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Posted: 5/3/2024 3:21:49 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Grendelsbane: HK level arrogance, Olympic level QC, a willingness to orphan products at the drop of a hat, and the tendency to use the end user as the beta tester They recycle failed ideas frequently onto newer generations of Shooters, and then abandon and disavow knowledge of their own now-orphaned project. And their R&D and Indian QC blow chunks. The last new pistol design they did that was well done was the 2022, IMO, and they orphaned it as fast as possible. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 5/3/2024 3:23:28 PM EDT
[#2]
Damn, wish Narphenal was still here.
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Posted: 5/3/2024 3:24:29 PM EDT
[#3]
OG P series were good guns
they cut cost to increase profits and poof they started turning out shit they make cool stuff but i do not trust the quality old school german swiss excluded |
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TN, USA
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Posted: 5/3/2024 3:28:25 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By AR15A2SporterII: They used to do this :https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/66656/IMG_20161111_1655548_4_jpg-3203971.JPG My west German 226 is the same way. Stupid accurate. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 3:33:14 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Seven-Shooter: All of this. They recycle failed ideas frequently onto newer generations of Shooters, and then abandon and disavow knowledge of their own now-orphaned project. And their R&D and Indian QC blow chunks. The last new pistol design they did that was well done was the 2022, IMO, and they orphaned it as fast as possible. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 4:17:27 PM EDT
[#6]
Love my Sig, its almost impossible to miss with. 320 Spectre Comp, DPP, gas pedal. Wife has a 365xl w/ 507K, love that too.
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Posted: 5/3/2024 4:36:25 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JAG2955: Ummmm, they've probably come out with more new designs in the last decade than any other manufacturer. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JAG2955: Originally Posted By Seven-Shooter: All of this. They recycle failed ideas frequently onto newer generations of Shooters, and then abandon and disavow knowledge of their own now-orphaned project. And their R&D and Indian QC blow chunks. The last new pistol design they did that was well done was the 2022, IMO, and they orphaned it as fast as possible. For better or worse, you're totally correct. A lot of their designs/variations are bullshit though - they could probably cut like 40% of their lineup and still have twice as much dumb shit as other manufacturers. examples:  Attached File Attached File Attached File Attached Filethere is a fuckload more where that came from |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 4:42:09 PM EDT
[#8]
The 4XT Pro, and Tango 6 are awesome.
I hate most things they make, except the P365. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 4:45:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: BobRoberts]
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By skindroid: For better or worse, you're totally correct. A lot of their designs/variations are bullshit though - they could probably cut like 40% of their lineup and still have twice as much dumb shit as other manufacturers. examples: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/430189/1000001240_jpg-3204595.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/430189/1000001239_jpg-3204600.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/430189/1000001238_jpg-3204596.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/430189/1000001237_jpg-3204597.JPG there is a fuckload more where that came from The “bullshit” sells well. Customers are happy to buy a the RMR rose and others want a pocket pistol that won’t snag on the pocket. The rainbow have always been great sellers. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/3/2024 4:47:49 PM EDT
[#10]
Sig was better when it was produced in West Germany. In the USA, not so much...
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Posted: 5/3/2024 4:59:53 PM EDT
[#11]
I just wanna know who at Sig is blowing in the military procurement department.
I don’t believe for one second they’re getting every contract because all of their products are superior. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 5:06:03 PM EDT
[#12]
Sig uses only the finest Indian MIM pot metals in their offerings. The premature rusting of slides and mags is a sign of the “To hell and back reliability” that Sig boys claim.
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Posted: 5/3/2024 5:08:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: PabloMcGlock]
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By colklink: Sig invented the pistol brace. Sig had introduced a compensator that was essentially a mono core suppressor without the outer tube. Sig gives the FBATFE the middle finger constantly. That makes them good people. No Sig bought the design of the Sig brace. I remember seeing a member here that designed it and then sold it to Sig. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 5:10:17 PM EDT
[#14]
Sigs marketing budget spent paying former tier one guys to shill their garbage was the best decision they ever made. The water heads lap that shit up and buy in droves.
