was towed (T-bone ar 40 mph, that's a good bet) it has not been SECURED since being taken into custody. That means your chain of custody on any evidence recovered is shot. If you have your law degree, you should have known that. It is the most common way defense attourneys get evidence thrown out. If you remember correctly, that wrongfully accused innocent known as O.J. was miraculously set free by attacking the chain of custody. There was alot of fingerpointing and character assasination to free that peice of shit, but it boiled down to evidence handling. Kalifornia, Despite the fact that the lady wasn't really driving, did she produce any evidence of insurance? If she did, see if she will make a sworn statement or begin the claim process to help her friend. That would get her from helpful fibbing to insurance fraud, and insurance companies DO love to go after them. Right now she is a fish too small for their time. My guess is no one has any insurance (except your friend). In my experience well over 75% of all illegals involved in accidents I have worked have 3 things in common: 1: No license 2: No insurance 3: No English BTW officers in my department have been told NOT TO ARREST parties stopped for various traffic infractions or involved in accidents if they are found to have no insurance or no valid license (they must be scared of LULAC). They feel we better serve the community by issuing a citation (which generally turns into a warrant) and allowing said motorist to continue on his or her way. I don't even issue them citations if they are going to drive away since I am afraid that some lawyer type will have my ass in a civil suit when one of these idiots kills someone with a copy of a ticket I just issued him in his pocket. Maybe I'm paranoid but this shit is outta control. Saleen
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 4:41:01 AM EST
Listen to Eric. I've been in the insurance claims business for 16 years, and his "last clear chance" explanation is right on point. I don't necesssarily like the laws that we have, but I can sure as hell tell you how the civil courts interpret them. Good luck in dealing with your insurance company. While you should certainly make an Uninsured Motorist claim, the adjuster will also apply a negligence comparison in evaluating your case. It might turn out to be something handled under Collision and PIP/Med Pay, with different deductibles and premium impact. Your lawyer will guide you.
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 4:49:36 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/13/2001 4:46:06 AM EST by RikWriter]
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: So we're not even talking about CRIMINAL LAW here, because, if we were, then it is just as likely that BOTH drivers are criminally liable for the accident! The illegals for running the red light and Kalifornia's friend for failure to yield, or failure to take reasonable steps to avoid an accident.
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Nope. That is not likely at all. What is likely is that the person who BROKE THE LAW by running the red light is solely responsible for the accident under the law.
Now, I'm not sufficiently familiar with California(?) traffic laws to say that Kalifornia's friend has committed any offenses under those laws, THAT'S WHY I SPECIFICALLY ASKED HIM IF THE POLICE ISSUED ANY TICKETS!!!! THAT would sure be a sign of some traffic violation, would it not???? Sheesh! You guys need to keep your eyes on the ball on this one!
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And you need to stop pulling this crap out of your ass. You just admitted you don't know California law on the matter, yet you are making ominous and idiotic statements about how his friend is legally responsible for an accident that was clearly someone else's fault.
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 5:11:46 AM EST
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: When the light turns green, that is not a sign to proceed into the intersection, it is a sign that you may proceed into the intersection [b]IF THERE IS NO ONCOMING TRAFFIC![/b] Just because you have the green light doesn't mean your friend was right to proceed to cross the intersection! [u]Both[/u] drivers were at fault IMHO. So you stop at every green light you come upon? What a crock.
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 5:48:16 AM EST
man that is really bad about the accident but.....................................................have you been to mcuzi.com lately........................................................yuck............................................. M.I.G........................................................you suck................
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 5:54:29 AM EST
Post by Halfcrocked -
What a crock.