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Posted: 5/3/2024 5:10:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: JupiterMaximus]
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By M1Zeppelin: I just wanna know who at Sig is blowing in the military procurement department. I don’t believe for one second they’re getting every contract because all of their products are superior. The 320 didn’t even go into Phase 2 of the usual handgun trial because they offered them to the Army at cost just to get the contract., at the end of Phase 1. The M9 went through Phase 2 twice and won it both times. Guess someone at Sig knew Phase 2 would kill that garbage gun. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 5:15:08 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JupiterMaximus: The 320 didn’t even go into Phase 2 of the usual handgun trial because they offered them to the Army at cost just to get the contract., at the end of Phase 1. The M9 went through Phase 2 twice and won it both times. Guess someone at Sig knew Phase 2 would kill that garbage gun. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JupiterMaximus: Originally Posted By M1Zeppelin: I just wanna know who at Sig is blowing in the military procurement department. I don’t believe for one second they’re getting every contract because all of their products are superior. The 320 didn’t even go into Phase 2 of the usual handgun trial because they offered them to the Army at cost just to get the contract., at the end of Phase 1. The M9 went through Phase 2 twice and won it both times. Guess someone at Sig knew Phase 2 would kill that garbage gun. And the Glock outperformed the Sig in the trials. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 5:15:15 PM EDT
[#17]
I have a 220, 226,and an M17. Wife has a 365XL. Absolutely no issues with any of them. I’m relatively certain I’ll add a few more to the collection
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Posted: 5/3/2024 5:23:04 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By PabloMcGlock: And the Glock outperformed the Sig in the trials.  Attached FileDude, username is fitting for sure with this post. The guns were neck and neck at best with each other. Sig learned from Beretta how to play the game. Don't be sore. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 5:23:53 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By skindroid: For better or worse, you're totally correct. A lot of their designs/variations are bullshit though - they could probably cut like 40% of their lineup and still have twice as much dumb shit as other manufacturers. examples: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/430189/1000001240_jpg-3204595.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/430189/1000001239_jpg-3204600.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/430189/1000001238_jpg-3204596.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/430189/1000001237_jpg-3204597.JPG there is a fuckload more where that came from P320 P365 MCX MPX SPEAR Cross NGSW-MG or whatever MG336 I'm probably forgetting some. All in about the last decade. Which is all better than yet another also-ran AR cartridge. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 5:33:13 PM EDT
[#20]
My P229 legion SAO is at least as good as my Staccato C2 for less than half the price. In fact, I think the SAO trigger on my 229 is better than the trigger on my C2.
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Posted: 5/3/2024 5:45:10 PM EDT
[#21]
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Posted: 5/3/2024 5:51:08 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Dumak: My P229 legion SAO is at least as good as my Staccato C2 for less than half the price. In fact, I think the SAO trigger on my 229 is better than the trigger on my C2. You have to be butthurt Glock didn't win the service pistol trials |
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NV, USA
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Posted: 5/3/2024 5:54:31 PM EDT
[#23]
My P226 and P320 turned me into a newt.
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Posted: 5/3/2024 5:56:03 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sierra-def: /media/mediaFiles/sharedAlbum/subnetfavoritelol-1033.gif Dude, username is fitting for sure with this post. The guns were neck and neck at best with each other. Sig learned from Beretta how to play the game. Don't be sore. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By sierra-def: Originally Posted By PabloMcGlock: And the Glock outperformed the Sig in the trials. /media/mediaFiles/sharedAlbum/subnetfavoritelol-1033.gif Dude, username is fitting for sure with this post. The guns were neck and neck at best with each other. Sig learned from Beretta how to play the game. Don't be sore. I’m not sure if that’s true. There are some people familiar with the process and I believe they had stated that Glock wasn’t even given a chance even after submitting a G17 and 19 for trials. I will say that it is my unprofessional opinion that had the new Sig undergone the testing that the 1911 and the Beretta had done in the past, that several of the piss poor short comings SHOULD have been spotted. But I’m just a dude on the internet. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 6:02:43 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By John91498: Sig was better when it was produced in West Germany. In the USA, not so much... If you like guns that require more maintenance, have shit finishes that rust if looked at and that are less durable, sure. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 6:08:59 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TonyRumore: This sums up the Sig556 debacle quite nicely. Tony |
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OK, USA
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Posted: 5/3/2024 6:09:04 PM EDT
[#27]
Older sigs are great. Last 20 years they have made numerous models and then not supported them and then quit making them. MCX rifles were supposed to be pinnacle AR15. Then changed upgraded left behind again. They change designs and parts leaving customers behind. Tried the 320s out and went back to 220 series.
I do like their 365 series and I have magazines so will keep it until the plastic wears out. New military rifle looks like it weighs 15 pounds. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 6:17:17 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 64tinc: Older sigs are great. Last 20 years they have made numerous models and then not supported them and then quit making them. MCX rifles were supposed to be pinnacle AR15. Then changed upgraded left behind again. They change designs and parts leaving customers behind. Tried the 320s out and went back to 220 series. I do like their 365 series and I have magazines so will keep it until the plastic wears out. New military rifle looks like it weighs 15 pounds. I can tell you for a fact the .308 version is ridiculously heavy per the one I’ve played with. According to the interwebs, the Sig MCX Spear in .308 weighs 9.2 lbs with an 16 inch barrel and the Springfield M1A weighs 9.3 lbs with a 22 inch barrel and that’s the Walnut option. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 6:22:22 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JAG2955: And yet, they sell. I'm not actually talking about the BeefSupreme versions, but: P320 P365 MCX MPX SPEAR Cross NGSW-MG or whatever MG336 I'm probably forgetting some. All in about the last decade. Which is all better than yet another also-ran AR cartridge. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By JAG2955: Originally Posted By skindroid: For better or worse, you're totally correct. A lot of their designs/variations are bullshit though - they could probably cut like 40% of their lineup and still have twice as much dumb shit as other manufacturers. examples: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/430189/1000001240_jpg-3204595.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/430189/1000001239_jpg-3204600.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/430189/1000001238_jpg-3204596.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/430189/1000001237_jpg-3204597.JPG there is a fuckload more where that came from P320 P365 MCX MPX SPEAR Cross NGSW-MG or whatever MG336 I'm probably forgetting some. All in about the last decade. Which is all better than yet another also-ran AR cartridge. I mean, McDonald's hamburgers sell really well too - they're still dogmeat and wonderbread lol I only talk shit because I have been issued Sigs and shot a ton of them - at least all the popular models. I think they're riding on good marketing (muh Goober knowledge transfers) and their name at this point. In my experience, their triggers feel like they came from my kids Nerf gun (especially the 320) and they overall feel cheap and trashy compared to an HK or Walther. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 6:24:01 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By cornhskr: Metal Sig good, plastic not so much. My SIGpro SP2022 is offended |
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CO, USA
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Posted: 5/3/2024 6:38:23 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 03RN: I've posted about it a bunch fwiw I was working at a range and posted about how our 320 rentals were going down and how hard it was to get spare parts. We had sig reps in the shop regularly and they recognized me and someone from sig called my manager and told him to make me stop. My manager saw what I wrote and didn't think there was an issue. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 03RN: Originally Posted By AeroEngineer: Originally Posted By 03RN: Because they called my employer and told them to have me stop posting on arfcom. We’re going to need more details on this one. I've posted about it a bunch fwiw I was working at a range and posted about how our 320 rentals were going down and how hard it was to get spare parts. We had sig reps in the shop regularly and they recognized me and someone from sig called my manager and told him to make me stop. My manager saw what I wrote and didn't think there was an issue. They did the same thing to one of my employees back in the day. Refused to fix a broken rental gun, he posted about it, and I got a phone call from them. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 6:59:54 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By M1Zeppelin: I’m not sure if that’s true. There are some people familiar with the process and I believe they had stated that Glock wasn’t even given a chance even after submitting a G17 and 19 for trials. I will say that it is my unprofessional opinion that had the new Sig undergone the testing that the 1911 and the Beretta had done in the past, that several of the piss poor short comings SHOULD have been spotted. But I’m just a dude on the internet. The IG report is readily available. There isn’t really a reason to rely on hearsay |
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FM, USA
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Posted: 5/3/2024 7:10:23 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Gator: FPNI. Sigs used to be great... Cohen may have made them more profitable, but after ditching a reasonable level of quality control. Yeah, Cohen did to sig what he did to kimber. |
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 5/3/2024 7:20:51 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By subcomunic8r: I own five pistols and 4 of them are Sigs. I'm contemplating a P365XL or Macro. They fixed my 18 year old P220 under warranty for free. No complaints from me. How did you get them to do that? My P226 SAO Legion started falling apart after a couple years and they were going to charge me to repair it. Didn't like it that much anyway so I just chucked it in a safe and it sits to this day. My top of the line Sig shits the bed in no time and I have used "Cheap Plastic" Glocks since then and not an issue. They made such a big fucking ridiculous deal with the Legions and "Sig Quality" after that I just said 'fuck 'em!' At least when I buy a Kel-Tec I expect it to not work! |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 7:54:19 PM EDT
[Last Edit: MouseBoy]
[#35]
I have never owned a Sig........never will
 They have a shit-ton of money though. They are expanding very rapidly and spending around here like drunk sailors. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 7:56:13 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DH243: Yeah, Cohen did to sig what he did to kimber. Took them from near extinction when they were building a few pistols out of pot metal to the world's leader in small arms. Horrible. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 7:58:37 PM EDT
[#37]
I love sig, p-226 was my first pistol I bought for myself, rod and gun club, Wiesbaden Germany, circa 1990, p-226 / p-220 are amazing pistols, also love my sig m400 ar-15. Saw a p229 with optic recently and simply loved it.