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Maybe so, maybe so, but why don't you check with the laws in Michigan to determine if a green light means that you may proceed into an intersection BEFORE checking to see if if may be done so safely. It may be a crock, but it's THE LAW in Texas and Louisiana, the only two states whose traffic laws I'm familiar with. We'll wait and see what Kalifornia finds out when and if he consults with a California atty., to see what the traffic laws in California provide. BTW, do you think Kalifornia's friend did him any favors by pulling into the intersection with a 40 mph car running the red light? Eric The(Patient)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 6:46:19 AM EST
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: Maybe so, maybe so, but why don't you check with the laws in Michigan to determine if a green light means that you may proceed into an intersection BEFORE checking to see if if may be done so safely. It may be a crock, but it's THE LAW in Texas and Louisiana, the only two states whose traffic laws I'm familiar with. We'll wait and see what Kalifornia finds out when and if he consults with a California atty., to see what the traffic laws in California provide. BTW, do you think Kalifornia's friend did him any favors by pulling into the intersection with a 40 mph car running the red light?
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Like he knew the guy was coming. I am not a lawyer Eric and I don't play one on TV, but about a year ago my parents were in an accident much like the one that occurred with Kalifornia and his friend. They were turning left on a green arrow when a Scottish tourist in a rental car ran the red light and hit them at about 40MPH. Guess what, not only did they not get a ticket (no surprise there as the OTHER guy was BREAKING TRAFFIC LAWS) but the Scottish guy's insurance paid for their car. Now there was no civil trial, but that undermines your incredibly unlikely scenario wherein the cops would find that both parties are liable.
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 8:19:37 AM EST
Post from Rikwriter -
Like he knew the guy was coming.
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What were the illegals driving? Some sorta' Stealth automobile. Did they have headlights? Are you adding to Kalifornia's story by making it impossible for ANYONE to see the oncoming vehicle? No one's mentioned THAT possibility, but if YOU were there maybe YOU should come forward as a witness!
...about a year ago my parents were in an accident much like the one that occurred with Kalifornia and his friend. They were turning left on a green arrow when a Scottish tourist in a rental car ran the red light and hit them at about 40MPH. Guess what, not only did they not get a ticket (no surprise there as the OTHER guy was BREAKING TRAFFIC LAWS) but the Scottish guy's insurance paid for their car.
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As you stated, your parents were MAKING a left turn on arrow, so it's not the same. It's not the same as a car that accelerates from a stopped position into the intersection only to be broadsided by a vehicle breaking traffic laws!
Now there was no civil trial, but that undermines your incredibly unlikely scenario wherein the cops would find that both parties are liable.
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[b]Cops don't find anyone liable![/b] That's not their responsibility. That's up to a court of law. Do you even read my posts thoroughly? We're NOT talking about criminal culpability, we're talking about financial responsibility! Kalifornia's already stated he not interested in seeing anyone go to jail! Why don't you re-read everything, and determine what your state's traffic laws say on the subject, and THEN get back to us. In the meanwhile, ALL I am interested in is seeing what any California attorney might tell Kalifornia about the various civil liabilities of ALL drivers involved in this accident, for the sole purpose of paying for any damages he may have suffered! What's your purpose? A pi$$ing contest with me? Eric The(Sheesh,Indeed)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 8/13/2001 10:16:02 AM EST
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: As you stated, your parents were MAKING a left turn on arrow, so it's not the same. It's not the same as a car that accelerates from a stopped position into the intersection only to be broadsided by a vehicle breaking traffic laws!
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Well, yes, IT IS! They waited for the green arrow, and when it came they turned...and then the guy who was ignoring the red light hit them. It is almost exactly the same circumstances.
[b]Cops don't find anyone liable![/b] That's not their responsibility. That's up to a court of law.
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Are you REALLY a lawyer?? OF COURSE COPS FIND SOMEONE LIABLE!! THEY HAND OUT THE TICKET! THEY DECIDE ON THE SPOT WHO WAS RESPONSIBLE! What the hell are you TALKING about???
Do you even read my posts thoroughly? We're NOT talking about criminal culpability, we're talking about financial responsibility!
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No, *I* have been addressing your misguided and just plain wrong statement that both parties were at fault. You didn't limit your statement to civil damages, you also applied it to legal responsibility...and you were, and still are, wrong.
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