That said… They do some retarded shit though, rolling out stupid finishes, models, etc, failing to support products / quickly dumping products , support for them and customers who own them is pretty awful though. |
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USA
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Posted: 5/3/2024 8:00:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: crazymoose]
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FreefallRet: They got me, luckily I was able to offload my SIG while they were still popular. I still have my 10.5 because it's the closest I'll ever get to a 553. That said, it throws brass with enough velocity to kill a man, and the two gas port sizes on the regulator are exactly the same. Between that and an MPX gen 1 that become obsolete the month after I bought it, I decided to say fuck SIG forever. The German X Five I had was alright, but honestly the Arex Alpha is a better gun for less than half the price. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/3/2024 8:01:19 PM EDT
[#39]
Indian MIM parts being made controversy.
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Posted: 5/3/2024 8:17:16 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BobRoberts: The IG report is readily available. There isn’t really a reason to rely on hearsay Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BobRoberts: Originally Posted By M1Zeppelin: I’m not sure if that’s true. There are some people familiar with the process and I believe they had stated that Glock wasn’t even given a chance even after submitting a G17 and 19 for trials. I will say that it is my unprofessional opinion that had the new Sig undergone the testing that the 1911 and the Beretta had done in the past, that several of the piss poor short comings SHOULD have been spotted. But I’m just a dude on the internet. The IG report is readily available. There isn’t really a reason to rely on hearsay If you’re talking about the DOT&E 4 page report, it doesn’t really explain much of anything. Especially how Sig got to skip the 20 thousand round endurance test causing Glock to file a complaint that was investigated by a federal court in which they found no wrong doing…. It unfortunately does leave a lot of room for hearsay. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 8:23:51 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By M1Zeppelin: If you’re talking about the DOT&E 4 page report, it doesn’t really explain much of anything. Especially how Sig got to skip the 20 thousand round endurance test causing Glock to file a complaint that was investigated by a federal court in which they found no wrong doing…. It unfortunately does leave a lot of room for hearsay. Pretty simple they were skipping the 20k test for either pistol because they were both mature striker fired designs, it’s stated in the report. Glock wasn’t going to magically get the win even if they did it. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 8:31:12 PM EDT
[#42]
Sig is a mediocre gun company that builds somewhat decent guns, but they have some really really shitty habits.
1. Throw every product they can think of at the wall like shit, and see what sticks. 2. They cheated during the military pistol procurement. The way the bid solicitation was written by the US Army, they are the only company that had a product already ready that fit the bid. 3. The "surplus" M17's that they bought were recalled from the military due to the drop safety issue. The military got new guns, a bunch of chumps paid 3x (or more) what the military did for used, defective guns. 4. The argument of "don't drop it and it wont go off" is the same as the one Apple made where they stated "you're holding the phone wrong." Drop safeties are a thing for a reason. We are people, people do and make dumb mistakes. 5. The p320 trigger is by far the WORST striker fired trigger on any gun I have ever shot.EVER. This is coming from a man that owns a Taurus G3. Having said all of this, I've been eyeballing a 2022 for a while. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 8:55:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Boom_Stick]
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Epyon: 5. The p320 trigger is by far the WORST striker fired trigger on any gun I have ever shot.EVER. Ive got 3 flavors of SF; sig, glock and HK. To me glock is the worst. Its a gate latch staple gun no matter how you try to doctor it up. Vp9 and p320 for me are neckNneck with a nod towards the p320. It just breaks so nice for a SF. Ive heard the walther SF is the best of the best but ive got no trigger time on it. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 8:58:01 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Epyon: Sig is a mediocre gun company that builds somewhat decent guns, but they have some really really shitty habits. 1. Throw every product they can think of at the wall like shit, and see what sticks. 2. They cheated during the military pistol procurement. The way the bid solicitation was written by the US Army, they are the only company that had a product already ready that fit the bid. 3. The "surplus" M17's that they bought were recalled from the military due to the drop safety issue. The military got new guns, a bunch of chumps paid 3x (or more) what the military did for used, defective guns. 4. The argument of "don't drop it and it wont go off" is the same as the one Apple made where they stated "you're holding the phone wrong." Drop safeties are a thing for a reason. We are people, people do and make dumb mistakes. 5. The p320 trigger is by far the WORST striker fired trigger on any gun I have ever shot.EVER. This is coming from a man that owns a Taurus G3. Having said all of this, I've been eyeballing a 2022 for a while. #5 
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Posted: 5/3/2024 8:58:06 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BobRoberts: Pretty simple they were skipping the 20k test for either pistol because they were both mature striker fired designs, it’s stated in the report. Glock wasn’t going to magically get the win even if they did it. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By BobRoberts: Originally Posted By M1Zeppelin: If you’re talking about the DOT&E 4 page report, it doesn’t really explain much of anything. Especially how Sig got to skip the 20 thousand round endurance test causing Glock to file a complaint that was investigated by a federal court in which they found no wrong doing…. It unfortunately does leave a lot of room for hearsay. Pretty simple they were skipping the 20k test for either pistol because they were both mature striker fired designs, it’s stated in the report. Glock wasn’t going to magically get the win even if they did it. But they’re not mature designs. I’m not rooting for Glock in this instance either. What I am saying is it reads like it was half assed and adopted. Trigger problems, double ejections, the notorious drop issue. Army recommendation? Pass but fix these things and we’ll purchase. It used to be “fix and resubmit for testing again” Whether or not they were blown out of proportions, that is not the sign of a mature striker fired pistol. You don’t skip tests because it’s been around a bit. That is a disservice to the men and women who have to carry them. These weapon systems should be dragged through all 4 corners of the earth and beaten the living shit out of before adoption. We knew these things in the 1930’s when it came to firearm adoption. Now we settle for close enough. Somebody is making a killing off of Sig getting all of these contracts and if these pistols are a foreshadowing of what Sig is willing to give and the quality the Army is willing to adopt, we are in trouble. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 9:10:09 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11boomboom]
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Epyon: Sig is a mediocre gun company that builds somewhat decent guns, but they have some really really shitty habits. 1. Throw every product they can think of at the wall like shit, and see what sticks. 2. They cheated during the military pistol procurement. The way the bid solicitation was written by the US Army, they are the only company that had a product already ready that fit the bid. 3. The "surplus" M17's that they bought were recalled from the military due to the drop safety issue. The military got new guns, a bunch of chumps paid 3x (or more) what the military did for used, defective guns. 4. The argument of "don't drop it and it wont go off" is the same as the one Apple made where they stated "you're holding the phone wrong." Drop safeties are a thing for a reason. We are people, people do and make dumb mistakes. 5. The p320 trigger is by far the WORST striker fired trigger on any gun I have ever shot.EVER. This is coming from a man that owns a Taurus G3. Having said all of this, I've been eyeballing a 2022 for a while. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Epyon: Sig is a mediocre gun company that builds somewhat decent guns, but they have some really really shitty habits. 1. Throw every product they can think of at the wall like shit, and see what sticks. 2. They cheated during the military pistol procurement. The way the bid solicitation was written by the US Army, they are the only company that had a product already ready that fit the bid. 3. The "surplus" M17's that they bought were recalled from the military due to the drop safety issue. The military got new guns, a bunch of chumps paid 3x (or more) what the military did for used, defective guns. 4. The argument of "don't drop it and it wont go off" is the same as the one Apple made where they stated "you're holding the phone wrong." Drop safeties are a thing for a reason. We are people, people do and make dumb mistakes. 5. The p320 trigger is by far the WORST striker fired trigger on any gun I have ever shot.EVER. This is coming from a man that owns a Taurus G3. Having said all of this, I've been eyeballing a 2022 for a while. #5 is already mentioned so... #2? Cheated? They had a gun that met the solicitation the Army had made, so they cheated? That's sounds like some next level butthurt. Screw them for having exactly what the Army was looking for.  Originally Posted By M1Zeppelin: But they’re not mature designs. I’m not rooting for Glock in this instance either. What I am saying is it reads like it was half assed and adopted. Trigger problems, double ejections, the notorious drop issue. Army recommendation? Pass but fix these things and we’ll purchase. It used to be “fix and resubmit for testing again” Whether or not they were blown out of proportions, that is not the sign of a mature striker fired pistol. You don’t skip tests because it’s been around a bit. That is a disservice to the men and women who have to carry them. These weapon systems should be dragged through all 4 corners of the earth and beaten the living shit out of before adoption. We knew these things in the 1930’s when it came to firearm adoption. Now we settle for close enough. Somebody is making a killing off of Sig getting all of these contracts and if these pistols are a foreshadowing of what Sig is willing to give and the quality the Army is willing to adopt, we are in trouble. Half-assed adoption I can get aboard with. I don't think the Army's testing was thorough enough, either. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 9:52:51 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Boom_Stick: I dont Criticize or argue with people (anymore) about what they like or dislike about a handgun. All handguns are different and everyones tastes are different. But when you say the p320s trigger is the worst, I gotta ask, how many SF guns are you fluent with? Ive got 3 flavors of SF; sig, glock and HK. To me glock is the worst. Its a gate latch staple gun no matter how you try to doctor it up. Vp9 and p320 for me are neckNneck with a nod towards the p320. It just breaks so nice for a SF. Ive heard the walther SF is the best of the best but ive got no trigger time on it. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Boom_Stick: Originally Posted By Epyon: 5. The p320 trigger is by far the WORST striker fired trigger on any gun I have ever shot.EVER. Ive got 3 flavors of SF; sig, glock and HK. To me glock is the worst. Its a gate latch staple gun no matter how you try to doctor it up. Vp9 and p320 for me are neckNneck with a nod towards the p320. It just breaks so nice for a SF. Ive heard the walther SF is the best of the best but ive got no trigger time on it. I became a Walther fanboy by dry firing a PDP Compact at my LGS last year. I also had a P320 and a VP9 out of the case to try out. After I felt the trigger on that PDP, I let the sales guy know he could put the other guns away. Now I have between 3k-4k rounds through my Walther. FWIW, I have experienced zero malfunctions - and I mean absolutely zero. The only thing I added was a metal guide rod. Recoil spring weight is stock.  Attached FileTry one out if you get the chance. |
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Posted: 5/3/2024 10:00:38 PM EDT
[#48]
My MK25 (P226) is solid and fun to shoot, however modern Sig is a fucking train wreck.
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/3/2024 10:32:01 PM EDT
[#49]
Originally Posted By DernHumpus: I want to like Sig as a manufacturer, but they sure have a lot of black eyes these days and the fanbois still run rampant. Sig is one of the very few manufacturers pushing boundaries and coming out with innovative products especially compared to Glocks, it is no surprise there will be teething problems. However, most of these are overblown especially when internet recycling starts, now some are saying the P938 is not drop safe to now P320s blowing up when Glocks loaded with the wrong handloads for 30+ years. So much double standard out there. I'm an FFL and although P365s/P320s are among our best selling pistols and the M400 among our best selling rifles, we have not had any customers detailing their bad or RMA experiences. The brand that we have had by far the most finish/QC issues with NIB guns requiring RMA is Smith & Wesson, then followed by Ruger. I personally own a good amount of firearms, and at the moment I have about 8 or 9 SIGs (P365s, Spear-LT, P320s, MPXs). Thousands of rounds between each Sig I own, and I have yet to have a parts breakage, catastrophic failure, or fight stopping malfunction. Of course I shoot quality ammo Fiocchi/Hornady/S&B/Federal and clean my firearms after every range session. Again, a lot of this recent hate stems for Glock not being the most popular kid on the block, combined with Sig winning numerous military contracts that usually Glock or H&K or FN were taking, and the fact that a non-Glock is apparently the best selling pistol in the country (P365). |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 5/3/2024 10:34:27 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By skindroid: For better or worse, you're totally correct. A lot of their designs/variations are bullshit though - they could probably cut like 40% of their lineup and still have twice as much dumb shit as other manufacturers. examples: https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/430189/1000001240_jpg-3204595.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/430189/1000001239_jpg-3204600.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/430189/1000001238_jpg-3204596.JPG https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/430189/1000001237_jpg-3204597.JPG there is a fuckload more where that came from Isn't that capitalism? No one is forcing you to buy any of that, so how can we blame too much variety as bad now? Haven't you seen a S&W or Ruger product catalog Lol |
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